Cave Feedback

[edwardelricfreak]

Or one could introduce a greyed out 'Breed-specific action/This breed of dragon does not have a breed-specific action' (maybe with a link to the help page on BSAs) for the dragons that don't have one.

 

(I bet that'd annoy some people. But I just had to suggest it. It's not even just meant as a joke - though that being said, I have no investment in this.)

I'd be okay with this, but overall I just don't like actions that aren't relevant on the page. I wouldn't want "Name" to show up first or whatever on an egg before all of the relevant actions for it. :\

 

Maybe we could be able to manually choose the order of actions and whether or not we want to see the greyed-out actions?

Edited September 29, 2014 by edwardelricfreak

[KageSora]

Perhaps TJ would like his site to evolve.  Try to state plainly what the difficulties are, so he can fix the problems.

(News section TJ informed members changes were coming. )

Sure, TJ may want that--but if the users have an issue with it then we're fully allowed to voice that and to complain to let him know.

 

 

For me, personally, it's "fixed" in that it's functional again. The new order is much better, too. but I still don't like it. It bothers me. It looks "messy". "Breed" and "(Re)name/BSA"'s describing lines seem to run into each other.

 

I'd rather see each column with a lowered width and a wider gap between them--think three columns with the middle one being blank.

 

Additionally, the way that we have ones that have 2-line descriptions and 1-line descriptions next to each other bugs me. Maybe it's just sort of OCD* of me but it really just... I don't like it one bit.

 

I'd rather see something like this:

 

(Re)Name | Describe

Breed/Hide | Abandon/Release

BSA | Kill

 

 

Or, with the actions grouped with the "bad" ones in one column and the others in another:

 

(Re) Name | Abandon/Release

Describe | Kill

Breed/Hide

BSA

 

 

Also not a fan of the "things you can't use showing up greyed out" thing, either.

 

*Before anybody says something--and yes, I know there are several of you--I do, in fact, have OCD, so it's a legit usage of that.

[Cinnamin Draconna]

Here's another tidbit... if the page remained as a list, missing actions wouldn't cause the remaining actions to jump around either. They might move up and down, but not sideways.

Edited September 29, 2014 by Cinnamin Draconna

[Fuzzbucket]

Whoops. I just went to incubate an egg - and almost went for kill. This DOES need to go back to a list or be better arranged....

 

Kill needs to be as last as it gets, whatever page it is on.

[Keileon]

I like it better now that the issues are fixed, but I still don't particularly like the change in the first place. I'm sure I'll get used to it, but I prefer the old layout.

[Melisande]

Whoops. I just went to incubate an egg - and almost went for kill. This DOES need to go back to a list or be better arranged....

 

Kill needs to be as last as it gets, whatever page it is on.

Either go back to the list or make it optional that users can choose on their account settings what kind of layout you see.

 

TJ has changed things before and then reverted them back after users asked him to... I think they had to make a petition or something for the lineage views. I would be ok with doing that if it was a way to get attention and to be taken seriously that this is an issue and it needs to get fixed, but not sure where in the forums that would go, here in the suggestions section maybe?

Edited September 29, 2014 by Melisande

[olympe]

Can't we opt out of killing/releasing entirely? I don't want to use any of these actions ever again. Well, unless I'm trying for an ND and want to force the egg... But in this case, I could change my account setting shortly before the TOD.

[Fuzzbucket]

Can't we opt out of killing/releasing entirely? I don't want to use any of these actions ever again. Well, unless I'm trying for an ND and want to force the egg... But in this case, I could change my account setting shortly before the TOD.

I sometimes WANT to release rather suddenly - as in see an egg in a trade thread and want to be first to get it... Even as it is, I am sometimes too late dumping whatever to give me a space ! Killing - well, yes, neggies and zomblies need that... But the kill link needs to be where you CANNOT miss. I would like the big word on the actual action page, like we have for the biome we are in.

 

But I still want to know WHY this change was made. What benefit did TJ see in it ? I am fascinated.

[Pixxelation]

Sure, TJ may want that--but if the users have an issue with it then we're fully allowed to voice that and to complain to let him know.

 

 

For me, personally, it's "fixed" in that it's functional again. The new order is much better, too. but I still don't like it. It bothers me. It looks "messy". "Breed" and "(Re)name/BSA"'s describing lines seem to run into each other.

 

I'd rather see each column with a lowered width and a wider gap between them--think three columns with the middle one being blank.

 

Additionally, the way that we have ones that have 2-line descriptions and 1-line descriptions next to each other bugs me. Maybe it's just sort of OCD* of me but it really just... I don't like it one bit.

 

I'd rather see something like this:

 

(Re)Name | Describe

Breed/Hide | Abandon/Release

BSA | Kill

 

 

Or, with the actions grouped with the "bad" ones in one column and the others in another:

 

(Re) Name | Abandon/Release

Describe | Kill

Breed/Hide

BSA

 

 

Also not a fan of the "things you can't use showing up greyed out" thing, either.

 

*Before anybody says something--and yes, I know there are several of you--I do, in fact, have OCD, so it's a legit usage of that.

I'd like that second option, except maybe with the BSA moved to bottom right so things are more even.

[Melisande]

Can't we opt out of killing/releasing entirely? I don't want to use any of these actions ever again. Well, unless I'm trying for an ND and want to force the egg... But in this case, I could change my account setting shortly before the TOD.

Killing / Releasing is not entirely a bad thing. I mean the only way to get a zombie is to kill the dragon and try to bring it back.

 

And there are some lineage projects built around releasing a dragon.

 

 

Stuffing the options at the bottom of a list, so you don't have to look at them would be a good solution for people who don't choose to use them. Where as with the column layout they are kinda in your face. Just like Earthquake on the pebble dragons... very few people use it because of the poor success rate but some people still do use it to try to force eggs to hatch faster.

[Fuzzbucket]

I'd like that second option, except maybe with the BSA moved to bottom right so things are more even.

NO ! KILL needs to be bottomest right. The least likely action to pick.

[Pixxelation]

I disagree with that, Fuzz. Being in the middle makes it least likely to be picked, IMO. People tend to choose things on the top or bottom, so putting it in the middle and on the right side make it least likely to be chosen. Plus, it would otherwise disrupt the uniformity of the actions pages among adults or make the pages look unbalanced.

[Fuzzbucket]

I disagree with that, Fuzz. Being in the middle makes it least likely to be picked, IMO. People tend to choose things on the top or bottom, so putting it in the middle and on the right side make it least likely to be chosen. Plus, it would otherwise disrupt the uniformity of the actions pages among adults or make the pages look unbalanced.

Which is EXACTLY why it would be better to go back to the perfectly balanced single column.

 

And I don't know about YOU, but I certainly look last at the last as in bottom right option (last as it would be in a BOOK !)

[annageckos]

I disagree with that, Fuzz. Being in the middle makes it least likely to be picked, IMO. People tend to choose things on the top or bottom, so putting it in the middle and on the right side make it least likely to be chosen. Plus, it would otherwise disrupt the uniformity of the actions pages among adults or make the pages look unbalanced.

I agree with this, though really I don't care much the order of things. I'll get used to it. It really doesn't affect me much. I may accidentally click on a wrong action, but I always double check before clicking the accept button.

[Dracaena]

First let me say thank you for moving kill action from the first thing to the end of the list. That had always bothered me.

 

On the plus side for the new arrangement of the actions page, it does seem to load quicker. I don't have things jumping as they load and accidently clicking something besides influence because I didn't let things fully load first.

 

On the negative side, the actions columns run into each other with not even a space between letters of the two columns. This varies on page (stage of dragon) and skin used and can also affect the account page. This problem doesn't seem to show up with the Dino Cave skin, it is very pronounced with the St. Patrick's Day skin. I normally use default scroll skin and use IE browser with a laptop hooked up to a separate monitor and ergonomic keyboard (more like a desktop). Sorry I am not geek enough to be handy with posting screen shots to illustrate.

 

As far as the show actions grayed out or don't show if not available debate, I think it would be better to have them grayed out. It's much more new player friendly. Also having the same actions jumping from one column to the other depending on what stage of dragon you look at is confusing. Consistency is good.

[Beldarius]

- It detracts from the visual appeal of the site and makes the page look messy. It's all clustered up instead of a neat, linear list.

-  For users who have been here for years it makes it harder to find the action they want.

Point 1: that is just an opinion of a few people. Just because you think it's ugly doesn't mean everyone thinks the same way. Personally, I don't mind the change. I wouldn't have minded if it had stayed the same, but I know I'll get used to this layout soon.

 

Point 2: ...Um. There are only five or six actions. Saying they're hard to find makes it sound like you're in a hurry and have to "click on it right now". Nothing is hard to find if you just spend some time and look for it. And eventually you'll just get used to it and find it without having to focus. ...I mean, I've been here for SIX years and I don't think they're hard to find at all!

Edited September 29, 2014 by Beldarius

[LibbyLishly]

Point 1: that is just an opinion of a few people. Just because you think it's ugly doesn't mean everyone thinks the same way. Personally, I don't mind the change. I wouldn't have minded if it had stayed the same, but I know I'll get used to this layout soon.

 

Point 2: ...Um. There are only five or six actions. Saying they're hard to find makes it sound like you're in a hurry and have to "click on it right now". Nothing is hard to find if you just spend some time and look for it. And eventually you'll just get used to it and find it without having to focus. ...I mean, I've been here for SIX years and I don't think they're hard to find at all!

I have to agree with this. I actually think the look is good, and my husband (who works in graphic design) says that the columns are way better from an aesthetic point of view than the list. This isn't like the lineage alterations, where all the players had been working to create something based on how it looked; this is a purely functional page, and therefore an abrupt change matters much less. The decreased efficiency can be annoying at first, but I'm already over it.

 

Now, I understand that a couple of our players have special circumstances that make this much more difficult for them than for the rest of us - having to have a zoomed-in screen, for example. From their standpoint, functionality has just decreased dramatically. I also don't use a mobile version, so I can't speak to how this is working there.

[edwardelricfreak]

As far as the show actions grayed out or don't show if not available debate, I think it would be better to have them grayed out.  It's much more new player friendly. Also having the same actions jumping from one column to the other depending on what stage of dragon you look at is confusing. Consistency is good.

Yes, I like having the greyed out actions there maybe for NEWBIES, but *I* would like to opt-out of that. I know I can't give an egg a name, or can't breed with x, or can't release x. And personally, I DON'T like the idea of having completely irrelevant actions on something. Breed is first on adults. If every stage were to share the layout and just have certain ones greyed out, that means Breed will be one of the first ones, placed higher than a lot of the actions only relevant to hatchies and eggs. All of the stages would have Freeze, BSA, Name, Abandon, Release, Hide, etc if we wanted actions to remain the same.

 

This is why I wish I could customize it *myself*. Drag and drop the order of the actions, hide certain actions including greyed-out ones, what stages the actions appear on (with a checkbox for quickly selecting all/no stages), and even choose a single column or double column layout. But it sounds like quite a bit of work and it's just a dream of mine. Would be nice. Individual users can place actions based on how relevant they are to that user, or hide some they wouldn't dare use. I don't think it should work for individual dragons, though, so if you hide breed it hides breed from all of the dragons.

 

Personally I like the double columns, and I rather like the current layout of the actions, though I wish I could hide certain ones like Name on the eggs.

[Pixxelation]

Which is EXACTLY why it would be better to go back to the perfectly balanced single column.

 

And I don't know about YOU, but I certainly look last at the last as in bottom right option (last as it would be in a BOOK !)

Where did I say anything about it being last? All I said was that it would be least likely to be clicked where it is now, in reply to your saying that it would be less likely to be clicked by accident if it were in the bottom right corner. As I said, people tend to overlook the middle, if anything, so keeping it where it is now makes sense.

 

As for the new layout, I personally like it better. It's more organized and is more visually appealing to have things divided the way they currently are.

[Melisande]

I have to agree with this. I actually think the look is good, and my husband (who works in graphic design) says that the columns are way better from an aesthetic point of view than the list. This isn't like the lineage alterations, where all the players had been working to create something based on how it looked; this is a purely functional page, and therefore an abrupt change matters much less. The decreased efficiency can be annoying at first, but I'm already over it.

 

Now, I understand that a couple of our players have special circumstances that make this much more difficult for them than for the rest of us - having to have a zoomed-in screen, for example. From their standpoint, functionality has just decreased dramatically. I also don't use a mobile version, so I can't speak to how this is working there.

Being in graphic design myself I have to say that the uneven columns are not aesthetically pleasing at all.

 

 

 

The list worked well and was easy to find all your actions in a nice neat list. This new have to hunt and pick with bigger description text boxes has made actions less helpful and more annoying. Moving the actions out of place from where they were for over 6 years gives a disadvantage to players who have been playing for years and are used to where their actions are normally.

 

Being a "purely functional" page as you put it makes this change that much more disruptive, since it impacts game play negatively with the changes and does nothing positive to game play.

 

I've read people here in the thread are now misclicking because oh wait that's not where the action is.

 

Not to mention there are still problems with zoomed in screens and the mobile app. Not sure about the custom skins since I only use the default.

 

 

 

This has been a very bad change and a lot of users really want TJ to fix it and make it nice and usable again.

Edited September 30, 2014 by Melisande

[kiramaru7]

Not really a complaint, since everything works now, unlike the other day, but it feels like things were shuffled around again on the action page. Did they tinker with it again? ^^; If they are tinkering, maybe they should put things back where they were? It worked better & looked neater as a single column.

[Melisande]

This is why I wish I could customize it *myself*. Drag and drop the order of the actions, hide certain actions including greyed-out ones, what stages the actions appear on (with a checkbox for quickly selecting all/no stages), and even choose a single column or double column layout.

That would be the most perfect thing ever lol

[Slaskia]

I can adapt, but the action page with the default skin still has issues:

 

 

There needs to be a some space between the two columns...

 

Bottom one with the adult is kind of amusing as it 'almost' makes sense .

[Ardath Rekha]

What really bothers me about the images Slaskia just posted, aside from the lack of spaces between the columns, is that the same actions keep moving to different parts of the page. That increases the chance that a user will misclick on an action they don't want to do. If we have to get used to it, we'll get used to it a lot faster if things are in consistent places.

[Jazeki]

I can adapt, but the action page with the default skin still has issues:

 

 

There needs to be a some space between the two columns...

 

Bottom one with the adult is kind of amusing as it 'almost' makes sense .

I'm using the default skin, but I'm not having these issues. Maybe it's browser based?