Trading Inflation

[Amazon_warrior]

I'm legitimately asking this. Why are users that have CB Blacks and vines asking for rare items? I'm really curious. I'm almost certain that I read in the wiki that CB won't alt. I refresh over them.

Because there was a point when they were insanely hard to find in the Cave, to the point where they dropped at about the same rate as metals.

 

Now they're dropping a *lot* more frequently, but it seems that people haven't quite shaken off the perception that "CB Black"=rare/valuable.

 

 

(I think that's also a significant part of the inflation problem, actually. People get upset when they can suddenly catch a perceived "rare", but then so can everyone else and the price that others are willing to pay for it has dropped accordingly. Yeah, a CB Black was once worth a CB Gold, but if you asked for that now you'd get laughed out of the thread...)

 

 

Regarding the Shimmer trade mentioned above - could well be the owner was looking for something quite different (or accepted a lower trade from a friend. Or..., or...) The point is, no one is *forced* to trade with anyone else. I find the attitude of "I've got all these shiny things so you HAVE to trade with me!" almost as bizarre as people who ask for low-gen metals in return for messy commons. For the record, 3rd gens from my bronze Shimmer were (mostly) traded for one CB metal or 2-3 2nd gen metals.

Edited March 24, 2013 by Amazon_warrior

[ElayneDragonLover]

Yep. When trades with 6 CB metals and 4th gen Shimmers can sit for days, you REALLY know its time to just give up! It is pathetic. I know TJ can't control trading, but perhaps something could be done about the amount of rares that drop in the cave? Some rares aren't even rares anymore.

I am darn sure you would get offers on what you listed, just maybe not the narrow offers you want

[Dawnfur]

Seriously? I had a trade up for a 2nd Gen Silver and it didn't get any offers in 2 days. :/ Not a single one. You know times are bad when 2nd Gen Metals are practically worthless.

[PointOfOrigin]

Just traded a messy third gen Silver for a CB Ice. I find it much easier to PM people nowdays then offer on a link.

[Vhale]

Speaking of that. Quite a few people have mentioned that they don't trade with people that don't respond to PMs as well. I don't keep lists personally, but there is always the possibility that something happened in the past.

 

It's also possible that the IOU list is extremely full and they aren't willing to bump other people because someone wants to use CB metals to cut in line.

 

And /agree with Sin

 

I am starting to wonder if the occasional days of dragon cave lag is actually the site readjusting ratios. I'm not seeing near as many blacks or trios as I did at the start of the rush. That may be why blacks are still up there. Golden Wyverns, Vines, ridgewings and stripes still seem pretty common. Royal Blues have almost hit blocker status. Anyone that wanted a few more should take advantage while they can, for sure!

[Fuzzbucket]

Seriously? I had a trade up for a 2nd Gen Silver and it didn't get any offers in 2 days. :/ Not a single one. You know times are bad when 2nd Gen Metals are practically worthless.

I saw that. I couldn't get you anything worth offering as I was close to locked... A lot of people are just now because of all the AP goodies. If it's still up for grabs - do let me know and I'll try tomorrow when I have a slot (I am TOTALLY scroll locked right now !)...

[_Sin_]

(I think that's also a significant part of the inflation problem, actually.  People get upset when they can suddenly catch a perceived "rare", but then so can everyone else and the price that others are willing to pay for it has dropped accordingly.  Yeah, a CB Black was once worth a CB Gold, but if you asked for that now you'd get laughed out of the thread...)

Agreed. By the same token, people get upset when suddenly their "trading power" vanishes. When a 2nd gen metal, that would have had half traders salivating 2 months ago, gets no offers, the breeder must feel quite disconcerted.

[ElayneDragonLover]

Seriously? I had a trade up for a 2nd Gen Silver and it didn't get any offers in 2 days. :/ Not a single one. You know times are bad when 2nd Gen Metals are practically worthless.

I have found what offers you get often depends on what you put in your post.

 

If you say taking offers, sometimes people think: I don't know what to offer, so offer nothing

 

If you only list a few specific things, and then say and offers, they think: Wow I don't have anything like that, and won't offer.

 

I've found it hard to strike a balance sometimes. I don't know what you're second gen silver was bred from (besides the silver ) but I too likely thought I didn't have anything worth a 2nd gen silver that I was willing to trade at the moment.

[Amazon_warrior]

Agreed. By the same token, people get upset when suddenly their "trading power" vanishes. When a 2nd gen metal, that would have had half traders salivating 2 months ago, gets no offers, the breeder must feel quite disconcerted.

Ayup. And then there's nothing to be done except be flexible and focus on whatever the rarity of the moment happens to be (if possible). The problem is that while some people may find that a fun challenge, others clearly find it teeth-grindingly frustrating.

 

I guess I don't usually get as annoyed by the trading ups and downs because I've almost never relied solely on trading to get all my rares (a great many of my trades have been Have: CB Trio/Black/Stripe, Want: Some CB hatchies or maybe a lowish gen shiny), but that doesn't mean I don't have sympathy for those that do for whatever reason.

 

ETA: I do get vexed at all the step lineages that people always offer, but that's more a personal preference and a gripe that my preferred lineage type (even-gens) is not considered to be as "valuable".

Edited March 24, 2013 by Amazon_warrior

[Kishing]

I have found what offers you get often depends on what you put in your post.

Yep, this. I've also had better luck offering on trades than getting offers - I put up a 3rd gen gold last night, looking for a metal swap or other offers, and nothin'. Today, though, I went through the trading threads and found a bloodswap I'd been looking for and it was accepted pretty quickly.

 

Thing is, I would've taken one or two BSA hatchlings for it, or a PB blusang, but if I don't list those I usually don't get the offers.

 

A lot of people are just now because of all the AP goodies.

 

That's my problem, yup. I saw your trade too, Dawnfur, but I feel like I've had the full complement of 21 eggs and hatchlings for an eternity now. It's hard to resist an incuhatchable AP!

[AineLeith]

I don't think I'll ever really understand the whole concept of the trading of certain Generations and types of lines. But usually when I do trade I do TRY to add more than what I ask for.

 

Currently I have a trade offer going in one of the trade threads, I know that though all I am offering are metals, my best is only a 5th gen and everything else is lower than that on the totem pole. And I'm only asking for one kind of egg, doesn't even have to be second gen it could be any (though given i'm asking for the new ones I know they aren't down to 7th gens yet) I don't care if its messy, I don't care if it's inbred. I just want one egg.

[XiziX]

I'll be honest. Since trading is so hard - and I have almost given up. I tend to just accept offers from people who look like they need what I am trading. IE: someone with barely any low gen silvers is bound to get my trade, rather than someone with 50. XP (Or someone who is doing a project and desperately needs a specific egg)

 

The values of things are so out of whack, I really am not sure what to do other than put in my post for people to offer what THEY think it is worth. That way, if someone can not offer what I consider an auto, then they can offer whatever they see fit and I will usually accept it.

 

.....But overall, I think I may just breed and drop the stuff in the departure threads and hope people who need the eggs can grab them and return the help. We need new breeders and new people in the trade threads. It's the same few people over and over again. The same couple people with ALL the CB metals, the same couple few with the Shimmers and desired Tinsels (who only trade amongst themselves it seems - but I may be wrong.)

 

We just need variety... very badly... And we need the rares to go to people who don't have any, so they can fill the trade threads and produce new blood and lineages... (I have my metals, but I know people who don't and would be willing to gift their low gen offspring to people as well to help get more people in the game/trades.) :[

 

Also on the mention of people not responding to PMs. Yea, I avoid trading with people who are rude and don't reply to a trade offer PM - and I remember names well - so doing that is almost an instant move to my 'don't even bother with this person' mental-list. A kind "No thanks." that takes less than a second to send is always better than ignoring the person. It's just so disrespectful and rude doing that, because you leave the person HANGING there, unsure if you are going to respond or not.

 

Which is why I love message tracking, it tells me if people are doing that. <3 lol.

[tjekan]

Also on the mention of people not responding to PMs. Yea, I avoid trading with people who are rude and don't reply to a trade offer PM - and I remember names well - so doing that is almost an instant move to my 'don't even bother with this person' mental-list.

It's worth keeping in mind that it's easy even for the best-intentioned of people to miss responding to a PM here or there. This forum system does not mark messages that have been responded to, so people who get a lot of mail need a very good memory to remember which messages have already been answered and which haven't. I know for a fact that I've responded to the same message two times on more than one occasion, and I'm sure there have been other times when I've completely forgotten to answer one. It does happen, and isn't always a slight.

[Wymsical]

It's worth keeping in mind that it's easy even for the best-intentioned of people to miss responding to a PM here or there. This forum system does not mark messages that have been responded to, so people who get a lot of mail need a very good memory to remember which messages have already been answered and which haven't. I know for a fact that I've responded to the same message two times on more than one occasion, and I'm sure there have been other times when I've completely forgotten to answer one. It does happen, and isn't always a slight.

Also, have fun dealing with a PM assault. I'm talking a dozen or more within just a few minutes. It is not easy to keep track of.

 

I try my best to respond to as many as I get, so long as it is clear the person isn't PMing about things I have stated I do not wish to be bothered about.

Edited March 25, 2013 by Commander Wymsy

[Vhale]

It's worth keeping in mind, but it's also true that people do blacklist for it. And they did that before prize dragons for normal trades, so it's not just a pm assault thing.

 

I am a very impatient trader myself. I like to try to trade eggs for hatchies so I can hunt a new egg. So I don't like to have something hanging about trades for more than a couple hours. So I do try to give a big optional list of what I'll take so the trade will move.

[Riverwillows]

I know what you mean, Vhale. I get impatient too. lol

 

I don't like trades that take more than say, 5 hours, unless they state they are going to bed, will check in morning, that's fine then. As long as they DO check in the morning, and not afternoon.

 

But if I have a trade, and it goes too long without an offer, I will most likely just gift it.

[dragonstar]

I'll be honest. Since trading is so hard - and I have almost given up. I tend to just accept offers from people who look like they need what I am trading. IE: someone with barely any low gen silvers is bound to get my trade, rather than someone with 50. XP (Or someone who is doing a project and desperately needs a specific egg)

 

The values of things are so out of whack, I really am not sure what to do other than put in my post for people to offer what THEY think it is worth. That way, if someone can not offer what I consider an auto, then they can offer whatever they see fit and I will usually accept it.

 

.....But overall, I think I may just breed and drop the stuff in the departure threads and hope people who need the eggs can grab them and return the help. We need new breeders and new people in the trade threads. It's the same few people over and over again. The same couple people with ALL the CB metals, the same couple few with the Shimmers and desired Tinsels (who only trade amongst themselves it seems - but I may be wrong.)

 

We just need variety... very badly... And we need the rares to go to people who don't have any, so they can fill the trade threads and produce new blood and lineages... (I have my metals, but I know people who don't and would be willing to gift their low gen offspring to people as well to help get more people in the game/trades.) :[

This! Entirely my thoughts. I wrote up a post then scrolled up and decided to just quote this, haha. That's what I've noticed too, I don't want to point fingers and I'm not of course accusing anyone but from what I've noticed if people have at least one CB rare in a trade post, they generally also have several more of different breeds offered in the same post.

 

Right now the ratios are so out of whack that I'm not even sure what's worth what - is a CB Striped still rare? I don't even know what to do with my other unneeded CB black because I wasn't sure if anyone would trade for it (since the trading threads now seem to be just rares-for-Shimmers or rares-for-rare swaps now) so I just gave it to someone. But previously it would have been worth a lot more, which kinda sucks because I finally catch one and it's worth nothing.

 

I traded a 2g Silver for 4 CB Lurkers on Halloween, but I doubt that would happen now. if he ever decides to breed again

[Pink]

I know what you mean, Vhale. I get impatient too. lol

 

I don't like trades that take more than say, 5 hours, unless they state they are going to bed, will check in morning, that's fine then. As long as they DO check in the morning, and not afternoon.

 

But if I have a trade, and it goes too long without an offer, I will most likely just gift it.

See, I don't mind trades taking a while if I'm offline myself anyways (I'm usually in school), but what always bothered me is when people offered on a low time hatchling and then proceed to not respond for ages.

Especially if it's a trade I actually like.

 

That being said, I've been wondering what people have /actually/ been getting for bred metals that aren't CB or 2nd gen. Has anyone made a trade with one of those recently (like in the last day or two)?

I've seen a lot of people trying to trade them, but I haven't noticed whether or not they've had any success.

 

[_Sin_]

We just need variety... very badly... And we need the rares to go to people who don't have any, so they can fill the trade threads and produce new blood and lineages... (I have my metals, but I know people who don't and would be willing to gift their low gen offspring to people as well to help get more people in the game/trades.)

If I may... A tiny suggestion... If you want "new blood" and players participating, try offering for trade eggs that are not "parented" by Holidays. Obviously, I understand "my dragon, my breeding choice." But new players often do not have anything they can use to continue those lineages so why should they offer?

 

[Tirition]

See, I don't mind trades taking a while if I'm offline myself anyways (I'm usually in school), but what always bothered me is when people offered on a low time hatchling and then proceed to not respond for ages.

Especially if it's a trade I actually like.

 

That being said, I've been wondering what people have /actually/ been getting for bred metals that aren't CB or 2nd gen. Has anyone made a trade with one of those recently (like in the last day or two)?

I've seen a lot of people trying to trade them, but I haven't noticed whether or not they've had any success.

I personally haven't been able to trade my higher - gen (4th gen +) metals at all.

 

I have, however, been able to trade for other higher - gen metals, so I guess it's an even trade off?

 

(I also agree that more variety would be a good thing)

 

[Bu-tan]

.....But overall, I think I may just breed and drop the stuff in the departure threads and hope people who need the eggs can grab them and return the help. We need new breeders and new people in the trade threads. It's the same few people over and over again. The same couple people with ALL the CB metals, the same couple few with the Shimmers and desired Tinsels (who only trade amongst themselves it seems - but I may be wrong.)

 

We just need variety... very badly... And we need the rares to go to people who don't have any, so they can fill the trade threads and produce new blood and lineages... (I have my metals, but I know people who don't and would be willing to gift their low gen offspring to people as well to help get more people in the game/trades.) :[

^ This. This is why so many people were getting frustrated with not being able to catch metals in the cave. On top of the fact that not everyone has/had nice lineage metals for swaps. For the moment, however, swaps aren't really what is being asked for. It's other CBs. You want a CB Gold? Better bring shimmer/neglected/two CB silvers. Metal swaps only seem to go so far right now. [And that's even if you get lucky that your metals actually breed. I've only managed two silvers from the same metal during this entire time and I only traded one away. I gifted the other.]

 

Up till now, people who could not catch metals most likely could not catch blacks/stripes/trios either. Unless it was that rare occasion when the clouds parted and the planets alined. Most of us who had that hard of a time getting uncommons like that are pretty much stocking up while we can. I know I am. I'd rather not trade off things I've never had this good a chance getting unless I absolutely had nothing else to offer and even then I've found myself not wanting to part with the blacks and stripes I've gotten.

 

Some frustration also stems from not having the types of lineages asked for. Some just like to collecting in general, like I. I have more fun collecting in general then doing projects. Some of these lineage requests also request for things from spriter's alts, which narrows the field -even further-.

 

There is also something else I've noticed. Most people do not want to trade "down". That's why some offers have been sitting for so long. Why trade for a 4th Gen *insert breed* when they can just ask for a swap instead. Trading up is almost nearly impossible on some things.

 

And we really do need the cb metals getting dispersed among more people to widen possible swap/other trades if our trades aren't going to get widened to those outside the forums. I've been watching the poll lately and most who have answered in there of -veteran- players still don't have CBs after three-to-five years of playing.

 

*is always long-winded, sorry guys.*

[Vhale]

Sometimes I'll put a trade up before I head to sleep, but I try to mention that I'm plotting on leaving the trade up for awhile. Otherwise, I admit, half the reason is also that I hate to go digging around in the trade thread trying to find my post to edit it. There is probably an easier way to do it than I have been

 

One of my last trades, I put four trios up, two ice and two magma and warned that I was close to hatchy locked. So once I accepted the first two, I wouldn't accept the 2nd two for at least 24 hours. So I titled the links Slow Ice trade and Slow Magma trade. I got three offers each on the "fast" trades and only 1 altogether on the slow trades. So it does seem to make a difference to people that I posted I'd be accepting two of them after 24 hours, at best. Granted, no one with hatchies wants their trade fodder to sit around 3 days, get rejected and then it grows up on them.

 

/and agree with Bu-tan

 

The leetle gold hatchy on my scroll is thanks to sending a cb gold to a player that had none, that will breed the heck out of it.

 

One of the problems with the CB metals all going to the same pool of people is that they breed their slots and stop. So even if they could breed 15 2nd gens, they aren't going to until the first move. There were remarks about DC being a free market economy earlier. To me, it's more like how Diamonds are marketed. Diamonds are actually common. But one company controls the supply so well, that they have made them worth far more than other gems. It's not that they are rare, it's that the supply is tightly controlled.

Edited March 25, 2013 by Vhale

[Slaskia]

Sometimes I'll put a trade up before I head to sleep, but I try to mention that I'm plotting on leaving the trade up for awhile. Otherwise, I admit, half the reason is also that I hate to go digging around in the trade thread trying to find my post to edit it. There is probably an easier way to do it than I have been

You can click on your username and go to your profile (as if you were another user) and use the 'search for all posts by this user' option. That's what I did for trades I wanted to quote/edit, especially for threads that are fast moving.

 

That is, provided, one is not a very frequent poster....

 

On-topic: I've largely given up on trade atm unless I get something I know will 'move', like the CB Silver I caught last week.

[XiziX]

If I may... A tiny suggestion... If you want "new blood" and players participating, try offering for trade eggs that are not "parented" by Holidays. Obviously, I understand "my dragon, my breeding choice." But new players often do not have anything they can use to continue those lineages so why should they offer?

Yea, I stopped breeding my Metals to Holidays last year. Simply because that is what everyone else seems to do, and some people can't continue those babies.

 

So, good suggestion. :]

 

One of the problems with the CB metals all going to the same pool of people is that they breed their slots and stop. So even if they could breed 15 2nd gens, they aren't going to until the first move.

This too. Which is a HUGE problem that is really messing up the DC trading all together. The only people that can help change that, are those that have been hoarding the Metals and only trading them for 'Shimmers and other super rare things' from people who already have craploads of CB metals anyway. And I will add. Some of the people with the CB metals are having trouble trading for them to.

Here is my guess as to why:

 

- You have 6 CB Golds. You will only trade for Shimmers and Low Gen Tinsels.

 

- However, the people who have Low Gen Tinsels and Shimmers already have ridiculous amounts of what you are offering. (CB Metals or NDs)

 

- Therefore, the offer isn't really seen as that important or appealing because as I said before only a handful of people have all of the "wealth" in this game at the moment. (And it is questionable as to HOW they are the only ones who have them, but I can only guess.)

 

- Now, why are the Golds not buying Shimmers or whatever super rare they want? Because the people who have the wealth have so much of it they aren't sure what to ask/do with it. They have no value now because you already have everything and anything you could ever possibly want or need. And when you don't get what you want from your trade, you just keep it, and add it to the pile of endless rares that sit idly on the scroll. (I have yet to see the people with TONS of CB metals sit there giving away their low gens.)

 

- Meanwhile, the hundreds and hundreds of other players out there, who aren't in the little circle of "wealthy" people with handfuls of rares, are left out of the loop and unable to trade.

 

- Why? Because we have a few things going on:

• 1.) People who want the rares, but can't afford them, are still trying to trade for them while ignoring offers that are decent/match their trade values. Which then discourages other people from offering.

 

2.) What was once considered rare, is no longer. IE: Ratios are messed up and no one knows the values of anything anymore. (IE: Blacks and Stripes)

 

3.) The people who understand what the heck is going on are giving up trading because there is nothing they can do and are tired of the unbalance and frustration.

Edited March 25, 2013 by Lyxii

[Pink]

Wasn't the kind of the point of the metal surge though?

I mean, granted, metals are tightly controlled, but until now, metals were even more tightly controlled. Getting a 2nd gen gold or silver was nigh impossible. At least now there are more people on average with CB metals than there previously was. It's widened the breeding pool immensely.

Even if people do hoard, some of those eggs do (by sheer probability) go to people with few to none CB metals, and these are people who would have never had CBs otherwise.

 

 

The achievable trades I've seen people offer (pretty sure I saw a 7th or 8th gen shimmer for a few very specific CB hatchlings recently) have been gone in about 5 minutes, leaving behind only the trades that no one really wants. That would give the illusion that the trades are full of people asking for impossible things, but in reality, I think those are just the people who have no idea how to properly trade (this isn't including the shimmer people, however. THAT I completely understand, being as I've traded shimmers, and I know how many messages you get if you ask for non-shimmer or non-metal things)

 

I know most people just /want/ certain things and don't take time to research the value of certain dragons.

 

I also know that If I'm trading something rare and asking for something less than what it's worth, I /always/ delete the post afterwords or I get begging emails for days.

 

Finally, with all the low timed eggs in the ap, I've been locked nearly all week. I have no idea how anyone has space to trade anyways.

 

 

Edited March 25, 2013 by Pink