Lineage view change

[Natayah]

I don't think being hostile to TJ is going to illicit any response, and will probably get the thread shut down. I don't think him responding or not responding says anything about his game, personality, or judgement on how he admins things. Although I've been upset myself about this issue, I'm still going to breed dragons into the AP, and I'm still going to breed some lineages. I like high even gens, even if their first gen is hard to see.

 

I don't mind the smaller icon. I would just have a preference that all boxes be the same. So if there is some server load issue, please note I would be cool with a bunch of boxes that are all the same size. Then I know for certain lineages I just gotta zoom in or magnify the page.

 

However, I would like to keep this thread open in hopes that some response does come of it, or at least that someone is considering the comments. And I do hope for a response eventually. Because I do want to get rid of my banner ads but I am still holding out on donating until there is ... any response .... even if its vague or doesn't say much, in regards to this issue. Although, depending on the situation, and the way players sometimes overreact, I can understand choosing not to respond if its just not a high priority.

 

However, it would be awesome if any admin or mod could say _anything_ regarding this issue. Even if its just - there is no response at this time but maybe there will be later. At this point, I think people care less about the pictures or whatever issue there is or is not. We just want to know if this is gonna be the way things are going to be for awhile or not. Even if you can't tell us why for whatever reason. Or do you all want feedback or ideas with this? Because we'd be happy to give them in very constructive non-attacking ways if we knew what area to direct them towards.

[Iside]

What about create a signature banner to keep on saying we preferred the old lineage view? Something like the one about missing the frills.

 

If TJ sees a lot of people with it in their signature maybe he could rethink the change, unless there was a technical reason for it.

[grammydragon]

I don't think a banner in your signature will make a bit of difference in reality.

It hasn't for Frills.

 

Perhaps I am seeing a pattern where there is none, and I am frequently

wrong in my ideas, but...I feel like there is a process going on to change the

direction DC has been going. The amount of refusals increasing, the change

in the deadline-tombstone lineage viewing to discourage that practice,

the issues with the timing of views on fansite's to prevent Neglected's, the

frequency of new releases with increase in rares, and the increased

efforts to please those players using mobile devices to play on DC...just

some of the overall mood I get.

 

Perhaps it is a matter of trying to regain lost control, but I feel the wide

demographics of players is a nuisance to the focus of pleasing a smaller

focus group. Somebody please tell me I am all wrong.

Edited July 18, 2013 by grammydragon

[DarkEternity]

Well what if we tried to use Stylish to rewrite the table formatting?

[Kelkelen]

The people to whom the lineage views matter the most are EG breeders.

 

Most EG breeders are unhappy with the change, some to the point of quitting the game entirely.

 

I don't see any reason NOT to return to the former view, so as to keep a huge section of players happy, particularly as so many other non-breeders benefit from their efforts.

 

The only reason I can see to keep the change is if it somehow makes the site run markedly more smoothly.

 

As it stands now, with the silence on the admin end, we have NO idea why the change was made.

 

Also, enough discussion of it has arisen, such as this thread, that by now it's clear the players are being ignored. Naturally, bad feelings are brewing.

 

I would really appreciate some communication from "on high," even if it's just to say that concerns are noted and that we'll know more soon.

[whitebaron]

Well what if we tried to use Stylish to rewrite the table formatting?

That's a grey area: Usage of scripts on the site is banned, though its intended use per the ToS is to avoid cheating.

 

Also, I think it is setting a precedent I would not want to set: "It is ok for the admin to change the site against a large part of the userbase, because they'll just remove the change for themselves." No, no support from me for that kind of message.

Edited July 18, 2013 by whitebaron

[smileytechie]

That's a grey area: Usage of scripts on the site is banned, though its intended use per the ToS is to avoid cheating.

 

Also, I think it is setting a precedent I would not want to set: "It is ok for the admin to change the site against a large part of the userbase, because they'll just remove the change for themselves." No, no support from me for that kind of message.

The ToS bans "Using browser addons, scripts, or other tools that modify pages on the Dragon Cave site in order to give users of said addons an advantage over other users." I think that means that using addons etc. is only banned if it gives an advantage (e.g. in catching dragons). Modifying the lineage view would not give an advantage over other users, so I believe it would be okay.

 

To me, the possible bad precedent is outweighed by users leaving now. As a lineage maker not too bothered by the change itself, I worry more about fellow players leaving the game now, rather than possible future changes. Of course, that's assuming that players who hate the change will be willing to use a userstyle instead of leaving. If they aren't, the point is moot.

[grammydragon]

hmmm, might I just peek in to mention that I don't know what this

Script tech is that you are talking about. But, as much as I am disappointed

in current state of affairs, I am considering dropping the game rather than

messing with something that would get a scroll burned.

Edited July 18, 2013 by grammydragon

[Shadlok]

I know that since I opened this thread when the change first happened, tensions have gotten higher and I know people are unhappy. I have appealed to TJ to post in here and I know he read the message since I had it tracked. However, no response has come of it. I may try again in a few days.

 

However, I would like to ask if anyone would be willing to make a banner. It may not change things, but it is worth a shot.

[tjekan]

If TJ's not responding to email or forum posts about this, then unfortunately, that means he doesn't *want* to respond. Not that he wants to respond and just keeps forgetting to. He's already aware of the situation, and has decided not to answer. Sig banners or email campaigns aren't going to change anything.

[Fuzzbucket]

I still think he may be working on stuff and not ready to comment. He did already change the spiral and stairstep views.

[annageckos]

I still don't like the new look to the EG lineages. I cringe every time I see them. Still hoping that they get changed back.

[tjekan]

I still think he may be working on stuff and not ready to comment. He did already change the spiral and stairstep views.

Yes, I'm really hoping that he's working on adding the different views to our scroll options. That would make it a real addition to the site, not just an unpopular change.

 

My point is just, making little sig banners and sending TJ lots of email isn't going to change anything. Sending him money, as someone suggested, wouldn't change anything either. He already knows a lot of people aren't happy. Either he cares or he doesn't. Either he's working on an awesome fix or he isn't. Nothing we do externally is going to change his state at this point, because it already exists, and he's not talking to us, so it's impossible to know what that state is. Angel might as well make a "Save Schrodinger's cat!" banner. ;-)

Edited July 19, 2013 by tjekan

[Confused Cat]

Angel might as well make a "Save Schrodinger's cat!" banner. ;-)

 

 

 

[tjekan]

ROFLMAO!

[Shadlok]

Angel might as well make a "Save Schrodinger's cat!" banner. ;-)

Well excuse me for trying to do something more than rant about how TJ is an inadequate admin for not speaking in the thread.

 

I didn't want to make a banner as a campaign, I wanted to make a banner to reach a larger audience of people. Posting in here right now are the same handful of people, repeating how they are still unhappy or how they are still very content with the change. I intended instead to get more votes on the poll and more people's opinion. I don't want a "WE HATE TJ FOR CHAANGING OUR LAYOUT" campaign because that would be ridiculous and get our opinions nowhere. I want a banner inviting other people of the forum to come and let their opinions be heard too.

 

Concerning this, I care for people's opinions, and not a paradoxial/zombie cat.

 

In other words, I actually found that comment to be blunt and somewhat offensive because all I am trying to do is help to let the voice of all of us be heard.

[DarkEternity]

Seriously, if it is against the site rules to revert our even gen lineages back to the way they were before the change, I would quit. It's cheating now, is it? If reverting changes is actually unethical, then what about changing a lineage view without forewarning? A sin? Lol. :[

 

I don't think TJ's gonna change it back so it's time to live with the view, quit or fiddle with it by ourselves.

 

All the talk of banners, it's a good idea, but do you have any idea how truly pathetic that sounds? An section of the userbase, down on its knees, saying 'I know we can't do anything to change your mind, but would you consider changing it back?'

 

Nope. We're doomed. Doooomed.

Edited July 19, 2013 by DarkEternity

[Shadlok]

Seriously, if it is against the site rules to revert our even gen lineages back to the way they were before the change, I would quit. It's cheating now, is it? If reverting changes is actually unethical, then what about changing a lineage view without forewarning? A sin? Lol. :[

Among the 7 Deadly DC sins.

 

We wouldn't be doing it for personal gain, just for enjoyment of our lineages. I do not think we would be breaking ToS, considering we are not doing it to have anything more than any other player.

[dragonpuck]

 

I don't think TJ's gonna change it back so it's time to live with the view, quit or fiddle with it by ourselves.

 

or-- stop at 4th gen and make a lot more pretty lineages, since we won't be spending our time on the higher gens.

[Syleye]

or-- stop at 4th gen and make a lot more pretty lineages, since we won't be spending our time on the higher gens.

Ugh, If this has to happen I will be highly irritated. I have spent too much time working on building the blocks for a 6th gen song lineage comprised of Nebulas in a certain color order. Given how much of a pain it is to get them to color right, I don't want to throw the project out the window now.

[Sycamore]

Oh my goodness, this is amazing!

 

While I agree that 'campaigning' probably won't make a difference (and as much I'm afraid that the reason we haven't heard anything is because there's no chance it's going to change OR become optional), this is too spectacular not to use.

Edited July 19, 2013 by Sycamore

[prpldrgnfr]

Oh my goodness, this is amazing!

 

While I agree that 'campaigning' probably won't make a difference (and as much I'm afraid that the reason we haven't heard anything is because there's no chance it's going to change OR become optional), this is too spectacular not to use.

I totally agree with you! Only for me it's now more of a 'play the game however you want as long as it's one of the ways I want you to' protest. A lot of things have been changed lately that directly affect my personal play style.

[tjekan]

Concerning this, I care for people's opinions, and not a paradoxial/zombie cat.

 

In other words, I actually found that comment to be blunt and somewhat offensive because all I am trying to do is help to let the voice of all of us be heard.

Sorry you took it that way. I was trying to be humorous, not mean.

 

If you want to make a serious banner instead of the cat one then by all means go ahead. It's highly unlikely that a banner will actually catch TJ's attention or make your voice heard more than it already has been (has there ever been a lobbying banner on here that actually had an effect? Honest question, I can't think of one.) But there's no harm in your trying!

[Fuzzbucket]

If you want to make a serious banner instead of the cat one then by all means go ahead. It's highly unlikely that a banner will actually catch TJ's attention or make your voice heard more than it already has been (has there ever been a lobbying banner on here that actually had an effect? Honest question, I can't think of one.) But there's no harm in your trying!

You may use the image from my avatar along with it

[missy_]

and the increased efforts to please those players using mobile devices to play on DC...just some of the overall mood I get.

grammydragon, I am on a mobile device and I dislike this lineage view -- not only in even gens but in Stairstep and other types of lineages.

 

<snip> maybe he could rethink the change, unless there was a technical reason for it.

 

As for where this may have originated, my best guess is here in Suggesions/Requests. (Or maybe not. But that suggestion relates directly to this issue.) If that was what he implemented, he did not implement the full suggestion, which included a suggestion to allow us to click to restore the original view.