We want Forum Feedback!

[Troya-Shel]

We have addressed the complaints from members concerning the CP posts, many times.

Most members that complain about them, do not welcome members. Members need to ask themselves, How many times do I post in Introductions?

 

As the welcome posts disappear after a short time, I really thought, that this is not wished or might be considered as spam.

 

We tell members to link their scrolls in their signatures:

1. They are new, asking questions, and we need to see their scrolls to answer most of the time.

2. It helps avoid warning them for scroll spam.3. If the do not have a scroll or don't choose to add it, they do not have to.

 

This I really do understand and accept.

 

When I post in intros, I try just to say hi, because I know other people have the links that some new users find hard to find on the forum handy. I think if all the people that don't like the copy'pastas would pop in to the intro section more to just say hi and welcome to the forum, maybe that would help? :3

 

It is not the copy'pastas intros. I think a lot of people avoid saying - Hi Welcome, because it could be treated as spam. The information is neccessary, maybe it could just be written..a bit nicer.

 

At the beginning (first few days) I actually thought Z was a computer, that just posted the same things.

 

Dear Z, I know now, you are not a computer and you have also helped me, very kindly, where I did not know where to post something.

 

Are other smilies allowed here ? In Germany we use so cute smilies, that I just cannot find here on this board.

[Obscure_Trash]

Next to a post your posting are "Clickable Smilies". At the bottom of that box it says "Show All" so we do have a few more smileys, but I agree that most of them aren't too cute. x3 Kanaye has a list of smiley's she encourages other users to use right here. So, you can use other smiley's, but you'll have to find them elsewhere and post them as images here. I believe there's a topic around here for different smilies, though, if you'd like me to find it for you. :3

[Troya-Shel]

Next to a post your posting are "Clickable Smilies". At the bottom of that box it says "Show All" so we do have a few more smileys, but I agree that most of them aren't too cute. x3 Kanaye has a list of smiley's she encourages other users to use right here. So, you can use other smiley's, but you'll have to find them elsewhere and post them as images here. I believe there's a topic around here for different smilies, though, if you'd like me to find it for you. :3

Thank you. I do know where I can get really great smilies. I just did not know if I was allowed to use them. This is differant from Forum to Forum.

[~!~]

I think a lot of people avoid saying - Hi Welcome, because it could be treated as spam.

Not only would it be treated as spam, it would feel like spam, to me, anyway. That's why I don't post in the intro section. Nearly every thread in there is just "hey I had to post this so here I go" and they never look at it again. Posting anything that isn't unique and helpful would make me feel I'm just trying to boost my own post count.

[HeatherMarie]

this forum dosent do anything that reflects on the game i bet most good dragons and bsas are rejected all the bsas i liked are rejected

this forum is poorly run and MOST OF ALL TOOO STRICT

I just have to add my 2cents here, because the Dragon Requests and BSAs are one part of the forum that I really think does most things right.

 

The BSA subsection in particular, since I spent more time there: I love that there is a stickied "Section Guidelines", and that most (not all, but most) of the stuff that would be shot down fast are outlined in those guidelines. I've complained about the vagueness of some rules on this forum, but the BSA section seems to be an exception. I see tons of BSAs shot down, and I've commented/shot down more then a few myself, but I've hardly ever seen BSAs that follow the guidelines and actually make sense get shot down without tons of discussion beforehand.

[NixAyum]

So fouramz feedback? I'd love to see a dragon-themed oekaki section. 8D

Dragon oekaki? o-o What's that?

[purpledragonclaw]

It's Japanese for "dragon doodling".

[Classycal]

Spam is defined very clearly in the forum rules -

No, it really isn't.

 

The rules note:

Messages that do not contribute to the topic or forum are considered spam and the poster will receive a warning.

And that is up to a lot of interpretation. It needs to be more specific.

 

[Infinis]

No, it really isn't.

 

The rules note:

And that is up to a lot of interpretation. It needs to be more specific.

More specific how? TBH it really doesn't help just to say "it needs to be more specific". WE need specifics on how you want it more defined. n_n

 

That is actually quite clear from what I can tell, though. It specifically says that off-topic messages that don't contribute to the topic at hand or the particular forum are spam. Off-topic messages like posting "i love pokemanz" in a topic about animal cruelty (or a different video game, even) is spam. It's hard to interpret something that specific another way, for me anyway...

[Classycal]

From _Z_

In reply to the Spam complaint. Spam is spam it is clearly defined in the board rules. If you know your posting spam, it is pointless to complain about being warned.

As I noted above, I don't think the definition is clear at all. I had no idea I was posting spam because I didn't interpret the rule the same way the mod did. And I must not be the only one because a lot of people answered the question that was considered spam. I just think the rules should be more clear. I now understand what is considered spam on this board, but a lot of people obviously don't because I'm seeing it happen quite frequently. And I don't think you can blame that on a lack of reading the rules.

 

And I obviously should still quake in my boots before posting anything since I was reprimanded for what I said. Should that have happened in such a thread?

 

 

From Infinis

Off-topic messages like posting "i love pokemanz" in a topic about animal cruelty (or a different video game, even) is spam. It's hard to interpret something that specific another way, for me anyway...

But, see, that’s just it... It was not so obvious as what you note. It’s not as if, suddenly, in the midst of the topic, I said something like, “Hey, guys, you seen that new 3D movie that’s out?”

 

Maybe I didn’t get the reference to “spam” as used here because I wasn’t raised with PC’s. When I went to college, I typed my research papers on a typewriter. I feel like I have to be a super computer guru to know what’s going on with this site, but I’m not computer illiterate, and, in fact, have taught some various job specific computer classes. The spam as referenced here still threw me, and I don’t know how to tell you to be more specific.

 

[TJ09]

I think the problem here is that the people who understand the rule, well, understand it, and thus don't know what isn't clear. And the people who don't understand it, well, don't understand it, so they don't know what they don't know.

[skinst]

SPAM = Stupid Pointless Annoying Message.

 

By that definition alone, SPAM itself is extremely subjective because what constitutes as spam to one might not be to another.

 

However, I do agree that I think the idea of 'off topic chatter' being a warnable offence is a bad idea. Topics are going to be derailed every now and then, and that isn't always a bad thing.

 

There is a difference between 'stupid pointless annoying messages' and a thread whose subject matter has changed, and that I think is what needs to be addressed.

[MURDERcomplexx]

Some off-topic chatter's no big deal, but when it's something like two pages of talking about your cats in a thread about food, that's when we have a problem.

Or even if it's something slightly relevant to the topic, like the tangents about religion in the gay rights thread. That I could understand. But if someone brings up a dream about llamas in spandex in the gay rights thread, that's just plain off-topic spam.

 

Some off-topicness is fine. It just...should at least be relevant somehow to the topic that it's in.

[Obscure_Trash]

As I noted above, I don't think the definition is clear at all. I had no idea I was posting spam because I didn't interpret the rule the same way the mod did.

 

The topic was about the Festival of Eggs.

 

The question was about the magikarp badge.

 

That seems off-topic to me?

 

Yes, thread conversations evolve. Sometimes we can get conversations that wander for a bit and can seem off topic. That just recently happened in the Gay Marriage/Rights thread. The conversation started turning into Religion and after we realized it was getting away from the right topic, it was brought over to the Religion thread so the conversation could be continued.

 

However, posting about your dog in the gay marriage thread from out of nowhere, would also be spam. Kind of like what happened in the news thread.

 

I honestly just don't know how to make the rules more clear for those that are confused. I'd be happy to hear your suggestions, though. :3

[HeatherMarie]

However, I do agree that I think the idea of 'off topic chatter' being a warnable offence is a bad idea. Topics are going to be derailed every now and then, and that isn't always a bad thing.

This, Sock. This is exactly how many of us feel.

 

Going into, say, a BSA thread, and posting "i like kittens!" would of course be spam. That's obvious.

 

It's not so obvious that, in a News thread about dragons, if someone asks a question about dragons this is a little bit off-topic, answering said question can get you warned. That's not obvious at all, and it kind of stinks. Sure, the question was off-topic, but it was still about the site... And being nice enough to answer the question shouldn't mean a warn.

 

So see, it's a matter of degrees. There's blatant hit-you-over-the-head SPAM, and then there is more subtle, simply sort of off-topic, and it's not at all obvious that "Messages that do not contribute to the topic or forum" includes semi-off-topic questions.

 

And then I could add that "not contributing" is very subjective in and of itself. Are the things that I'm posting in this post "contributing" to the topic, or am I just trying to prove a point or somesuch? The fact that it doesn't SAY what is spam, only that messages that "do not contribute".... That is very subjective. And since that's the only rule we have to go by.... Yeah. Confusion.

[Troya-Shel]

Rules are necessary. Too many rules make things confusing though. And a-lot of work for the mods.

 

In my forum I handel this problem differantly. OK - we only have about 6 thousend members and not over 55 thousand, but it is usually about the same amount of members, that actually post. The bulk is silent readers.

 

If the topic gets off-topic it really depends how.

 

Talking about kittens and co. - please go to the tea-room. Our tea-room is similar to a chat-room, just on the forum in an area that guests cannot see.

 

Talk about something that could be important - please make a new topic, this could be interessting for others and will not be seen in this thread.

 

When an off-topic question stays like - question - answer - finished - I do nothing.

 

I have though also closed topics that got to heated up.

 

When the site is down - why not leave a thread, where the members can complain, whine, give infos, wish TJ good luck fixing things. In order to get information - a seperate news thread.

When the problem is solved, the threads can get closed and deleted.

 

This is a forum for games. Games are fun. Let the members have - somewhere a little fun.

 

Give them information instead of warns time to time.

 

Hey - that what you are doing belongs here or here or there. For example: I had no idea about the Congrats Thread, found it by chance just a little while ago.

[Lalasa]

I love the Dragon Cave forums, it's nice looking, there are ready made buttons for links and colors that makes posting easy, and I have yet to meet someone extremely rude.

 

There's one thing I don't like, and it's the Online List. If I want to find a specific forum user, I have to look very carefully because the text is so small and crammed together, it hurts my eyes. Perhaps have a separate page that has the whole online list with easier to read text? Or a feature that lets you see if your contacts are online? It would be much appreciated if I could find online people easier.

 

You see, I have a cousin on the forums and I would like to be able to see if she's still on after a post without murdering my eyeballs in the process.

Edited May 6, 2011 by Lalasa

[Infinis]

I love the Dragon Cave forums, it's nice looking, there are ready made buttons for links and colors that makes posting easy, and I have yet to meet someone extremely rude.

 

There's one thing I don't like, and it's the Online List. If I want to find a specific forum user, I have to look very carefully because the text is so small and crammed together, it hurts my eyes. Perhaps have a separate page that has the whole online list with easier to read text? Or a feature that lets you see if your contacts are online? It would be much appreciated if I could find online people easier.

 

You see, I have a cousin on the forums and I would like to be able to see if she's still on after a post without murdering my eyeballs in the process.

At the bottom of the online list underneath the name you should see options titled "last click" and "member name". If I need to see if someone is online I click "member name" and find them there, because it brings up a list that is much easier to read. :3 Just make sure your cousin isn't going on the forums as an anonymous user, as the lists don't show members going as anonymous. ^^

 

 

[RainDear]

I have been having a problem with the "member name" list for several days. It seems to cut off somewhere in the Ss or Ts even when there are members whose names are farther on in the alphabet on line.

 

Am I the only one who feels having a list of words/terms not acceptable for use on the forums accessible to/from the forums that they aren't to be used on is contradictory? I think that if a word that seems acceptable, but has a slang meaning not necessarily known to all persons for whom English is a second language, or who have a different English speaking culture, then getting a warn should be seen as a learning experience, not a punishment. Now you know that the word has a meaning you were unaware of, and you won't use that word here, again.

 

I think that the "unfriendly" atmosphere observed on the forums comes more often from members that answer questions with "You should read the FAQS" or "Wrong place to ask questions, you should have asked here" without even bothering to answer the question. I would hope that members could at least offer an answer with the correction, rather than just reprimanding the new member. When I first got here, I was overwhelmed by the amount of information I was expected to "know" before posting, and when I saw some of these responses I was not only afraid to ask questions, I was afraid to answer those questions I knew the answers to on the forum. I wound up answering questions by pm, so I wouldn't get into trouble for posting incorrectly. This feeling of being overwhelmed is the very reason I started mentoring before there was a project. If I saw someone who seemed to be struggling, I pmed them with the information I wished someone had given me at first.

Edited May 6, 2011 by raindear

[CatCreature]

At the bottom of the online list underneath the name you should see options titled "last click" and "member name". If I need to see if someone is online I click "member name" and find them there, because it brings up a list that is much easier to read. :3 Just make sure your cousin isn't going on the forums as an anonymous user, as the lists don't show members going as anonymous. ^^

Personally, I just do a search. (Ctrl+F on PC, dunno Mac) A bit tricky if you don't know the name of the user you're searching for.

[Lalasa]

At the bottom of the online list underneath the name you should see options titled "last click" and "member name". If I need to see if someone is online I click "member name" and find them there, because it brings up a list that is much easier to read. :3 Just make sure your cousin isn't going on the forums as an anonymous user, as the lists don't show members going as anonymous. ^^

The thing is Infinis, she could have suddenly posted then automatically gone off. So that means in the end I will still have to look at the online list. (I say this because leaving suddenly is a bad habit of mine)

And yes, my cousin has an account.

Plus the Member Name list confuzzles me. Is it too much to ask for a bigger, full page version of the online list which you could click on as a link to see?

Edited May 6, 2011 by Lalasa

[skinst]

I honestly just don't know how to make the rules more clear for those that are confused. I'd be happy to hear your suggestions, though. :3

Well, I think it's not about changing the rules so much as not being so strict with it.

 

For example: Abortion thread, Solar posts. Everyone asks her how her surgery went because everyone knew she was having it. It still involves abortion because it's discussing the female anatomy, yet it's not about abortion.

 

Gay Marriage thread: NobleOwl was about to have a kid. Everyone asks her about it. Still involving gay marriage since she is in a relationship with another woman, yet it's not about gay marriage.

 

See what I mean?

[Classycal]

From SockPuppet Strangler

The topic was about the Festival of Eggs.

 

The question was about the magikarp badge.

It wasn’t that simple, Sock. People were asking questions about where folks were finding the Easter eggs. I mentioned that I found my first one while using the splash BSA (shallow water dragons). Someone then asked how that worked and several people answered. You make it sound like someone suddenly pulled the question from thin air. There are shades of gray.

 

It seems it would have been much nicer to remind folks (in the thread) that they needed to get back on topic and that the splash BSA wasn’t on topic in your mind. I see it as contributing to the forum. And in other threads you have reminded folks to get back on topic. But maybe you gave them warnings, too. But what really upset me after the fact was that I saw you posting spam repeatedly in a topic. And, no, I don’t remember which topic.

 

 

From Marie 19R

QUOTE (skinst @ May 5 2011, 10:32 PM)

However, I do agree that I think the idea of 'off topic chatter' being a warnable offence is a bad idea. Topics are going to be derailed every now and then, and that isn't always a bad thing.

 

This, Sock. This is exactly how many of us feel.

Yes, it is.

 

 

From Marie 19R

It's not so obvious that, in a News thread about dragons, if someone asks a question about dragons this is a little bit off-topic, answering said question can get you warned. That's not obvious at all, and it kind of stinks. Sure, the question was off-topic, but it was still about the site... And being nice enough to answer the question shouldn't mean a warn.

Exactly. You sound like you have been there.

 

 

From Marie 19R

So see, it's a matter of degrees. There's blatant hit-you-over-the-head SPAM, and then there is more subtle, simply sort of off-topic, and it's not at all obvious that "Messages that do not contribute to the topic or forum" includes semi-off-topic questions.

 

And then I could add that "not contributing" is very subjective in and of itself. Are the things that I'm posting in this post "contributing" to the topic, or am I just trying to prove a point or somesuch? The fact that it doesn't SAY what is spam, only that messages that "do not contribute".... That is very subjective. And since that's the only rule we have to go by.... Yeah. Confusion. 

Exactly again.

 

 

When I first got here, I was overwhelmed by the amount of information I was expected to "know" 

Yes, it is overwhelming. Plus it’s not always easy to find.

 

[Obscure_Trash]

I did PM TJ about the member list thing. I'm not sure what's up with it. :<

 

Those are interesting examples, skins - but what happened with them? Official warn, verbal warn, nothing?

 

If you wanna find the posts where I spammed and PM them to me, I'll even go warn myself.

We do have a whole Help section and a topic on splash in Site Discussion. However, please note that you did get your warn removed. If I didn't send you a PM for that, please let me know, as I've been attempting to remember to send PMs for all warn actions, as per user request in this topic. If I'm still forgetting, it'd be good to know, so I can work on it.

 

I see many of you saying "this is subjective" but no one offering up something maybe less subjective. Even if it's not how mods are interpreting the rule, it would give us an idea of how to clear things up for you or even a better idea of what you're looking for.

 

If we're being too strict and TJ agrees, as they are his rules, I will loosen up.

 

~

 

When new users join, there is a big box of important links before they post a certain number of times. However, if people have a way to make this more clear/the site easier to navigate, even after the box goes away, please let us know.

Edited May 7, 2011 by SockPuppet Strangler

[skinst]

Those are interesting examples, skins - but what happened with them? Official warn, verbal warn, nothing?

I know verbal warns were handed out, but I can't see if other people get official warns so I'm not sure if anyone else did. ^^;;

 

But basically, a lot of people were put off by it because a LOT of people were very curious about both subjects, and we couldn't chat about it. Considering both topics are rather active, I'm pretty sure it would have gone back to both topics at hand after the inquiry was over.

 

When new users join, there is a big box of important links before they post a certain number of times. However, if people have a way to make this more clear/the site easier to navigate, even after the box goes away, please let us know.

 

I just opened a new browser so I could have a look through the links (since it's been 2 1/2 years since I saw them, lol) and realised what might be the issue:

 

FAQ is very thorough, but it's HUGE.

 

Very, very few people are going to read through all of that. It's incredibly overwhelming to newbies.

 

So I am going to dissect the Site Rules page a little, since it's short and to the point:

 

Respect Others

It isn't possible to get far in the world if you refuse to respect others. Treat others kindly, don't insult them, and others will do the same in return. If you refuse to treat others well, then you will get not only a warning, but a bad reputation, which opens the door for more negativity.

 

I'd suggest adding a link to here for those who are new to forum behavior. Very helpful and it's a light read.

 

No Spam

No one likes spam, it clutters the board, so don't contribute to the problem. Messages that do not contribute to the topic or forum are considered spam and the poster will receive a warning.

 

Very, VERY subjective (sorry Sock ) and for a newbie, probably rather difficult to know what spam is. Not to mention, it would probably scare any newbie half to death.

 

I propose rewording this entirely, and posting a link to the Help Section so the newbies know where to go in case they have a question. Better yet, the Tiny Little Questions thread.

 

No "(Please read the forum rules)" Posts or Topics

There are tons of people doing this, yet their dragons are almost hatched and they still have over 6 days left. Most people don't need the clicks desperately enough to spam the entire forum to get them. Put a link to your scroll in your sig and post them on other sites (providing you do not break that site's rules) and you'll be fine.

 

Too wordy. I'd add a link to the last part of the FAQ demonstrating how a newbie can put their scroll in their signature and rewording this to something like:

 

"Do not post your scroll or eggs anywhere on the forum. You may put a link to your scroll in your signature only. If you are unsure how to do this, please visit here [insert FAQ link] and follow the instructions."

 

No Eggs/Dragons in Signatures

Because this is a forum created for Dragon Cave, there is a much higher ratio of Dragon Cave members to non-members than on most forums. Thus, if eggs were allowed in signatures, there would be a higher concentration of dragons/hatchlings/eggs on this forum. This leads to egg spam, which is prohibited in the above rule.

 

I propose combining this rule with the one above.

 

Use Constructive Criticism

When someone posts their art or other types of creation, they generally do not want it insulted or put down. If you do not like a work, post how you feel it could be better; Offer suggestions for improvement, but do not insult the creative works of others.

 

For this, I think linking to the Artist Equitique thread in said section is best. A lot of people won't know how to crit something constructively, so therefore a short guide on it is best. If the one in that section is too long, I reccomend this one instead.

 

Keep it PG-13

This means no ****ography, extreme violence, or even swearing. Attempts to bypass the censor will get you warned.

 

A link to what PG-13 entails is probably a good idea.

 

Post Content

Posts may neither contain nor link to any of the following content:

Adult material (Nudity or ****ography)

Viruses, Spyware, Malware

Illegal Downloads

Threatening, harrassing, or obscene content

 

Pretty straight forward, so I see no reason for changes.

 

Read pinned topics and make sure to post in the right section

Pinned topics are there for the benefit of all. They save members from having to recreate the same common topics, and save mods the time of reviewing posts. Duplicate topics are a waste of both your time and the time of the moderation team, so any duplicate topic will be closed and their poster will receive a warning.

 

A link to the search feature of the forum would work wonders.

 

*phew* Hope that helps some. :3