Trading Hub Feedback

[HeatherMarie]

Well, 'extensive research', no. But if someone specifies that they are *only* looking for, say, '(this breed) not related to (this link)', then I think it's in the offerer's best interests to actually see what it is the person wants. Just offering stuff randomly isn't very likely to get you anywhere, and *is* very likely to piss people off. I don't think it's too much to ask for people to click one little link if there were some sort of wishlist link attached to a trade. And I guess if someone can't be bothered to do that, that's fine, they just might not get as many offers accepted because they aren't offering the right things.

[StormWizard212]

Personally, I'd prefer to not have a text-based in-cave wishlist system. I like having a small, brief field to look at that tells me exactly what people want. If there's something more specific you're after, I think it's much more effective to post on the forum where you can post pictures of what you're after that can help people determine if they have what you want with a quick glance. Unless the feature is something similar (click the tiles of the breeds you're willing to accept for this trade) then I'm not really on board with a lengthy text-based wishlist. 

 

I would definitely like a 'have' box to describe the dragon on offer. I'd also be happy with a generation marker for offers, but I'm not really that fussed about it. 

Edited June 13, 2018 by StormWizard212

[49ER]

well I do look at "not related to this" that is put on their want on trade.  But there are people who have 50 or more prizes, that want someone to look at long spreadsheet, or they want you to check scroll.  There is nothing I want bad enough to do that.  

[HeatherMarie]

15 minutes ago, StormWizard212 said:

Personally, I'd prefer to not have a text-based in-cave wishlist system. I like having a small, brief field to look at that tells me exactly what people want. If there's something more specific you're after, I think it's much more effective to post on the forum where you can post pictures of what you're after that can help people determine if they have what you want with a quick glance. Unless the feature is something similar (click the tiles of the breeds you're willing to accept for this trade) then I'm not really on board with a lengthy text-based wishlist. 

 

I would definitely like a 'have' box to describe the dragon on offer. I'd also be happy with a generation marker for offers, but I'm not really that fussed about it. 

 

The thing is, not all people are looking for something that can be expressed in a small, brief field (or in breed pictures). And 'just go to the forum' isn't really a great alternative because there are many users who don't have a forum account, or *can't* have a forum account for whatever reason. Now that there is an in-cave trading area, there needs to be an adequate way to express Wants *in-cave*. I'd be fine with simply expanding the character-limit in the current Want field, honestly. But as it stands right now it is very limiting. I mean, right now the best I can do is something like ' (Anything) really messy-lineaged, 10th-gen+ preferred', which isn't really adequate when many people's definition of 'messy' is totally different then mine. If I add 'no stairsteps or even-gens' to that, there is no room to actually put any specific breeds. I'm honestly not expecting people to read a whole essay or anything, but I really would like *some* sort of expansion on our 'Wants' abilities, because right now the Trading Hub is very very limiting to anyone who isn't looking for something very specific/short.

[49ER]

Well if someone does not use forum, then we are no worse off than before. For those that do, you could direct them to your siggy or profile, but chances are, people won't look anyway.  As it is, I can request CB Green Gemshard and I get an offers that are neither CB, nor gemshard, nor even green.

[HeatherMarie]

There will always be people who simply don't read, or don't care, no matter what the Wants says and how concise/specific it is. Nothing will stop that. But for those who do read, a bit more detail in the Wants would be a very helpful thing. I mean, there is a difference between someone offering something I don't want because they don't care what I actually ask for, and someone offering something I don't want because there wasn't room to actually express what I Want. Having a better way to specify Wants is a good thing for both sides.

[Ribombee]

1 hour ago, HeatherMarie said:

There will always be people who simply don't read, or don't care, no matter what the Wants says and how concise/specific it is. Nothing will stop that. But for those who do read, a bit more detail in the Wants would be a very helpful thing. I mean, there is a difference between someone offering something I don't want because they don't care what I actually ask for, and someone offering something I don't want because there wasn't room to actually express what I Want. Having a better way to specify Wants is a good thing for both sides.

 

Exactly this! I have one person who offers on almost every trade I put up, always offering some super messy line when I specifically say no messy lines or long lines. I pretty much just automatically reject their offer at this point. However, I also get offers of people who are clearly trying, but they just don't know what I want. I ask to PM me, and some do, but likely a lot do not have forum accounts. If their scroll name is the same as their forum name, I will sometimes PM them to let them know I am considering an offer or what have you, too. We don't need scroll-to-scroll communication, I agree. We do need some way of making things a little easier. Even being able to link to a group to say, "Any 2 perfect mates for dragons from this group: link", but that takes up so much of the space on the wants that it is not really doable right now without using tinyurl, which many people will not want to open because you can't see what it is. I don't think we should encourage the use of tinyurl, anyway, because it would not take long for someone to abuse it, unfortunately. I would not mind a tiny space for a scroll wishlist (if said wishlist had the ability to link to lineage views and/or groups), but even the ability to link to groups at all would really help. For example, I would happily trade a lower tier rare for a variety of mates I need, but not all of the mates I need. I could just make a group for the ones I would be willing to trade away a zyu, trio, or xeno (for example) and say, "Any perfect mate for dragons from this group: link". I think the biggest problem right now is that when we had Dragon Market, there was room to specify mates and markers to say we wanted lined or CB offers. It is pretty easy to offer a CB and ask for another CB in return, much less so to ask for lineages, especially when OFFERING lineages so we need to give a brief description of what we are offering like, "4th gen red(m) x silver checker. Funny code. Want 4th gen silver from silver(m) x ice checker." DC has evolved a lot since lineages and trading became available, and now a huge amount of players dedicate most of their time to lineage building.

[Toyo]

Another reason I'd like more room is:

 

If my scroll is hidden, which it is always now thanks to viewbombing, I'd love to have the space to say, "can accept 2 eggs or up to 3 hatchlings." I've been getting offers with 4 eggs, and I end up declining because there's no way to let them know I can only take 2. 

 

With cramming in "haves" and "wants" into the tiny box, there's obviously no room.

[Fuzzbucket]

I am hugely amused by all the people offering 3 and 4 EGGS. I don't know when I would last  have had space to make on offer on something like that.... As for the optimism of some requests....

[HeatherMarie]

20 minutes ago, Fuzzbucket said:

I am hugely amused by all the people offering 3 and 4 EGGS. I don't know when I would last  have had space to make on offer on something like that.... As for the optimism of some requests....

 

lol Oh you mean the trades that have a long-lineaged messy and ask for a CB rare? I giggle at those too, those are most likely people who aren't on the forums so don't know the general worth of things.... And then I often offer on them, since I actually like that kind of stuff.

 

edit: Can we PLEEEEASE get a confirmation when we click Decline? Please please please? I just had a great offer on my trade and accidentally clicked the wrong link! We have to put in our password to accept, why isn't it the same for decline? That's so frustrating! 

Edited June 13, 2018 by HeatherMarie

[Fuzzbucket]

We don't ? WOW, I had no idea... I agree; we should. An unwise decline is almost worse than a whoops accept ! Can you remember who it was and message them here?

[Ribombee]

42 minutes ago, Fuzzbucket said:

I am hugely amused by all the people offering 3 and 4 EGGS. I don't know when I would last  have had space to make on offer on something like that.... As for the optimism of some requests....

 

Yeah, this keeps being a problem. There is an offer right now I want to accept for one of the eggs offered, but I don't have room for 4 eggs. >_> I can fortunately incuhatch two and make it work in a bit if they don't withdraw the offer first, but it can definitely be difficult! I know why people do it; they want to do bulk to make up for lower value, which would be fine in a game that did not have limits on growing things. Less so in DC. Hehe.

Edited June 13, 2018 by Ribombee

[Fuzzbucket]

That kind of trade NEEDS to be on forum, so one can accept some and save some for later.

[Ribombee]

Just now, Fuzzbucket said:

That kind of trade NEEDS to be on forum, so one can accept some and save some for later.

 

99% sure this person doesn't have a forum account. *Shrugs* Not much that can be done about that other than some more space to say how many eggs we can accept. 

[Shadowdrake]

This thread has gotten pretty darn big, so I'm going to try to organize the suggestions here. This post is just a very rough listing; tomorrow or later I'll post again (or edit, if no one's posted yet) with them categorized.

 

Suggestions that TJ have already addressed:

• Pagination -- tentative confirmation
• "Have:" field -- tentative confirmation
• Previously declined offer reminder -- being considered
• Saved trades -- unlikely to happen, trades come and go too quickly
• Offer on multiple trades -- he seems uncertain on this, citing spam offers

 

Current unsorted list of suggestions (geez!):

• Pagination addressed
• Some sort of generation or CB indication on the eggs/hatchlings displayed
• Filter for lineage gen
• Previously declined offer reminder addressed
• Decline confirmation
• Display offer for decline and accept pages
• Saved trades addressed
• Offer on multiple trades* -- tentatively addressed
• Anonymous trade creation/offering
• "Have:" field addressed
• Bigger "Want:" field, or additional place for associate links (forum, group, etc)
• "Contact:" field
• More specific search terms ("___", etc)
• Notification for people who are too locked for the trade to go through
• Small, possibly preset messages for declines or pending trades
• Larger optional message accessible from all of your trades
• Let trader take only part of the offer
• Freebie area
• Display # of magis available
• Include scroll name in search criteria
• Option to block a specific person from seeing your trade after multiple declined offers on the same trade
• Prevent an identical offer from being re-offered
• Hide spam offers
• Hide trades you're not interested in
• Dragons in trading hub redirect to lineage links
• Edit trade post info
• Edit from private to public trade

 

Feel free to comment if there are any I've overlooked. I mostly skimmed the latter half, as it looks like people have gone over all the suggestions a couple times at least.

Edited June 13, 2018 by Shadowdrake

[Thuban]

12 hours ago, olympe said:

Hmm, it seems that communication for trading is key. On the other hand, direct scroll-to-scroll communication is a no-go for many of us. So it would help if...

• ... we could create a general wishlist on a page linked to on our scrolls. Since this is strictly on DC only, it would be okay to link to your wishlist in your trade. (Free-form? Stock phrases? Egg/hatchie icons with short descriptions? Lineage for mate search?)
•  

Hmm.. something like /user/name/wishlist could work in theory. It would need to be bound by the rules that are normally applied in the cases where we have been able to write messages, and the ability to report inappropriate/rule breaking messages would need to exist. If a trade is too complicated to be able to fit it into the current box, then an option to link /that/ page (a simple "click here for more information" linky) would keep it clear and concise without messing up current set up. It wouldnt be scroll to scroll communication, as its not really that different from linking to your christmas tree or something silly.

[TJ09]

39 minutes ago, Shadowdrake said:

This thread has gotten pretty darn big, so I'm going to try to organize the suggestions here. This post is just a very rough listing; tomorrow or later I'll post again (or edit, if no one's posted yet) with them categorized.

 

Suggestions that TJ have already addressed:

• Pagination -- tentative confirmation
• "Have:" field -- tentative confirmation
• Previously declined offer reminder -- being considered
• Saved trades -- unlikely to happen, trades come and go too quickly
• Offer on multiple trades -- he seems uncertain on this, citing spam offers

 

Current unsorted list of suggestions (geez!):

• Pagination addressed
• Some sort of generation or CB indication on the eggs/hatchlings displayed
• Filter for lineage gen
• Previously declined offer reminder addressed
• Decline confirmation
• Display offer for decline and accept pages
• Saved trades addressed
• Offer on multiple trades* -- tentatively addressed
• Anonymous trade creation/offering
• "Have:" field addressed
• Bigger "Want:" field, or additional place for associate links (forum, group, etc)
• "Contact:" field
• More specific search terms ("___", etc)
• Notification for people who are too locked for the trade to go through
• Small, possibly preset messages for declines or pending trades
• Larger optional message accessible from all of your trades
• Let trader take only part of the offer
• Freebie area
• Display # of magis available
• Include scroll name in search criteria
• Option to block a specific person from seeing your trade after multiple declined offers on the same trade
• Prevent an identical offer from being re-offered
• Hide spam offers
• Hide trades you're not interested in
• Dragons in trading hub redirect to lineage links
• Edit trade post info
• Edit from private to public trade

 

Feel free to comment if there are any I've overlooked. I mostly skimmed the latter half, as it looks like people have gone over all the suggestions a couple times at least.

Let me just say I promise I've been reading the whole thread even if I stopped giving individual confirmations to every single thing.

 

At this point I'm mostly looking for patterns in usability, especially since there was (and to some extent still is) the potential for larger changes to the new birthday features that may make some of the smaller requests irrelevant. Eventually I'll want individual threads to allow things to get proper discussion without having literally dozens of different ideas being tossed around in the same place, but until I'm done iterating on some of the initial promises (like redoing the trade page--the page for viewing someone else's page has been rewritten, and the self trade page isn't far behind) which will simultaneously address some common requests here and make it easier to accomplish others.

[StormWizard212]

6 hours ago, HeatherMarie said:

 

The thing is, not all people are looking for something that can be expressed in a small, brief field (or in breed pictures). And 'just go to the forum' isn't really a great alternative because there are many users who don't have a forum account, or *can't* have a forum account for whatever reason. Now that there is an in-cave trading area, there needs to be an adequate way to express Wants *in-cave*. I'd be fine with simply expanding the character-limit in the current Want field, honestly. But as it stands right now it is very limiting. I mean, right now the best I can do is something like ' (Anything) really messy-lineaged, 10th-gen+ preferred', which isn't really adequate when many people's definition of 'messy' is totally different then mine. If I add 'no stairsteps or even-gens' to that, there is no room to actually put any specific breeds. I'm honestly not expecting people to read a whole essay or anything, but I really would like *some* sort of expansion on our 'Wants' abilities, because right now the Trading Hub is very very limiting to anyone who isn't looking for something very specific/short.

 

I don't have any problem with expanding the 'want' box a bit. What I was opposing wasn't the text field on trades, but a specific wishlist feature that some people suggested. I don't want to see an exhaustive text list of everything a person will accept and a "look at wishlish" written in the want box in each trade they put up. Having more room in the 'want' box to give a bit more detail would be fine. I've run out of space a couple of times and needed to adjust the way I communicated to make it shorter. What I don't want to see is a limitless text box or a separate text-based wishlist feature. I like the simplicity and aease of use of "this is what I have and this is specifically what I want for it" rather than a "here is a list of everything under the sun I'd consider".

 

Unrelated, but I just noticed that there's no longer confirmation when accepting a trade. I clicked the 'accept' button next to the offer and it immediately went through. I'm not sure if this is an intentional change, but I'm not personally a fan. Even though it's an extra step, I liked having the confirmation to avoid misclicking a trade and accidentally accepting it. 

[49ER]

2 hours ago, StormWizard212 said:

Unrelated, but I just noticed that there's no longer confirmation when accepting a trade. I clicked the 'accept' button next to the offer and it immediately went through. I'm not sure if this is an intentional change, but I'm not personally a fan. Even though it's an extra step, I liked having the confirmation to avoid misclicking a trade and accidentally accepting it. 

Wow, this is true??   NOOOOOO!  We need to be able to put in PW to confirm!  

When we do ND exps, we have link posted to multiple users, so they can cue it up and put in pw, waiting for egg to turn and then accept as soon as it turns.  I have also nearly accidentally accepted, instead of declined offers, and have been able to backtrack before I actually accepted.  So yes, please put that part pack the way it was!

[Ruby Eyes]

On 6/12/2018 at 7:56 AM, 49ER said:

Of course it would be really awesome if people just offer what you ask for, but....*shrugs*

11 hours ago, 49ER said:

Speaking for myself, I do not ever read through someone's lengthy laundry lists of what they want, or go through spread sheets of their owned prize lines or search their scrolls for missing lines.  I just make an offer, and they can kick it if they already have that line.  

 

Funny, these two statements coming from the same person.

Personally, some days I do read someone's "lengthy laundry list" just in case I may have *anything* they could use, just because I'm interested in their offer and I happen to have some time. (And the more breeds DC gets, the more lineages will exist and the longer wishlists will become.)

Other days, I don't feel up to that task, but then I simply ignore the trade as a whole and don't throw stuff at the trader that they're not going to want anyway - that would just needlessly waste my eggslot and their time.

 

Fact is, it's a different thing if you DO NOT WANT to read wishlists, or CANNOT read them because they don't exist. If it's there, I can still decide to not look at it. If it's not there, I have no choice.

[49ER]

That seems to be an attack on me, but I will chalk it up to something being lost in communication.  When somebody says what they want, I offer what they want.  But when it comes to prizes, I am not going to sift through their hundreds of lines, whether on spreadsheet or scroll to see if they have it or not, so I put up a prize and they can decline.  Now if I offer a chicken, then that is ignoring completely what they asked for.

[Ruby Eyes]

Well, you did say you'd just make an offer. It was only an observation anyway, of mismatching actions and expectations.

You're probably not the only one doing so, but what I was trying to point out is: there are different players with different playstyles. Just because one person doesn't want to read wishlists doesn't mean that everyone else wouldn't want to read them either.

Which is why I think shooting down the suggestions regarding on-site wishlists would cater to only one part of players (who wouldn't care anyway since they WON'T READ them,) but wouldn't help the others at all.

[49ER]

On 6/11/2018 at 10:56 PM, 49ER said:

Of course it would be really awesome if people just offer what you ask for, but....*shrugs*

This was in reference to people offering more eggs than someone asked for and therefore could not be accepted because of scroll limits.  Has nothing to do with wishlists.

 

I do not see anything where I "shot down" someone else's suggestion. I am sorry if I gave that impression.  

[Fuzzbucket]

4 hours ago, StormWizard212 said:

 

I don't have any problem with expanding the 'want' box a bit. What I was opposing wasn't the text field on trades, but a specific wishlist feature that some people suggested. I don't want to see an exhaustive text list of everything a person will accept and a "look at wishlish" written in the want box in each trade they put up. Having more room in the 'want' box to give a bit more detail would be fine. I've run out of space a couple of times and needed to adjust the way I communicated to make it shorter. What I don't want to see is a limitless text box or a separate text-based wishlist feature. I like the simplicity and aease of use of "this is what I have and this is specifically what I want for it" rather than a "here is a list of everything under the sun I'd consider".

 

Unrelated, but I just noticed that there's no longer confirmation when accepting a trade. I clicked the 'accept' button next to the offer and it immediately went through. I'm not sure if this is an intentional change, but I'm not personally a fan. Even though it's an extra step, I liked having the confirmation to avoid misclicking a trade and accidentally accepting it. 

 

This, especially the bolded bit. Because:

 

1 hour ago, 49ER said:

When somebody says what they want, I offer what they want.  But when it comes to prizes, I am not going to sift through their hundreds of lines, whether on spreadsheet or scroll to see if they have it or not, so I put up a prize and they can decline.  Now if I offer a chicken, then that is ignoring completely what they asked for.

 

Which is my position entirely.

99.9% of the time, if someone's trade on forum is all about look at my wishlist -if it's a link to a post, I go elsewhere. (and the same would apply if more detailed stuff is put up in the hub). I WILL - if I want something enough, go to heir profile, but I am not going to go through a long post of "what I need" - not least because i have offered on that basis and got a "Oh sorry I haven't updated  that since 2009; I have those now, thanks,." As for checking a spreadsheet for relatives - no. I will make an offer that will fit except for the related bit, THEY can check their OWN spreadsheet. People putting up a trade need to put a bit of work in too

 

And honestly - how many trades do people have up at any one time ? It isn't THAT much work to check offers.

 

And we need the password to confirm and decline thing.

Edited June 13, 2018 by Fuzzbucket

[49ER]

I do want to say one thing that may have been lost in all these grumblings/minor annoyances.  All in all, I do love the Trade Hub and it has resulted in a much better trading experience than the forum has been for me, so I for one, am glad to have this new feature--Thanks TJ!