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2015-09-27 - Encyclopedia Update (and more)

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I hope I haven't come across as snarky or arrogant. I'm more flustered with what I perceive as pessimism than anything else. xd.png Once the changes actually come out I'll feel less irked because then it's just a matter of taste rather than a clash of general attitudes.

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I really wish we could offer visitors scroll sort options. rolleyes.gif I have a sorting system that makes sense to me but is probably opaque to anyone else, but if people need to click on things, all my collection-goal CBs (16 adults + frozen hatchie set for each breed/variant) are on the first 10-11 pages (250 per page), followed by code dragons, then everything else ordered by generation and then breed. And then various lineage projects in various stages of completion. And then at the other end things get really weird - staircases, Prizes, unbreedables, bred frozen hatchies, random "spare" CBs... rolleyes.gif But I unhid everything so if people want to click, they can.

Edited by Amazon_warrior

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In other news, there will not be a dragon released this month; the next new dragon will be part of the Halloween event towards the end of next month (details to be announced later). However, several existing dragons are going to be receiving sprite updates over the coming weeks, including (but not limited to):

Horse Dragons (Receiving dimorphism with a new male adult sprite)

Silver Dragons (All sprites updated)

Nilia Pygmies (New dimorphic adults)

2007 Christmas Dragons (Small shading and anatomy tweaks)

All sprite updates will be retroactive to existing dragons. A new news topic will be made when the updates are made.

It'll be a few weeks, guys. There might still be a few loose ends to tie up in terms of sprite updates or implementation.

Edited by PieMaster

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Saying you don't like the updates is one thing. Arguing with the people who do is another.

 

And really Marie, I think Reds are in desperate need of having all four feet planted on the ground. Wouldn't you think they'd be tired by now of standing on an invisible hill?

*snorts* Omg it does look like there is an invisible hill! I never would've thought of it like that. And no, I totally wouldn't mind if that was fixed. But the overall storybook-dragon feel of the Red, I would hate to lose that.

 

Encyclopedia! I had a *lot* of new things to unlock! I've been spending waaaayyyy too much time surfing other people's scrolls in order to unlock breeds. Now I only have 7 breeds that still has stuff to unlock. Imo, the hatchie requirements are harder. And some of the numbers seem outrageous (I've "observed" over 200 Flamingos!). But it's fun!

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I was surprised to find that I have most of the new info unlocked. I haven't checked all of it. There's still some to do, of course. *eyes flamingos* But I don't actively collect those, so my "owned" numbers are small.

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I hope I haven't come across as snarky or arrogant. I'm more flustered with what I perceive as pessimism than anything else. xd.png Once the changes actually come out I'll feel less irked because then it's just a matter of taste rather than a clash of general attitudes.

I guess what irritates me the most is the fact that people are complaining and it hasn't even happened yet. They're not even giving it a CHANCE. Someone has worked hard to re-sprite the silvers. I'm fairly certain it was done with the utmost respect for the original design and won't be too drastic of a change, and will be fabulous since they'll be sprited to the current cave standards, not a rush job back in early 2008 to avoid copyright infringement. But people are preemptively stating that they hate the change, will hate the new sprite, and would rather keep the old sprites. If I was the spriter, I'd see all the posts and get a bit discouraged.

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i hope reds get a update to

I hope they stay so very western style they always remind of the "The Red Dragon" "Y Ddraig Goch" of the Welsh Flag. As long as the overhaul still does this to me i do not have to rename my dragons. ninja.gifblink.gif

 

Edit: One typo if you find more please collect and trade them. biggrin.gif

Edited by Tigerkralle

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Splits are one I would love to see updated, they have always been one of my least favorite dragons from day one.

 

I also would like to see reds updated, I think they have a lot of potential that a little polishing could help.

Edited by Nectaris

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I hope they stay so very western style they always remind of the "The Red Dragon" "Y Ddraig Goch"  of the Welsh Flag. As long as the overhaul still does this to me i do not have to rename my dragons.  ninja.gif  blink.gif

 

 

Edit: One typo if you find more please collect and trade them.  biggrin.gif

 

 

well yea of course

i just wanna see them become amazing because they have the potential

wanna see that potential?

google red dragon and look at the cool images 0_0 so cool

 

they could become the most western westerns to ever western!

Edited by blockEdragon

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I guess what irritates me the most is the fact that people are complaining and it hasn't even happened yet. They're not even giving it a CHANCE. Someone has worked hard to re-sprite the silvers. I'm fairly certain it was done with the utmost respect for the original design and won't be too drastic of a change, and will be fabulous since they'll be sprited to the current cave standards, not a rush job back in early 2008 to avoid copyright infringement. But people are preemptively stating that they hate the change, will hate the new sprite, and would rather keep the old sprites. If I was the spriter, I'd see all the posts and get a bit discouraged.

Nobody has said any of those things. They've just said that they like the current silvers and that they're sad that they're going to be updated. It's not a knock on whoever sprited it whatsoever, it is an indication of love and attachment towards the current sprites, which isn't a bad thing.

 

Think of it this way: it's like having a much loved ring that you've had for quite awhile. Some people would love it if that ring was replaced with something shinier and glitzier. Others would prefer to have the original one back, and that's okay.

 

People are not required to be excited towards the new sprites. Considering DC's history I would honestly be surprised if any spriter on DC was unaware that redoing sprites can be a contentious issue.

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When I first started DC, Red Dragons were my favorite. Reds are well deserving of a sprite update imo.

 

But, if any old sprite in-cave really, and I mean really, needs an update... that would be the Stones. iirc they're supposed to be DC's canonical largest breed. I know the sprite sizes don't represent the actual size comparisons of the dragons, but I do think the largest DC drag should have a sprite that represents that to the fullest extent.

Edited by DragonKing1337

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People are not required to be excited towards the new sprites.

This is actually something I've seen on the forum a *lot*. Especially with new releases. There is this overwhelming feeling in this forum that if you don't care for the sprites, you need to shut up. Anyone offering their opinion/criticism gets shut down if it's at all negative. I think the community as a whole can stand to be a little more tolerant of different opinions.

 

edit: I am spend way too much time hunting down dragons to unlock Encyclopedia entries. Is this supposed to be *this* much fun? 'Cause it is!

Edited by Marie19R

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This is actually something I've seen on the forum a *lot*. Especially with new releases. There is this overwhelming feeling in this forum that if you don't care for the sprites, you need to shut up. Anyone offering their opinion/criticism gets shut down if it's at all negative. I think the community as a whole can stand to be a little more tolerant of different opinions.

The thing is, though, that no sprites have yet been revealed to dislike. I really think people need to try to stay neutral to things and not decide that they're sad to see a sprite "go" until they've actually seen the updated sprite; it might be much more subtle than initially expected, and might even fix things that, looking back on the old sprite, are flaws you hadn't even noticed.

 

Overall, I think people are reacting too quickly and not even giving the new sprites a chance. Really, people are only going to be unhappy with updates if they look upon them negatively from the start. I suggest giving oneself a chance to adjust to new sprites, and then looking back and asking which you honestly prefer; the answer might surprise you, or you might still dislike it. You never know. (I say this as an artist who has been stubbornly against making some edit to one sprite or another, but then, after giving myself a chance to adjust, come to prefer the edited one)

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I agree with Pie. Said it better than I could've.

 

Also, I highly highly agree with the sentiment the last page or two that Reds should get a sprite update. Although my beloved reds are already glorious, there are definitely flaws in their current sprite which I'd be delighted to see repaired in a fresh, new, up-to-date one. So long as their general design and vibrant, high-intensity red color are retained I'd be very happy to see this. I think several of the other old sprites could use a brushup, too, but I'd especially like to see one for my favorite breed! I've always loved them since I joined back in the day and it'd be great to see them get a brushup.

 

EDIT: On consideration, a few other species I think might benefit from a sprite update to various degrees...

 

As someone else mentioned, the Stone, and by extension the Geode and the Earth/Pebble. All three are acceptable sprites, but there are real flaws with the Stone especially and all three would just look really killer if redone using the current standard of detail and style IMO. Especially the Pebble and Geode - I'd love to see those same dragons, same poses, but rendered in higher quality.

 

I think someone else likely already mentioned the Dorsals. They're just so simplistic compared to most of the other breeds that even though I like them I don't breed them often. Even my alts don't get much love except from my reds (I like Red x Alt Dorsal for some reason tongue.gif).

 

The original Two-Headed needs it so, so badly. They just look so awkward. (Anyone else remember when these were rare-ish? xd.png)

 

Seasonals. I like the Seasonals a lot, but they suffer from the same comparison issue that the Dorsals do - their art style is just too cartoony, even somewhat Pokemonlike, to fit in with the rest of the site, even many of the similar-aged sprites. I've always felt this way about them and the more time goes on the worse they look by compare to newer species coming out and to older ones that have mostly stood the test of time like Hellfires.

 

Now, I feel the normal Black holds up pretty well all things considered, but although I know some people will hate me for this, I'm gonna say it - the Alt Black needs a redo. Especially the male.

 

I could go on but that's what comes to mind immediately.

 

For all of these, I'm not talking about changing the actual design of the dragon or the pose (although in some cases a pose change probably wouldn't hurt anything), just redoing the same sprite with more detail and a fresher, more up to date style.

Edited by Lurhstaap

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The thing is, though, that no sprites have yet been revealed to dislike. I really think people need to try to stay neutral to things and not decide that they're sad to see a sprite "go" until they've actually seen the updated sprite; it might be much more subtle than initially expected, and might even fix things that, looking back on the old sprite, are flaws you hadn't even noticed.

 

Overall, I think people are reacting too quickly and not even giving the new sprites a chance. Really, people are only going to be unhappy with updates if they look upon them negatively from the start. I suggest giving oneself a chance to adjust to new sprites, and then looking back and asking which you honestly prefer; the answer might surprise you, or you might still dislike it. You never know. (I say this as an artist who has been stubbornly against making some edit to one sprite or another, but then, after giving myself a chance to adjust, come to prefer the edited one)

The issue is the general forum attitude, not really this specific case but a trend on this website, of all negative opinions being attacked and treated as unwelcome.

 

I haven't really expressed any feelings towards this (outside of what isn't happening) as I haven't seen them, but the people who are more strongly against it have the right to their opinion as much as the people who are in favor of it. People have an unfortunate habit of trying to drown out any sort of negative feelings, to get those people to stop talking and to push the idea that everyone feels as they do. However, preventing people from having any kind of vent just leads to a more explosive result later on, when those who are unhappy get fed up with being shushed.

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I'm beginning to think it's a site feature to drop these kinda of posts so the forum community can be kept busy for awhile. tongue.gif

 

user posted image

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The issue is the general forum attitude, not really this specific case but a trend on this website, of all negative opinions being attacked and treated as unwelcome.

 

I haven't really expressed any feelings towards this (outside of what isn't happening) as I haven't seen them, but the people who are more strongly against it have the right to their opinion as much as the people who are in favor of it. People have an unfortunate habit of trying to drown out any sort of negative feelings, to get those people to stop talking and to push the idea that everyone feels as they do. However, preventing people from having any kind of vent just leads to a more explosive result later on, when those who are unhappy get fed up with being shushed.

I haven't actually seen people saying that they can't have negative feelings about stuff, just that they should at least wait with building an opinion about things that haven't even been seen yet.

 

Saying "I don't like the updates" would mean the person has future vision and saw what no one else save tj saw yet.

 

(What the majority of the people saying "Wait with your negative feelings towards the sprite changes until you at least saw the sprite, then build an opinion, and if you're not happy with it, you're fully welcome to voice it, albeit in a respectful way" is not wrong, to be honest.)

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The internet has become a place of free speech so expect anything from people, easiest solution is just try not to get offended too easily (or at all).

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(What the majority of the people saying "Wait with your negative feelings towards the sprite changes until you at least saw the sprite, then build an opinion, and if you're not happy with it, you're fully welcome to voice it, albeit in a respectful way" is not wrong, to be honest.)

Actually, it is wrong to expect people to sit on their hands and not express their feelings of trepidation. There's nothing wrong with being wary of change and saying so. In fact, it's comments like this that other people are talking about when they say that their opinions are being repressed and disrespected by other forumers with more "sunny side" opinions.

 

We already have the example of the switch from old gold to the new golds - that was a big overhaul; the new golds don't look a thing like old golds. That could happen with the silvers. Yes, we don't know yet what will happen, but I think people have a right to trepidation, which is all I've seen expressed here. No one is pre-hating a sprite they haven't seen, but by previous sprite change example, they're worried and they're saying so.

 

The continued responses of surprise, disbelief, and disappointment that anyone would be wary of an update to a very old and widely beloved sprite are repressive. You don't see responses from the wary saying "How can you be looking forward to something like this? Why would you want the sprite changed? How can you be happy about a sprite you haven't even seen yet?"

 

It's a news thread. We're discussing the news and speculating, good and bad, on information given in the news. It's not wrong to express either or any opinion within the forum rules.

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I haven't actually seen people saying that they can't have negative feelings about stuff, just that they should at least wait with building an opinion about things that haven't even been seen yet.

 

Saying "I don't like the updates" would mean the person has future vision and saw what no one else save tj saw yet.

 

(What the majority of the people saying "Wait with your negative feelings towards the sprite changes until you at least saw the sprite, then build an opinion, and if you're not happy with it, you're fully welcome to voice it, albeit in a respectful way" is not wrong, to be honest.)

 

 

 

 

Hi, Hellen! smile.gif

 

Actually what a number of people are mostly having a problem with doesn't so much involve the new sprites, per se, but the sprites and lineages they already have and are losing, along with DC history they've had for years on their scrolls.

 

Perhaps a good analogy might be one regarding a relative sending you an album of snapshots taken over the years of relatives you care about but maybe don't really get to see in person any more. So you like looking at the pictures of family and pets; they bring back memories and good associations.

 

Then someone looks at the album, announces that it has pictures of ugly old people in it - who are not at all ugly to you, quite beautiful, in fact - and that they're going to toss and replace them with pictures of better looking strangers.

 

But you'd rather look at pictures of those you care about...

 

Well, I suppose not everyone would, but a fair number of us certainly would, and can't see how this (and related issues) keep somehow getting so misunderstand.

 

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Perhaps a good analogy might be one regarding a relative sending you an album of snapshots taken over the years of relatives you care about but maybe don't really get to see in person any more. So you like looking at the pictures of family and pets; they bring back memories and good associations.

 

Then someone looks at the album, announces that it has pictures of ugly old people in it - who are not at all ugly to you, quite beautiful, in fact - and that they're going to toss and replace them with pictures of better looking strangers.

 

But you'd rather look at pictures of those you care about...

I'd say a more accurate way to put the analogy would be that someone would be replacing the old photos with recent, new pictures of the same people. The old pictures that hold the old memories are gone, but new ones of the same people would be in their place.

 

The silvers aren't being replaced with strange dragons that aren't silvers.

Edited by ParticleSoup

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Thank you. I thought up some silly amusement park ride analogy, but that's a way more apt way of putting it. xd.png It almost works, though - TJ is running a site, which means that he needs to take into account what's best for the majority even if it's not going to have 100% universal approval. When old rides get taken down a number of people almost certainly are sad about it, but that doesn't mean that it wasn't the best choice for the park.

Edited by Tehya Faye

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