Holiday Rereleases

[Fuzzbucket]

CellyBean, that's.... really not a nice way to put it.

 

To be frank, while I'd love everyone to have CB old Holidays, releasing them in the Cave is NOT THE WAY TO DO IT. I will re-iterate: There are FAR too many ways this can be heavily abused and no way to check it without causing as many problems as it "solves".

 

The ideal solution would be the Trader's Canyon, or something similar to it that does NOT pit the "Haves" (those who have fast internet) against the "Have Nots" (those with slow internet / reflexes).

 

So no. I do NOT support this idea. But I do support some *other* way of getting old CB Holidays into the hands of everyone. And it has nothing to do with multi-clutches and everything to do with the extreme problems this specific idea would cause.

 

Cheers!

C4.

Yeah.

 

I know you are frustrated, Cellybean - but the store is really the only sane way to go about this. No-one is - OK very few people are - saying no-one should have CBs of old holidays or that they are badges of attendance - I think MOST people would like it to be possible (like olympe, as I do checkers, I collect 2 gens instead !) but adding them to the complexities of the actual holiday would be a nightmare - it really would. Especially if they clogged up the biomes making it harder to get the new ones. The last thing we need is more holidays in the AP; look at it now - 4 days afterwards and still not a regular egg in sight. Not that I'm complainign - I am desperately frustrated to be totally locked ! - but it is really bugging all the players who don't want masses of holidays.

Edited November 4, 2016 by fuzzbucket

[mo7]

once again dragons SHOULD NOT BE A PRIZE OR A BADGE

we already have badges at the top of our scrolls showing hey we were here during this event and stuff

 

once again i must point out the prize dragons given out to only  few players here. does anybody like that at all??? that no matter what the chances of them getting a cb prize dragon is out of their control?

 

and let me point out on the trading threads there are several people who missed out on the witchlights because they were sick or family stuff came up. are you (general you) really going to begrudge them the chance to get an awesome cb halloween dragon because waaaaah i want my halloween dragon to be special because i was there first? on the dragcave wikia it tells us that when tj released prize dragons for the second time there was a big waaaaaaaaah from the first prize owners because they felt like their prize dragons werent special anymore. sounds pretty selfish, childish and greedy huh?

 

fine dont want to give up mulitclutches then either suck it up and let people who dont have a cb holidays get them because fat chance of doing a lineage with hollies or yulebucks or heartseekers or val 09s, or as vixendra said give holidays the 0.00001% chance to breed their own kind of egg outside of their breeding season

Whether or not dragons should be prizes is an opinion, and you really don't need to be so rude about shooting down others/textually screaming yours. This is (or at least should be) a civilized chat where all sides can say their bit, which is what I was doing. I feel like there isn't anything really wrong with dedication prizes so long as they're available as we have things now, with holiday dragons dropping in high amounts.

 

Also prizes and holidays aren't comparable imo in difficulty/method of obtaining. CB prizes were wildly erratic in how they were obtained and was entirely random. CB holidays, however, are typically "they will drop x day and anyone whose here can grab them." Even if your internet isn't great you can at least usually get some from generous people. So really your arguments about prizes hold no bearing over the conversation of obtaining prizes. Either you were here and caught them or you weren't.

 

If someone missed out on the halloween/valentines/christmas event as I have a couple times in the past there are always people willing to gift to those who weren't as fortunate. I've been in that situation and I've also been the giftee at times.

 

However, I know a lot of players who literally only play for those holidays which they couldn't get otherwise. I am of that opinion and my playing slows greatly outside of holiday release season. If I knew I could just get the releases in the future I'd probably end up not playing entirely.

 

I'm not trying to bash you or your opinion. I'm just sharing my feelings on it, as we are supposed to do and allowed to do in the suggestions section. These are my feelings on something like this.

 

On top of that is entirely possible to do lineages with hollies, yulebucks, val 09s and the like and I know this because I help people with that stuff all. the. time. That's literally what I do is help with lineages. There are many beautiful old holiday lines out there.

 

Lastly, this method has the same problems that typical releases do where people who have limited time, internet or other issues.

Edited November 5, 2016 by mo7

[Crystalluna]

Personally, I really like how the CB holidays are one time only, it makes them more special! And it's not like people who missed that holiday can't get that dragon at all.

[_Sin_]

I know you are frustrated, Cellybean - but the store is really the only sane way to go about this.

Going with fuzzbucket here. At this point, the store could be a rational solution to the issue.

[Paradisiske]

We have actual trophies and badges right now. Trophies in dragon sprite form aren't necessary and they are a point of contention for the community.

 

quote is from an old thread i was reading

[olympe]

Agreed, we don't need trophies in dragon form. Still, I disagree with releasing old holidays as uncommon or even rare cave drops during the holiday season, since it would cause way too much mayhem. I'd much rather see the store implemented, where you can buy them two or three at a time.

Edited January 9, 2017 by olympe

[Paradisiske]

Agreed, we don't need trophies in dragon form. Still, I disagree with releasing old holidays as uncommon or even rare cave drops during the holiday season, since it would cause way too much mayhem. I'd much rather see the store implemented, where you can buy them two or three at a time.

what if they flooded the cave though? up until the new holiday is dropping incave?

 

so imagine this

 

its day 1, holiday breeding has just started and you decide to go cave hunting for some cb holidays. you go to the alpine which clears out pretty fast but as the fast clickers get egglocked with cbs and bred eggs from the ap it becomes easier for you to grab eggs from the cave.

 

and plus im sure other people would be gifting the cb holidays away to those that are struggling to catch them.

 

now some of the eggs share the same description i think (not sure dont really remember) but lets say you grab a cb yulebuck and you really wanted a cb ribbon dancer. you can trade the yulebuck egg away for it or just ap the yulebuck and hunt for the ribbon dancer.

 

now the ap would run much longer on holiday eggs but like at halloween this year people can put the codes of the eggs into clicksites so that they hatch and dont die. and if eggs do die then thats a shame but they're just pixels

[olympe]

I'd only have to look for hollies and yules, anyway, I've got all other CB Winter holidays maxed. *shrugs*

 

That might work for the two limited holidays and their respective breeds, but it certainly won't work out that way for Halloween. Not in this lifetime.

 

 

[Predat0rs]

I've missed almost a dozen Holiday Dragons. At this point, I'd take any option that would allow me to get Cave Borns.

[Paradisiske]

I'd only have to look for hollies and yules, anyway, I've got all other CB Winter holidays maxed. *shrugs*

 

That might work for the two limited holidays and their respective breeds, but it certainly won't work out that way for Halloween. Not in this lifetime.

but the fast clickers would still get egglocked so even the slow people will be able to catch the eggs they need

[Fuzzbucket]

but the fast clickers would still get egglocked so even the slow people will be able to catch the eggs they need

But in the run up we NEED to breed our holidays - so please no. A lot of us have holiday lineages and trying to get CBs as well would add to the strain.

[andromedae]

But in the run up we NEED to breed our holidays - so please no. A lot of us have holiday lineages and trying to get CBs as well would add to the strain.

If CB Holidays were available every year, it wouldn't be as much of a problem. If people want to work on lineages only a certain year, they can, without worrying about missing Holidays forever. They would be available next year. It's also possible to divide time/egg slots on 50% lineage and 50% catching CBs in terms of time and work. Both are totally possible, it's just about organization. Of course, no option will ever be fully perfect for everyone, but re-releasing CB Holidays doesn't block people from working on lineages in the slightest. That's more of a personal choice of what you want to do. Of course, the breeding period for Holidays could be extended too, to give people a better chance to work on their lineages and have special days for having CB holidays in the cave to avoid conflict of interest.

[SullenCat]

Agreed, we don't need trophies in dragon form. Still, I disagree with releasing old holidays as uncommon or even rare cave drops during the holiday season, since it would cause way too much mayhem. I'd much rather see the store implemented, where you can buy them two or three at a time.

What happens if the store is never implemented? Do you have any reason to think it will?

Unless TJ announces that the store will be implemented before he retires, let's forget it.

 

The holiday season is already characterized by mayhem. In the AP for several days, in the cave for a few days.

 

By the way, the more I read about the store, the store, the store and the store, the closer I get to oppose that suggestion. It is becoming the "let's forget every suggestion or idea since it is not about the store". It is becoming the bottleneck, omnipresent and useless.

Edited January 10, 2017 by SullenCat

[Robot Chimera]

What happens if the store is never implemented? Do you have any reason to think it will?

Unless TJ announces that the store will be implemented before he retires, let's forget it.

 

The holiday season is already characterized by mayhem. In the AP for several days, in the cave for a few days.

 

By the way, the more I read about the store, the store, the store and the store, the closer I get to oppose that suggestion. It is becoming the "let's forget every suggestion or idea since it is not about the store". It is becoming the bottleneck, omnipresent and useless.

I agree. There is no guarantee the store will ever happen, nor is it "the only sane option". It's one POSSIBLE option, not THE option. I'm sick of hearing people talk about it 24/7 like it's guaranteed to magically fix everything.

 

 

With the CB limit in place people who grabbed older dragons would be unable to get more. It's the same with Leetle Trees - they're incredibly rare, but I always see them in the cave because the people hunting have gotten theirs already. I could see them being available in the cave, although they would be a massive pain to catch (especially for Hollies/Yulebucks/Vday09s).

 

However I dislike the thought of removing the multi-clutch. Things like 2G hollies, Thuweds, or 2Gs from Spriters Alts are only possible to catch because many of those eggs auto-abandon.

 

Getting 1 CB old holiday from an event per year would be a solution I can agree with.

[Fiona]

Maybe some of us are opposed to the idea of handing out old holidays like some kind of event badge reward. Maybe some of us would rather not have old holidays at all rather than have their dragons used that way. Particularly if it requires completing the events in order to qualify.

 

The holidays here are already chaotic enough. And yes, I'm also opposed to them dropping in the cave.

 

I've supported the store idea because so far it's the only method of obtaining old holidays that I could agree to. Yes, I know the likelihood of it being implemented is low.

[Pokemonfan13]

If it's a general thread that is talking about multiple ways to do a specific thing and another thread's suggestion is the one someone likes best it's their right to say so. Hopefully they will still talk about the merits of the other suggestions that are being discussed, but it's still their right to just say "I think ____ is the best option for this".

 

One of the reasons I like the store best is it's a more limited way of letting us have old holidays back, and might remove the necessity of TJ's restriction saying that we only get old holidays as CB by losing holiday multiclutches. One of the best things about the holidays is being able to hunt for pretty lineages by other people, and that would mostly go away if we lost multiclutches just so we could have old holidays drop in the cave as CBs. There would still be pretty lineages in the AP, but they would only be the ones that people bred to abandon. So I might support another similarly limited suggestion that might let us keep multicluches, but I have trouble convincing myself the tradeoff of gaining CB old holidays at the expense of holiday multiclutches would be worth it.

[andromedae]

Another option to be considered is for Holidays to be re-released to be caught solely by those who do not own CB Holidays from past years, with the 2 caveborns per scroll limit remaining. That way, no one else has to worry about not being able to work on lineages because they might miss the chance to catch more dragons; besides the yearly new release. CB Holidays remain "special" to those who are concerned with that aspect [in my personal case, I couldn't care less about CB Holiday rarity]. It's very easy for other players to pose opposition in terms of re-releasing CB Holidays, especially if they already own their pair. It really detracts quite a bit of quality from gameplay, not to be able to even have the possibility of creating certain lineages simply because players are new. The limit of 2 per scroll also allows everyone to get a chance to obtain a CB Holiday equally, regardless of internet connection speed and other such possibly limiting factors.

Edited January 10, 2017 by andromedae

[Robot Chimera]

Another option to be considered is for Holidays to be re-released to be caught solely by those who do not own CB Holidays from past years, with the 2 caveborns per scroll limit remaining. That way, no one else has to worry about not being able to work on lineages because they might miss the chance to catch more dragons; besides the yearly new release. CB Holidays remain "special" to those who are concerned with that aspect [in my personal case, I couldn't care less about CB Holiday rarity]. It's very easy for other players to pose opposition in terms of re-releasing CB Holidays, especially if they already own their pair. It really detracts quite a bit of quality from gameplay, not to be able to even have the possibility of creating certain lineages simply because players are new. The limit of 2 per scroll also allows everyone to get a chance to obtain a CB Holiday equally, regardless of internet connection speed and other such possibly limiting factors.

I like this. As long as multi clutches don't disappear, I think re-releasing them in cave and keeping the limit is the best option.

[Fiona]

Don't forget to consider Halloweens in your discussion. We're limited to 2 CB of each of the Christmas holiday dragons and each of the Valentines dragons but not Halloweens. How are you going to address that issue?

[andromedae]

Don't forget to consider Halloweens in your discussion. We're limited to 2 CB of each of the Christmas holiday dragons and each of the Valentines dragons but not Halloweens. How are you going to address that issue?

You're right, I totally overlooked that point. Perhaps setting an initial "cap" for CB Halloweens might be the way to go. For players that have never owned a certain breed of CB Halloween, there could be an initial limit that's higher than the Christmas or Valentine's at 2, but a reasonable enough quantity to allow many or the grand majority players to obtain their CBs. For players who already own, say at least x number of a CB Halloween (for example: 4), there's a limit to how many they can grab of that dragon in a re-release. To further illustrate the point for people who own CBs of past Halloweens: say I already own 4 CB Graves, and their re-release occurs, I'm allowed to grab 2 more this year, and another 2 for the next. So on and so forth. I know a cap isn't ideal, since Halloweens are meant to be grabbed in any quantity, but a cap would really ensure that everyone gets a fair chance of obtaining at least a few CBs of each. There's also the possibility of setting no limits whatsoever, which would basically turn the Cave into a war zone, so I wouldn't prefer it. Numbers used within these examples are totally subjective.

 

 

[Pokemonfan13]

I think it would be reasonable to cap Halloweens. Perhaps a limit of 8 caught after the initial release? Unless TJ has changed his mind, he wouldn't be up for anything more complicated than "you can have X". (from the original "raise the holiday limits" thread)

 

With the limits already in place on xmas and valentines, and the possibility of capping Halloweens caught after the initial release, I'm really not sure it's fair to have the only way to get old holidays in the cave be to give up holiday multiclutches. Valentines and xmas, after the first year or two, it's mainly going to be newbies hunting the cave because everyone else will have their limit. Halloweens are another kettle of fish, and I can understand giving up multiclutches for halloweens to get them back unlimited. But I'd still prefer a reasonable cap and keep multiclutches, since that's what let's people find cool stuff in the AP. Obviously it might end up going down to two per clutch from sheer numbers, but that's still a pretty in the AP that wouldn't exist without them.

[Fuzzbucket]

I would oppose anything that meant giving up multiclutches. And I would not be at all happy to see them dropping in cave. Which leaves - the store. And at least that would WORK. There are such huge disadvantages to everything else so far suggested.

 

We have no idea how TJ feels about it; for all we know he is already working on it. But saying well, let's do something less good instead in case he is ignoring the whole thing is not the way to approach it, I think. The store would add so many other great things to the game as well as solving this issue that it is worth pushing for.

[Fiona]

I would be opposed to any caps on Halloweens simply because when TJ says "You can have X" I take that to mean period. Including those initially caught. Otherwise you're liable to have some newbie down the road asking "How come she's got 30 CB of those and it tells me I can only have 8?" and someone else coming here to suggestions with a thread about making past Halloweens unlimited since they were unlimited in the first release. "It's not fair! They could have all those! I want that many too!"

 

So, no caps on Halloweens.

[aussieJJDude]

As weird as this sounds, I would rather that past holidays come back into the cave. Even though I missed out on many past holidays - looking at the ribbon dancers! - I personally don't like the idea that everyone can get one even though they haven't signed up or played that year/time. Each holiday IMO represents another celebration for the individuals during the playerbase of that "era". Nothing can really bring that back. At most, I would like the see the past holidays go into reruns - of course, with a new holiday - eventually, but currently I am content with the fact that I "missed out".

[Paradisiske]

, but currently I am content with the fact that I "missed out".

you may be BUT i am not

 

i said it before and i'll say it again dragons especially cb ones SHOULD NOT be considered trophies available to only a select few. there are people who missed out on this christmas release and i felt awful because it was out of their control for missing it.

 

 

we already have trophies and badges at the top of our scrolls for that stuff. please dont try to include dragons in that regard as well seeing as how this is a collecting game and everyone should be able to the same chance every day to catch a dragon that they want

Edited January 10, 2017 by CellyBean