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ANSWERED:One-Time-Only Holiday Unfreeze Option

Should users be able to unfreeze previously-limited Holidays?  

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If I were to come back from a break and discover all my frozen hatchies had been unfrozen and grew up, I'd be a very unhappy camper. I don't even see how that kind of thing would be allowed, as it would fall under the messing with someone else's scroll and playstyle. A BSA to unfreeze or holiday perk chance, a la zombie revival, would be preferable. Keep it simple imo. No bias against lineage or breed.

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If I were to come back from a break and discover all my frozen hatchies had been unfrozen and grew up, I'd be a very unhappy camper. I don't even see how that kind of thing would be allowed, as it would fall under the messing with someone else's scroll and playstyle. A BSA to unfreeze or holiday perk chance, a la zombie revival, would be preferable. Keep it simple imo. No bias against lineage or breed.

As I said - you'd have the option to refreeze anything that had been unfrozen to the state it was when it was frozen - i.e. reverse it. This would mean that people who are inactive don't miss the only ever unfreezing of holidays window, as I don't think you could reasonably leave that option open for ever; it can only be allowed on hatchies frozen before the limits were lifted.

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Having to spend how many hours figuring out which adults used to be my frozen hatchies and then go back and refreeze them? Um, no please, that's too much like a LOT of work.

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Seems over-complicated to me. It would put people through the hassle of refreezing their hatchies if they don't want them unfrozen and having to code in all the ifs ands or buts if they may be inactive or don't wonder why the little snowflake icon glitched away on page 3 and 7, on 2 out of 3000 dragons.

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Just make it a one-time-use-only page for everyone where you can pick which Holidays (of any line) you want to unfreeze. Once used, the page is gone. Page either exists forever or is only for a year or two. Unfrozen things instantly mature. Not that complicated...

Edited by angelicdragonpuppy

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Just make it a one-time-use-only page for everyone where you can pick which Holidays (of any line) you want to unfreeze. Once used, the page is gone. Page either exists forever or is only for a year or two. Unfrozen things instantly mature. Not that complicated...

Or start from another angle and make it a BSA of some kind, that only works on frozen holidays. That way there'd be no reason to have a time limit and people coming back later would be able to use it. Could have it only usable once a month or something ?

 

And yes - unfrozens instantly mature. there CANNOT be the option to try and trade a CB Holly you have just unfrozen !

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This sounds like a good idea in theory,but it seems like it would have a multitude of problems. I never freeze "special" dragons, so this wouldn't benefit me personally in any way.

 

It all just seems too complex.

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I suspect (don't know, of course) that it would also be easier for TJ to set up something like the Refusal removal page, which would be active for a specified length of time, where people could take the 'eternal youth' spell off individual dragons of whatever type, (to then immediately become untradeable adults,) rather than coding to unFreeze ALL Frozen dragons AND recode so that people could re-'youthen' AND reFreeze those of the individual now-ADULT dragons that had previously been Frozen which they wanted to remain so.

 

Not to mention that some people have hundreds - I believe even thousands - of Frozen dragons...

 

 

And please bear in mind that Refusals are permanent, but have been removed on this type of specific, as-needed, individual basis for metallic and Holiday breedings, as when rare/rare breeding was made possible, in response to this change;

 

that killing a dragon is permanent, but, apart from the chance of normal revival, that if done at the right moment in time, people have a chance to make Zombies by doing so;

 

that the AP Blocking of the Cave had always been 'an immutable part of the game', until TJ fixed it, in response to circumstances;

 

that trading/gifting was 'was never part of the game' until TJ created Teleport, in response to circumstances;

 

that you can only EVER get CB Holidays in the season and year of their Release - unless you win and select one as a Prize, a special chance TJ allows us;

 

that you could only EVER have two of any Holiday, until (due to changing circumstances,) TJ allowed us more breds - the circumstance which has brought up this topic.

 

Over the years, TJ has adjusted certain areas of the game to bring us a better playing experience and in response to altering circumstance, and it doesn't seem logical to me that the 'Freezing is permanent' warning needs to necessarily involve/forestall this specific case, or restrict it to only CB Holidays Frozen in the year of their Release, for a one-shot opportunity for people to unFreeze dragons they Froze under different circumstances.

 

This may not directly and immediately bring benefit to us all, (apart from an increase in the breeding pool for next year) but it takes nothing away from the rest of us and harms no players, although it does involve more work for TJ in bringing joy to a fair percentage of the players, this, potentially in TJ's (as well as in our) view, offset by that further increase in bred dragons for future years of greatly increased demand, especially for breds providing a good lineage start.

 

Only TJ can say whether he considers this worth-while, but I honestly can't see any logical reason for this not to occur, other than his concerns regarding whatever time and effort this would cost him in setting up and posting a 'Freeze Spell Removal/ /'Exorcism?' xd.png page (the hatchies ARE cute little devils, aren't they?) to be available for some reasonable length of time.

 

 

Edit: no idea what else I might have forgotten, missed, lol... should have gone with coffee, not tea! laugh.gif

Edited by Syphoneira

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If it is a "limited time offer" you WILL get people coming back and saying no fair, they missed it because they didn't know - just as right now we have people saying no fair, we didn't know the limits would ever come off when we froze.

 

That's why I (now) think a holidays-only BSA is the best way to go. It would be available for ever - and would allow those who come back after a long break to have the same options as those of us who are here now, discussing it.

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If it is a "limited time offer" you WILL get people coming back and saying no fair, they missed it because they didn't know - just as right now we have people saying no fair, we didn't know the limits would ever come off when we froze.

 

That's why I (now) think a holidays-only BSA is the best way to go. It would be available for ever - and would allow those who come back after a long break to have the same options as those of us who are here now, discussing it.

A "BSA" on just frozen Holidays, right? I don't fancy the idea of adult Holidays having to use their BSA for it, so I think just a default action on Holidays frozen before Christmas 2013 would work best.

 

 

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Hah, it would make Exorcism more useful than it currently is, if it would also remove the frozen spell.

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I'd almost forgotten myself about the very similar action to that now being requested which TJ had created to remove the otherwise permanent Refusals on an individual basis from pertinent dragons after Rare/Rare breeding was allowed.

 

But TJ has reacted in a generous fashion to a very similar situation in the past, when circumstances had changed, and it seems only logical that people would be permitted to, ideally, unFreeze any Frozen in which the circumstances have altered since any such Freezing occurred.

 

 

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I'm against this. You know why?

Because most of you who want unfreeze option are against releasing previous CB Holidays. All of you say that people who weren't there can't have them. That they missed their chance. You know what? You were there. You got them. And you made your choice. Live with it.

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I'm against this. You know why?

Because most of you who want unfreeze option are against releasing previous CB Holidays. All of you say that people who weren't there can't have them. That they missed their chance. You know what? You were there. You got them. And you made your choice. Live with it.

Really? Because most people I saw who actually posted about it were sympathetic, but noted that there were massive logistics problems with actually getting them back. The only way you could prove it would be to have the dragon's mate(s) on your scroll, if they successfully produced offspring. And five years is a lot of time to release dragons that could have proved that you had once owned it.

 

Freezing at least is relatively simple to reverse. Reversing released dragons would require a great deal of time since it'd need to be vetted on a one-by-one basis, and TJ's the sole arbiter of the site at that level.

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Really? Because most people I saw who actually posted about it were sympathetic, but noted that there were massive logistics problems with actually getting them back. The only way you could prove it would be to have the dragon's mate(s) on your scroll, if they successfully produced offspring. And five years is a lot of time to release dragons that could have proved that you had once owned it.

 

That's over-complicated again. Really all that needs be done is look at the date the scroll was made. Beyond that, seems like a good chance everyone that released still has 1 CB holiday of that breed, so that is the proof they were there. Having to have the mate and offspring is overdoing it. Especially for Christmas, where they sit around blocking for 3 days.

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I'm against this. You know why?

Because most of you who want unfreeze option are against releasing previous CB Holidays. All of you say that people who weren't there can't have them. That they missed their chance. You know what? You were there. You got them. And you made your choice. Live with it.

Really? Because most people I saw who actually posted about it were sympathetic, but noted that there were massive logistics problems with actually getting them back. The only way you could prove it would be to have the dragon's mate(s) on your scroll, if they successfully produced offspring. And five years is a lot of time to release dragons that could have proved that you had once owned it.

 

Freezing at least is relatively simple to reverse. Reversing released dragons would require a great deal of time since it'd need to be vetted on a one-by-one basis, and TJ's the sole arbiter of the site at that level.

PointOfOrigin isn't talking about holiday dragons that have been released by their owners - but about re-releasing older holiday breeds. Like getting hollies or yulebucks released again.

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I'm against this. You know why?

Because most of you who want unfreeze option are against releasing previous CB Holidays. All of you say that people who weren't there can't have them. That they missed their chance. You know what? You were there. You got them. And you made your choice. Live with it.

 

 

 

Hi, PointOfOrigin.

 

Are you referring to a Cave re-Release of previous year's Holidays?

 

If so, while I could easily be mistaken or have missed something, I don't recall this coming up in this thread at all.

 

This topic regards dragons already existing on people's scrolls which were Frozen at a time when circumstances were entirely different, and not people who missed out on previous Releases.

 

You could start a thread on this, if you like.

 

 

Edit: never said I could type!

 

Signed: The Typo Queen.

 

Re-edit: so extremely ninja.gif ed... xd.png

 

 

And yet another re-edit to say that Vhale has an excellent point about any CB Holidays showing that people were present for that Release - people only taking one sprite form as their scroll goal could be easily identified by their scrolls and would not want two in any event.

 

If, rather than trying to locate the specific dragons released by these people, Released dragons were simply replaced by eggs/adults bearing the actual dates on which they arrived on these people's scrolls, matters would be enormously simplified.

 

The variation in dates would make them of interest to collectors, but I personally wouldn't grudge them that, if only on the grounds that they've done without these CBs for years, even if it was their choice to begin with, and that it creates no disadvantage for any of the rest of us, who might swap Holiday babies, but rarely trade them for anything other than the same/similar types of Holidays in season.

Edited by Syphoneira

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What olympe said. And I know that this hasn't come up before, but it needs to be brought up. Missing a release because you didn't know about game or you whatever other reason, is being treated like a you miss you loose thing by most players. I don't see why this should be treated any differently. You made your choice. Your loss. Asking for a different treatment just because you didn't know, would be a bit hypocritical IMO.

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What olympe said. And I know that this hasn't come up before, but it needs to be brought up. Missing a release because you didn't know about game or you whatever other reason, is being treated like a you miss you loose thing by most players. I don't see why this should be treated any differently. You made your choice. Your loss. Asking for a different treatment just because you didn't know, would be a bit hypocritical IMO.

While I personally have never quite understood the vehemence against past holiday re-releases, it's nonetheless quite a different scenario:

 

If you miss a holiday event, you knew you could get the dragon - and you didn't get one.

If you froze a holiday dragon, you didn't know the limits would be lifted - and you acted as if they wouldn't.

 

In other words, in the one situation, you're not acting on information you have*, whereas in the other situation, you acted on information you didn't have.

 

* I'm aware that's not by choice for many of the discussed scenarios, but that just makes it yet another difference, honestly. Keep in mind, though, that I'm not in opposition to CB re-releases; 'different' for me personally in this case does not mean I'm in favour of one and not the other, just that I find them to be not comparable.

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Actually, most people miss holiday release because they didn't know. Either they didn't know about the game or they were too new too know about this special one time release. Those who do miss it for some other reason do have a shot at new release - I've seen CB holidays being gifted plenty of times (hell, I did it myself).

 

So, I find them to be somewhat comparable. And, at the very least, both of these discussion concern removing the rules that would affect only one, small group of people. I don't see why the older players should get some slack while the newer players can't.

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Actually, most people miss holiday release because they didn't know. Either they didn't know about the game or they were too new too know about this special one time release. Those who do miss it for some other reason do have a shot at new release - I've seen CB holidays being gifted plenty of times (hell, I did it myself).

 

So, I find them to be somewhat comparable. And, at the very least, both of these discussion concern removing the rules that would affect only one, small group of people. I don't see why the older players should get some slack while the newer players can't.

I still don't find them comparable. There was nothing in the game expressly claiming "you aren't getting a holiday dragon". There was something in the game expressly claiming "you can only have two of this breed".

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Actually, most people miss holiday release because they didn't know. Either they didn't know about the game or they were too new too know about this special one time release. Those who do miss it for some other reason do have a shot at new release - I've seen CB holidays being gifted plenty of times (hell, I did it myself).

 

So, I find them to be somewhat comparable. And, at the very least, both of these discussion concern removing the rules that would affect only one, small group of people. I don't see why the older players should get some slack while the newer players can't.

 

 

 

There actually was a thread on this somewhere, a looooong while back, suggesting a re-Release of previous Holidays so that those who missed out would have a shot at CBs.

 

I personally was in favour of this, and if I recall correctly, it was shot down by TJ, so may very likely have been closed, but you could try searching for it, and if it's gone, start a new one?

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If you miss a holiday event, you knew you could get the dragon - and you didn't get one.

If you froze a holiday dragon, you didn't know the limits would be lifted - and you acted as if they wouldn't.

 

In other words, in the one situation, you're not acting on information you have*, whereas in the other situation, you acted on information you didn't have.

 

Actually - the scroll owner froze the hatchling knowing that freezing is IRREVERSIBLE. The page even warns them about it - in caps. In other words - the scroll owner acted exactly on the information available. Why people chose to freeze a hatchling is irrelevant for the freezing action. The game doesn't ask why someone freezes a hatchling. You can't use the *how* to argue in one case and the *why* for the other one.

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Actually - the scroll owner froze the hatchling knowing that freezing is IRREVERSIBLE. The page even warns them about it - in caps. In other words - the scroll owner acted exactly on the information available. Why people chose to freeze a hatchling is irrelevant for the freezing action. The game doesn't ask why someone freezes a hatchling. You can't use the *how* to argue in one case and the *why* for the other one.

 

 

Well, people variously accidentally bred rare/rare pairings, or did so not knowing that rare/rare breedings didn't work, or did so as a test, knowing that rare/rare breedings had only occurred as a glitch around the breeding season in previous years, and these Refusals were permanent.

 

But it didn't matter why they had had a rare/rare Refusal - TJ set up a page where people could have these Refusals removed when the situation changed and rare/rare breeding was allowed.

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A "BSA" on just frozen Holidays, right? I don't fancy the idea of adult Holidays having to use their BSA for it, so I think just a default action on Holidays frozen before Christmas 2013 would work best.

It can't really be a default action. What's wrong with a BSA (not one attached to a holiday, no, but I'm sure some dragon would be happy to take it on smile.gif )

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