Trading Inflation

[DarkEternity]

I saw someone who was asking for 13th even-gen specific lineages for CB metals if that makes anyone feel better?

That was me, though:

- I stalk already: the even gen thread in breeding, the great lineages found on the AP, sometimes the congrats thread and definitely the even gen gifting/trading thread for even gens I like. Chances are most of the lineages that people make I've already seen. I also like combined staircases on occasion. It's not necessarily 13th gen though I am asking for higher gens because I feel guilty about declining people who PM me with lower gens

- If I notice lineages I like from these threads which are 5th to 6th gen generation I PM people or people offer and that is how people get onto my profile page *coughs loudly* If you ask, the worst you can get is declined, whereas if you don't ask there is no chance of being accepted at all (and my CB metals are growing up fairly fast: 5 are hatchies and 3 are almost ER eggs). I don't keep blacklists and people rarely PM me anyway.

- I am not trading shimmers when/if I get them for anything other than lineages: common, otherwise I don't really care as long as I like the dragons in the even gen chequers *coughsloudlyatprofilecough* Obviously I hoard rares like most other people, but lineages will take the priority above your usual CB metal crap.

- It's not to say that I don't like lineages other than super long lineages but I have been wanting super long lineages of specific chequers since 2010. If your lineage is not on the list, I want, PM me anyway. If your lineage is not long enough, PM me anyway. If your lineage is still a work in progress, PM me anyway. I have to say that I am afraid of being inundated by PMs, but evidently not getting very many offers and a lot of people too nervous too PM is also a great difficulty in trading. I also don't bite and I love to hear people's thoughts and feelings.

- Future second gen HOLLY offspring from Time will probably go to 1 x e x t r e m e l y long even gen chequers (breeds I like) as well because I'm evil, rares come by luck in the span of minutes but it takes so much time to make a chequer that you might as well have something valuable for your effort. 2nd gen rares from Time I'm probably to lazy to breed. 2nd gen commons are essentially free for people working on lineages.

- The truth about 2nd gen prizes and 2nd gen hollies and people with lots of them: the people who are brave enough to PM or accept you know what tend to be richer and more successful than people who are silent or withdrawn. PMing is not quite trading harassment, per se, but while a lot of people are busy attacking the people who are PMing the winners, the people who are PMing are benefiting. Or I might be extremely cynical, but I think that some people PM winners on one side and on the other side lecture others about the sins of PMing winners. Do not take these comments at face value.

- Make connections, connections, connections.

- People judge you by the content of your posts and your behaviour online. Unconsciously, subconsciously, whatever.

- I am not a huge fan of pinks, purples, drakes, splits, pygmies and PBs. D:

 

My biggest regret as a newbie was being too afraid to PM other people so I simply don't want other people to make the same mistake I did. Far better to PM then simply give up on trading in the face of inflation altogether. I hope that in asking for things other than shimmers, CB metals and things I might ease off the pressure of EXTREMELY RICH PEOPLE BECOME EXTREMELY RICH. It probably won't make a difference in the long term and the majority of rares I catch likely won't leave my scroll because of the amount of time I invest in them nowadays, but hopefully inflation is controlled down the track.

 

One of the big issues with introducing lots of rares is the devaluing effect, which is why Shimmer owners mostly trade amongst themselves (at least ON PUBLIC TRADE THREADS) because CB metals for big traders are worth much less than they were previously. The biggest issue is that when CB metals were common, non-winners stood more of a chance against getting 2nd gens from people other than winners, but now there is more shimmer-shimmer interaction between owners.

 

Tl;dr post is very long.

 

And as far as I know most 3rd gen shimmer offspring request/trades/gifts are made the same way that I am doing it: in private mostly 'cause we are not allowed to mention OR accept you know what. And guess what, the ban is just making the trading situation worse.

Edited March 9, 2013 by DarkEternity

[RMS]

• "If you ask, the worst you can get is declined, whereas if you don't ask there is no chance of being accepted at all."
• "Far better to PM then simply give up on trading in the face of inflation altogether."

I can't agree with this more. The owners can't read minds of dozens and dozens of people out there, nor do they have time to go through the scroll of everyone who advertises in their signatures.

 

If you don't approach them individually, you won't stand out because there's just too many people out there who want Shimmers already. Even if you don't think your offer will get accepted, I would encourage people to try (unless their profile/signature asks for people to not PM them, of course).

 

Don't be discouraged! Ask the owners what they like. They don't all want CB metallics and neglecteds.

[Amazon_warrior]

*peers at scroll*

 

My highest-gen checker is this. It was a right pain in the botty to make.

 

 

ETA: Whoops! Thanks Wookieinmashoo.

Edited March 9, 2013 by Amazon_warrior

[Wookieinmashoo]

*peers at scroll*

 

My highest-gen checker is this. It was a right pain in the botty to make.

I think you may have given the wrong link.

 

I noticed that CB black have greatly decreased in "value". There was that time I traded a holly IOU for one CB black, back when they were almost as rare as CB metals. Now I have 10 and 2 eggs I don't know what to do with.

[SnowSherry]

I think you may have given the wrong link.

 

I noticed that CB black have greatly decreased in "value". There was that time I traded a holly IOU for one CB black, back when they were almost as rare as CB metals. Now I have 10 and 2 eggs I don't know what to do with.

CB blacks and cb stripes are dropping like COMMONS lately

[Katykins2]

I'm always up for Black dragon adopting!

 

@ DarkEternity. I hope you get some offers. Those would be pretty cool to have and you are absolutely right about the work put in

 

@ Noxion. I might disagree, I have PMed a lot of people (8ish to 9) with shimmer breeding lists and they stop responding when I offer something other than CB metals, not even an offspring of my amazing lovely CB gold with choice of mate if they are looking for metals. Though I can see having too many offers to respond to every PM. I think seeing all the people throwing every CB gold in sight at shimmer owners has really raised some of their expectations. Lol those with third and fourth gens who don't want the CBs are in hiding. I haven't gotten a real response to what they are looking for or like other than "whatever I can get." But it's ok, I got my scroll goal metal and am content to wait until the madness dies down!

Edited March 9, 2013 by Katykins2

[DarkEternity]

It was like that in 2010 as well. For fair trades, you'll have to wait a couple of months. If you want to pay an expensive price and recoup your losses, it's necessary to do a trade ASAP because I remember in 2010 when some peeps paid high prices and then the prices dropped dramatically... D:

Shimmer/shimmer trades (anything over 3rd gen) seem dumb to me because exploiting the market while you can is a good idea since they'll be worth nothing soon.

 

You have to remember that the initial number of CB shimmers is higher than the initial numbers of CB tinsels in 2010 so the numbers are going to crash wayyyy faster and we have teleport straight up this year. My first tinsel (4th gen silver) was obtained in Mar 19, 2011 and the tinsels/HMs were awarded on Feb 13, 2011. I was one of the earliest adopters of tinsels and I obtained my tinsel from Absolute. At the time, there were far fewer tinsels on the market than there are Shimmers nowadays, so I expect the drop will occur even sooner than normal. Patience is good, though I too am kind of rearing to mop up all the shimmers off the trading threads.

[PointOfOrigin]

~ snip~

I wonder... Would you like something like this or this?

 

As far as Shimmer trading goes, I'm sorry now that I haven't PMed the winners. It was honestly because I didn't want to put more pressure on them. But it seems that one more person doesn't matter and that the fast ones do get everything. Next year, I won't make that mistake.

[senyi]

I wonder... Would you like something like this or this?

 

As far as Shimmer trading goes, I'm sorry now that I haven't PMed the winners. It was honestly because I didn't want to put more pressure on them. But it seems that one more person doesn't matter and that the fast ones do get everything. Next year, I won't make that mistake.

This ^

I was worried/ being too 'shy' to ask the winners for anything >.<

[DarkEternity]

http://dragcave.net/lineage/cebps is nice but it could do with a little expanding <- evil grin

Back on topic... yup... have to be a ninja with trade offers

Edited March 9, 2013 by DarkEternity

[RMS]

Maybe it's just me, but I can catch metals myself (and have quite a few already), so I don't value them quite as highly. I mean, they are always nice but say, interesting lineages with old pinks, spriters' alts, or even just nicely coordinated ones with commons will interest me more. Personally speaking.

 

I mean, CBs are just that - eggs generated by the cave. You'll never get the creativity or originality of the breeders from those.

 

Mostly why I'm disappointed to see CB trade flourishing so heavily in DC nowadays. Didn't used to be this bad years ago.

[PointOfOrigin]

http://dragcave.net/lineage/cebps is nice but it could do with a little expanding <- evil grin

Back on topic... yup... have to be a ninja with trade offers

Working on it I think I've got enough dragons for a fifth gen.

 

Also, two moths ago, I've thought that I really don't have anything to offer... and then I've seen what other people offered, and I realized that as far as dragon collecting goes, I'm middle class.

[TheGrox]

Maybe it's just me, but I can catch metals myself (and have quite a few already), so I don't value them quite as highly. I mean, they are always nice but say, interesting lineages with old pinks, spriters' alts, or even just nicely coordinated ones with commons will interest me more. Personally speaking.

Trouble is, you'd never get anything like a CB Metal for a nice Spriter's Alt lineage. I've given up putting mine in trades, because they hardly get any offers.

 

But aside from that, I'm getting sick of trading. I think gifting is the way to go now .

[SnowSherry]

I'm browsing the EatW dragon market and did not see a single cb blusang on offer

[Iside]

I am working on another, a purebred red, that I intend to take as high as I can get it.  Things just seem to lose steam when they hit 7th gen:

7th Gen Purebred Red

I'll be impressed if I can get to 8th gen before the end of the year, to be honest. But I'm still breeding. 

May you like 2 5th gen unrelated reds?

 

My highter checkered is currently a 6th gen but will get 7th gen very soon (hopefully, still need only to breed 2 dragons but they are quite stubborn)

 

Edited March 9, 2013 by Iside

[terradi]

Blusangs seem like they're incredibly rare. Wish I had more than one CB one so I could breed off 2nd gens and try trading with those.

 

I'm beginning to think that they're as valuable as metals at this point, which is something I never would have imagined before.

 

I really hope CB golds are worth less in the future. Then, maybe, I'll have something worth trading for one of them. Eventually, I'll have a 2nd gen Shimmer. Likely to be in like ... a year at this point, because I'm farther down on a list. ^^ But I'm thinking it's unlikely that 3rd gen Shimmers will be devalued much even over time. I mean, people still want 3rd gen tinsels very much.

 

Prettiest checker I have is probably this one - http://dragcave.net/lineage/X050l even though the lineage is quite a common pairing. Given that I got the mate as a gift, I'm assuming that this wouldn't be nearly as valuable as an unusual checker or interesting staircase.

[RMS]

Trouble is, you'd never get anything like a CB Metal for a nice Spriter's Alt lineage. I've given up putting mine in trades, because they hardly get any offers.

 

But aside from that, I'm getting sick of trading. I think gifting is the way to go now .

I can kind of understand why. In my mind I classify CBs and breds differently - CBs are for starting your own lineages and bred eggs are good for continuing it/adding to your lines.

 

And I'm getting sick of trading and discussions about trading myself. The discrepancy between "haves" and "have nots" is so huge, and I'm really discouraged by comments like "I got this Shimmer for so cheap!!" "I'm willing to pay this x CB metals for Shimmers!!" It's become such a cutthroat market place, and I just want to wash my hands from it.

 

If I'd known what sort of atmosphere trading has nowadays, I wouldn't have even bothered to step into the community. Eh.

[Reidragon]

I can kind of understand why. In my mind I classify CBs and breds differently - CBs are for starting your own lineages and bred eggs are good for continuing it/adding to your lines.

This <3! I only want Cbs to do pretty checkers I'm aiming for 4 male and 4 female Cb of every species to do lines and then I plan to blood swap a LOT! Personally pretty lineages make the game fun I think. Not sure why everyone and their mother wants only 2nd gens. I have an AMAZING Holly checker. Here is a baby from my pair http://dragcave.net/lineage/SeMUh.

 

Even the whites are super gorgeous I think. I own Joyous Seraph and Lailah Charmeine too and I used to breed them for babies a lot. Now it seems like no one wants them :/ Which is a right shame cause I think they are a gorgeous pair! I traded a GON for Anael before TJ disabled trading of GONs >> And yeah.....haven't been able to summon since ><!

 

And Joyous was an outright gift from a dear friend of mine but I think I enjoy Anael's babies more. There is just so much red and white LOVE. They are my favorite pair on my scroll actually

 

Lineages are simply....exciting and the possibilities are endless. Really the only reason I even want those Cbs is for the lineage capabilities and I figure 8 Cbs, 4 male, 4 female is enough to get me to 4th gen and from there I can blood swap to get higher x3 providing I can find some people willing to swap that is.

 

But yeah....I agree trading has got out of hand and I do wish lineaged eggs were worth more. Though....I suppose that does hold true for some people :3

 

(P.S Every time I see them in lineages other people have done I squeal!)

Edited March 9, 2013 by Reidragon

[Slaskia]

Yeah, Blusangs are hard to come by, but so far in my experience, bred ones aren't worth much. I have two 2nd gen PB up, but not really getting any bites on them at all.

[kerrikins]

Blusangs do seem hard to come by right now...

 

I did some hunting in the coast yesterday but it barely moved - I do wonder if that's contributing to the scarcity. More people are stalking the Alpine/Desert right now and not bothering to touch the coast at all.

 

 

[TobiDei]

Yep yep.

Like lots of people above me said, i want CB metals mainly because i have none, and collecting every dragon as CB is one of my DC goals.

Another reason is, to gift the 2gen metals to new users. I was rarely gifted things when i was new and that made it vaguely difficult for me to find quality trades. so i'd like to help new users as much as possible.

(thanks to those people who did gift to me though <3.. but most of you guys probably stopped playing now.)

 

Um, anyways, i'm rather not pleased with how majority of trades are centering their attention on shimmers, not all of them, but still a lot.

(its good to see lots of trades that dont JUST want shimmers, but have a secondary choice, which gives us an option in what to offer..)

): There is only such a small chance of a shimmer owner willing to trade eggs away right now.

Um um, correct me if im wrong please..

Not wrong at all. I would totally trade a 2nd gen Shimmer Scale for somethings people offer, but the problem is, do they really think I (or any of the other winners) have the leisure to breed the Shimmers just for them, while there are tons of other people on our waiting list? :/ Nor do they give the option of taking an I.O.U, they demand that they be served right that instant while others patiently wait their turn on lists.

 

Also wanted to say I saw those saying they saw winners asking for CBs/multiple CBs/Shimmer swaps. While I did ask for CB Metals (It was too tempting, since I've very new at the game. Joined November of last year), I took whatever the offerer offered. 2 people offered 1 CB Silver each, took them, 1 person offered 2 CB Golds, took them. After I had those sets never asked for more. Asked for more common things after; CB GWs or CB/2nd Gen Trios. Some spots on my list are actually gifting to newbies. I can't even fathom why others would be asking for Shimmer Swaps so early! I plan to do that after others have gotten some 2nd gens for themselves!

 

Not trying to brag here or anything! Just trying to point out everyone can share the problems of crazy trade demands.

 

Would like to mention the new dragons, the Speckle-Throated ones, were asking for ridicules trades on EATW. CB Metals for 3 or less of their new eggs. Though, that could be credited to the rumor that the new eggs were possibly new metals. But my gut still says that they would have asked for that anyway, regardless of speculations of rarity. Speaking of which, after maybe two or three days after they first dropped, I haven't seen any. Really wish they would post more information about them, especially rarity of them.

 

EDIT: Saw someone asking for a Neglected for a 2nd gen PB new dragon on EATW. We really need the rarity established.

Edited March 10, 2013 by TobiDei

[skauble]

Not wrong at all. I would totally trade a 2nd gen Shimmer Scale for somethings people offer, but the problem is, do they really think I (or any of the other winners) have the leisure to breed the Shimmers just for them, while there are tons of other people on our waiting list? :/ Nor do they give the option of taking an I.O.U, they demand that they be served right that instant while others patiently wait their turn on lists.

 

Pretty much this. I'm not a Tinsel/Shimmer winner, but watching this play out over the last few years it seems to me that a lot of those trades are made outside of the trade threads - either with people they know, those who contact them, IRC, etc. Not to say that trades for 2nd gens don't get made on the trade thread - I've made them there, so they happen, but you have to catch the attention of an owner and they have to have space on their list at the time, which doesn't always happen. So I think that some people could stand to be a bit more realistic and flexible in trade offers and probably not be so surprised/upset when they offer really good things and still can't make a trade.

 

Also wanted to say I saw those saying they saw winners asking for CBs/multiple CBs/Shimmer swaps. While I did ask for CB Metals (It was too tempting, since I've very new at the game. Joined November of last year), I took whatever the offerer offered. 2 people offered 1 CB Silver each, took them, 1 person offered 2 CB Golds, took them. After I had those sets never asked for more. Asked for more common things after; CB GWs or CB/2nd Gen Trios. Some spots on my list are actually gifting to newbies. I can't even fathom why others would be asking for Shimmer Swaps so early! I plan to do that after others have gotten some 2nd gens for themselves!

 

For me, the DC economy is about what the market can bear. If people want a ton of metals for a dragon and someone wants to give that to them, there's nothing wrong with that. It's certainly extremely nice when people will take less for an egg that would command a higher price, but if someone has something that's the equivalent of a DC Rolls Royce and they ask a Rolls Royce price for it, that's just the way the game goes.

 

The weirdness starts when people have what is widely considered a Pinto but are asking Rolls Royce prices.

 

Which isn't to say that there isn't an issue with prize dragons. I think that there is. But that's not because of the winners and how they play, but largely because of the extremely limited number of CB prizes awarded. And, IMO, it's really knocked DC (both the game and the economy) off balance.

 

Again, that's not about what people are asking/offering for a prize offspring, but it's because it's given people who can grab lots of CB metals an incentive to never stop. While it's true that many of us were consistently on the look out for rares while hunting, now it's kind of like an imperative with many people because they're trying to make a bunch of low gen prize deals.

 

And let me stress, that's not a knock on them, I did that for much of last year. It's a legitimate way to try to achieve a given goal. But before the rather expensive prize dragon market developed, people still collected rares, but there was also a lot of time set aside for more common collecting and people were willing to trade CB metals for a wider variety of things. (That, of course, doesn't refer to every player, but to a rather persistent trend.) So, in some respects, there's been a lot of players that have been shut out on CB metals because of the constant super high-level competition in the cave and the lack of "in" for the metal trade market.

 

Would like to mention the new dragons, the Speckle-Throated ones, were asking for ridicules trades on EATW. CB Metals for 3 or less of their new eggs. Though, that could be credited to the rumor that the new eggs were possibly new metals. But my gut still says that they would have asked for that anyway, regardless of speculations of rarity. Speaking of which, after maybe two or three days after they first dropped, I haven't seen any. Really wish they would post more information about them, especially rarity of them.

 

EDIT: Saw someone asking for a Neglected for a 2nd gen PB new dragon on EATW. We really need the rarity established.

 

Yeah, this happens with most new releases, but this one was much worse, IMO, partly because of the rare rumors and partly because the other eggs came back so fast. But the thing that most people who post those kind of trades don't seem to get is that the majority of people who have things like CB metals to trade for new release eggs are most likely perfectly capable of catching those very same eggs.

[DarkEternity]

But before the rather expensive prize dragon market developed, people still collected rares, but there was also a lot of time set aside for more common collecting and people were willing to trade CB metals for a wider variety of things. (That, of course, doesn't refer to every player, but to a rather persistent trend.) So, in some respects, there's been a lot of players that have been shut out on CB metals because of the constant super high-level competition in the cave and the lack of "in" for the metal trade market.

This. Before the mass CB metal phase and just after the winners were announced, I went on a crazy search for CB metals. This was in the period where you would see approximately 1 CB metal every 8 hours. I managed to catch 3 and spent almost all my time PMing winners, trying to work out trades before every single other person on the forums made deals. I only managed to trade off one of my CB metals before they all grew up, but the point is that even if CB metals were not my favourite thing, having them became a necessity.

[PointOfOrigin]

Not wrong at all. I would totally trade a 2nd gen Shimmer Scale for somethings people offer, but the problem is, do they really think I (or any of the other winners) have the leisure to breed the Shimmers just for them, while there are tons of other people on our waiting list? :/ Nor do they give the option of taking an I.O.U, they demand that they be served right that instant while others patiently wait their turn on lists.

 

Also wanted to say I saw those saying they saw winners asking for CBs/multiple CBs/Shimmer swaps. While I did ask for CB Metals (It was too tempting, since I've very new at the game. Joined November of last year), I took whatever the offerer offered. 2 people offered 1 CB Silver each, took them, 1 person offered 2 CB Golds, took them. After I had those sets never asked for more. Asked for more common things after; CB GWs or CB/2nd Gen Trios. Some spots on my list are actually gifting to newbies. I can't even fathom why others would be asking for Shimmer Swaps so early! I plan to do that after others have gotten some 2nd gens for themselves!

 

Not trying to brag here or anything! Just trying to point out everyone can share the problems of crazy trade demands.

 

Would like to mention the new dragons, the Speckle-Throated ones, were asking for ridicules trades on EATW. CB Metals for 3 or less of their new eggs. Though, that could be credited to the rumor that the new eggs were possibly new metals. But my gut still says that they would have asked for that anyway, regardless of speculations of rarity. Speaking of which, after maybe two or three days after they first dropped, I haven't seen any. Really wish they would post more information about them, especially rarity of them.

 

EDIT: Saw someone asking for a Neglected for a 2nd gen PB new dragon on EATW. We really need the rarity established.

First of all, congrats! I didn't even know that you were one of the winners. Which brings me to my point. The thing is, there are still a load of CB Shimmer owners for whom the majority of the forums doesn't know. We don't knew your forum name or even if you are on the forum. That's why I think that people make offers in the trading threads. They hope that one of the previously unknown winners (who probably doesn't keep a list) will pop out of the ground and PM them. They are not hoping that Wolfsong, Noxion, Forest or Qualeo will PM them - they hope that they'll get a shot at some other winner.

 

We know, and it's really appreciated IMO, you guys are much more open then previous year winners and much more communicative. And even, if you did take only metallic offers, why would we complain? It's natural that a person will take the best deal offered. And as long that metallics are offered, that's their price.

 

Specles will settle down. Every release, there's an uproar, and in most cases it's just a false alarm. Let people ask what they want - if the price is too small, they just won't get what they want

 

ETA:

Yeah, this happens with most new releases, but this one was much worse, IMO, partly because of the rare rumors and partly because the other eggs came back so fast. But the thing that most people who post those kind of trades don't seem to get is that the majority of people who have things like CB metals to trade for new release eggs are most likely perfectly capable of catching those very same eggs.

 

A couple of people who offered CB Silvers for new dragons early in the release certainly didn't help.

Edited March 10, 2013 by PointOfOrigin

[TobiDei]

So I think that some people could stand to be a bit more realistic and flexible in trade offers and probably not be so surprised/upset when they offer really good things and still can't make a trade.

 

For me, the DC economy is about what the market can bear.  If people want a ton of metals for a dragon and someone wants to give that to them, there's nothing wrong with that.

 

Have to say I agree with both of those (but we can all take a slightly guilty pleasure in whining about the second one sometimes ;P ).

 

Which isn't to say that there isn't an issue with prize dragons.  I think that there is.  But that's not because of the winners and how they play, but largely because of the extremely limited number of CB prizes awarded.

 

Have to agree with this, as well. It would be nice to give out larger numbers, but as with the Tinsels, maybe this year more Shimmer Scales will be given out as prizes at Christmas.

 

On the bright side, the prizes do seem to throw off the rare scale, making metals easier to come by. I've seen at least 10 CB Silver since the Shimmer Scales entered the Cave.

 

 

Yeah, this happens with most new releases, but this one was much worse, IMO, partly because of the rare rumors and partly because the other eggs came back so fast.  But the thing that most people who post those kind of trades don't seem to get is that the majority of people who have things like CB metals to trade for new release eggs are most likely perfectly capable of catching those very same eggs.

 

If only they could understand that. I, too, believe this is worse (though I can really only compare it to Christmas/Valentine releases, as well as the Tri-Horn release, since that's all I've been around for). Can't say I recall many people asking for CB Metals for their Tri-Horns. I also really think that the unknown rarity of these new dragons have something to due with the outrageous requests.