What's your opinion on exclusive dragons?

[Tango]

Just thought of another exclusive - black sweetlings. I believe they were given to users who experienced a glitch where their sweetling eggs disappeared, this was early on in the event and so less users ended up with the black sweetlings which made them more rare. Users who weren't on wouldn't get them because they didn't experience the glitch. A bit like how the spriter alts are thank you's to the spriters, this was an apology to the users who randomly lost eggs they caught. I have no idea how difficult 2gs are to trade for. Thoughts?

[_Sin_]

Just thought of another exclusive - black sweetlings. I believe they were given to users who experienced a glitch where their sweetling eggs disappeared, this was early on in the event and so less users ended up with the black sweetlings which made them more rare. Users who weren't on wouldn't get them because they didn't experience the glitch. A bit like how the spriter alts are thank you's to the spriters, this was an apology to the users who randomly lost eggs they caught. I have no idea how difficult 2gs are to trade for. Thoughts?

Personally I would leave those alone as well. They were intended to compensate for a glitch. In case you wonder, no, I don't have any black sweetling.

[Ribombee]

If prizes are added to a store, I would want CB hybrids to be, and old holidays. Both the later two were given as HM prizes, and the honourable mention should not be worth more than the actual prizes. If one of the prizes is added, ALL of the possible types of prizes need to be added. A lot of people shoot down the CB hybrids but want CB prizes available, but that's really not the way to go about it. It needs to be all or none.

 

Spriter alts and alt sweetlings I am 100% fine with leaving as is. They are special sprites for a special thank you or apology to those who worked or were affected by something.

[andromedae]

Well, I am very new to dragon cave. Indeed, I think it's a truly sad thing that there is no availability/chance for me or other new players to obtain previous CB holidays. I think DC should implement a feature to make the site a little more welcoming in that sense for newer players like myself. It is a good thing to honor players who have formed a part of this site for years, but a lack of CB holidays can be quite discouraging. The release of past years' CB holidays would allow the site more flexibility in terms of lineages, allowing more players to contribute. Perhaps, to maintain their rarity, there should be CB holiday re-releases once every two years?

 

As for Spriter's Alts, they're just fine. They deserve to be rewarded for their wonderful efforts.

 

In terms of CB prizes I think it is absolutely absurd to not have yearly contests, since they are events of such grand importance to Dragon Cave, a staple of the site, you might even say. I don't have a problem with 2Gs being so rare, I think it's kind of fun to work hard for what you want, but a problem would arise if no more prize contests were to be hosted or if they were to happen irregularly rather than yearly, since that would cause the value of prizes to skyrocket.

Edited July 7, 2016 by andromedae

[sylviamaris]

I know it's an unpopular opinion, but tbh I was happier when Prizes were more rare. For a while it was special just to get any bred one, but now that folks are trading for 2nd and 3rd gens they're not even really... rare anymore, you know? And no, I am a casual trader, but I am not hustling for a low-gen Prize. I feel the same way about Spriters' Alts.

 

And I HATE the idea of a store. Let me have my rares, and let other people have their rares. This is not Neopets.

 

(/cranky old lady)

Edited July 7, 2016 by sylviamaris

[guuvii]

I am an old player and I don't even have a lot of the CB holidays because I can't log in everyday, much less when there is a holiday. I don't think older players deserve any kind of "compensation" for playing the game, really. Plus, I'm not that much into trading or depending on someone else to breed me stuff, so it's really sad that some lineages are truly off limit.

 

I think the older holidays should be somehow re-released. For a long time, having more than 2 holidays was unthinkable and now we have that. So why not re-release? Newer player, older players, it truly doesn't matter, cause I was already around for a lot of holidays and still couldn't get an egg.

 

Spriter alts though, shouldn't be messed with. Specially as an artist myself, I understand they take a lot of work and spriters should be absolutely rewarded somehow, even more than they currently are would be more than fair.

 

Now, prize dragons I don't really have an opinion on. Maybe that, I don't know about everyone else, but I think it would be much nicer if they were actually prizes for winning contests (writing, drawing, collecting, baking, anything??) instead of raffled.

[Paradisiske]

I think that cb holidays should be released incave during their holiday breeding time mixed in with the regular eggs. But we still have the scroll limits for only 2 cbs per scroll or maybe 3 or 4 per scroll since some holidays are only one gender while others have both genders. Once it's time for the new holiday to be released then the old holidays stop dropping until next year. Same with cb alts/hybrids.

 

Cb prizes I think should maybe remain in the raffle if they can't be released incave but the number of people who can win one should be increased dramatically.

[birdzgoboom]

Ah, I didn't know that. You'd have to be a very good spriter for it to get picked over the others I imagine. Fixed in main post.

 

So far the consensus seems to be people mostly want CB holidays available for everyone, are split about prizes and are all ok with spriter alts. So for those people who do want re-releases or want CB prizes - how would you do it? All holidays released on the day? Maybe a week of holiday releases, or would that screw up breeding? What about prizes - more raffles, dropped in cave?

 

I know a store is probably the answer but if TJ didn't want it, but wanted us to be able to get the exclusives how do you think he'd do it?

Literally every person that makes a concept sends it in to him via PM, including in-cave artists like myself. It puts everyone on an equal playing ground, regardless of in-cave status. (The first post is still misleading in that regard. )

 

 

 

I would like to see CBs of past holidays available during certain times each respective holiday season, to at least keep the time of capture relevant... ie: past halloween dragons available around Halloween, etc.

 

As for prizes.

I know some people really care about CBs but I honestly don't care. It does suck for people who can't make lineages with them, though, so any way they would be made more available is fine by me I guess.

 

I still feel like I'm in the minority when I say I really wouldn't like a store, especially for things like past holidays or things that desirable, or whatever. I'd rather be playing the game casually and get lucky and find an egg in a biome than have to wait out for my currency to build up enough to buy something. :T

[meowxmeow]

It's an unpopular opinion, but I think CB holidays should remain exclusive barring HM prizes and such. I say this as someone who has missed out on five years worth of holiday events. To me, it keeps the game challenging and is a little reward for being active.

 

As for prizes, in theory I don't have a problem with how they are distributed, but the timing is inconsistent/doesn't always happen. And I seriously hate how the trading market revolves around 2Gs. I really don't give two hoots about lineages so..

[Vhale]

Having had a discussion about similar things in another game, my preferred way to deal with such issues is now Veteran Rewards.

 

2 year increment. People get to pick 1 CB egg, whatever they want. Not tradeable.

[Natayah]

OP, I think you probably should remove spriters' alts out of the discussion because they really don't apply to this discussion. Those are rewards or thank yous for a lot of hard work given with no type of compensation for special dragons and is more of a artistic thing rather than a dragon release subject. Because it seems everyone is talking about spriters' alts and not your real point because ... people aren't really talking about the point of your thread.

 

Although I think we may have already had this discussion in a bunch of other threads, however, my opinion is that I don't really care. I'm not saying it isn't sometimes frustrating. But I just don't care anymore. But I also have stopped caring about what dragons I do or do not collect. So that might be why that is what it is.

[Syiren]

Having had a discussion about similar things in another game, my preferred way to deal with such issues is now Veteran Rewards.

 

2 year increment. People get to pick 1 CB egg, whatever they want. Not tradeable.

^I like that idea.

 

But I don't mind prizes and the like being exclusive. Just knowing that I can sometimes find descendants is awesome enough for me, whether they're prizes or Spriter's Alts. I love collecting the latter and building bigger lineages with them, but it's not the end of the world if I don't get any CB's myself.

 

I say the Spriter's Alts are perfectly set up the way they are. The artists who design/create them work hard to make sure they're ready and look as fantastic as they do, therefore it's only right that they alone get that exclusive design or color.

 

As far as Prizes go, It doesn't bother me if I don't have a CB. I won't lie and say it wouldn't be awesome, but I feel its something that should be earned through a raffle or a contest. Like a few years ago during the snow wars event. Those who did everything and achieved a certain amount were entered into the raffle and the winners got the prizes.

 

We have enough kind people on here who donate nice lineages of both prizes and holidays all the time, some who even gift them to others out of the blue. I myself was given a wonderful rare gift and I love paying it forward whenever I can.

 

The way it's set up so far has shown me that there are many members who are full of kindness. Granted I don't spend much time in the trading threads and mostly stick to donating, but either way, I don't currently see any need to change things up.

 

Though, if there was one thing I'd want to change it'd be the chance to get previous Holliday dragons as CB's. Maybe not the rare Holly, but Yule bucks, Ribbon Dancers, Bone Marrows, etc. We do have a two CB limit (excluding Halloween) which is fine, I'd just like the chance to get some of the earlier ones from before I joined. But seriously, that's my only wish, but if it can't happen then I'm fine with that too.

 

Edited for spelling errors.

Edited July 7, 2016 by Syiren

[Ha-Ki]

Having had a discussion about similar things in another game, my preferred way to deal with such issues is now Veteran Rewards.

 

2 year increment. People get to pick 1 CB egg, whatever they want. Not tradeable.

That is actually a very neat idea

If it's not in suggestions already, would you mind making a thread there?

[Tango]

OP, I think you probably should remove spriters' alts out of the discussion because they really don't apply to this discussion. Those are rewards or thank yous for a lot of hard work given with no type of compensation for special dragons and is more of a artistic thing rather than a dragon release subject. Because it seems everyone is talking about spriters' alts and not your real point because ... people aren't really talking about the point of your thread.

 

Although I think we may have already had this discussion in a bunch of other threads, however, my opinion is that I don't really care. I'm not saying it isn't sometimes frustrating. But I just don't care anymore. But I also have stopped caring about what dragons I do or do not collect. So that might be why that is what it is.

This is a discussion about any exclusive dragons. When they were first released with sweetling, I was vehemently against spriters alts. This was because there was a statement, or I THOUGHT there was a statement saying everyone would have a chance to catch every dragon and spriters alts and the black sweetlings went against that. Since then I've changed my mind on spriters alt, but I was curious what others thought.

[AGYK]

Many people do not yet even own a cb gold because of their slow connection.

I agree with the bulk of what you say, but not the net issue. There are ways around that. Some of us put in quite some time trying to help others get around that issue. Player-run raffles or contests, random gifts, or trades for bundles of CB hatchies all help level the playing field. There are other ways around a slow net or poor trade fodder, too...

 

Is it sad that I can actually imagine some people doing just that, because in their eyes it would make their dragons offspring less valuable to trade?

See: CB Holly owners refusing to breed after the creation of Teleport, because they could no longer control the destination of all 4 eggs.

 

Just thought of another exclusive - black sweetlings. I believe they were given to users who experienced a glitch where their sweetling eggs disappeared, this was early on in the event and so less users ended up with the black sweetlings which made them more rare. Users who weren't on wouldn't get them because they didn't experience the glitch. A bit like how the spriter alts are thank you's to the spriters, this was an apology to the users who randomly lost eggs they caught. I have no idea how difficult 2gs are to trade for. Thoughts?

Nononononono and no. (For the record, I have no black Sweet.) Those were originally intended to be the Sweetling spriter's alt. Kila sacrificed her own alt as a special apology to those affected by the glitch. She has stated they are not to ever be given to anyone else, a sentiment which I heartily agree with. Yeah, it really sucks that the CB population is falling, but whatcha gonna do.

 

So for those people who do want re-releases or want CB prizes - how would you do it? All holidays released on the day? Maybe a week of holiday releases, or would that screw up breeding? What about prizes - more raffles, dropped in cave?

Store, store and store. It's neater and cleaner than releases or raffles imo.

 

I know a store is probably the answer but if TJ didn't want it, but wanted us to be able to get the exclusives how do you think he'd do it?

Hm. Not gonna say how he would do it because I have no idea. But I don't think it would be a terrible thing to have prizes drop somewhat like Golds, perhaps a bit rarer. That gives all the people who have been asking for another rare something to chew on, it provides a bigger CB prize base, and it removes some of the complaints about the raffle. I expect people would still complain about rarity and price, but they already do that so ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

For the Holidays, there was a suggestion floating around to address the falling CB populations. I'm a bit hazy on the exact details, but I think it would basically mean a week of CB breeding followed by a <period> (week, 3 days, 1 day, w/e) of all the old holidays dropping as uncommon/rare CBs, mixed in with the new CB holidays. I believe players would still be limited to 2 CBs. That seems reasonable enough to me; it gives the CB Holiday populations a much-needed boost but blocks hoarding and provides an even playing field for the new players.

 

Edit: here's the suggestion I was thinking of. I got a bunch of the details wrong, but the general idea right. There's also a suggestion to make Holidays breed true all year around but with a very low breeding chance, a la prizes.

[gigglymonkey12]

While I do want some of the CB holidays dragons that I missed, I have come to accept it. I think that they are special because they are released during the holidays and also because you know that the only time to get a CB pair of that breed is during that release

It is an unfortunate thing for others not to be able to get a 2G of that dragon/ or for the chances to be lower because players are leaving. However, I don't really consider holiday dragons as an exclusive dragon. They're not considered exclusive because everyone had the chance to grab them - if they're playing the game at the time. In many other games there are items that are considered limited editions and that is what a holiday dragon is to me.

 

Maybe sometime later they could do a re-release of those holiday dragons. Like a specific breed could drop for a certain period of time.

 

I don't think spriter's alts should be discussed here. I think of it as a reward for their hard work.

 

[Vhale]

That is actually a very neat idea

If it's not in suggestions already, would you mind making a thread there?

I probably wouldn't be able to give it the attention it would need to keep up with it right now. But if someone else wants to run with it, that's fine.

 

THe basic idea follows the Ultima Online vet reward system. I looked up a link to post for clarity and it looks like they've added quite a bit in the last decade. The original rewards were dye tubs (dye clothes) and statues.

 

It's quite a bit more detailed than just 1 dragon per year or 2. To go full UO he'd probably have to add things like egg freezing potions and let them be tradeable.

 

Come to think of it, frozen eggs wouldn't be a bad currency =p

 

http://uo.com/wiki/ultima-online-wiki/items/veteran-rewards/

[Cinnamin Draconna]

The ONLY exclusive I'm in favor of are Spriter's ALTs. They earned them, they deserve them and occasionally I can get a 2nd gen.

 

As for any other exclusive. NO!!!!!

 

Prizes should NEVER have been given out as they were. They should be just like Golds, available in cave to whomever can catch them.

 

Holidays are tricky tho. Caveborns show your devotion to the game by being onsite to catch them on a holiday. But there should be a way to get caveborns later.

 

I'm in favor of the store. That would be the best place to get old Holidays... caveborn ALTs and Hybrids.. and maybe Prizes, but I'd prefer for Prizes to drop in the cave like golds.

[Earth Gurl]

I personally have been in favor of the store idea for a long time. I pretty much stand with most of you on my being against exclusives other than spriter alts. I don't have a problem with holidays' being available again as CB's. (We always have the time stamp to prove we caught the originals, anyway.)

 

The only unfortunate thing about making CB Prizes' being available to everyone is the fact that not all Prizes were won through the raffles. If you recall, the original prizes were won by having the most beautifully decorated Christmas trees and were chosen through voting. So they technically did earn their prizes. I would suggest original prize owners be given a badge or something to commemorate their tree decorating (or give them a different colored tree badge).

[NotBambi]

I would suggest original prize owners be given a badge or something to commemorate their tree decorating (or give them a different colored tree badge).

I like that idea!

 

ETA: Ahem, I was supposed to write more than I did. I'll just plagiarize Cinnamin Draconna. As for any other exclusive, other than Spriter's ALTs, NO!!!!!

Edited July 8, 2016 by NotBambi

[Ruby Eyes]

It's an unpopular opinion, but I think CB holidays should remain exclusive barring HM prizes and such.  I say this as someone who has missed out on five years worth of holiday events.  To me, it keeps the game challenging and is a little reward for being active.

Except that being active now doesn't help you at all with acquiring those. That's not a challenge, that's ... no chance at all.

 

Having had a discussion about similar things in another game, my preferred way to deal with such issues is now Veteran Rewards.

 

2 year increment. People get to pick 1 CB egg, whatever they want. Not tradeable.

I'm jealous. When I voiced a similar idea (just with 1 year) in the What do we want for DC Birthday thread, it got shot down pretty much instantly. Coming from you, people seem to like that idea.

I mean, I like it as well, obviously, I'm just a little jealous.

 

I would suggest original prize owners be given a badge or something to commemorate their tree decorating (or give them a different colored tree badge).

I like that idea, too! That could even work for all Prize *winners*: a badge that says in which contest they won which place (like, a golden, silver, bronze, or wooden icon for the according contest/raffle).

[Artius]

Well. Personally I'm okay with all of these.

I'm not a raffle winner and I've missed some CB holidays; but like Tecca said, I think the challenge of obtaining of such rare dragons is one of the merits of DC.

 

It is next to impossible to get some things because people only want 2nd Gen prizes while some 2nd Gen Prizes have prices that most normal players can't meet

Apart from that, I feel the same way. Rich owners seem to be getting richer but other users are stationary.

[andromedae]

The problem with not making previous CB holidays available is that there is a strong reliance on trading with users who are still active, own the dragon in question and would be willing to breed a 2G. I personally don't have trouble with getting a 2G instead of a CB but still, if users from previous years slowly become less and less active it will be more difficult to even get a 2G and their value will increase due to diminished availability. For those users who are greatly interested in low-gen dragons like myself of course, it's kind of a big thing to worry about.

Edited July 8, 2016 by andromedae

[silver_tiger]

I also think that the spriter's alts should be removed from this topic. The way those tend to work is TJ changes your scroll so every holiday dragon you get of that type is only alt colors. So, if we had spriter's alts, then we would lose the normal sprite... unless things changed, I guess.

 

I think I'm most fond of the idea of a store. Holidays should only be available around their respective holiday, of course, which will force people to be very selective about how many of the older holiday dragons they try to get--a good way to keep the initial numbers relatively low. I have no idea about Prizes... maybe have a cooldown effect? People can only buy one every month or two... idk.

[cyradis4]

Spriter's Alts: won't talk about that, everyone else has.

 

Old CB Holidays: Having them available somehow in CB form to new users is becoming vitally important. The tale of CB Hollies tells it: They were super rare to start with, and by the time of the first HMs, were almost extinct. Then, they bounced back and people began to actually see them again, and two years ago they were actually accessible to a large part of the user-base, though still stupid expensive. Now, with no raffle this past year and no HMs the year before? They've slid into "nearly extinct in 2nd gen" again. There were about 30 active CB Hollies this past winter... Most of them from the most recent HMs. I think, if memory serves (mo, you out there?) that there were only 5 originals active. Give it another year or two, and 2nd gen Hollies will be effectively extinct again. As it was, I think less than 100 2nd gen Hollies were bred last year.

 

And other Holidays will soon go that way too, if there's no way to replenish them.

 

So I'm against CB Holidays staying "exclusive". I support the store idea, myself. Same for the CB Prizes, I'd rather them in the store. I dislike the concept of a "prize dragon" that's that limited.

 

In general, I'm against "exclusives". I'd be more ok with Holiday CBs not returning, if we weren't rapidly loosing the oldest breeds. As it is, I'd support most methods of replenishing them. But then, I've always considered Holidays more of a "limited edition" rather than an exclusive like Prizes. Reason is, everyone can get the Holidays (like a limited edition) if they are there at the right time.... but Prizes are exclusively "luck" and no matter what, the vast majority of people will never (at this time) be able to get them.

 

Cheers!

C4.