Make CB Golds **slighty** less rare

[The Flash]

The entire suggestion is about adjusting ratios.

What are you even talking about? I never said to adjust the ratios FIRST. Hint: Keyword is FIRST.

[Tehya Faye]

The suggestion, not your posts. This thread is asking for the rarity of Golds to be adjusted. People are discussing the general rarity of CB Golds, discussing potential ways to truly fix it, and discussing why CB Golds are the way they are to offer valuable feedback to this basic suggestion.

Edited June 27, 2015 by Tehya Faye

[nlechoppa]

What I think know you're missing is I never said to screw with the ratios and make Golds easier to catch - don't take out of my mouth - I, for one, want scripters to be dealt with. And if the blocker issue needs to be fixed first, then fix it. And I presume that will naturally come with a decrease in the rarity of Golds.

 

Again, 5 years. That's utter . If you don't get that, oh well.

Scripters are rather hard to deal with as there is really no definite way to tell if someone is a scripter or not unless they admit it.

[The Flash]

Scripters are rather hard to deal with as there is really no definite way to tell if someone is a scripter or not unless they admit it.

No definite way, yes, but couldn't TJ write a script, in theory, that could detect if something seemed 'off'? As in, say, if a user catches 5 CB Golds a day. Or something like that. Of course, it'd help if he actually posted in these threads...

[kabocha]

Scripters are rather hard to deal with as there is really no definite way to tell if someone is a scripter or not unless they admit it.

Yeeeep. I mean, you can try, but then you end up getting innocent people, and drama erupts over THAT.

 

However, to move away from the topic of scripting, it'd be nice if the ratio was adjusted for Golds... This would affect breeding too, wouldn't it?

'cause I'd sure like my golds to produce something one of these days.

[The Flash]

Oh, and to elaborate: If said script accidentally banned someone that wasn't scripting, perhaps an option to contact TJ or a mod (Do forum mods have power on the actual site? I'm thinking yes, since they can approve descriptions, IIRC) and prove otherwise?

 

Although... I'm not quite sure how they could prove their innocence.

[NotBambi]

Oh, and to elaborate: If said script accidentally banned someone that wasn't scripting, perhaps an option to contact TJ or a mod (Do forum mods have power on the actual site? I'm thinking yes, since they can approve descriptions, IIRC) and prove otherwise?

 

Although... I'm not quite sure how they could prove their innocence.

Do you mean that is ok that they can't prove their innocence?

What is the point here, to go after scripters or to go after people that can catch rares? The most "popular" script, the one installed by 100+, probably hundreds after they share with their friends, doesn't explicitly go after Golds but, in general, after rares. How do you deal with that? Just ban everybody that is able to catch 5+ rares a day? Get 5 Trios and you are you banned?

This is sounding more and more like a witch-hunt.

[nlechoppa]

It's best to just leave it alone, scripters have limits in any case and for now we should not be focusing on preventing them as of right now.

[AnanoKimi]

What I think know you're missing is I never said to screw with the ratios and make Golds easier to catch - don't take out of my mouth - I, for one, want scripters to be dealt with. And if the blocker issue needs to be fixed first, then fix it. And I presume that will naturally come with a decrease in the rarity of Golds.

 

Again, 5 years. That's utter . If you don't get that, oh well.

I actually dont think waiting x amount of years for something is a bad thing (just look at the loyal shenmue fans who've been waiting for years to have their 3rd installment of that game series) unless its something of dire and immediate attention. Patience is a virtue many don't have and well if someone doesnt want to wait 1 or be it 5 years to get a gold then no one is making them really. They can always just focus on other things.

 

Not to say that it is not an issue that needs to be fixed but again, no one is gonna die if golds don't become easierto catch and its not like CB hunting is the only way to obtain a gold. Many gift, you can IOU trade (at your and the other person's discretion), some people do services like art in exchange for rares. It may not be the same as catching one on your own but at least you can get a gold.

 

and if you don't care about generations or CB then getting any kind of gold is not an impossible task. Some people will gladly gift or trade 2nd gens or higher for the sake of collection.

 

So No one really has to wait any length of time to get a gold. Some people aren't sitting around jut staring and refreshing the caves in the hopes of spotting one. When people say "I've played for 5 years and havent managed to catch one" it doesnt mean they've spent the majority of ther DC time (after other important task they may have in life) just staring at the biomes hoping to find one. They mean that within those five years of trading, raising, collecting other things, socializing in the forums (if applicable for some) and breeding, the few times or any sur number of times they've gone to hunt they havent seen/caught one.

 

So no one has sat around waiting five years at the ave, we've been doing other stuff too. I'm in that group of 5+ years having played and not having caught a single gold. But in those five years I've bred, traded, gifted, socialized, collected, hoarded, etc, not just hunted so maybe in one of those when I was scrolling over what dragons to breed a gold appeared and I might have had a chance but was too busy and oh well. Who knows, doesnt matter.

 

Where improvement would be nice and would be helpful, none of us are gonna drop dead should TJ decide to not want to get involved in this idea.

Edited June 27, 2015 by AnanoKimi

[yosofine]

I think this thread needs to take a deep breath and realize that the ratios of each breed to the others is taken care of by TJ and they change as the need arises. Just because some people find it easier to catch rares than others, there is no reason to change the programming because we find a certain breed more difficult to catch. They are called rare for a reason and they are there (the trade threads prove it).

 

I've been with this game for years and my first gold was gifted to me. My first CB gold was gifted to me by a friend who traded really nice eggs for it. I had been here about 5 years before I caught one. My word of the day is patience. Keep looking for rare or uncommon eggs. Memorize the egg descriptions. Look for eggs at odd times if you get the chance. Trade for good eggs and rare lines. Build up your scroll other ways (breeding, wishlists, events, etc.). Then you may get a chance at those CB Golds and Silvers.

 

Scripting is a strong accusation around here and can have strong consequences. They will eventually get caught. If you truly know something the admin should know about, contact TJ or any mod.

 

I will say this about eggs: No matter what happens, someone will complain.

My other personal saying: Never say never.

 

I do like the idea of discussion and letting your hopes and dreams be known. Who knows what will happen?

[Fuzzbucket]

I think this thread needs to take a deep breath and realize that the ratios of each breed to the others is taken care of by TJ and they change as the need arises. Just because some people find it easier to catch rares than others, there is no reason to change the programming because we find a certain breed more difficult to catch. They are called rare for a reason and they are there (the trade threads prove it).

 

I've been with this game for years and my first gold was gifted to me. My first CB gold was gifted to me by a friend who traded really nice eggs for it. I had been here about 5 years before I caught one. My word of the day is patience. Keep looking for rare or uncommon eggs. Memorize the egg descriptions. Look for eggs at odd times if you get the chance. Trade for good eggs and rare lines. Build up your scroll other ways (breeding, wishlists, events, etc.). Then you may get a chance at those CB Golds and Silvers.

 

Scripting is a strong accusation around here and can have strong consequences. They will eventually get caught. If you truly know something the admin should know about, contact TJ or any mod.

 

I will say this about eggs: No matter what happens, someone will complain.

My other personal saying: Never say never.

 

I do like the idea of discussion and letting your hopes and dreams be known. Who knows what will happen?

This. Thanks, yosofine.

 

The difficulty catching golds is NOT something that will bring about the end of the word as we know it. Five years is NOT that unreasonable, as "reason" has nothing to do with anything. I've played longer than that and have never caught one. So censorkipz what ? I have been gifted some by (non-scripting) faster catchers; lovely people. If I hadn't - well, again - it isn't the end of the world.

 

If you had been working on seasonal lines when C4 and I and hundreds of others were

 

*trembles at memory of that winter season*

 

Springs were extinct, I think I bred ONE spring the entire season, trying each week with 16+ pairs. Even summers were really tough.

 

So yea, even suggesting that...... *shudders*

 

Cheers!

C4.

 

- then you'd know about REAL frustration - as there was NOTHING anyone could do about that one except wait a year - just to BREED a pair you already owned. Hunting for the seriously elusive is as NOTHING by comparison.

Edited June 27, 2015 by fuzzbucket

[CNR4806]

Sorry, as much as I disagree with most of The Flash's points (especially regarding scripters) and over-the-top emotions, 5 real-life years to make progress in a game like this is utterly ridiculous.

 

Gifting should also be ruled out as a factor. If "community spirit" is the only thing keeping the playerbase's frustration of something practically being an unobtainium in a game proper at bay, something is seriously wrong with the game design.

 

 

But yes, as everyone has said (including myself), nothing should be done specifically to the metals before the obviously-broken ratios system is fixed (or obliterated).

[olympe]

Even though the ratio system doesn't work overly well, we do need some kind of ratios. Even if every breed was created at random, there'd still be a ratio involved.

[AquaBlueRain]

Even though I only have one CB Gold, I'd like to keep them as rare as they are.

[nlechoppa]

Ratios should be replaced with rarity.

Ratios have to be destroyed.

[NotBambi]

Ratios should be replaced with rarity.

Ratios have to be destroyed.

The fact is that we do not really know how things work. Based on what I know, TJ could already be using rarity instead of ratios. Or do you guys know more than I do and can clarify?

[JavaTigress]

The fact is that we do not really know how things work. Based on what I know, TJ could already be using rarity instead of ratios. Or do you guys know more than I do and can clarify?

AFAIK, it is by ratios. I would THINK that if TJ had changed something as major as THAT he would have given us a heads up that a change was coming, at least. To mu knowledge, w don't know EXACTLY what the ratios are, but I THINK that they DO exist. To my knowledge THAT is why dragons from more recent releases tend to appear more frequently than older releases... assuming that both were intended to be common.

 

That is frustrating, I admit.... but I truthfully don't know what might work better.

 

Seeing as I don't have all the details that TJ does, I am not ENTIRELY sure I feel comfortable in saying that the ratios need to be done away with entirely ( AND I think TJ has said that isn't happening, though he is certainly free to change his mind) but I DO wonder if something could be done to alleviate the frustration. I don't want to see any dragons retired or such.

Edited June 28, 2015 by Silverswift

[AnanoKimi]

Even though I only have one CB Gold, I'd like to keep them as rare as they are.

So with this statement you mean you wouls like to continue to have golds impossibly rare for the average user and only available to a small elite group of users with fast internet connections, fast reflexes, and/or cheaters making it so that those not within that small group of elites have to completely settle for having to muster some form of negotiation with these people to have a chance at one or have to wait for someone to kindly gift them one because otherwise there is no way most users would have a chance at them...?

 

I have to agree, waiting isnt fun, and can seem ridiculous, waiting for a release is definitely not the same as waiting for something within a game that should be obtainable normally. Waiting years to get something due toa major game flaw is rather ridiculous and should get fixed. There are many good ideas out there to help with this issue and hopefully the boss man finds time to let us know his thoughts on this issue.

[NotBambi]

AFAIK, it is by ratios. I would THINK that if TJ had changed something as major as THAT he would have given us a heads up that a change was coming, at least. To mu knowledge, w don't know EXACTLY what the ratios are, but I THINK that they DO exist. To my knowledge THAT is why dragons from more recent releases tend to appear more frequently than older releases... assuming that both were intended to be common.

 

That is frustrating, I admit.... but I truthfully don't know what might work better.

 

Seeing as I don't have all the details that TJ does, I am not ENTIRELY sure I feel comfortable in saying that the ratios need to be done away with entirely ( AND I think TJ has said that isn't happening, though he is certainly free to change his mind) but I DO wonder if something could be done to alleviate the frustration. I don't want to see any dragons retired or such.

In my case, that would be AFAIDNK TJ seems to prefer to allow us to find out instead. All things considered, I kind of like that approach and the relative challenge.

I do admit that I didn't notice that dragons from newer releases tend to appear more often than older ones - with the exclusion of release times- and, on normal times, I still could see that being linked to rarity.

 

[AnanoKimi]

Off topic but can someone explain what AFAIK and/or AFAIDNK is/means? PM is fine.

 

A lot of the ratios thing is msotly user observation with slight cryptic input from TJ. Though it is apparant that the less of something is getting raised the more abundant it is in the caves thus the blocker issue.

[Guillotine]

Off topic but can someone explain what AFAIK and/or AFAIDNK is/means? PM is fine.

 

A lot of the ratios thing is msotly user observation with slight cryptic input from TJ. Though it is apparant that the less of something is getting raised the more abundant it is in the caves thus the blocker issue.

They mean "As Far As I Know"/"As Far As I Don't Know".

 

Yeah, basically everything we know about ratios is supposition. We have very little solid evidence of how things are working at this moment, but we can make educated guesses based on collective user observation.

[Syphoneira]

It's best to just leave it alone, scripters have limits in any case and for now we should not be focusing on preventing them as of right now.

 

 

 

I would like to point out that in situations where stock is regularly being stolen en masse rather than obtained normally, and where there's no way of those standard order levels keeping enough of whatever on the shelves to fill needs or of catching those taking the stock in quantity, the usual response would be keep the shelves stocked to the estimated required level anyway, so that at least needs are fulfilled and the system functions.

 

Since the objects in question ('trade fodder' sprites generally, whether intended to be rare or not,) cost no money to obtain in larger quantities and are not sold but free for the taking, why wouldn't this be feasible here as well, even if on a temporary 'outside the ratios' basis while other issues (such as unmoving biomes and the raising of auto-APed low-timers into the ratios, as well as disposing of/reducing the scripter issue) were being addressed?

 

If the value of various dragons resides for some only in others being unable to have even a hope of obtaining them to keep trade value high for those using them as 'trade fodder', (therefore making cheating worth the risk for some while reducing areas of game-play for many regular members,) whereas those other members require them for scroll goals and the continuance/creations of various lines and lineages important to actual game-play, which line of thinking would most productively be followed to improve both the gaming experience for most and the site itself over-all?

 

 

Many people have never had the thrill of catching certain hard-to-come by dragons and at current rates, never will, yet catching dragons is a huge part of the point of the site.

 

As stated, this shuts them out of achieving scroll goals and much breeding potential, these forming huge parts of the point of the site.

 

The lack of variety long showing in the biomes makes hunting boring, yet hunting is a huge part of the point of the site.

 

Why should the thrill of the desirable catch and the most beautiful CB dragons be essentially reserved for the relative few players able to afford/with access to fast systems?

 

Trading may be a huge part of the site, but it doesn't need to shut a huge part of the membership out of huge areas within nearly all of the huge parts of the site, (including areas of trading itself,) leaving many with a loss of interest and lack of engagement in an experience they may find accumulating too many chronic and long-term disappointments in something they play for fun and in great part often because they CAN play it without a fast system - apart from an increasing number of the most beautiful and desirable dragons they come here to collect and breed.

 

An awful lot of the people feeling this way don't seem to be commenting on threads like this, in some cases because feeling that their concerns may be dismissed, and in others because they aren't here much or at all anymore.

 

 

And I personally think these are huge points pertaining to the general membership and to the site which are perhaps not enough considered.

[Kukuru]

I need some clarify, i'm a bit confused.

Isn't the ratio the same as rarity? In the meaning as both would work in %.

[olympe]

Basically, yes. However, we neither know the exact rarity nor the exact ratios, as TJ prefers to keep them secret.

 

Also, I agree with Syphoneira. However, even if the rarity of golds doesn't get changed, I still think that increased movement in the biomes (shuffles happening more often than every 5 minutes) and making commons more desirable (by both punting cave blockers to the AP and fixing the issue with common x common breedings) are good steps in helping the site in general. Plus, of course, catching cheaters is never a bad idea. Also, adding a cave biome like the old cave - a "biome" where all eggs drop according to their ratios - might help with the movement issue, too.

 

Obviously, I'm not going to complain if golds and other very rare CB breeds become more common, but I think that the suggestions I rehashed above might already improve the situation quite a bit.

[AnanoKimi]

Basically, yes. However, we neither know the exact rarity nor the exact ratios, as TJ prefers to keep them secret.

 

Also, I agree with Syphoneira. However, even if the rarity of golds doesn't get changed, I still think that increased movement in the biomes (shuffles happening more often than every 5 minutes) and making commons more desirable (by both punting cave blockers to the AP and fixing the issue with common x common breedings) are good steps in helping the site in general. Plus, of course, catching cheaters is never a bad idea. Also, adding a cave biome like the old cave - a "biome" where all eggs drop according to their ratios - might help with the movement issue, too.

 

Obviously, I'm not going to complain if golds and other very rare CB breeds become more common, but I think that the suggestions I rehashed above might already improve the situation quite a bit.

Yeah basically this. I completely agree with this and I also feel that taking these steps would definitely be steps in the right direction.