Notice Regarding Trading Harassment

[WraithZephyr]

Maybe I am missing something here, but I have NEVER seen anyone tell another person what they can or cannot do with their dragons or pressure in any way. I certainly hope that certain posts, including my own are not construed in such a manner, because that is just NOT what is being said.

.

that's just it.. it's not really seen in public but in PMs. I had someone who came out of nowhere and PM'd many times DEMANDING I trade whatever high value egg or hatchling I happened to have on my scroll at the time for whatever messy/inbred thing he had.. it didn't matter if what I had was up for trade or not. for example.. I was told I had to trade my 2nd gen gold for his 12+ gen inbred silver... or I had to trade a 4th gen tinsel for a pink hatchling... or I had to breed him this or that high valued dragon for nothing. He went after a lot of breeders in this fashion. And sadly.. looking at what would occasionally show up on his scroll.. I'm afraid he took advantage of some people through intimidation/non-stop harassment... probably conned a lot of nice things from newer players in return for junk or just to get him to leave them alone. I banned him from PM'ing me. I had to then ban him from emailing me when he realized he could not PM me anymore. Reported the email to their email provider.

[tjekan]

that's just it.. it's not really seen in public but in PMs. I had someone who came out of nowhere and PM'd many times DEMANDING I trade whatever high value egg or hatchling I happened to have on my scroll at the time for whatever messy/inbred thing he had.. it didn't matter if what I had was up for trade or not. for example.. I was told I had to trade my 2nd gen gold for his 12+ gen inbred silver... or I had to trade a 4th gen tinsel for a pink hatchling... or I had to breed him this or that high valued dragon for nothing. He went after a lot of breeders in this fashion. And sadly.. looking at what would occasionally show up on his scroll.. I'm afraid he took advantage of some people through intimidation/non-stop harassment... probably conned a lot of nice things from newer players in return for junk or just to get him to leave them alone. I banned him from PM'ing me. I had to then ban him from emailing me when he realized he could not PM me anymore. Reported the email to their email provider.

Thanks for that example, WraithZephyr. I think that gives a very clear picture of what bannable PM harassment would look like. :-o

[Starscream]

it is definitely a good example of what should not be tolerated by any user from any user.

[Obscure_Trash]

This thread is not here to discuss raffles or other prize-giving events. It is here to remind users not to harass other users and to let users know that if they are being harassed, they can (and should!) contact a moderator.

 

Please forward PMs/screenies/IRC stuff of harassment to a moderator if:

• You are being pushed or pressured into something you don't want to do. You have said no and the user continues to push the issue.
• You are being called names or cussed out.
• A user is rude.
• Your are feeling hurt.
• You are being made to feel as if you should avoid the forum/IRC/wherever to avoid a user.
• A user demands that you gift or trade them something.
• You have let it be known you don't want to interact with the user and they continue to contact or pester you.

If you think you should maybe PM a mod - do it. Even if we don't hand out a warning, we can know we need to keep an eye on a certain user, we can talk to the user, or we can talk with you and give you some advise.

 

If anybody is being offered a gift that they feel uncomfortable taking, it is their right to say no. A gift is a gift - you do not have to accept it. You do not owe anything in return for that gift.

 

People also do not owe a response to every PM they get. There may be several reasons not to reply and that is up to the receiver.

 

If you do not understand any of this, please contact a moderator for clarification.

Edited February 21, 2013 by SockPuppet Strangler

[LuckyFreckle]

I have to disagree on the "not ignoring rude PMs"

 

If anyone ever sends me some rude PM, I'm not responding, period. If some random jerk started being rude to me on the street, I would walk away, because he is a complete stranger, and I am not entitled to give attention to someone I don't know.

 

 

You get what you give. If you politely PM me, I will politely respond. If you out of absolute nowhere, send me a rude PM, I'm just going to block you. I have one life to live, and life is short. I'm not wasting energy on someone like that. I have more important things to deal with. Now, if the PM conversation started off polite, and somehow spiraled into rudeness, I will likely keep responding, and ultimately warn that if it continues, they will be blocked completely.

 

As for the "unfairness" of it all, life isn't fair. I would like a mansion and a brand new Mustang. I'm not going to roll the window of my used Jeep Compass down at a red light and demand that the guy in the brand new Mustang gives me his, or sets me up with one. That's asinine. You can't always have what you want. I have never won a raffle. I was not here until 2010, after the Frills and Bright Pinks were discontinued. Know what I did? I built a bridge. I reconciled that I wouldn't have certain things, or would have a hard time getting certain things. I don't have a Neglected. I don't have a Guardian (after over a year of trying), and I have high-gen Tinsels.

 

The most valuable things on my scroll are a 2nd Gen. Dusk, a 2nd Gen. Holly, and a couple 5th Gen Dorkfaces. That's it. Sure, I have two CBs of almost every single dragon. I have worked hard to everything that I do have, that way I can breed wonderful lineages for people if they ask (currently trying to make a complex one made up of Reds, Greens, Golds, & Silvers - and they just don't want to breed metallic children unfortunately). Would it be nice to have won a prize? Sure, but you know what? Eventually, I got the tinsels on my scroll, eventually I'm sure I'll find high-gen Shimmers in the AP. Maybe I'll have something worth trading for a low-gen. Until then, I'm focused on completing my scroll with that I still need and can catch myself.

 

I'm on neither side of the fence. I think that Prize Winners should consider themselves lucky, which I'm sure they do, but they should not be harassed by anyone. I've seen that a couple of winners have graced the thread, but I'm not going to PM them. I never PMed anyone for a tinsel, and I'm not doing so for a Shimmer. What I am getting sick of is seeing a lot of people who feel entitled, I'm getting sick of seeing a bunch of drama-mongering on the threads, the arguments over who should and shouldn't do what, and a bunch of general whining, moaning, and dead-horse-beating. I don't understand it, I really don't. People will win, people will lose. It's not the best feeling in the world when you don't win, but guess what? C'est la vie. It's life. Life is not fair, it is not easy, and while yes, the forums should certainly be fair, polite, human nature never will be. Prize Winners have the ultimate right as any one of us. Don't give me this "they should share with the community" crap. They do what they want, just like you do what you want with your own scroll. I don't think you'd take too kindly to someone telling you how to run it, prize dragons or not. Don't do that to them.

 

And after reading this thread, I feel I should probably edit my profile and set some rules for PMs and whatnot. It could probably use some cleaning anyway.

 

Lastly, if I came across as harsh, it probably because I was being harsh. Every thread it's something else. Every holiday it's something else. Every raffle it's something else. There's always some kind of problem, or argument, that divides this community, and those of us who are sitting on the fence and watching are not really entertained or amused by it. I can't speak for all like me, but it gets annoying to the point where I only come here to look at the News section. And I may stop that soon enough too. This drama and bickering over pixels is ridiculous, and the fact that people are being harassed through private messages is absolutely disgusting.

 

 

[dragongrrl]

I have to disagree on the "not ignoring rude PMs"

 

If anyone ever sends me some rude PM, I'm not responding, period. If some random jerk started being rude to me on the street, I would walk away, because he is a complete stranger, and I am not entitled to give attention to someone I don't know.

 

 

You get what you give. If you politely PM me, I will politely respond. If you out of absolute nowhere, send me a rude PM, I'm just going to block you. I have one life to live, and life is short. I'm not wasting energy on someone like that. I have more important things to deal with. Now, if the PM conversation started off polite, and somehow spiraled into rudeness, I will likely keep responding, and ultimately warn that if it continues, they will be blocked completely.

 

As for the "unfairness" of it all, life isn't fair. I would like a mansion and a brand new Mustang. I'm not going to roll the window of my used Jeep Compass down at a red light and demand that the guy in the brand new Mustang gives me his, or sets me up with one. That's asinine. You can't always have what you want. I have never won a raffle. I was not here until 2010, after the Frills and Bright Pinks were discontinued. Know what I did? I built a bridge. I reconciled that I wouldn't have certain things, or would have a hard time getting certain things. I don't have a Neglected. I don't have a Guardian (after over a year of trying), and I have high-gen Tinsels.

 

The most valuable things on my scroll are a 2nd Gen. Dusk, a 2nd Gen. Holly, and a couple 5th Gen Dorkfaces. That's it. Sure, I have two CBs of almost every single dragon. I have worked hard to everything that I do have, that way I can breed wonderful lineages for people if they ask (currently trying to make a complex one made up of Reds, Greens, Golds, & Silvers - and they just don't want to breed metallic children unfortunately). Would it be nice to have won a prize? Sure, but you know what? Eventually, I got the tinsels on my scroll, eventually I'm sure I'll find high-gen Shimmers in the AP. Maybe I'll have something worth trading for a low-gen. Until then, I'm focused on completing my scroll with that I still need and can catch myself.

 

I'm on neither side of the fence. I think that Prize Winners should consider themselves lucky, which I'm sure they do, but they should not be harassed by anyone. I've seen that a couple of winners have graced the thread, but I'm not going to PM them. I never PMed anyone for a tinsel, and I'm not doing so for a Shimmer. What I am getting sick of is seeing a lot of people who feel entitled, I'm getting sick of seeing a bunch of drama-mongering on the threads, the arguments over who should and shouldn't do what, and a bunch of general whining, moaning, and dead-horse-beating. I don't understand it, I really don't. People will win, people will lose. It's not the best feeling in the world when you don't win, but guess what? C'est la vie. It's life. Life is not fair, it is not easy, and while yes, the forums should certainly be fair, polite, human nature never will be. Prize Winners have the ultimate right as any one of us. Don't give me this "they should share with the community" crap. They do what they want, just like you do what you want with your own scroll. I don't think you'd take too kindly to someone telling you how to run it, prize dragons or not. Don't do that to them.

 

And after reading this thread, I feel I should probably edit my profile and set some rules for PMs and whatnot. It could probably use some cleaning anyway.

 

Lastly, if I came across as harsh, it probably because I was being harsh. Every thread it's something else. Every holiday it's something else. Every raffle it's something else. There's always some kind of problem, or argument, that divides this community, and those of us who are sitting on the fence and watching are not really entertained or amused by it. I can't speak for all like me, but it gets annoying to the point where I only come here to look at the News section. And I may stop that soon enough too. This drama and bickering over pixels is ridiculous, and the fact that people are being harassed through private messages is absolutely disgusting.

Thank you for saying this. I do not have time or energy to waste on responding to rude or objectionable behavior. My son went through a brief phase where he tried to throw a couple of tantrums. I walked away, and he quit throwing tantrums.

 

Abuse of whatever form does not have to be tolerated, and harassment is a form of abuse.

[egwenna]

[...] The "haves" have existed since the game began.  [...]

Not delving into the raffle-no raffle conversation except to say "This." and agree with Fiona... and reading just a little high, what xXAngelicEvilXx says, too.

 

As far as the publicly stated No Harrassment policy ... I think it's a little sad that it has to be said. :-(

 

Treat others as you wish to be treated - or better.

 

At least now that it has been said, players who have been (or are being) harrassed will know they have recourse and will feel confident enough to reach out for support to deal with the offenders.

Edited February 21, 2013 by egwenna

[Charbreon]

im honestly not suprised why do people do this :/

 

if i was them i would find someone else who will give/breed for them

[Banuk]

What I mean is that when people start saying you cannot do as you want with your own dragons and you "should" play it another way, that IS harassment.

In the Suggestions section, it's common practice for people to tell others how to play the game/tell someone they're playing wrong, but, no, it's not harassment there! I'm betting if I tried to report someone who was telling me how to play over there, I would get a warn myself for wasting a mod's time and being "whiny".

 

But yet when it comes to prize dragons, suddenly it's harassment and not okay to suggest that someone is doing it "wrong".

 

I just...

 

I don't get it.

Edited February 21, 2013 by Derranged

[shikaru]

In the Suggestions section, it's common practice for people to tell others how to play the game/tell someone they're playing wrong, but, no, it's not harassment there! I'm betting if I tried to report someone who was telling me how to play over there, I would get a warn myself for wasting a mod's time and being "whiny".

 

But yet when it comes to prize dragons, suddenly it's harassment and not okay to suggest that someone is doing it "wrong".

 

I just...

 

I don't get it.

Mods shouldn't warn you for reporting someone you feel is harassing you. The first post says nothing about prize dragons, and just because it's talking specifically about trading doesn't mean it can't also extend to other topics. Harassment in general isn't okay. I mean, I can't actually speak for active mods, but if you feel like you're being harassed or attacked by another forum member for any reason, report them to a mod.

Edited February 21, 2013 by shikaru

[manticore]

In the Suggestions section, it's common practice for people to tell others how to play the game/tell someone they're playing wrong, but, no, it's not harassment there! I'm betting if I tried to report someone who was telling me how to play over there, I would get a warn myself for wasting a mod's time and being "whiny".

 

But yet when it comes to prize dragons, suddenly it's harassment and not okay to suggest that someone is doing it "wrong".

 

I just...

 

I don't get it.

Because people go to a suggestions forum seeking suggestions about how to play. But if you're telling people they're doing it wrong unsolicted, that's rude.

[simkim]

I really do hope the winners who I contacted to congratulate them and to offer them something that I could breed - I hope they took that as a sincere honest congratulation.

 

I didn't breed first and give them a teleport. I gave them the option to say thanks, but no thanks.

 

I never expected to even be put on any list of any sorts for anything. All I wanted was to make some winners smile, since I know a lot of pms they get are probably demanding in nature.

 

To anyone that I offered a breeding - if you felt that I was expecting something in return - I do NOT expect anything in return. Enjoy yourself.

 

As for Mysfytt and others who don't want to trade or gift their 2nd gen shimmer-scales for whatever reason. That's their choice.

 

I don't even have to breed anything of mine for anyone. I do it because I love making people smile and be happy. Rude requests get them nothing from me. Polite requests will invariably always get something from me. Speaking of my breeding, that is.

 

I enjoy the raffle because I think that was a very fair way of picking out winners, although, considering we now number in the thousands, I do wonder that 60+1 (spriter's alt) is enough? If TJ thinks that's a fair number, then I accept that as so.

 

Without TJ, we would have no DragCave. So keep that in mind when you play, remember that TJ doesn't have to breed his Thuweds for us. Just an example here.

 

Above all, people need to think: "Would *I* like this post or pm if someone else sent it to *ME*, if I had that dragon?" If you say no, I wouldn't - then take a minute and pause... revise the post or pm so that it's something that YOU wouldn't mind getting. That's probably the best way to make sure you don't send out a pm or a post that sounds wrong or could even be considered harrassment.

 

Like many years ago: If you can't say something nice, then don't say anything at all.

[dramanutt29]

Wow, why is this even a thing? Shouldn't people know by now how to behave properly? Yeesh.

[Obscure_Trash]

In the Suggestions section, it's common practice for people to tell others how to play the game/tell someone they're playing wrong, but, no, it's not harassment there! I'm betting if I tried to report someone who was telling me how to play over there, I would get a warn myself for wasting a mod's time and being "whiny".

 

But yet when it comes to prize dragons, suddenly it's harassment and not okay to suggest that someone is doing it "wrong".

 

I just...

 

I don't get it.

Don't know where this vicious rumor started but I'm frustrated it seems so prevalent. Let's put it to rest.

 

No, mods certainly do not warn if a report sounds "whiny".

 

We warn spammers who use the report function to advertise products. A few users were warned for using the report function to harass mods - and these were removed pretty quickly. That's it.

 

We will PM a user if they are regularly sending reports we don't understand in order to see where they're coming from and work out any misunderstandings. But a curious PM is not a warn in any way.

 

Suggestions are for suggesting changes or improvements to the game. If you feel a suggestion negatively affects a play style, that's something that should be brought up and discussed in the thread.

 

There's a difference in:

1. PM'ing someone: "You need to breed me your gold x balloon pair right now and give me a gold because I don't have one! You're a bad person if you don't!"
2. Posting a suggestion: "Golds should only be able to breed and produce with balloons because that's the best pairing. Who agrees?"
3. Replying to a suggestion: "You don't breed your golds with balloons!? That's dumb. Your play style is dumb. You need to only breed them with balloons."

1. and 3. should be reported to bring a mod's attention to the situation. 2. just requires a comment about why you disagree - it unreasonably controls play styles for no reason (though the thread is liable to be closed when a mod gets to it, any way). Edited February 22, 2013 by SockPuppet Strangler

[HeatherMarie]

There's a difference in:

1. PM'ing someone: "You need to breed me your gold x balloon pair right now and give me a gold because I don't have one! You're a bad person if you don't!"
2. Posting a suggestion: "Golds should only be able to breed and produce with balloons because that's the best pairing. Who agrees?"
3. Replying to a suggestion: "You don't breed your golds with balloons!? That's dumb. Your play style is dumb. You need to only breed them with balloons."

1. and 3. should be reported to bring a mod's attention to the situation. 2. just requires a comment about why you disagree - it unreasonably controls play styles for no reason (though the thread is liable to be closed when a mod gets to it, any way).

For clarification: What about those huge/intense threads we had awhile back where multiple people were saying that breeders are controlling the game, breeders are blocking the AP and ruining CB-hunter's playstyles, etc? Are those type of comments okay since they aren't aimed at a specific person? If, within the thread, a comment along those lines *was* aimed at someone in the thread, would that be warnable?

[Obscure_Trash]

For clarification: What about those huge/intense threads we had awhile back where multiple people were saying that breeders are controlling the game, breeders are blocking the AP and ruining CB-hunter's playstyles, etc? Are those type of comments okay since they aren't aimed at a specific person? If, within the thread, a comment along those lines *was* aimed at someone in the thread, would that be warnable?

Other mods, please chip in.

 

They are perhaps...insensitively worded posts? and it wouldn't hurt users to take the time to think about the words they use and how they will sound to others, but I do not think they are a warnable offense. It's mostly arguing how the game is done and what changes to make so that the most people are happy. If it is specifically aimed at someone "Marie [since you're asking, just stealing your name <3 ], you breed and block the cave? That ruins my game, how rude!" or whatnot, that could very well be grounds for a warn. Threads shouldn't be discussing specific users. Suggestions are about a concept and how it will effect users, not about user A.

 

Of course it does all depend on the words and the tone, too. Regardless, if you feel any post is rude or an attack, please report it. Even if we don't warn, it makes us aware of the situation and perhaps we can steer the discussion down a different road. :3

Edited February 22, 2013 by SockPuppet Strangler

[MedievalMystic]

if you feel any post is rude or an attack, please report it.

 

 

I have a strange feeling you guys are going to be swamped and up to your eyeballs in reports. I think you'll get reports if someone says boo from now on. lol *tosses out bottles of aspirin*

[simkim]

I have a strange feeling you guys are going to be swamped and up to your eyeballs in reports. I think you'll get reports if someone says boo from now on. lol *tosses out bottles of aspirin*

That wouldn't surprise me at all. At least for the first few weeks, anyway.

[Hellen]

That wouldn't surprise me at all. At least for the first few weeks, anyway.

And I have to add, rather one report too many to look at than not getting any reports at all, and might missing real harrassment going on, that users would have never bothered (or were too frightened) to report at all.

 

 

 

[bluebell_rose]

As far as rude begging goes, i'm used to it by now. Been getting them since 2008 so it doesn't affect me anymore lol. Started on another site pokeplushies and then the dc begging for me started in 2009 ish. Asked way back in 2009 pm beg me for trades, would anything be done about it and was told if it happens more than once, it can be reported to a mod.

 

And to be honest, people do like gifting things. And sometimes the spirit of trading is actually born from gifting. Like the tgt type gifting thread that evolved into a trading thread and then evolved into an official coded in game trading system. I gifted one girl a bunch of rares and in turn when a super rare was released, she helped me to get my own by passing me the secret answer which she figured out well ahead of everyone as thanks for me helping her. I didn't expect for that to happen.

Edited February 22, 2013 by bluebell_rose

[Fuzzbucket]

As far as rude begging goes, i'm used to it by now. Been getting them since 2008 so it doesn't affect me anymore lol. Started on another site pokeplushies and then the dc begging for me started in 2009 ish. Asked way back in 2009 pm beg me for trades, would anything be done about it and was told if it happens more than once, it can be reported to a mod.

 

And to be honest, people do like gifting things. And sometimes the spirit of trading is actually born from gifting. Like the tgt type gifting thread that evolved into a trading thread and then evolved into an official coded in game trading system. I gifted one girl a bunch of rares and in turn when a super rare was released, she helped me to get my own by passing me the secret answer which she figured out well ahead of everyone as thanks for me helping her. I didn't expect for that to happen.

WHAT ???? Tell me more (PM if necessary !)

 

I think this thread, and the fact that it will make people more ready to report now that they know mods will support them, may well help a LOT here.

[simkim]

And I have to add, rather one report too many to look at than not getting any reports at all, and might missing real harrassment going on, that users would have never bothered (or were too frightened) to report at all.

This is also what I would rather, if I was a mod or irc op - I'd rather doublecheck than not be aware of an issue.

[Starscream]

It is better staff to be aware of some situations rather than have some poor kid go off the deep end because he could not get the help. I am not saying anything this serious has occurred in dragon cave. I do not want to see it happen ever.

 

(Marie19R @ Feb 21 2013, 07:05 PM)

For clarification: What about those huge/intense threads we had awhile back where multiple people were saying that breeders are controlling the game, breeders are blocking the AP and ruining CB-hunter's playstyles, etc? Are those type of comments okay since they aren't aimed at a specific person? If, within the thread, a comment along those lines *was* aimed at someone in the thread, would that be warnable?

 

Other mods, please chip in.

 

They are perhaps...insensitively worded posts? and it wouldn't hurt users to take the time to think about the words they use and how they will sound to others, but I do not think they are a warnable offense. It's mostly arguing how the game is done and what changes to make so that the most people are happy. If it is specifically aimed at someone "Marie [since you're asking, just stealing your name <3 ], you breed and block the cave? That ruins my game, how rude!" or whatnot, that could very well be grounds for a warn. Threads shouldn't be discussing specific users. Suggestions are about a concept and how it will effect users, not about user A.

 

Of course it does all depend on the words and the tone, too. Regardless, if you feel any post is rude or an attack, please report it. Even if we don't warn, it makes us aware of the situation and perhaps we can steer the discussion down a different road. :3

 

in regards to sock's thought:

If it was user a saying "This one user liked to hassle me about how I collected my vampires and insisted I order the codes alphabetically" (pulling a wild idea off the top of my head) is an entirely different approach leaving a user their right to privacy. Its indirect, it may be used as an example of a situation which the user who wrote it has carefully kept it neutral.

 

The alternate idea, and socky I'm gonna use you! <3

"Sockpuppetstrangler used to drive me insane by telling me I have to order my dragons by code alphabetically or it hurts their eyes. "

Which is a direct target to a specific user giving them a name to backlash on

 

In a nutshell it's a huge complicated matter that staff would need to sift through, to get the minor reports into one pile, and sort it out to where the meat actually is.

 

It needs the user base to trust us to know that we know what we are doing <- clunky sentence, I bet the one who's helped me proof reads eyes are bleeding

 

DC staff are not going to warn a person for a small misunderstanding unless it snowballs out of control. If they can catch a situation that is about to brew soon enough, they may be able to steer(I am sure I am writing about fixed bulls here ) it back onto track and have little to no warns handed out, just redirection.

 

From an IRC op way, I would rather have the report brought to me so I can look into it with other staff.

 

[Symphonic-Nemesis]

I've only seen harassment happen once, in regards to Connacht, my shimmer. Told a kid the breeding list was full and he responded with a cuss word, demanding to know what other people had offered in return.

 

Luckily I had a friend of mine who is a site veteran help me deal.

 

It is an unfortunate thing to see something like this occurring. But for the most part I am glad that the majority of this community is a friendly, helpful one.

[Bambi]

I've only seen harassment happen once, in regards to Connacht, my shimmer. Told a kid the breeding list was full and he responded with a cuss word, demanding to know what other people had offered in return.

 

Luckily I had a friend of mine who is a site veteran help me deal.

 

It is an unfortunate thing to see something like this occurring. But for the most part I am glad that the majority of this community is a friendly, helpful one.

Wow, that's really horrible. You don't deserve to be treated like that.

 

~ Bam