Add an ADDITIONAL monthly raffle -- with harder entry requirements

[Fuzzbucket]

And honestly - how many of us would run with hard - not least because - well I don't WANT 12 adult lindwyrms; I have my own priorities.

[HeatherMarie]

4 hours ago, Shadowdrake said:

I can understand wanting actual gameplay when it comes to a fairly major part of DC. However, the only idea I have that'd work without favoring dedicated players is with a minor rehaul so that you "enter" the raffle at the start of a month by choosing your entry method, and once you complete your chosen requirements it enters you automatically.

 

Example:

Entry requirements (Select one)

           (easy)                             (medium)                                 (hard)

[Raise 3 bred adults]       [Raise 6 adult olives]      [Raise 12 adult lindwyrms]

 

If someone enters but drops off DC after they complete it, well, that's not much different from entering the easy raffle now and vanishing right after.

 

 

I would absolutely love this. No complicated/controversial changes with the raffle itself, just allow *optional* harder entry requirements. Casual players would still be able to enter just the same as now, while users who are looking for something extra to focus on could choose a harder method.

(Personally it would depend a little on what the actual different-level tasks are each month, but I feel like I'd choose the medium at least some of the time, simply because it would give me an incentive to do things I probably already need to do (for my personal scroll goals) but don't usually think about...)

[Uther_Pendragon]

Haven't yet won anything, but remain hopeful I will eventually! I'd plotz if a silver tinsel landed on my scroll.

 I have noticed that after the holiday stuff, the entry requirements are very easy which, to me, is great after all the kerfuffle and busyness when I'm feeling a little burned out. I do already scramble (heh) to work on scroll goals between new releases, and sometimes that feels like a lot, and like I'm always playing catch-up, But that's just from my point of view.

 

If it needs to be switched up, Shadowdrake's choose-your-own-adventure idea seems the least impactful, and kinda fun. 

  I feel mildly bad when releasing the dragons I raised to enter, but didn't really want, so I'd lean toward staying on the 'hatch 6 eggs' or 'raise 6 dragons' level, so I have the choice of what I'm adding to my scroll, but I do understand ppl wanting more of a challenge. I might even choose the medium sometimes!

 

[dragongrrl]

6 hours ago, Shadowdrake said:

I can understand wanting actual gameplay when it comes to a fairly major part of DC. However, the only idea I have that'd work without favoring dedicated players is with a minor rehaul so that you "enter" the raffle at the start of a month by choosing your entry method, and once you complete your chosen requirements it enters you automatically.

 

Example:

Entry requirements (Select one)

           (easy)                             (medium)                                 (hard)

[Raise 3 bred adults]       [Raise 6 adult olives]      [Raise 12 adult lindwyrms]

 

If someone enters but drops off DC after they complete it, well, that's not much different from entering the easy raffle now and vanishing right after.

I like the idea of having options for the difficulty, and as long as it doesn't affect the chances of winning a prize, this seems like a win-win to me.

 

1. It does not change the odds of winning a prize.

 

2. It allows players to work at the level they feel they want.

 

I have never won any of the raffles, don't know if I ever will, but a challenge would make it more interesting to me.

[Jazeki]

I'm neutral, leaning to no. I do like the choose your own entry option mentioned, but I don't see a real need for this. I would probably enter or at least try for that extra ticket/prize possibility, but I don't see the point of a whole extra raffle or ticket option because this one doesn't seem challenging enough. I haven't won yet from the zero-thought requirements. I don't need an extra harder raffle to also not win on. 

 

[Whirlaway]

It took 12 years for me to win a raffle on this game and I can say that I was downright frustrated with the raffles before I won - call me bitter but I was, and still am, jaded by the fact that people could win multiple prizes while it took 12 years for me to get one. Considering how low the chances were to win, I was always glad they were easy requirements to enter because I don't want to raise a number of lineaged dragons to adults or other more extensive requirements, for a super slim chance at winning a prize. 

I don't think there should be an entirely different raffle with harder requirements, really. That opens up more chances for the more dedicated players, or players more willing to sacrifice their slots for things they might not normally collect, than it does for less dedicated players. I'd rather see more prizes given away each month than to have a secondary raffle that's going to lean more towards people more willing to invest their time and slots to it. 

In short, I don't mind the easy requirements, but I don't think a second raffle should be added. 

[Fuzzbucket]

IT didn't take me quite that long - but there are of course many dedicated players who have yet to win at all - that's how random works !

[Fuzzbucket]

A raffle is a raffle. Whatever else, it's fair. Every single player who enters has the same chance. Making the overall requirements tougher would disadvantage players with smaller scrolls and fewer slots. Until the day people are prepared to accept that random is random, these suggestions will keep coming.

 

Sure more prizes would be nice, as would adding prizes to the market. But other than that - no support for any change.

[Long_Before_Sunrise]

On 3/4/2021 at 9:37 AM, Fuzzbucket said:

And honestly - how many of us would run with hard - not least because - well I don't WANT 12 adult lindwyrms; I have my own priorities.

The 'raise wyrms' one was problematic. There weren't that many wyrm breeds and they're not that common in the Cave. 

 

No. It's not fair to raise the standards and exclude the newbies.

[Guillotine]

I wouldn't mind it being a "choose your difficulty" kind of deal; hell, even if it entered people into different raffles that'd be fine. I specifically didn't like the idea of getting two chances per month to win, which I realize in retrospect I didn't word clearly enough.

[Ruby Eyes]

4 minutes ago, Guillotine said:

I wouldn't mind it being a "choose your difficulty" kind of deal; hell, even if it entered people into different raffles that'd be fine. I specifically didn't like the idea of getting two chances per month to win, which I realize in retrospect I didn't word clearly enough.

Same. Especially if it's 3 totally different ones and I'm not sure which ones I'd qualify for in advance, the page could just tell me which of the 3 options I already solved and enable the "enter" button for me

[HeatherMarie]

4 hours ago, Fuzzbucket said:

A raffle is a raffle. Whatever else, it's fair. Every single player who enters has the same chance. Making the overall requirements tougher would disadvantage players with smaller scrolls and fewer slots. Until the day people are prepared to accept that random is random, these suggestions will keep coming.

 

Sure more prizes would be nice, as would adding prizes to the market. But other than that - no support for any change.

 

While I disagree with the raffle being 'fair', that depends on what 'fair' actually means, but I very much agree with this in general.

 

Really, saying no one would 'lose' anything with this suggestion, or it wouldn't disadvantage anyone, is simply not true. Right now every single user who does the bare minimum gets 1 raffle entry per month. A separate raffle with harder requirements would mean that some players get *two* chances a month, while others can still only get 1. How is that not a disadvantage? I would 100% benefit from something like this, I have the time and ability to meet pretty much any harder requirement, but there are plenty of casual players with limited playing time who would be completely blocked from the second raffle. The *only* way a second harder raffle *wouldn't* disadvantage anyone would be if you could only enter one raffle, not both.

[Fuzzbucket]

What I mean is that you can't get a prize by buddying up to someone, by being judged to have created a better tree than others (that was AWFUL), by grinding... we ALL have the exact same chance if we enter. What would make it more fair than that ? It's like any other lottery. Buy a Wintario/National Lottery/euromillions ticket and you have the same chance of winning that everyone else does. A small one.

 

I have held premium bonds in the UK since I was 16 years old - that's SIXTY YEARS. I have NEVER won a single penny. My daughter bought some when she moved house. 16 years ago. She has won a prize eleven times. That's lotteries for you., But it's perfectly fair - just REALLY annoying !

[Estellux]

I think the only way I'd support this in use for raffles would be thus: If you pick the 'harder' option, you can pick which prize you get entered for (so if I wanted a silver shimmer *specifically*, I could enter for that). However, if you pick one, you are removed from being entered for the other ones (as in, you're rolled for silver shimmers and ONLY silver shimmers. You're not in the pool for any bronze shimmers or silver tins or anything). With this idea, it would still just be one entry, not an additional. Even then, however, I would be skeptical of such a change.

 

I don't see an issue necessarily with having a 'harder' option if desired if it's just a different way, although I don't know if it would appeal to enough people to make it worth it. I also would avoid making it "do this extra thing for an extra ticket", since to me it seems like you'd be asking for even more debates over 'fairness'.

 

That said, I think it would be neat to have those optional built-in goals (like Nook Miles Plus in ACNH). Perhaps they could be used for additional shards or something like that, instead of being tied into the raffle.

Edited March 5, 2021 by Rosastrasza
additional thought

[animatedrose]

I wouldn't mind the option route for the raffle entry difficulty, that seems pretty cool. That would hopefully satisfy the people who want to work for their entry or want a challenge. I'm also against it awarding an extra ticket, though. While that does seem cool in theory, it does add an element of unfairness to it and there will be an outcry about how a subset of users has double the chances of winning versus everyone else. The raffle is meant to be as fair across the board as possible. Adding extra tickets for certain actions done defeats the purpose of that.

 

Support for the difficulty options. No support for extra tickets. If the raffle remains the only way to get prizes, keep it a fair chance for everyone, rng willing.

[PrincessLucy]

I wouldn't want a raise with no click as a requirement. It is too easy for people to sabotage other people's eggs/hatchlings, and give them a click just to disallow their entry.

[dragongrrl]

6 hours ago, PrincessLucy said:

I wouldn't want a raise with no click as a requirement. It is too easy for people to sabotage other people's eggs/hatchlings, and give them a click just to disallow their entry.

You are right about that! It is one of my biggest challenges on the site, but it can still be done.

 

PB EGs of Stripes, Gemstones or Xenos may be worse, and I know Nebulas take forever in a project if you're depending on one color.

 

I have managed to raise 4 of my Zeros since March 1st, but there are at least 9 with 1 click out of the total 42 for that period. Still just under 10%, and I hate it when that click happens at the last minute before adulthood..

 

I will stick with them though, because I do want the challenge.

[TheGrox]

I'm hesitant to wade into this again, as I think the introduction of the raffle all those years ago was a bad thing and has caused no end of controversy and upset since. Having been away for many years and just recently returned, the monthly raffles seem to have made things much better than they used to be. I would, however, be interested to know the stats on how the number of CB Prizes given out every month compares to say the number of CB Golds/Stats/other rares appearing in the cave.

 

I do still think the raffle could be made better and more fun. I hear a lot of talk of fairness, but DC is inherently unfair. Throughout DC time and effort are rewarded, e.g. to collect rares. And in every other section of the game one can put in more effort to achieve one's own goals (hunt the cave for longer, raise more enticing tradeables, save up shards, etc). I suppose in some ways the frustration of the raffle is that there is no way to improve your chances at the only way of getting one of the rarest things in the game.

 

As such, I think I would support this (though not as much as just upping the number of prizes given out or making the entry requirements for the current raffle a bit harder than say 'hatch three eggs').

 

On a related note, I do think fun little monthly tasks like we're talking about to earn bonus shards or something similar would be good too.

 

I don't like the choose your own adventure thing for the raffle though - it just doesn't seem fun to me to choose a really hard task to achieve the same reward as 'hatch three eggs'. We can already set ourselves extra goals for zero reward if we so wish.

[ShorahNagi]

On 3/5/2021 at 5:48 AM, VixenDra said:

winners suddenly get blocked out from the raffles, there will be yet another tiny forever exclusive group of players capable of breeding sth others can't, in this case a PB, and there are still way too few double winners

I am one of the few double winners (Snow Wars 2013 & June 2017 raffle) - and sadly due to rejection, I can never have a PB from my prizes  *so one less in the 'monopoly'*

 

That aside, think of a real life raffle - a lot of times, you don't have to be present to win. Rather you can just walk in, buy your ticket and leave *which is not so different from A not so active player who comes on, raises the required dragons, then leaves until the end of the month*.

 

 I still agree with others that at the end of the day that raffles are random and there's no need to change them - save maybe adding a little more variety to the entry requirements [nothing crazy, still simple things like "Hatch a Water element dragon"]

 

[Fuzzbucket]

1 hour ago, ShorahNagi said:

That aside, think of a real life raffle - a lot of times, you don't have to be present to win. Rather you can just walk in, buy your ticket and leave *which is not so different from A not so active player who comes on, raises the required dragons, then leaves until the end of the month*.

 

 I still agree with others that at the end of the day that raffles are random and there's no need to change them - save maybe adding a little more variety to the entry requirements [nothing crazy, still simple things like "Hatch a Water element dragon"]

 

Agree 100%.Not everything in life can be achieved by trying harder. A bit of chance is no bad thing.

[angelicdragonpuppy]

Letting people choose raffle difficulty without any associated bonus for doing so does nothing for me. I want more of a challenge, yes, but I'm not a fool. I'm not going to pick a harder route to the same end for no reason. 
 

Also, this doesn't have any effect on the original raffle, if done as a separate raffle. The odds of winning the easy raffle will be the same as always. People who feel jealous of the second raffle aren't really losing any chance of winning at all, they're just envious of people who now have a higher chance overall via a separate pool--but that's AFTER they put hard work in. I believe people should be able to get the same things in the game from varied methods of play (and incidentally, with varied raffle entry requirements, sometimes the 'harder' option might fit with what they like to do anyway), but I also don't believe more active players should be limited to the same level of accomplishment as less active ones, beyond a certain level. 
 

My main point at the end of the day is we were promised more interesting raffle requirements, they never materialized, and an interesting and rewarding motivator for old done-it-all players to try something new never materialized with it. 

[HeatherMarie]

My basic outlook here is that I Do Not Want any sort of 'special treatment' as it were just because I have the ability to sit on the computer all day doing harder tasks. I don't like the whole raffle to begin with, but as Fuzz says at least it's 'fair' in that everyone gets an equal chance each month. I don't think it's 'fair' in any sense for me to be able to *double* my chances of winning something just because I have no job and no life and am often literally on DC 8+ hours a day. That's my own personal situation, and it's given me plenty of advantages in terms of right-place-right-time and simply having the time to do lots of different stuff, but I'm well aware the vast majority of users don't have that kind of situation. People have work, school, responsibilities.

 

DC has always been a rather low-key game, you can play and do pretty much everything available while still being a 'casual' player. 'Grinding' for stuff like more shards isn't possible and many of us like that it isn't possible. Let's face it, even after having a monthly raffle for a handful of years now, CB Prizes are still hugely valuable and basically the top of the top. Honestly, I think they are Too Important to add such a huge imbalance to the whole concept, giving some people *double* the chance to win while others simply won't have that ability. 

 

(On the other hand, I wouldn't be opposed to a second raffle in general, if it had the same simple basic requirements. Even harder tasks to get one 'extra ticket' to the current raffle might be okay, I guess. But not a full second raffle with a full second pool of prizes only available to some people.)

[Murkydepths]

32 minutes ago, HeatherMarie said:

My basic outlook here is that I Do Not Want any sort of 'special treatment' as it were just because I have the ability to sit on the computer all day doing harder tasks. I don't like the whole raffle to begin with, but as Fuzz says at least it's 'fair' in that everyone gets an equal chance each month. I don't think it's 'fair' in any sense for me to be able to *double* my chances of winning something just because I have no job and no life and am often literally on DC 8+ hours a day. That's my own personal situation, and it's given me plenty of advantages in terms of right-place-right-time and simply having the time to do lots of different stuff, but I'm well aware the vast majority of users don't have that kind of situation. People have work, school, responsibilities.

 

It's pretty normal for people who put more effort into a game to get rewarded for it. I doubt OP is suggesting the new requirements would require 8 hours of playtime, that'd be ridiculous. I see it more as probably taking the same amount of time but with a bit more thoughts? Rather than picking up 6 random eggs to hatch for the 'hatch 6 eggs' they might have to pick up 6 water element eggs to hatch.

[Fuzzbucket]

PLEASE no more prize dragons that we cannot gain by working for them, which rely on RNG alone. I rue the day the raffles were invented, and would much rather see the existing ones became available in the market with prices to fit.

2 hours ago, Murkydepths said:

 

It's pretty normal for people who put more effort into a game to get rewarded for it. I doubt OP is suggesting the new requirements would require 8 hours of playtime, that'd be ridiculous. I see it more as probably taking the same amount of time but with a bit more thoughts? Rather than picking up 6 random eggs to hatch for the 'hatch 6 eggs' they might have to pick up 6 water element eggs to hatch.

 

What is also pretty normal in THIS lovely peaceful play at your own speed game is that you DON'T have to grind to get things. People who only have time for a couple of hours a week can be just as happy as those like HeatherMarie, who can he here 24/7. And you do get rewarded for playing more - more slots. ( And we did have to do 6 from the desert one month, too, IIRC.)

Edited March 7, 2021 by Fuzzbucket