ANSWERED:Suggestions to improve the raffle

[Kith]

I suppose I should clarify my stance a bit in case it gets misconstrued. I don't necessarily want tinsels and shimmers to be common, I just wouldn't mind if they were. I just would like it if the "have cake and eat it too" attitude went away; either they breed and trade like rares, or they breed and trade like commons.

 

Of course, that would require changing other people's minds, which is a very hard thing indeed, so I won't be expecting it anytime soon.

 

So, since TJ has said our winner number arguments are not up for consideration, I think the staggered multi-clutch idea might be one of the better options. It will probably skew the average generation of the bred population down, but if the main issue here is the acquisition of 2G (and other "low gen") prizes, that would improve things even if the ratio of the prize dragons was not altered.

[Fuzzbucket]

I just would like it if the "have cake and eat it too" attitude went away; either they breed and trade like rares, or they breed and trade like commons.

 

Of course, that would require changing other people's minds, which is a very hard thing indeed, so I won't be expecting it anytime soon.

QFT.

[EscapistLore]

This game isn't real life, quite simply, and I don't think it should be compared to real life situations. (*walks up to the cashier at the grocery store, "Hi, I'd like to buy a silver shimmer!"*)

 

Games are meant to be fun. If i had won the raffle.. I would still be proposing the idea of more prizes. The prizes are too scarce for the population, at least that is how it seems.

 

I can't stop wanting my favorite sprite (silver shimmer). To stop wanting... I may as well stop wanting to play, which won't happen, I love this game, as I suspect all of us do.

 

I have a few 3Gs and soon I'll have a 2G. The prices aren't always impossible, but I feel the issue is that there are so few, that just finding an open list can be a problem. If there were more, there would be a better chance of decent offers being accepted. Though, I really think that this raffle with the amount may cause lower prices over time, and I hope so. Its just the scarcity that is the problem more so than the price.

 

I'd love having a summer raffle. Instead of, "Oh, I didn't win, another year to wait..." It'll be, "Oh, I didn't win, maybe this summer!" To address how some people tend to be busy, perhaps an easy event or just an 'Enter the raffle' Button.

 

I can kind of understand the idea of after x amount of time, you win x dragon... But I'm not sure I like that idea.. Not sure why I don't though, so.. I don't have any arguments against it.

 

But all in all.. This raffle may have helped a lot, it may only help a little. We do really need to see. As someone said, it's difficult to know what ideas we can come up with and such without TJ's opinion, but from the amount of prizes I think he is aware of our concerns. This is a definite step forward.

 

And on the note of recolored shimmers... Oh, I would adore having a dark grey (steel) or black (coal) shimmer. But that's just me, I'd be quite happy making pretty lineages with those as the base and building in the other color shimmers at higher generations.

 

Edit- But I want my cake and I wanna eat it! Ok, now really. I wouldnt mind prices going down, I just think we need to find the balance between them being so super scarce and them being too common. I don't want them to be common. I want them to be accessible to more people. Which... Give it a few months. They might be.

Edited January 13, 2014 by EscapistLore

[Sarah864]

The problem I see with multiclutching is that it will lower the value of gens. It's already difficult enough trading shimmers/tinsels higher than 4th gen and with an increase of everything but caveborns will just make prizes MORE valuable. Instead of trading multiple cb rares for 2nd gen people will offer them instead for the actual prize.

Edited January 13, 2014 by Sarah864

[Kith]

The problem I see with multiclutching is that it will lower the value of gens. It's already difficult enough trading shimmers/tinsels higher than 4th gen and with an increase of everything but caveborns will just make prizes MORE valuable. Instead of trading multiple cb rares for 2nd gen people will offer them instead for the actual prize.

Wait, what? It looks like you're saying the value will be lowered, but they'll be more valuable...

[Fuzzbucket]

The problem I see with multiclutching is that it will lower the value of gens. It's already difficult enough trading shimmers/tinsels higher than 4th gen and with an increase of everything but caveborns will just make prizes MORE valuable. Instead of trading multiple cb rares for 2nd gen people will offer them instead for the actual prize.

I really can't see anyone trading their actual prize for a bunch of anythings.

 

But @ EscapistLore:

 

I can't stop wanting my favorite sprite (silver shimmer). To stop wanting... I may as well stop wanting to play, which won't happen, I love this game, as I suspect all of us do.

 

That is my favourite sprite of the six, too. And I have several on my scroll. The SPRITE doesn't know what gen it is and it's very pretty indeed, whatever its family tree..

[Sarah864]

Wait, what? It looks like you're saying the value will be lowered, but they'll be more valuable...

Sorry, should have specified. The value of all prizes except caveborns will be lowered and the price of the caveborn prize will be raised.

 

Edit:

I really can't see anyone trading their actual prize for a bunch of anythings.

 

I couldn't see anyone trading their 2nd gens either but give it time and here we are. Even if they're not trading the offers will still be there therefore increasing trade harassment etc. BUT that's an argument based on what ifs. Right now shimmers/tinsels below 4th gen have low values while 2nd gens have outrageously high values. With multiclutching I can see the same thing happening but with caveborns.

Edited January 13, 2014 by Sarah864

[Kith]

Sorry, should have specified. The value of all prizes except caveborns will be lowered and the price of the caveborn prize will be raised.

I'm not seeing the issue there. The CB prizes have always been valued extremely highly, and not many have ever been traded, so I don't really think the trade value of the CB prize dragons themselves is relevant.

[Sarah864]

I'm not seeing the issue there. The CB prizes have always been valued extremely highly, and not many have ever been traded, so I don't really think the trade value of the CB prize dragons themselves is relevant.

The trade value of all other shimmer/tinsel gens will be lowered as a result.

[Kith]

The trade value of all other shimmer/tinsel gens will be lowered as a result.

I thought that more widely available low-generation prizes was what the majority of players was after. If the price goes from nearly impossible to expensive (or from expensive to reasonable, depending on your viewpoint), how is this bad?

[angelicdragonpuppy]

The trade value of all other shimmer/tinsel gens will be lowered as a result.

The trade value of the lowest gens (2gs-3gs) is already too high. Nothing should require 5+ of the cave's rarest normally obtainable dragons (CB Metals) to pay for. Inflation needs to be countered, not preserved.

 

Plus, anything above 4g already has very little value, as you said. It's sort of the natural progression of the game... high gen anythings aren't worth much of anything any more, not to most, because they're so easy to get. I don't think ideas should be shot down just because something worth very little already is then worth a little bit less.

 

 

[Sarah864]

I thought that more widely available low-generation prizes was what the majority of players was after. If the price goes from nearly impossible to expensive (or from expensive to reasonable, depending on your viewpoint), how is this bad?

I just worry that with multiclutching will make the ultimate prize less desirable. Currently 2nd gens can go for multiple cb rares but if they produced eggs like crazy wouldn't that make breeding prizes less valuable than say breeding golds/silvers? :s

[Fuzzbucket]

The trade value of all other shimmer/tinsel gens will be lowered as a result.

Which does not matter AT ALL, if seeing an end to ludicrous trade inflation is seen as a good thing.

 

As to 2nd gens - of course people will trade those - they can usually breed more.

[Kith]

if they produced eggs like crazy

For that to occur, the ratios would have to be altered so that more prize dragon babies would be produced in general. If the ratios were not changed, then the total population would remain stable, but the average generation count would go down.

[angelicdragonpuppy]

I just worry that with multiclutching will make the ultimate prize less desirable. Currently 2nd gens can go for multiple cb rares but if they produced eggs like crazy wouldn't that make breeding prizes less valuable than say breeding golds/silvers? :s

2gs can go for 5+ CB Metals. I don't think it'd be a big loss if the raffle owners could only swap their Prize's offspring for 1-2 CB Metals each.

 

As per the above ratios, a wholeee lot of crazy would have to happen for the CB Prizes to suddenly be worth less than CB Metals when their offspring can buy half a dozen CB Golds / Silvers right now.

 

If the trade threads are a good indication, the cave produces at least a couple CB Metals a day. Thus, even with a big increase in Prize amounts, CB Metals will still never be worth half so much... especially when you consider that anyone in theory can catch a CB Metal and use it as they will, but only a select group can ever have CB Prizes to make 2gs with. If my only way to make a nice Tinsel lineage of my choice is by buying one from a CB Tinsel owner, then you'd better bet those CB Prizes will always have more worth than any CB Metal, because I can never get my hands on a CB Prize myself.

Edited January 13, 2014 by angelicdragonpuppy

[Sarah864]

2gs can go for 5+ CB Metals. I don't think it'd be a big loss if the raffle owners could only swap their Prize's offspring for 1-2 CB Metals each.

 

As per the above ratios, a wholeee lot of crazy would have to happen for the CB Prizes to suddenly be worth less than CB Metals when their offspring can buy half a dozen CB Golds / Silvers right now.

 

If the trade threads are a good indication, the cave produces at least a couple CB Metals a day. Thus, even with a big increase in Prize amounts, CB Metals will still never be worth half so much... especially when you consider that anyone in theory can catch a CB Metal and use it as they will, but only a select group can ever have CB Prizes to make 2gs with. If my only way to make a nice Tinsel lineage of my choice is by buying one from a CB Tinsel owner, then you'd better bet those CB Prizes will always have more worth than any CB Metal, because I can never get my hands on a CB Prize myself.

Ah okay. Thanks for the clarification.

[EscapistLore]

But @ EscapistLore:

 

 

 

That is my favourite sprite of the six, too. And I have several on my scroll. The SPRITE doesn't know what gen it is and it's very pretty indeed, whatever its family tree..

I think more my point is that I want to create lineages with my favorite sprite. I'm already tending towards hoarding these, and getting the sprite itself is not an issue at all for me, lots are given away (higher gens and such). But I love checkers and I would love to have a silver shimmer checker (With niostrifes). The way things are right now, I can't. One of my dreams of a specific pairing spiral is completed, at least. But.. I'm not sure I'll ever be able to make a checker with the dragons I want.. Which saddens me a bit. I can't do what I want to in a game where 'play your way' is the norm.

 

But, you are right, for collecting sprites alone, there is no problem at all, I just have dreams I see as impossible right now. Perhaps that'll change over the course of a few months.

[DragonNighthowler]

True, I made an error comparing an economic collapse to DC situation, which is not even close. So I'll use another analogy.

 

Remember when, years ago, nobody cared about lineages? Well, during that time, when trading was done via a glitch in the AP, and lineages were not taken into account, rares like metallics were hard to come by. So hard, they rarely appeared in the AP at all.

There was a thread called LIT (Lost in Trade), where dragons that were lost in the AP could be given back (it was frowned upon to "steal" a trade through the AP).

 

Getting a metallic, any metallic, was not easy, and they weren't cheap.

 

Then, trading happened which meant more people went into the market, and then lineages happened as well, which meant people took that into account when trading. Suddenly, very wealthy people with loads of metallics discovered they actually had nothing worth to trade, because people wanted short gens, and wouldn't trade for messy lineages.

 

Such is the situation, today, something over 2nd to 3rd gen, a metallic, that breeds like a metallic, is considered of little value. Sure, I could trade a 6th gen for some hatchies, some common eggs, maybe... but little more.

 

There was not a movement going against metallic high prices, nor was a discussion ever done about why greedy metallic breeders put such prices on their eggs. It simply happened because people refused to pay for those eggs, so those eggs today are being gifted away to people who have no silver.

Funny thing is... it happened with tinsels and shimmers too. I payed 10 purple hatchies for a 7th gen, and today most likely I could have gotten it for free.

 

The problem is, you guys want a second gen, and you want it now, which is what keeps demand so high and thus prices as well.

[angelicdragonpuppy]

The reason 2gs cost so much isn't just because people want them and will pay for them. People want and will pay for 2g Metals, too... but because there's so many around, and more every day, people have more options and can find trades that don't cost half their liver. People can't charge bucketloads for a 2g Metal because there will be lots of other people asking less, so asking a ton means you won't trade your egg.

 

Meanwhile, CB Prizes are extremely low in number, and that rate doesn't seem to be increasing nearly fast enough to keep up with demand. People can charge an arm and a leg for an egg, because there's so few in the market that people don't really have other options to turn to. Even those owners who do ask more reasonable prices have their lists full most of the time, leading those who really want a low gen to either go without or pay til they bleed.

 

We've waited four years for prices to even out. They haven't. In fact, they've gotten worse. The CB Prize owners have such supreme command of the economy that they soon stock up on all the CB Metals / Neglecteds / normal people rare things they could ever want, and turn to only wanting Prizeswaps or similar things.

 

Trying to curtail the desire to collect things in a collecting game probably isn't going to go so well. What we need is more supply to meet the demand--enough stuff in circulation that the low gens can go down to sane prices again. Again, they don't have to be cheap, not by a long shot, but I do think there should be enough that one or two of the cave's rarest catchable CB dragons has a good chance of swapping for one.

 

CB Metals used to essentially be the end-all, the highlight of DC hunting, the big whopper. You caught one and either you were overjoyed or you swapped it for a CB Neglected and were overjoyed at that. The rarest of the rare were things you could, with time, luck, and dedication, catch or create for yourself. But now whenever I catch a CB Metal all I think is "darn, wish these rotters would get me that 2g Tinsel from Sunsong I really want." The best things we can get ourselves aren't worth so much anymore... and that stinks.

Edited January 13, 2014 by angelicdragonpuppy

[Fuzzbucket]

The reason 2gs cost so much isn't just because people want them and will pay for them. People want and will pay for 2g Metals, too... but because there's so many around, and more every day, people have more options and can find trades that don't cost half their liver. People can't charge bucketloads for a 2g Metal because there will be lots of other people asking less, so asking a ton means you won't trade your egg.

 

Meanwhile, CB Prizes are extremely low in number, and that rate doesn't seem to be increasing nearly fast enough to keep up with demand. People can charge an arm and a leg for an egg, because there's so few in the market that people don't really have other options to turn to. Even those owners who do ask more reasonable prices have their lists full most of the time, leading those who really want a low gen to either go without or pay til they bleed.

 

We've waited four years for prices to even out. They haven't. In fact, they've gotten worse. The CB Prize owners have such supreme command of the economy that they soon stock up on all the CB Metals / Neglecteds / normal people rare things they could ever want, and turn to only wanting Prizeswaps or similar things.

 

Trying to curtail the desire to collect things in a collecting game probably isn't going to go so well. What we need is more supply to meet the demand--enough stuff in circulation that the low gens can go down to sane prices again. Again, they don't have to be cheap, not by a long shot, but I do think there should be enough that one or two of the cave's rarest catchable CB dragons has a good chance of swapping for one.

 

CB Metals used to essentially be the end-all, the highlight of DC hunting, the big whopper. You caught one and either you were overjoyed or you swapped it for a CB Neglected and were overjoyed at that. The rarest of the rare were things you could, with time, luck, and dedication, catch or create for yourself. But now whenever I catch a CB Metal all I think is "darn, wish these rotters would get me that 2g Tinsel from Sunsong I really want." The best things we can get ourselves aren't worth so much anymore... and that stinks.

*cough*

 

I have a CB neglected. It's even a genderless (an added bonus !) It was a gift out of the blue. These things do happen. Not everybody tries to get your first born on the side.

 

Now - what is that WORTH, if it cost me not one red cent ? Markets are artificial. That is the be-all and end-all of it.

[angelicdragonpuppy]

*cough*

 

I have a CB neglected. It's even a genderless (an added bonus !) It was a gift out of the blue. These things do happen. Not everybody tries to get your first born on the side.

 

Now - what is that WORTH, if it cost me not one red cent ? Markets are artificial. That is the be-all and end-all of it.

Gifts out of the blue don't mean these things usually happen / apply to everyone. I was gifted a CB Neglected by a very generous person myself... but every other one of mine I've had to pay lots for. Because that's how things normally work.

 

Saying "markets are artificial" when most of us have to rely on them to get the things we want isn't really helpful... If I just said "haha, markets are silly and I don't believe in them!", I wouldn't have half as many nice dragons as I do.

 

And my main point--that the rarest of the rare has shifted from things we can obtain on our own, to things we must pay other people to breed for us--remains the same.

Edited January 13, 2014 by angelicdragonpuppy

[Troubletail]

The reason 2gs cost so much isn't just because people want them and will pay for them. People want and will pay for 2g Metals, too... but because there's so many around, and more every day, people have more options and can find trades that don't cost half their liver. People can't charge bucketloads for a 2g Metal because there will be lots of other people asking less, so asking a ton means you won't trade your egg.

 

Meanwhile, CB Prizes are extremely low in number, and that rate doesn't seem to be increasing nearly fast enough to keep up with demand. People can charge an arm and a leg for an egg, because there's so few in the market that people don't really have other options to turn to. Even those owners who do ask more reasonable prices have their lists full most of the time, leading those who really want a low gen to either go without or pay til they bleed.

 

We've waited four years for prices to even out. They haven't. In fact, they've gotten worse. The CB Prize owners have such supreme command of the economy that they soon stock up on all the CB Metals / Neglecteds / normal people rare things they could ever want, and turn to only wanting Prizeswaps or similar things.

 

Trying to curtail the desire to collect things in a collecting game probably isn't going to go so well. What we need is more supply to meet the demand--enough stuff in circulation that the low gens can go down to sane prices again. Again, they don't have to be cheap, not by a long shot, but I do think there should be enough that one or two of the cave's rarest catchable CB dragons has a good chance of swapping for one.

 

CB Metals used to essentially be the end-all, the highlight of DC hunting, the big whopper. You caught one and either you were overjoyed or you swapped it for a CB Neglected and were overjoyed at that. The rarest of the rare were things you could, with time, luck, and dedication, catch or create for yourself. But now whenever I catch a CB Metal all I think is "darn, wish these rotters would get me that 2g Tinsel from Sunset I really want." And that stinks.

*nods*

 

It's easy to say that people should just stop asking/ stop offering so much for low-gen prizes, but absent a steady and significant (if still small) supply like we have for metals, that only works as long as absolutely everyone keeps to it.

 

It's somewhat similar to a Prisoner's Dilemma situation: If everyone offers and asks for exorbitant amounts for low-gen prizes, than the prices spiral out of control and traders either can't obtain them or have to basically mortgage their scrolls to get them and everyone in the trading market loses. If every trader and every CB prize owner agrees that the going price for a low-gen should be ~2 CB metals, then the prices stay reasonably obtainable and many more users can trade for them- even if they'll still be waiting for ages because of the scarcity. But if most traders and prize owners are keeping to the ~2 CB price and one person starts offering or asking for more, than they benefit at everyone else's expense- why would any rational prize owner take an offer of 2 metals when they can get 12 or 20? Why would any rational trader offer 2 when someone else is offering 12 now and is much more likely to be chosen? As soon as anyone stops taking the selfless path, everyone has to start behaving more selfishly too if they don't want to lose out, and we're back in the first scenario again. The only way to avoid that kind of inflation is if the supply is increased (through more prizes, more raffles, multiclutches, whatever) to the point where it's at least somewhat proportionate to the demand.

 

And the inflation has effects that go beyond just the people who want prize dragons. It's easy to say that people should just stop wanting low-gen prizes or write them off as unobtainable, they way they do for Frills and Old Pinks, but they have a ripple effect on the whole economy because anything rare (or percieved as rare, like the supposedly-uncommon coppers) becomes the currency used for trying to obtain low-gens, and it becomes much more difficult to catch them or trade anything 'lesser' for them. Unless people stop wanting rare dragons entirely (which would be a bad thing for the game- having difficult but realistic goals to strive for is what maintains interest and keeps people playing), then the prize market will affect them regardless of whether they care about prizes or not.

[Sheriziya]

- After a certain percentage of the game time that you played in DC you could request in a separate page in the site to have your CB Tinsel or Shimmer. This amount of time could be by TJ's discretion.

 

- Or even: add a new page into the site, named "Trading" where Gifts and Trades are showed. This would help even the players who don't use this official forum.

People who had gifted more dragon/eggs in a year will had a little more high possibility than others to win a Prize Dragon.

Well, I'm back from work

 

@Naruhina: I think the first suggestion could be interesting in a way. It's another variant of (part of) the combined suggestion I've made earlier.

But do long time players need to be rewarded seperately? I've been here on and off since 2009. Does that mean I should be rewarded for that? My reward is that I can collect my dragons, keep the names I make up for them and just have fun.

I think the second suggestion of a trade page could be an entirely valid suggestion on it's own! It wouldn't have to do anything with the raffle at all. A trading place on the main site would be a great thing! Right now there's a part of the community which is not here on the forums, but which might be interested in trading nonetheless. A trading page on the main site would serve the part of the community which is not here on the forums. Great idea Although I think TJ will not approve of the idea that people who have gifted more dragons/eggs could have a higher possibility to win a prize dragon. He has stated previously he wants it to be equal to all players. And I still think that's good. After all, otherwise new players would "suffer" because they haven't (have hardly) had the chance to gift dragons/eggs.

 

You can have your cake OR you can eat it, people, but you really can't have both!

Errr..... what if I bake the cake myself? I like baking cakes

Getting back on topic here....

 

I couldn't care less about shimmers and tinsels. They are practically worthless.

I find this very interesting coming from you. I noticed in your profile you've got quite a specific wish list for tinsels with specific lineages. Or do you mean low-gen dragons?

I already said it, I have all tinsel/shimmers I want.

Not according to the above mentioned wishlist....... sorry if I'm offending you, but either you want more tinsels, like you stated in your profile and perhaps you could help us make a suggestion to actually improve the raffle system (and the distribution system of the prize dragons), which would also help you in getting more tinsels, or you don't want more tinsels and are not really interested in helping us making a complete suggestion to improve the raffle and distribution system. Or at least that's the way I see it.

Even gens have no order at all, they are so multicolored they are practically messy even gens.

I've seen several people in the "great lineages found in the AP" who were very happy with even gens with multiple colors. Even people who've been at DC for several years already. So this might be true for you, but not for everyone.

 

So, summarizing, I'm not going to mortage myself through a full year to get a second gen of a lineage with such little possibilities.

I'm not willing to pay these insane prices either, if that's your main point. But then again, I don't care about the generation of the dragon either. I've been gifted very beautiful prize dragons, which I absolutely love, which higher gens. And these are dragons I intend to breed too. Currently I'm even looking for mates for them. So, yes I like to collect prize dragons, but in my own fashion

 

There is a funny thing, you, the ones complaining, are the ones putting that prize. You, who put up a trade for four CB metals, a second gen holly and whatever else, are inflating the prize. I can't hunt CB metals, I should complain that you are putting such expectations on tinsel breeders, and you're shifting the market towards rare for rare trading, that you're making it impossible for the common hunter to be able to trade for metallics any more.

I have to be honest and say I can agree with you, up to a certain point. Yes, people who are offering these insane "prices" for 2nd gens to prize owners help set the price. Yes, those prize owners who accept these prices and ask for these kind of prices afterwards help set the price as well. There's also a point, though, in the fact that there are only 120 CB tinsels and 120 CB shimmer-scales in total released in the community. This makes them not even equal to golds and silvers. This is a created scarcity due to the raffle as it is set up now. It's a scarcity we players have no influence on with the current system, hence our suggestions to improve the system.

Prizes aren't expensive because people are willing to pay loads. Prizes are expensive because there are few cb prizes to userbase ratio.

I only partially agree with that, like I said above

If those advocating for more tinsels, more raffles, and multiclutches they have no control of, would still advocate the same were they winners of a raffle and owners of a CB specimen.

I'd definitely do that. Like I stated elsewhere I'd probably keep a few 2nd gens for myself and than start gifting to people who've been very generous to me in the past, glomp gifting, newbie gifting, AP gifting (or at least that's how I see it ) and than perhaps... probably very far in the future, trade. I'm not much of a trader (yet) so I wouldn't really care about trading my prize dragons. I'd much rather see the joy from someone who got an unexpected gift.

 

I would REALLY LOVE a Black "participation" prize. After all, "loosers" on Christmas get coal.

Sorry, I just really have to ask (maybe it's because I'm not familiar with the custom here in the Netherlands), but Coal with Christmas? I don't understand. Is it something like we have here in the Netherlands where children are told they will get the "roe" from "zwarte piet" if they've been naugthy? (what he's holding in his left hand):

Which is pretty sad, considering you, as a mass, have the power to manipulate everything, and yet, you don't.

Okay, we're not yet changing things in trading, but we are working, as a (partial) mass, to help improve the raffle system and prize dragon distribution. So, we do that.

We are thinking on making the other person happy.

Than help us do the same. Like I said in my earlier post, there were several reason to start this thread in the first place. One of them is to make a lot more people happy (including current prize owners, I might add)

Not thinking about personal gain. Simple as that. The whole thread is based on; "I want this."

I disagree with that. Like I stated in the above mentioned post, one of the main reasons this thread was started in the first place, was:

the raffle leads to mountains of PMs to the prize dragon winners [and a certain amount of harassment]

I just worry that with multiclutching will make the ultimate prize less desirable. Currently 2nd gens can go for multiple cb rares but if they produced eggs like crazy wouldn't that make breeding prizes less valuable than say breeding golds/silvers? :s

What is the "ultimate prize"? The CB (which I think was only traded once, maybe twice on all 120 dragons) or 2nd and higher gens?

Either way, I think Olympe's suggestion for multiclutching might work very well:

CB: Chance of breeding up to 4 eggs.

2nd gen: Chance of breeding up to 3 eggs.

3rd gen: Chance of breeding up to 2 eggs.

4th gen and higher: no multi-clutches possible (unless mated to a holiday dragon during its breeding season)

And keep in mind:

out of the 4 eggs the division might be as followed:

- 4 prize dragons

- 3 prize dragons, 1 kin

- 2 prize dragons, 2 kin

- 1 prize dragon, 3 kin

- 4 kins

I think this is how I remember the old multiclutching worked, but I'm not certain about that.

f seeing an end to ludicrous trade inflation is seen as a good thing.

this ^^ That's what's important imho

And I hope the combination of suggestions I came up with based on all comments in the thread will work towards that.

The problem is, you guys want a second gen, and you want it now, which is what keeps demand so high and thus prices as well.

Prices are determined by supply and demand, both in real life economy as well as in games, like here in DC. Yes, demand for 2nd gens is high. BUT the supply is partially determined by the very low amount of CB prizes in the first place (120 CB tinsels and 120 CB shimmers to start with). So there are two sides to the story instead of only WANT, WANT, WANT. And it's the second side we're trying to improve with our suggestions.

 

The Silvers and Gold were and still are available in the Cave, whereas the prize dragon are NOT. They only come in the raffles. And we don't know what TJ will do with the next raffle (hence my second scenario suggestion). THAT's the difference between the situation with the Golds & Silvers and the prize dragons.

 

Well, that's about it for now.

[natli]

CB Metals used to essentially be the end-all, the highlight of DC hunting, the big whopper. You caught one and either you were overjoyed or you swapped it for a CB Neglected and were overjoyed at that. The rarest of the rare were things you could, with time, luck, and dedication, catch or create for yourself. But now whenever I catch a CB Metal all I think is "darn, wish these rotters would get me that 2g Tinsel from Sunsong I really want." The best things we can get ourselves aren't worth so much anymore... and that stinks.

I joined before the first raffle when the cb Gold was the rarest thing in the cave. The whining went something like this: "I will *never* catch a cb metal" & "I will *never* trade for a cb metal, because I'm poor" "CB metals should be more obtainable" "Those evil hoarders/scripters/rich people are taking *all* the cb metals". I should know as I was saying those things myself!

 

As for owners of decent lineaged Hollies, they were mobbed if they ever mentioned they own one. It was scary.

 

Now, we can do away with all rares. Or make it so the rarest thing would be 'uncommon'. The popularity of DC will drop, because some people are here for the challenge.

 

 

[angelicdragonpuppy]

Now, we can do away with all rares. Or make it so the rarest thing would be 'uncommon'. The popularity of DC will drop, because some people are here for the challenge.

Why can't we just make it so the rarest things are no more rare (or at least not much more rare) than the rarest things people can naturally collect in the game?

 

If people think catching CB Metals is easy, then truly you are a skilled hunter. For most of us, though, they're pretty darn hard to get, and offer a great deal of challenge (as you said above, they were once the hardest things to get in the game). I agree the game needs rares to strive for. I don't think, however, that it needs rares so rare that people have to hunt down half a dozen of the cave's normally rarest dragons to trade for one.

 

I hate exclusivity in adoptables games, and every time another breed goes exclusive, I cringe. I HAVE Old Pinks / Frills / CB Holidays of everything but Holly, and I still wish all these things could be brought back so other people can get them. Unfortunately it seems it'll never happen... but at least those exclusives aren't being mentioned in every trade thread, every wishlist, teasing us with the knowledge that literally nothing we can hunt down in the cave or create on our own is likely going to be worth one of their offspring.

Edited January 13, 2014 by angelicdragonpuppy