Change description/look of dead eggs from biting

[Reidragon]

Support! I would love this.

[Amaterasu-sama]

@SockPuppet Strangler

 

Thanks you are right about that. Perhaps it takes a while to update? Because when I posted the thread I had 1 kill slot left, same as before I used bite, but now my kill action is greyed out, although I haven't killed anything. I've made edits on first post.

 

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First of all thank you guys for the overwhelming support!

 

I like all the description suggestions too, you guys are great.

 

As for some points being raised

 

- I'm definitely not trying to pass off biting as "moral". But it is a fact many people are more tolerant towards vampire biting than outright killing so it does help a lot if one can distinguish. (for eg. I myself wouldn't mind gifting to someone with any number of bite fails on scroll, but if they are just letting eggs die of neglect or killing them I would at least like to know how it happened and understand their reason before attempting to gift because I'm comfortable with biting, but not killing).

 

- The suggestion is not about TGT/any gift group bending their rules (although it is related, I'm not going to go into that topic). As much as it blows, it's not our call to make. I'll however like to say, just because someone bit an egg, it does not mean they will bite a gift/trade. It is like saying everyone who uses a bite action is a careless owner and inconsiderate person who can not properly take care of a gift. And biting isn't something random like earthquake that will effect eggs it is not intended on, so I don't see how someone can end up biting an egg unless they intentionally wished to do so. Basically, banning someone with bite kills from giveaways is no sure shot way to tell if the person is a good owner, they may still let the egg die from neglect, abandon it etc. In which case they will be banned from the giveaway, so can't the same be done to people who bit a gift instead of banning them outright without a chance given at all? I'm personally not against being ineligible for giveaways, but I can not ban myself from using Bites for it because I love vampires and all kinds of interesting lineages they can make if turned.

 

 

Basically from what I understand, just about everyone has an idea of what I'm suggesting and most support it - that, we want bitten dead eggs distinguished from other dead eggs for whatever reasons we have, that may differ from person to person; and to make in cave profile of vampires more interesting by adding details to dead eggs that are related to them.

 

Thanks all

 

EDIT: I'd love it if someone is feeling inclined enough to try a egg sprite with the original description of how it looks like in first page

The dead egg shell can be plain/muddy brown in color (something like neglected, just green replaced with brown) - something that shows egg was attempted to be turned but died so it didn't fully take a vampire egg's form/color.

Edited January 25, 2013 by Amaterasu-sama

[CatCreature]

- The suggestion is not about TGT/any gift group bending their rules (although it is related, I'm not going to go into that topic). As much as it blows, it's not our call to make. I'll however like to say, just because someone bit an egg, it does not mean they will bite a gift/trade. It is like saying everyone who uses a bite action is a careless owner and inconsiderate person who can not properly take care of a gift. And biting isn't something random like earthquake that will effect eggs it is not intended on, so I don't see how someone can end up biting an egg unless they intentionally wished to do so. Basically, banning someone with bite kills from giveaways is no sure shot way to tell if the person is a good owner, they may still let the egg die from neglect, abandon it etc. In which case they will be banned from the giveaway, so can't the same be done to people who bit a gift instead of banning them outright without a chance given at all?

I can only talk as a TGT-mod but I keep seeing many gifters who refuse to even answer PM's from someone with dead things on their scroll. Or regreting gifting to someone who turned out to have something dead. TGT listens to them since we depend on their generousity.

 

Other gifting threads might change their rules if this becomes true. I don't know since I'm not modding those threads.

[Natayah]

Huge Support. And I never bite on my scroll and still support!

 

Many players (not gifting threads but players) choose to make a distinction between failed biting and other kill methods for their giftings. I don't honestly care but many do. So if a large part of the player base cares, then I support a distinction. Not to get on gifting threads ( cause TGT wont distinguish ), but individuals do and will.

[Fuzzbucket]

Maybe just show the TOP half of the egg broken off, instead of the bottom ? Simples ?

[platedlizard]

My only concern with the changed egg sprites is getting all the spriters onboard for it. I don't think someone else should change their art unless the spriter gives permission, and what if someone doesn't alter their own sprite or refuses to give permission? It's more work for them. If all the spriters agree to make a different bite sprite then I think it's okay. I like some of the examples in this thread so far... although the egg shouldn't be too bloody or scary because we have young children who play this game.

 

Edit: I especially like this idea since it allows you to see what the scroll-owner is doing with their eggs. It adds an extra level of interest to the game when you see bitten eggs in hatcheries or while looking at a friend's scroll.

 

Edit2: Another option is to show who bite the egg, just like successful vampire eggs do. After all, that dragon still bit that egg, even if it died.

Edited January 26, 2013 by platedlizard

[PointOfOrigin]

My only concern with the changed egg sprites is getting all the spriters onboard for it. I don't think someone else should change their art unless the spriter gives permission, and what if someone doesn't alter their own sprite or refuses to give permission? It's more work for them. If all the spriters agree to make a different bite sprite then I think it's okay. I like some of the examples in this thread so far... although the egg shouldn't be too bloody or scary because we have young children who play this game.

 

Edit: I especially like this idea since it allows you to see what the scroll-owner is doing with their eggs. It adds an extra level of interest to the game when you see bitten eggs in hatcheries or while looking at a friend's scroll.

 

Edit2: Another option is to show who bite the egg, just like successful vampire eggs do. After all, that dragon still bit that egg, even if it died.

I don't think that's much of a concern. None of the egg sprites are credited, and most of them have a white egg for the base.

[aangs-sister]

My only concern with the changed egg sprites is getting all the spriters onboard for it. I don't think someone else should change their art unless the spriter gives permission, and what if someone doesn't alter their own sprite or refuses to give permission? It's more work for them. If all the spriters agree to make a different bite sprite then I think it's okay. I like some of the examples in this thread so far... although the egg shouldn't be too bloody or scary because we have young children who play this game.

Actually, spriter permissions isn't a problem here. Spriters don't get full control over eggs sice they are just recolours of TJ original egg sprite. That's why sites like EATW's Dragon Market can use them without asking and users like PieMaster can make catcher/giftee badges. If you don't believe me, check at the very bottom of an egg's veiw page and you will see no credits listed.

 

edit: 'ed

____

 

As for this suggestion, I love it. I'm a mass biter and it would be great to have it visible that I wasn't just killing randomly. It would also be less of a pain in the but for gifting groups and traders that could see that the recipients of their eggs/hatchling were just trying to get a vamp.

Edited January 26, 2013 by aangs-sister

[DeathCry]

I support this, like others before me.

[platedlizard]

I don't think that's much of a concern. None of the egg sprites are credited, and most of them have a white egg for the base.

Thanks, I didn't realize this. I support this as long as the new sprite isn't too scary for young players.

[Amaterasu-sama]

Actually I don't support the bloody egg idea at all lol (although I really appreciate Ivyeth's input and hard work) , it gives me the (wrong type of) creeps. And it may do opposite of what this thread is trying to do. The bloody eggs may add another layer of "this owner is cruel *omginstanthate*" to people's mind who are already against biting. It may also make vampires look more repulsive, while part of the motive behind suggesting this change was to also help gain more support for vampire breed and increase their popularity.

 

As for spriting, I don't know how this works at all, but what I was hoping for is something like egg shell of neglected, so basically we're not editing an existing egg picture but will have to create a new "standard bite fail" broken egg that will replace every bite failed normal egg's picture irrespective of its breed. So I don't know what kind of permissions that would require, or none at all.

Edited January 26, 2013 by Amaterasu-sama

[TheGrox]

Why not just have the dead egg image as a dead vampire egg, rather than the usual dead whatever-egg-you-bit image? When a Vampire bites an egg, it could turn it into a Vampire, but kill it in doing so. Then you'd know it was a Vampire kill.

 

i.e this

 

No new spriting, no permissions needed, no fuss.

 

I recognise, of course, that you still couldn't differentiate between an egg killed by being bitten, and a Vampire egg which died of sickness/neglect/earthquake/deliberate killing. But if it's that big of a problem, then just change the message on the egg's page to something different to the normal 'killed' message, too.

 

 

It was just a thought (and probably not a popular one), but I thought I'd throw it out there, anyway.

Edited January 26, 2013 by TheGrox

[Pokemonfan13]

Why not just have the dead egg image as a dead vampire egg, rather than the usual dead whatever-egg-you-bit image? When a Vampire bites an egg, it could turn it into a Vampire, but kill it in doing so. Then you'd know it was a Vampire kill.

 

No new spriting, no permissions needed, no fuss.

 

I recognise, of course, that you still couldn't differentiate between an egg killed by being bitten, and a Vampire egg which died of sickness/neglect. But if it's that big of a problem, then just change the message on the egg's page to something different to the normal 'killed' message, too.

 

 

It was just a thought (and probably not a popular one), but I thought I'd throw it out there, anyway.

Sickness/neglect have a different message from being killed with an action. So you wouldn't be able to tell the difference between a vampire kill and a successful vampire killed with kill/earthquake.

 

I think a slightly different dead egg sprite [i agree, not gory] combined with a slightly different dead egg message is perfect.

[Amaterasu-sama]

This would depend on what is the real process behind bite mechanism. (which I'm not aware of). When a vampire cracks open shell and kills embryo inside like the bite fail page says, did it already turn the egg, then killed it? Or was it under process of turning but killed before it completed? If it's the latter, then it won't make sense to use a turned vampire's dead egg image at all.

 

The egg suggestions so far is assuming egg was under process of turning and didn't survive, so it's halfway in between i,e. It's neither the original breed nor a vampire.

[terradi]

That is interesting ... do the failed vampire eggs fail to make the transition from regular dragon to vampire, or does the shock of having their egg violently broken open do it?

 

I can't remember the wording on the bite action, and all my vampires are out of commission for the time being. They crack the egg open, and inject their venom. I want to say that it sounds like their venom kills the egg, making them failed transitions and thus, potentially, a dead egg mid-transition.

[SkylerFarrier]

I love this idea. Outside of failed bites, I've killed exactly 2 eggs. Once was when I first started and thought "forcing" a junk egg was a good idea. And the other was a goof where I thought I picked up a 1d egg from the AP but it actually had like a few seconds left.

[Keileon]

Supporting this. The only dead eggs one will see on my scroll are either failed Vampires or failed Neglecteds, and it's a pain to try to explain that to breeders who simply assume I don't take care of my eggs.

[Pokemonfan13]

That is interesting ... do the failed vampire eggs fail to make the transition from regular dragon to vampire, or does the shock of having their egg violently broken open do it?

 

I can't remember the wording on the bite action, and all my vampires are out of commission for the time being. They crack the egg open, and inject their venom. I want to say that it sounds like their venom kills the egg, making them failed transitions and thus, potentially, a dead egg mid-transition.

It's something like "...cracks the egg open, killing the embryo inside" It sounds like the bite itself is too hard and damages the shell too much.

[platedlizard]

"Unfortunately, this egg has been killed by a vampire," is a pretty good description for failbites in my opinion. It's similar to the original kill description "Unfortunately, this egg has been killed." and gets the point across easily. I still like the idea of a different sprite though. For me it's not about the gifting threads or anything like that, it's about adding an extra dimension to gameplay. It allows me to see what others are doing with their eggs and adds interest to the hatcheries when I'm busy cleaning them out. That's just me though.

[Coronaviridae]

As a vamp "breeder," I'd like this.

[Nectaris]

Personally, I am all for it. I do think it is different that other killing, if for no other reason than that is the only way to create vampires.

[Rafaela22]

I like this idea. I have some vampire, but I'm always too scared to bite because I think people will be sad/mad if I kill the egg by accident.

[Ashywolf]

Yes, this is a good idea. It prevents chaos in trades and breeding and you can vamp without fear of being rejected from trades.

[Coronaviridae]

Yes, this is a good idea. It prevents chaos in trades and breeding and you can vamp without fear of being rejected from trades.

If people are okay with you vamping your eggs, anyway. Although I understand that most traders are so long as you don't vamp their eggs and it's more "dead shells could be someone irresponsible; I don't want to give my eggs to them".

[Ashywolf]

it's more "dead shells could be someone irresponsible; I don't want to give my eggs to them".

This was my point, yes.

 

Different message would resolve this (assuming that the eggs did die of bites of course).

Edited January 29, 2013 by Ashywolf