Abortion

[KageSora]

Does it occur to anyone that if you do get a abortion that your murdering someone? Because think for a second... If your mum abortted you... well the end you wouldn't be here. Life is precious and short and I know your a woman and that you should have control over your body and do what ever but what about the person inside of you? Doesn't it get a choice? Are this selfish that we can't think of a unborn? Look at a picture of a baby or think of someone's child and say what if it was abortted? is not seeing that smile on it's face worth it or not seeing that child loved and growing up? yes I know some times it is a hard sittuation and others you may be shunned but you will get throught it one step at a time because I know you will! So I think Abortion should be illigal and I know some of you are like the world is over populated and this and that but come on!... why do you do it if your going to abort it? Just think about it and ask yourself what if I was aborted or what if that child that I love was? ! Peter 4:8 and John 3:18 and ! John 3:18 . PS please don't send l me with hate mail I really don't need that at the moment.

If my mom aborted me, I wouldn't care. I wouldn't have been human at the time. I would have been a clump of cells. And I say this as an adoption success story--I wouldn't have cared one bit if I were aborted because I would have ceased to exist before I even began to. It's not ending a life, it's preventing a life from starting.

 

It's not murder anymore than killing a tapeworm is murder.

 

 

Please, tell me what's selfish about killing what I view not as a human (since it's not, it's a clump of cells that could spontaneously abort [aka miscarriage] on it's own, could become a tumor, become a calcified mass, could be stillborn, could KILL ME in the process of incubating it or giving birth to it, etc.) when carrying it would be detrimental to my mental and physical health?

 

Please, tell me what's selfish about not chucking an unwanted child into a system already too full of kids who wish they were aborted because they hate their lives because they've never been wanted or loved? (Because no, I will not instantly bond with the little screaming poop-sack once I pop it out. Won't happen. I'm not a naturally maternal thing, and no matter how much you wish otherwise there are people with vaginas who do not want kids and who don't have that change just because of a pregnancy).

 

Please, tell me what's selfish about not being emotionally capable of handling a pregnancy and terminating it because I would very likely kill myself if forced to go through with it because my mental stability (very fragile as it is) would collapse and I really don't think it's healthy for an unborn child to be pumped full of heavy-duty medication like I'd need to be able to function?

 

Please, tell me what's selfish about not wanting to give birth the the child of the monster who raped me (since, due to being asexual and not in a relationship, at present rape is the only way I'd get knocked up)--especially when that monster can then sue for custody? (What child deserves to be brought up by a monster?)

 

Please, tell me what's selfish about ensuring that I survive for those who love me by getting rid of a clump of cells that don't have anybody who love them yet?

 

 

Making abortion illegal will not stop abortions. It will simply increase the deaths as women resort to throwing themselves down stairs, going to back-alley clinics for unsafe procedures, and ingesting toxic substances to try to kill the fetus. You will then have both women AND fetuses dying as a result. Women have been terminating pregnancies since long before there were legal rulings on the matter.

 

 

Don't bring your religion into this. Not all of us follow your religion, so don't shove it down our throats by making laws to mandate how we take care of our bodies based on your beliefs.

[Destiny Arts]

I, personally, dislike small children with the passion of a thousand suns. Asking me to look at pictures of them and image if they didn't exist is not going to sway my sympathies or change my point of view in any way, shape, or form, other than make me angry that people still think I need to LOVE LOVE LOVE children because I have a uterus.

 

I am asexual and currently have no interest in pursuing a relationship of any sort at this time. If I were to EVER get pregnant it would be because I was raped. Why is it fair that I should have to carry some rapist's child to remind me every day of just how much I was violated, just because YOU think that said child is more important than I am?

 

I don't even care if it's murder, and I don't care what anyone else would say if I were to get an abortion. This is MY body. Not yours. Not some male politician's. Not some person that loves children. MINE. I should be able to say what goes on in it regardless of what anyone else thinks.

 

You don't like abortions? Don't get them. Don't try to tell other people what to do and what to think.

It may be a rapist child but it is still a child and it can go for adoption can't it? Also I am not telling you what to do or think I am putting my apinon out is that not what this forum is for to get your opinion out? Do what ever you want to. But I just said think and never said you had to did I ?

[Syaoransbear]

Does it occur to anyone that if you do get a abortion that your murdering someone? Because think for a second... If your mum abortted you... well the end you wouldn't be here. Life is precious and short and I know your a woman and that you should have control over your body and do what ever but what about the person inside of you? Doesn't it get a choice? Are this selfish that we can't think of a unborn? Look at a picture of a baby or think of someone's child  and say what if it was abortted? is not seeing that smile on it's face worth it or not seeing that child loved and growing up? yes I know some times it is a hard sittuation and others you may be shunned but you will get throught it one step at a time because I know you will! So I think Abortion should be illigal and I know some of you are like the world is over populated and this and that but come on!... why do you do it if your going to abort it? Just think about it and ask yourself what if I was aborted or what if that child  that I love was?  ! Peter 4:8 and John 3:18 and ! John 3:18 . PS please don't send l me with hate mail I really don't need that at the moment.

So no matter how badly your mom didn't want to be pregnant, you'd rather she suffer horrendously just so you could be born? Don't you love your mother more than that? Even I don't like my mother much but I'd rather never be born than put her through an unwanted pregnancy.

 

Why do you think it's okay for a law to be created and all other women have their lives ruined based on your opinion? You said you wanted it illegal. Isn't it good enough for just you to not have an abortion if you ever got pregnant? Why do you have to force other women to follow your opinion that they don't believe in?

[siliconrose]

is it really going to  kill you or it die? How can you know? Is it not a life?

1) You're moving the goal posts -- the original question was "why would you do it if you're going to abort it?" These are all reasons why people get pregnant when they originally had no intention of having a child or, if the pregnancy was wanted, aborting it.

 

2) Before modern interventions, ectopic pregnancies had over a 50% mortality rate. This means both the mother and the baby die. The primary treatment for ectopic pregnancies is methotrexate: abortion. There is almost no chance of a successful pregnancy in an ectopic pregnancy, but if you get really, really lucky, there have been some cases of a Caesarian producing a live birth.

 

Do you really think that a 50% chance of death for the mother in return for a 1% chance for the life of the fetus is a fair trade?

Edited July 2, 2013 by siliconrose

[Destiny Arts]

Since so many people have a issue with my first post I want this to end after this before this turns ugly... I have my mind and you have yours that is that this forums was created for your point of view of abortions not something to argue about! ARE YOU CLEAR!

[Syaoransbear]

Since so many people have a issue with my first post I want this to end after this before this turns ugly... I have my mind and you have yours that is that this forums was created for your point of view of abortions not something to argue about! ARE YOU CLEAR!

That's all fine and dandy, but when you bring up legislation that's a different ball game. It's fine if you say "I don't believe in abortion and I would never have one." It's a lot different when you say "I don't believe in abortion and I believe by law YOU should never have one!" Then you have to prepare for a debate, because you are risking the rights and the lives of all woman. And we refuse to lose those things without a fight.

[Katie92]

Since so many people have a issue with my first post I want this to end after this before this turns ugly... I have my mind and you have yours that is that this forums was created for your point of view of abortions not something to argue about! ARE YOU CLEAR!

Arguing and debating points are two very different things.

[Destiny Arts]

Ok then... really??? You can't leave it at that? I said was pretty clear yeah you may want to argue or debait on stuff but I did say can we please leave it at THAT! I am sick of argueing and we really don't need to argue because you won right I surrender by saying LEAVE IT AT THAT. I hate argueing about stuff like this I had a opinion and that was that and now I am ending it RIGHT NOW . So say what ever you want because I don't care since you can't handle my opinion and I don't like yours that is that OKAY! I am done with this...

[Rosedamai]

Like I said before... I have my opinion and you have yours and this forums was created to put out your point of view on abortion and not to argue about it and I am leaving it at that. also to answer your question even if she hated you so much wouldn't you want to be alive?yeah you may have a terrible life untill you can leave the house but if you get over that bridge and start a new one and may someday become successful would that not be worth living for?

why do you hate discussions so much

Like this is a general discussions forum...people are going to discuss your viewpoints...that's not arguing

Arguing would be, say, personal attack, or something like "I think these clothes look terrible on you"

this is a discussion, if you couldn't handle people disagreeing with you, maybe you shouldn't have posted here.

Also, there's a difference between "I hate chickens, I think fried chickens are awful" and "I hate chickens, I think fried chickens are awful and I think no one should have any because I hate them and I think eating chicken is akin to mental torture".

 

ETA: If this was your personal blog I'd understand but this is a forum.

Edited July 2, 2013 by ylangylang

[KageSora]

I see...what... PM me on this but what is religion to you?

I'm not gonna bother PMing it, as I have nothing to hide from saying it in public.

 

I feel religion is a tool. It is something that should bring peace and joy to those who follow it. It is something that people should be able to turn to in the hard times, and to draw strength from to better themselves and the lives of those around them.

 

But all too often it is used not as a tool of peace and prosperity, but as a weapon meant to wound those who do not share the religion of the wielder.

 

Unless you live in a theocracy and are a member of the ruling religion(s), then you shouldn't go trying to pass laws based on your religion. Why should somebody who doesn't share your religion be forced to follow your rules?

 

(And, for the record, I was raised Roman Catholic, but that never clicked with me, and I've since abandoned it due to it ultimately causing me enough stress that it adversely affected my physical and mental health.)

 

Since so many people have a issue with my first post I want this to end after this before this turns ugly... I have my mind and you have yours that is that this forums was created for your point of view of abortions not something to argue about! ARE YOU CLEAR!

You're the one who came in here, speaking of making abortion ILLEGAL. Which would mean forcing your opinion on all others.

 

I don't like that there is a need for abortion in this world--but there is.

 

In a perfect world, birth control would never fail or be sabotaged. Rape would not happen. Finances would not take a turn for the worst and necessitate the termination of a much-wanted pregnancy. Adoption would be a system that helps all the children who go through it. The only pregnancies that would be terminated were those that were no longer viable or that caused too great a risk for the health or life of the mother or the fetus.

 

But we don't live in that kind of a perfect world.

 

That's why I feel CHOICE is important--so that those who do not feel it is acceptable can carry on with their lives without getting an abortion, and those who decide that it is for the best can.

[Kai]

Is it really necessary to 10x overkill one post

[Syaoransbear]

Is it really necessary to 10x overkill one post

Everyone was posting at the same time, it's not like people were going "Oh hey I feel like repeating everyone."

[Destiny Arts]

Everyone was posting at the same time, it's not like people were going "Oh hey I feel like repeating everyone."

To true.

[Gsea]

Ok then... really??? You can't leave it at that? I said was pretty clear yeah you may want to argue or debait on stuff but I did say can we please leave it at THAT! I am sick of argueing and we really don't need to argue because you won right I surrender by saying LEAVE IT AT THAT. I hate argueing about stuff like this I had a opinion and that was that and now I am ending it RIGHT NOW . So say what ever you want because I don't care since you can't handle my opinion and I don't like yours that is that OKAY! I am done with this...

Nobody is personally attacking you or really even trying to "argue" with you, and nobody is attacking your opinion. Everyone is just trying to

1. Educate you.

2. Defend their point, the same way you're defending your opinion.

 

You don't have to like their opinion, and they don't have to like yours. It works both ways. You even said specifically:

you can't handle my opinion and I don't like yours

So if you disagree with somebody's opinion, you need to handle it if they don't agree with yours. You're absolutely entitled to your opinion but that doesn't mean that people won't want to say something about it.

 

Also, if you're going to come into a controversial thread and post an opinion which the majority of the thread seems to be against, you simply need to be prepared for some sort of debate. Sorry, but that's the way it is.

 

Anyway, calm down. Nobody is trying to harass you.

 

(And I probably just repeated like 5 other people's posts, but I just felt like I needed to say this)

[Destiny Arts]

It's ok glamoursea2, I understand and thank you for clearifying that.

[BlitzDrake]

Does it occur to anyone that if you do get a abortion that your murdering someone? Because think for a second... If your mum abortted you... well the end you wouldn't be here. Life is precious and short and I know your a woman and that you should have control over your body and do what ever but what about the person inside of you? Doesn't it get a choice? Are this selfish that we can't think of a unborn? Look at a picture of a baby or think of someone's child and say what if it was abortted? is not seeing that smile on it's face worth it or not seeing that child loved and growing up? yes I know some times it is a hard sittuation and others you may be shunned but you will get throught it one step at a time because I know you will! So I think Abortion should be illigal and I know some of you are like the world is over populated and this and that but come on!... why do you do it if your going to abort it? Just think about it and ask yourself what if I was aborted or what if that child that I love was? PS please don't send l me with hate mail I really don't need that at the moment.

To every question; No. I'm a misanthropist, I have lockiophobia, if I was aborted how would I feel? I wouldn't CARE. Why? Because I never developed a conscious. I hate children. Just because there are women does NOT mean we are all "ERMEGERD A BABEH (devil spawn imo)" I MUST LURRVE IT!!!!!!No. Not all women are nurturing, there are some that are abusive to others and themselves. Not all of them are married. Not all of them would give homes. Adoption? Yeah, so lets put a woman through mental and physical trauma that will damage her the rest of her life. Telling her that she'll get through it "one step at a time..." seriously? Some people die from child spawnage so yes, it can kill you.

Why do they do it if they're going to abort it? Well let's see, medical reasons, someone could've messed with her BC, something failed? Nothing can be 100% can it? Let them have their own choice. Banning abortion will, in fact, cause more deaths, to both women and the "baby".

 

Those supporting the bill do not care for life. That's a big step you say? That's a lie you say? "Blighty dese peoples care far teh babehs they obviously care for life! After all they are "PRO LIFE" Well why don't these people care for the women that they want to be "Pro force a birth" at? If you care, a "Pro lifer" should care about the life of these women who could be seriously injured mentally or physcally...or die. Ever see these people in mass groups outside prisons opposing the death penalty? Ever see these people in HUNDREDS opposing war (I mean at places like gas stations, or common places we go to everyday)? Ever see these people holding up signs and screaming to others to stop poverty and homelessness with just as much vigor? What about domestic violence? I don't think so.

 

I would never bond with a child, I have a temper and would be a terrible parent. The thought of it makes me laugh I'd rather die than be that. You don't want us to bring up overpopulation etc? Well...too bad. The world is overpopulated as it is, frankly I see more places putting in place similar acts like China's One Child Policy within the next half century. More resources are going to be strained, more competition, etc, which will lead to the strain and suffering of future generations. This "child" may grow up miserable, etc. And just because it could be "the one to cure cancer" yeah? It could also become the next serial killer or Hitler.

If you are tired of arguing then you can always leave this discussion. As for me, Blighty is going back to bed and not run on 4 hours of sleep so more people don't face my irritability.

Edited July 3, 2013 by BlightWyvern

[KageSora]

Ahh, I forgot to tag it so now I can't find it, but there was a good post on Tumblr in response to the "what if the cure for cancer died with an aborted child?" thing.

 

It was something like "What it the cure for cancer would have developed inside the mind of a woman who got pregnant and was forced to drop out to support a child she never wanted?"

[Zovesta]

I feel religion is a tool. It is something that should bring peace and joy to those who follow it. It is something that people should be able to turn to in the hard times, and to draw strength from to better themselves and the lives of those around them.

 

But all too often it is used not as a tool of peace and prosperity, but as a weapon meant to wound those who do not share the religion of the wielder.

 

Unless you live in a theocracy and are a member of the ruling religion(s), then you shouldn't go trying to pass laws based on your religion. Why should somebody who doesn't share your religion be forced to follow your rules?

I agree with this wholeheartedly.

 

KageSora: I remember seeing that on tumblr lmao.

 

In the end, imo, it's all sad and all that a child is being killed when it comes to an abortion, but we have to think about priorities here. The child is gonna be born to a family who didn't want them AT BEST. I'd rather have one happier woman than two miserable human beings.

[HeatherMarie]

*siiiigh*

 

I honestly just don't understand how some people think. And this really isn't pointed at anyone in particular, I've been having abortion-talks in real life lately as well.

 

What makes a *possible baby* so much more important then a *real woman* who probably has family and friends who care about her, maybe a job that needs her, and yeah, has dreams and feelings and wants of her own.

 

That fetus that gets aborted is *not living* and THAT is the main reason I just DON'T. GET. IT. A fetus *cannot survive* outside the womb under 21 weeks, and the majority of abortion clinics (at least around here) won't abort much past that anyways. So there's a VERY huge chance that the fetus people are getting so upset about being aborted wasn't a sustainable lifeform at that stage anyways.

 

There is nothing magical about giving birth, nothing that's going to magically make a mother bond with and love a child that she doesn't want or can't take care of. Or have none of these people read any of the statistics on child abuse? There is NOTHING good about putting a child up for adoption or trusting the foster care system, there are plenty of statistics there as well. And PLENTY of children who've attempted suicide, who would've LOVED if they had been aborted rather then forced into a world full of hate and pain.

 

Do you know how psychologically damaging it can be to give birth to your rapist's child? Even if you give it up, the *act* of bringing that *thing* into this world, seeing it for however short a time, some women NEVER recover from that. But that's okay, because we saved a child that's not wanted, right?

 

And yes, as horrible and stupid as it sounds in this day and age, there are PLENTY of females who grow up with NO access to any type of sexual education, and have sex honestly *not knowing* that it can lead to pregnancy, and is that THEIR fault because the government and schools and parents did everything in their power to keep any type of sexual education away from them? Should THEY have to suffer through a pregnancy they don't even UNDERSTAND?

 

I just.... *sigh*

[Destiny Arts]

The only thing that I have to say to people at the moment is wow... just wow

 

PS: Also to people that are thinking that I am just giving up exstremely easily ... WRONG! I am just trying to make sure a fight or argument doesn't start... before something gets to ugly.

Edited July 3, 2013 by Destiny Arts

[Momo]

There are so many posts here that I just love, really, most of them from people that are notorious for writing up burning posts.

I agree with Zovesta's point in that "I'd rather have one happier woman than two miserable human beings."

What some people see is the action itself - abortion. As a result, they either don't care about or don't see what's on the other side. The mother that simply did not want to be pregnant; she now has a child that she did not want. I know a lot of pro-lifers that don't want to think about it, but let's be honest guys; there is a pretty good chance that child will not have a very loving environment. In the worst case, it will be abused or even die due to negligence. I knew a woman who made it a habit to leave her young child to his own whims wherever she went - upstairs, in the garden, and even in the car. She later confided that she never wanted that child.

 

I am religious, but the whole "you're instant pro-life if you're Christian!" ideal is something that I could never get behind. I never understood how a clump of insentient cells could possibly have more privilege than the woman who, if giving birth to that child, will be the one responsible for those 9 months, that labor, and most likely those next 18 years. trying to forget about that tumblr post that Kagesora quoted about that because it just burned me up. That's a lot to commit to, especially for women who don't even have that desire to raise young.

There is a lot of reasons for abortion that I know some pro-lifers don't even consider. Someone posted a very good list a good couple posts back, but yes.

Of course, there are less children being born due to abortion, and no one's saying that's not sad or unfortunate. However, on a realistic level, as a result there are more being born that are in happy, loving homes. That may sound cruel, but if basically all children were unhappy or abused and the adults were joyless or broken due to their own childhoods, what would that even be?

Some kind of new world torture, in my opinion.

 

I don't have a very good relationship with my own mother. My instinct is to exist and leave a large enough ink trail for the newer generations to want to follow. So I don't really care much for the intimate interaction with family life more than my desire to continue to succeed, but when my mother mentioned that she desperately wanted a daughter that would do things with her like bake and shop and gossip, I was crushed. I essentially was not what she wanted on the personal side of things ( though she is proud of my vast amount of academic success ) and though that is on a much smaller scale than abortion, I know that if I was a child she did not want at all, I would simply rather be aborted than give her that kind of grief. For those of you who want to hide behind the "would YOU want to be aborted?" inquiry; not all of us are selfish enough to be swayed by that concept to agree that the fetus instantly deserves life no matter what that means.

[Destiny Arts]

Also do you hear/ see what I hear/see?

[VictorianVivian]

The only thing that I have to say to people at the moment is wow... just wow

 

PS: Also to people that are thinking that I am just giving up exstremely easily ... WRONG! I am just trying to make sure a fight or argument doesn't start... before something gets to ugly.

I'm pretty anyone reading at this point is aware of your thoughts and opinions. This isn't some fight where you have to be "right." That's absurd. This is a shockingly civilized conversation between strangers regarding a sensitive topic. It's a discussion, not a debate. There is no "winner." Also, if you are strong in your convictions, you do not need to convince others that you are "right."

 

Just because someone walks a different path from yours does not mean that they are lost.

 

As for me? I'm 100 pro-abortion. I willingly and openly admit that I have absolutely no desire to have children and I will not take the poison known as "birth control." Therefore, I have taken other precautions to ensure that I will never get pregnant. However, should those methods fail (and I can't see how they would), if I miraculously became pregnant? Nope. Having it is not an option. Not for one split second. I don't need validation on that belief and I certainly don't need to convince anyone that I am "right." This is what is right for ME and me alone. What is right for YOU needn't be the same.

 

Also, I'm also not a Christian, so all of the Biblical talk means nothing to me. While Bible mythology is interesting, it is irrelevant to my personal beliefs.

[Destiny Arts]

I'm pretty anyone reading at this point is aware of your thoughts and opinions. This isn't some fight where you have to be "right." That's absurd. This is a shockingly civilized conversation between strangers regarding a sensitive topic. It's a discussion, not a debate. There is no "winner." Also, if you are strong in your convictions, you do not need to convince others that you are "right."

 

Just because someone walks a different path from yours does not mean that they are lost.

 

As for me? I'm 100 pro-abortion. I willingly and openly admit that I have absolutely no desire to have children and I will not take the poison known as "birth control." Therefore, I have taken other precautions to ensure that I will never get pregnant. However, should those methods fail (and I can't see how they would), if I miraculously became pregnant? Nope. Having it is not an option. Not for one split second. I don't need validation on that belief and I certainly don't need to convince anyone that I am "right." This is what is right for ME and me alone. What is right for YOU needn't be the same.

 

Also, I'm also not a Christian, so all of the Biblical talk means nothing to me. While Bible mythology is interesting, it is irrelevant to my personal beliefs.

Ok I can see that not one can be right or wrong on here. It's a win lose thing because I really don't want to change people into me ( that would be terrible ) but what I would like to know from you what is your beliefs or were do you stand on a topic like that? Because I find things like that interesting because it's another persons view.

[pudding]

Also do you hear/ see  what I hear/see?

That depends on what you are hearing and seeing. I can't read your mind so I have no idea what you are hearing and seeing.

 

Not all women are fit to be mothers. Not all women want to have kids. Not all women want to carry a child for a full term only to give it up to a flawed and broken adoption system. Don't force these women to do something that violates their personal rights. If you don't like abortion, don't have one. But give other people the right to choose.

 

Oh, and a pet peeve of mine; religious arguments really don't have a place here when talking about making abortion illegal or legal. At least in America, we are supposed to be secular in that we don't favor one religion over another. Biblical arguments have no place in legislation. Don't cite the Bible for a reason why abortion should be illegal or legal.