Religion

[Syaoransbear]

When people say things like "I'll pray for you" it makes me feel uncomfortable because by praying for me I feel like they are trying to represent me to God and sort of speaking on my behalf when they have no permission to do so. If I said "I'll pray to Satan for you" to a christian I'm pretty sure they would absolutely not want me to do that since then I'd be sort of hooking them up with Satan unwillingly.

[XxdragicexX]

@Syaoran i laughed so hard at the end

[philpot123]

When people say things like "I'll pray for you" it makes me feel uncomfortable because by praying for me I feel like they are trying to represent me to God and sort of speaking on my behalf when they have no permission to do so. If I said "I'll pray to Satan for you" to a christian I'm pretty sure they would absolutely not want me to do that since then I'd be sort of hooking them up with Satan unwillingly.

I wouldn't mind, considering I don't believe Satan can hear prayers

 

 

I get your point though. Would it bother you if someone was to pray for you without declaring it?

[lightbird]

I wouldn't mind, considering I don't believe Satan can hear prayers

 

 

I get your point though. Would it bother you if someone was to pray for you without declaring it?

No, if they *really* kept it to themselves and wouldn't let me know about it. Because I honestly couldn't be bothered by what I don't know about. C;

 

 

Honestly, the whole "prayer works" thing bothers me on a personal level, because my grandmother believes that I started to walk (I was quite late at that) because she went to the church to pray for me, not because the doctors hadn't correctly estimated what was wrong with me as a toddler...

Edited October 29, 2012 by lightbird

[St. Jimmy]

The way I see it, prayer doesn't work like "you ask for something and you might get it." At least, it doesn't work that way with the gods I follow. I use prayer to just talk to them and form a bond, like they're family. I feel begging them for things is rude; if they want to help me in some way they're perfectly capable of doing it on their own. Until then, I try to find my own help.

[Violletta]

I'm curious, Violletta, as you said Hell is often "misinterpreted," what is your understanding of the Biblical concept of Hell?

My concept of Hell is basically eternity without any sort of presence of Christ. Forever. And ever. To me, that terrifies me to no end. I see it as being left in the dark. I've been one to interpret Hell as being a fowl place where bodies rot while crawling after you or being punished for whatever sin you've done over and over again. I find those ideas to be ludicrous and figments of the imagination of human minds. Like I said, I just believe Hell to be a place where the presence of Christ is absolute zero.

 

 

Jimmy, I feel the same about prayer even though I don't believe in any polytheistic faith. Prayer is more of a bondage to me. It's like being able to talk to family and find comfort in them. Prayer to me is a personal thing. I'm only now adjusting to group prayer, and I just love the connection I feel with it because it's just--well. I don't even know how to describe it in words. I do feel a presence in my mind when I pray. Like something is there.

 

And like I said before, God isn't a vending machine. And I'm sure a lot of people think the same thing yet they do it anyways. Pray when they need to.

 

To be honest, I'm a very nontraditional prayer. I won't pray every night before I go to bed. When I feel there is a time that I need to talk to him, I empty my mind and I just talk. Be it verbally or mentally.

[Syaoransbear]

I wouldn't mind, considering I don't believe Satan can hear prayers

 

 

I get your point though. Would it bother you if someone was to pray for you without declaring it?

I guess I wouldn't be able to be bothered if someone prayed for me but didn't tell me haha .

[blah]

My prayers usually resemble Don Camillo and Peppone novels. Minus the answers of course.

 

If someone promises to pray for me, I don't mind so much to whom they're praying, I appreciate the sentiment of "I think of you and wish you all the best".

 

If what they think is best, is actually best for me or if I believe the one they're adressing in their prayers actually exists, doesn't matter so much to me.

[Stripey]

On the topic of prayers for people, I feel one of the authors I read said it best, (Mercedes Lackey, most likely ) in one of her novels. I can't remember the exact wording, but the gist was "Good done in the name of an evil deity is still good, while evil done in the name of a good deity is as bad a thing that can ever be."

 

I feel the same can be said for prayer. Good energies are still good energies, regardless to whom the person is praying, so I don't mind people praying for me, even though I don't follow their religion.

[Syaoransbear]

It just seems like unless you are asking for prayers, most of the time if someone is praying for you when you haven't requested it it's because of some lifestyle or moral choice of yours they disagree with and they are praying for you to mend your ways or something. I think someone else in this thread mentioned that saying "I'll pray for you" can be another way of insulting someone. Because having to resort to requesting assistance from some super natural power to get someone to change to better suit your opinion of morally correct seems pretty extreme.

[PointOfOrigin]

It just seems like unless you are asking for prayers, most of the time if someone is praying for you when you haven't requested it it's because of some lifestyle or moral choice of yours they disagree with and they are praying for you to mend your ways or something. I think someone else in this thread mentioned that saying "I'll pray for you" can be another way of insulting someone. Because having to resort to requesting assistance from some super natural power to get someone to change to better suit your opinion of morally correct seems pretty extreme.

This. My mother does that every time I get into disagreement with her. It's unbelievably condescending. It's like a polite way of saying "I'm better than you and you are a bad person"

[KageSora]

Honestly, the only time I see it NOT as a polite insult is when somebody is having a hard time in life--like praying for them to recover from illness, or that their family member gets better/they find a job/whatever.

 

But I see it more often in the "Oh, you're not following my lifestyle/support something that is against my religion/doing something I disagree with, I'll pray for your soul because you are clearly going too Hell if this keeps up so I'll ask my deity to "fix" you so you can not be damned" sense.

[HeatherMarie]

I've seen it (and had it) both ways. I've gotten "I'll pray for you" in response to the fact that I'm gay, which is the condescending "God can fix you!" response.

 

But I've also had friends who've said they'll pray for me when my mom was in the hospital, when I was in the hospital, when I was suicidal, etc. In those instances, it feels more like "I'll be hoping for the best".

[Violletta]

Honestly, the only time I see it NOT as a polite insult is when somebody is having a hard time in life--like praying for them to recover from illness, or that their family member gets better/they find a job/whatever.

These said situations are usually the only times where I will pray for anyone when I'm discussing with them certain things. I've never out front prayed for someone because I thought they're lifestyle needed to be fixed. Although I don't agree with it myself, I'm not against it. My own aunt is lesbian and I'm completely okay with it. She's one of the most devote Christian I know, besides her wife. But really, I am ashamed of Christian who would say, "I'll pray for you" as a direct insult to someone. It's just so morally wrong to me.

 

Speaking of which, I was talking to my friend yesterday about plans for Halloween and how we were bummed that we'd be busy with work to really go to any parties or anything tomorrow night. We were talking about how I was doing something for the church tomorrow since we put on this program for the little kids in our neighborhood to go trick-or-treating safely (since there are creepers out in our rural neighborhood) and me being a chaperone along with this boy I thought was cute. We were giggling about it and then she asked me if my mom even celebrated Halloween. I said no she isn't a great supporter of it, but it's my favorite second holiday and this girl in front of us turned around and flat out told us she didn't celebrate the holiday. We both sort of blankly stared at her and I said, "Okay." to her.

 

So she gives me this dirty look and said, "If you were a Christian, you wouldn't celebrate Halloween."

 

Oh I gave her a proper Christian smack down after that. I bet she was some weird, superstitious, extremely weird, orthodox Christian or whatever. I don't even know who she is. Megan was laughing at her the entire time.

[skauble]

Most of the time I don't mind if people say that they're praying for me, because I was raised a Christian and I know that they're doing something for me that they sincerely believe is truly going to benefit me.

 

The only time it gets to me is with people that have actively (and continuously) confronted me about leaving the church. When I'm having a problem and they say they'll pray for me, usually it's a pointed dig at the fact that I no longer believe. In those cases I think just doing it without telling me would be best instead of adding that kind of tension when I'm already in enough of a crisis that they believe I require their calling on God on my behalf.

 

But, for the most part, I try to take it as intended, because faith can be very comforting, and I think that a lot of people just want to share that feeling when they see someone struggling.

 

So she gives me this dirty look and said, "If you were a Christian, you wouldn't celebrate Halloween."

 

I went to Disneyland on Christmas with my friend and her son, once, and one of the employees called us heathens for being their on that holiday. We complained because, although I tend not to let the opinions of random people I meet for less than five minutes affect me, her son was about 11 and it did bother him (although it was more the judgmental hatred as opposed to the particular insult. Believe me, the Disneyland management was not amused in the least with an employee suggesting that people shouldn't be at their park.

Edited October 30, 2012 by skauble

[St. Jimmy]

I went to Disneyland on Christmas with my friend and her son, once, and one of the employees called us heathens for being their on that holiday. We complained because, although I tend not to let the opinions of random people I meet for less than five minutes affect me, her son was about 11 and it did bother him (although it was more the judgmental hatred as opposed to the particular insult. Believe me, the Disneyland management was not amused in the least with an employee suggesting that people shouldn't be at their park.

Ugh, how rude. Not everyone even celebrates Christmas... and why was he working there if he thinks people should stay home on that day?

 

Also, I hate it when people misuse the word Heathen and associate it with evil or atheism. (Nothing against atheism of course. It's just that most Heathens aren't atheists.)

[Awdz]

Ugh, how rude. Not everyone even celebrates Christmas... and why was he working there if he thinks people should stay home on that day?

 

Also, I hate it when people misuse the word Heathen and associate it with evil or atheism. (Nothing against atheism of course. It's just that most Heathens aren't atheists.)

Sounds like he was working there because he really needed a job but was disgruntled about not getting Christmas off. Bad moods almost never make a good impression about the person in them.

 

I see use of the word "heathen" (and saying "I'll pray for you") as phrases that can be used in either very positive or very negative ways, depending on the context. I agree with what others have already posted, that it depends on the spirit in which it was said whether or not it would be offensive.

[NobleOwl]

I only really pray for people I know if they're okay with it. And never in an insulting way. I've met too many people who don't want a Jew praying for them, and I don't like doing something like praying for someone without permission.

 

I went to Disneyland on Christmas with my friend and her son, once, and one of the employees called us heathens for being their on that holiday.

 

People have done that to us when we used Christmas to go to the movies.

[Violletta]

Don't people know that Christmas is only fun in the morning and during dinnertime? Seriously, what else are you supposed to do for the rest of the day in between a good Christmas breakfast and a Christmas dinner. It doesn't snow everywhere.

 

What dunderheads.

[Katie]

So she gives me this dirty look and said, "If you were a Christian, you wouldn't celebrate Halloween."

 

Oh I gave her a proper Christian smack down after that. I bet she was some weird, superstitious, extremely weird, orthodox Christian or whatever. I don't even know who she is. Megan was laughing at her the entire time.

Me and my Dad are Christians ourselves and we still celebrate Halloween and give out candy to children. She must of had a very strict household or something.

[PointOfOrigin]

The funniest thing is that Halloween is just one more holiday that Christians copied from pagan religions.

[Emmerz24]

It just seems like unless you are asking for prayers, most of the time if someone is praying for you when you haven't requested it it's because of some lifestyle or moral choice of yours they disagree with and they are praying for you to mend your ways or something. I think someone else in this thread mentioned that saying "I'll pray for you" can be another way of insulting someone. Because having to resort to requesting assistance from some super natural power to get someone to change to better suit your opinion of morally correct seems pretty extreme.

It doesn't always mean they're praying for your lifestyle choices (not religiously all the time anyway). My boyfriend recently told me that he started praying for me when we were still just friends and he's not even a Christian.

 

I don't really know what his religious beliefs are (except that he's Hindu, but I'm not sure to what extent), but he told me he's prayed every night for a long time, even before meeting me. I think it's just a way some people go about making extra sure something/some they care about will be okay... in some cases anyway. I have had "Christians" tell me "I"ll pray for you" in a condescending matter before because I have no religious affiliation, but I just ignore them haha.

 

 

 

Oh and as for Halloween, I only know two Christians (who are actually my best friends) who are against the holiday, though I think that's their parents' doing. Besides that, even the churches here partake in Halloween activities as they see it's just for fun.

[satyr76]

I find it offensive when people say "I'll pray for you" in an argument or something, but if they're praying for health/safety, I'd consider it a compliment. Even if they're of a different religion, I really wouldn't care. Praying for someone's salvation because they're gay, a different religion, etc. is alright, I guess, but telling them is rather offensive, and just seems to be a way of saying "I'm better than you."

[Violletta]

Me and my Dad are Christians ourselves and we still celebrate Halloween and give out candy to children. She must of had a very strict household or something.

That's what I thought. It's kind of weird though, to me at least, since I grew up participating in Halloween. It was fun for me. It's not like I would go into the weird satanic stuff. It doesn't attract my attention at all.

 

  The funniest thing is that Halloween is just one more holiday that Christians copied from pagan religions.

 

Actually, Halloween has no religious value to Christians. We never copied it, it's just a fun holiday to us. If you were a radical, then yeah you might believe it's a day dedicated purely to Satan. But it's not a holiday we adopted. The holidays I celebrate with Christian value is Easter and Christmas. And I do Lent too, but that's not exactly a holiday. So I'm sorry, but you are actually wrong in thinking Halloween is a holiday Christians made up.

[PointOfOrigin]

Actually, Halloween has no religious value to Christians. We never copied it, it's just a fun holiday to us. If you were a radical, then yeah you might believe it's a day dedicated purely to Satan. But it's not a holiday we adopted. The holidays I celebrate with Christian value is Easter and Christmas. And I do Lent too, but that's not exactly a holiday. So I'm sorry, but you are actually wrong in thinking Halloween is a holiday Christians made up.

I never said that it has any religious significance in today's world. However, it does have religious history and it was at one point in time a part of Christian culture. And yes, it was adopted from Samhain.

 

  When "local people converted to Christianity during the early Middle Ages, the Roman Catholic Church often incorporated modified versions of older religious traditions in order to win converts." Pope Gregory IV wanted to substitute Samhain with All Saints' Day in 835, but All Souls' Day (Nov. 2nd) which is closer in resemblance to Samhain and Halloween today, was "first instituted at a French monastery in 998 and quickly spread throughout Europe" (MSN Learning & Research- Halloween). In the 16th century, "Christian village children celebrated the vigil of All Saints' by doing the Danse Macabre. The Seven Brethren whose grizzly death is described in the seventh chapter of the deuterocanonical book of Second Macabees" is also said to have resulted in children dressing up in grizzly costumes to signify these deaths.

 

I just find it funny that all those radicals trying to replace Halloween with "Jesusween" (not sure about spelling) aren't aware of their religion's history.