Abortion

[St. Jimmy]

A person very near and dear to me was pushed VERY heavily into abortion, and this was after she decided to keep the baby, and it was past 12weeks and as it was family it really hurt me. I'm sure it hurt her more, though, and I still love her just as much.

And this is why I'm pro-choice, not pro-abortion. (Seriously, I don't know anyone who actually is pro-abortion.) People should have the right to choose what they do with their bodies, whether their choice is to carry to term or abort.

[anmiller86]

And this is why I'm pro-choice, not pro-abortion. (Seriously, I don't know anyone who actually is pro-abortion.) People should have the right to choose what they do with their bodies, whether their choice is to carry to term or abort.

I feel the same. Pro-choice for sure. I have had more than one relative/friend who was pushed/forced into an abortion, and it always hurts my heart for them. No child of mine will ever have to worry about that. Luckily I just have one girl, and one Son.

[Spelunker]

I feel the same. Pro-choice for sure. I have had more than one relative/friend who was pushed/forced into an abortion, and it always hurts my heart for them. No child of mine will ever have to worry about that. Luckily I just have one girl, and one Son.

I'm sorry to hear that.

[Riverwillows]

Ok, then yeah, I'm Pro Choice too. Like I said in my earlier post...I would not recommend it, but if you insist, I'll drive you there myself.

Edited May 8, 2013 by Riverwillows

[Whirlaway]

I have to say I believe that we women should be allowed hthe choice of having a child aborted or not I mean what if "you women" get raped and get pregnant do you seriously believe it should be fair to the women to have the child. No so abortion should be allowed always..

[KageSora]

I have to say I believe that we women should be allowed hthe choice of having a child aborted or not I mean what if "you women" get raped and get pregnant do you seriously believe it should be fair to the women to have the child. No so abortion should be allowed always..

The sad thing is, people often don't care about what's fair for the existing person and only care about the "potential person".

 

Not only that but "rape happens for a reason" and "women can't get pregnant from rape because their body have ways to shut that whole thing down" and "real rape means you can't get pregnant because it's not wet down there" and "it's their punishment for dressing like a /flirting with the man/walking in a bad part of town/etc."

 

(Please note I find the above disgusting, but they are real responses people have to the idea of rape and the idea that rape results in pregnancy. Justin Beiber said it happens for a reason. Multiple politicians have said rape can't equal pregnancy or have debated on what really qualifies as rape. Etc.)

[pikapooka]

Saw a great sign on the net today, totally what I think:

 

 

 

Yeah...why do they???

Ok now you've made my blood boil.

 

 

For one, don't attack beliefs.

Second: Christians aren't the only ones protesting! And we protest because it is wrong. God did not plan for these children to die.

 

Abortion is wrong. The moment an egg is conceived, there is life. Think about it, cells are alive. But if you look at the complexity of the human body, there is something magical during development. Something beyond science.

 

Thers's a heart beat at 10 weeks. There is life at conception.

 

Abortion in most cases is an easy way out. Next it is a rash,.forced descision.

 

[Riverwillows]

Christians aren't the only ones protesting!

Actually, yeah...they pretty much are.

 

 

And if you think it's a chosen "easy way out"......I..

 

I have no words. Read my post from earlier. Then pick up that rock and stone me. After all, that is what I deserve, yes?

 

It is so easy to judge someone else, is it not? Especially when you have not been where they have.

 

Edited May 12, 2013 by Riverwillows

[Rosedamai]

Abortion is wrong. The moment an egg is conceived, there is life. Think about it, cells are alive. But if you look at the complexity of the human body, there is something magical during development. Something beyond science.

*plucks out a hair*

I killed it cells are alive send me to jail

[KageSora]

Being alive in the sense of existing in a living state and being alive in the sense of being human--in a way that goes beyond physical to encompass the idea of mental, emotional, having a soul, etc.--are two very different things.

 

Bacteria, flowers, dogs, and humans all exist in a state of living. Therefore, a bacteria is alive. A flower is alive. A dog is alive. A human is alive.

 

However, bacteria, flowers, and arguably dogs (depends on who you ask) are not alive in the same way as humans as in having the mental, emotional, spiritual capacity as humans.

 

So clearly a bacteria != flower != dog != human.

 

 

A fetus is alive in the sense that it exists in a state of living, but it is not alive in the sense that a fully formed adult human is alive. Nor it is alive in the sense that a fully formed baby or young child is alive.

 

A fetus, until the point of viability, can die (hell it can still die after that if something goes horribly wrong), can be reabsorbed IIRC, can be miscarried, can develop a defect that would make it unable to survive outside the womb, become a tumor, become a calcified mass, etc. It can be stillborn if, like I said, something goes horribly wrong.

 

 

Fetus != fully formed human, the worth of a fetus to the world != the worth of an fully formed existing human to the world.

 

 

 

But if abortion is murder, but it's okay to kill somebody in self-defense...

 

Then I would justify an abortion as self-defense against an unwanted invader that is forcing itself on me in a way that is detrimental to my mental and physical well-being as well as potentially permanently damaging and/or life-threatening.

[Slaskia]

Ok now you've made my blood boil.

 

 

For one, don't attack beliefs.

Second: Christians aren't the only ones protesting! And we protest because it is wrong. God did not plan for these children to die.

 

Abortion is wrong. The moment an egg is conceived, there is life. Think about it, cells are alive. But if you look at the complexity of the human body, there is something magical during development. Something beyond science.

 

Thers's a heart beat at 10 weeks. There is life at conception.

 

Abortion in most cases is an easy way out. Next it is a rash,.forced descision.

I think you missed the point of the poster.

 

'Everything that happens is part of Gods plan'

 

Key word here is everything.

 

Everything means it includes abortions. It means God meant for those women to have those abortions.

[Kestra15]

For one, don't attack beliefs.

Second: Christians aren't the only ones protesting! And we protest because it is wrong. God did not plan for these children to die.

If something isn't viable, it can't live. And if it can't live, it cannot be alive, ergo it cannot be a human being. A little clump of cells is not viable and certainly can develop into something other than a human being, thus until such time as it becomes viable and will certainly develop into a human being and nothing else, it is not human nor alive, this it cannot be murder. Plain and simple.

 

And out of interest, how do you know what God's plan is?

[Svataben]

And if it can't live, it cannot be alive

Uhm...

A living thing is alive until it dies. The small cluster of cells is alive until it dies, regardless of when that is. It is alive.

A single live cell is alive, even if it won't be five minutes from now.

 

That doesn't mean it is human, or that it has rights.

 

The way I see it:

A fertilized egg has is alive and has the potential to become a human being. It isn't a human being yet, and won't be for quite a while.

It's like a single brush-stroke on a canvas that has the potential to be a great painting, but isn't there yet.

 

I'm just fine with the abortion limit (unless we're talking life of the mother etc.) being at the point right before the foetus can feel pain, which is at 24 weeks.

 

[cherryjinx]

I'm going to state my belifs firmly.

 

Once a cell is concieved, it is a child. Abortion kills children, and their is no other explanation for it's evil. There is no excuse, and nothing that could state it's right.

 

Killing a child in our lifetime is called MANSLAUGHTER. So is abortion, and I refuse to think it isn't.

I have marched for life two years in a row, and will continue every year to travel 22 hours ON A BUS with people to Washington D.C. and march in freezing rain, snow, and tempuratures that I would rather not walk in for two hours.

 

I'm going to state this simply, and clarify something for anyone reading this that is Prochoice. I hope this will change your mind.

 

*It's a child, not a choice. Would you kill your own baby? A LIVING, BREATHING baby? It's stated that just after a few WEEKS after conception their is a heartbeat and recorded cells in the womb.

 

*In the holocaust, would you shoot down Jews? If not (hopefully), why would you murder a baby?

 

*If the world is "too populated" and abortion is a "nessesary evil" then why was the baby concived in the first place? Polls show that 87% of children aborted are by teenagers. That's way to young to have a baby, but is it too old to be a killer?

 

I'm now stating some quotes I found on Pro-Life websites. If you think there is a logical explanation for abortion, make sure and tell me because I may change your mind.

 

*Our value should not be detirmend by our size- babies

 

*If you do not believe in miracles, perhaps you forgot you are one.

 

*Ever notice everyone Pro-Choice is already LIVING?!?

 

*When scientist find a cell on other planets they say, "We found life."

When scientists find a cell in the womb they say, "Its a choice, not life, not a child."

 

*If you're pronounced dead when your heart STOPS beating? Why aren't you pronouced alive when your heart STARTS beating?

 

Be pro life, and respect life <3

[cherryjinx]

For the record, anyone who's saying, "It's God's plan for those women to have those abortions." You are wrong. God gave us free will. FREE WILL. We can either go for his plan or against his plan, and I highly doubt he wants us to kill his own creations.

Is it God's plan for some psyco to bomb boston or to shoot down kindergardeners? NO.

He gave US the beautiful, beautiful gift of FREE WILL.

It's OUR decision to either follow his plan of life, or to destroy it.

He probably knew that they would get an abortion, but I promise you he hopes that maybe those people can change their hearts to be loving, forgiving people, and that they pray to be forgiven of their killings, their sin.

God didn't plan for us to have an abortion, he only hopes that we will change our mind.

Be prolife guys, be Pro-God

[Rosedamai]

Fine. On one hand you hold a petri dish with a zygote. On the other hand you hold a baby. You have to drop one. According to you there is no difference.

[PointOfOrigin]

Well, there are people here who can answer all of this better then me, but I'm going to try.

 

Once a cell is concieved, it is a child. Abortion kills children, and their is no other explanation for it's evil. There is no excuse, and nothing that could state it's right.

 

Nope. That's a zygote. It becomes a fetus once it's three months old.

 

Killing a child in our lifetime is called MANSLAUGHTER. So is abortion, and I refuse to think it isn't.

 

You are asking us to look at your side, but you refuse to listen to our reasons.

*In the holocaust, would you shoot down Jews? If not (hopefully), why would you murder a baby?

 

A living person, not just Jew has already lived. They have their hopes and personality, and their past. A fetus is a clump of cells that's unable to live on their own and that actually has a parasitic relationship with it's mother.

 

*If the world is "too populated" and abortion is a "nessesary evil" then why was the baby concived in the first place? Polls show that 87% of children aborted are by teenagers. That's way to young to have a baby, but is it too old to be a killer?

 

In other words, older people who don't get an abortion actually know how to prevent the pregnancy. Teenagers, from the other side, are awfully uneducated all thanks to the pro-life side and churches that refuse to give them proper education.

*Ever notice everyone Pro-Choice is already LIVING?!?

 

Ever noticed that big number of us doesn't want to be alive?

*When scientist find a cell on other planets they say, "We found life."

When scientists find a cell in the womb they say, "Its a choice, not life, not a child."

 

Cell on the other planet can live fine on it's own. A zygote and a fetus can't.

For the record, anyone who's saying, "It's God's plan for those women to have those abortions." You are wrong. God gave us free will. FREE WILL. We can either go for his plan or against his plan, and I highly doubt he wants us to kill his own creations.

 

And who of us ever used that argument? The ones using god are pro life activists. The only times we mention religion is when we say that we are against it having anything to do with laws.

[TikindiDragon]

For the record, anyone who's saying, "It's God's plan for those women to have those abortions." You are wrong. God gave us free will. FREE WILL. We can either go for his plan or against his plan, and I highly doubt he wants us to kill his own creations.

Is it God's plan for some psyco to bomb boston or to shoot down kindergardeners? NO.

He gave US the beautiful, beautiful gift of FREE WILL.

It's OUR decision to either follow his plan of life, or to destroy it.

He probably knew that they would get an abortion, but I promise you he hopes that maybe those people can change their hearts to be loving, forgiving people, and that they pray to be forgiven of their killings, their sin.

God didn't plan for us to have an abortion, he only hopes that we will change our mind.

Be prolife guys, be Pro-God

Just FYI there are many Bible reading, God fearing Christians that disagree with you about when life begins. Also Christianity sprang from Judaism, and Hebrew Scripture notes (I am sure Noble will elaborate on this) that it is the 'breath of life' given from G-d to humans that defines life - in Jewsish law a child is not alive until it has drawn it's first breath.

 

So I, as a Bible reading commited Christian, take issue with your comment "be pro-God". You do not have a monopoly on interpreting God's Word. And, incidently, I've found many people of the pro-life bent have rarely read the Bible through in it's entirety, and not normally more than once if they have.

[PointOfOrigin]

I'm pretty sure if a fetus turns into a tumor it can still have a heartbeart?

Also the whole god argument doesn't hold ground with some of us because some of us here don't believe in god (again, like me.) And some who do believe in god are pro-choice anyway.

Or they believe in different god. Hell, maybe they believe in multiple gods. And even if they do believe in same god as you, they probably have different interpretation...

[Switch]

((accidentally deleted post because i'm an idiot and it's like 5 AM forgive me))

 

*It's a child, not a choice. Would you kill your own baby? A LIVING, BREATHING baby? It's stated that just after a few WEEKS after conception their is a heartbeat and recorded cells in the womb.

I'm pretty sure if a fetus turns into a tumor it can still have a heartbeart?

 

 

And, I mean, what about the girls who would quite literally die if they had to carry their pregnancy through? Or ones who have an intense phobia of it and would be emotionally wrecked if they had to give birth (like me!) or would rather commit suicide than go through with it. And please don't say it should be a "punishment" for their own actions or they need to take responsibility for "being careless", because some could very well have become pregnant against their will. And aside that, birth control and other things don't always work, or could be sabotaged by a partner. And what if when it was born, the baby would be neglected or abused and become depressed and live such a terrible life they would eventually kill themselves or want to? And like someone said earlier, what if it would die after being born anyway due to a condition or defect? I really don't think cells who could potentially become a human should hold rights over an already living human being with emotions and thoughts and...

 

Also the whole god argument doesn't hold ground with some of us because some of us here don't believe in god (again, like me.) And some who do believe in god are pro-choice anyway.

 

Oh, and about the "pro-choice people are living" thing. There are several people here who have stated they wished they were aborted, so...

 

 

Anyway, basically everything everyone has already said.

Edited May 12, 2013 by Switch

[Fuzzbucket]

Killing a child in our lifetime is called MANSLAUGHTER. So is abortion, and I refuse to think it isn't.

That's fine. Believe whatever you like. That is your privilege. (what do you mean by "in our lifetime" by the way ? Your grammar makes your posts hard to understand at times.)

I have marched for life two years in a row, and will continue every year to travel 22 hours ON A BUS with people to Washington D.C. and march in freezing rain, snow, and tempuratures that I would rather not walk in for two hours.

And I have marched for the right to choose. That you have marched in support of your view and that I have marched in support of my view proves exactly nothing.

I'm going to state this simply, and clarify something for anyone reading this that is Prochoice. I hope this will change your mind.

On the contrary, it has reminded me of the dangers of people who are sure they hold the moral high ground. You are "stating" nothing but your own views.

*It's a child, not a choice. Would you kill your own baby?

If you count a cell - yes, absolutely; I have done so, by your definition.

A LIVING, BREATHING baby? It's stated that just after a few WEEKS after conception their is a heartbeat and recorded cells in the womb.

There are cells. There are cells in my fingernails - should I not cut them ? There are cells in a cancer - living, multiplying cells. I guess it's not OK to have that cut out either ?

There is a heartbeat - a bit later than I had my abortion but sure. But whatever it is cannot survive on its own; until it can, it is a parasite.

*In the holocaust, would you shoot down Jews? If not (hopefully), why would you murder a baby?

No, nor would I murder a baby. But a clump of cells is no more a baby than a malignant mole is.

*If the world is "too populated" and abortion is a "nessesary evil" then why was the baby concived in the first place? Polls show that 87% of children aborted are by teenagers. That's way to young to have a baby, but is it too old to be a killer?

The baby was conceived because two people had sex (or a woman was raped.) And I think your statistics are plain wrong - please provide a source - and NOT from a pro-life site. Thank you.

I'm now stating some quotes I found on Pro-Life websites. If you think there is a logical explanation for abortion, make sure and tell me because I may change your mind.

How will you change my mind by MY giving you an explanation of anything ?

*Our value should not be detirmend by our size- babies

Pardon ? But if you meant tiny things have as much right to live as elephants - fine; don't ever swat another bug will you ?

*If you do not believe in miracles, perhaps you forgot you are one.

I don't, but I'm not one anyway. Nor are my daughters.

*Ever notice everyone Pro-Choice is already LIVING?!?

I suggest you have a word with a few pro-choice dead people. My father - who was a minister of the church - is long dead and was pro choice; I can name any number of others.And many MANY people commit suicide - that too is a choice, and some who do so wish they had been aborted instead of born. Read this thread - several people have said exactly this.

*When scientist find a cell on other planets they say, "We found life."

When scientists find a cell in the womb they say, "Its a choice, not life, not a child."

Scientists have never found life on any other planet. Nor have I ever heard anyone describe a clump of cells as a choice. That doesn't even make grammatical sense.

*If you're pronounced dead when your heart STOPS beating? Why aren't you pronouced alive when your heart STARTS beating?

Because you cannot survive without leeching off your mother.

 

Also, by the way - you are NOT pronounced dead when your heart stops beating. Please check your facts. You are pronounced dead when there is no remaining brain stem activity.

 

Be pro life, and respect life <3

I am pro life. I am also pro choice. Most people who try to ban abortion are only interested in forcing a mother to bear the child to term. After that it's OK to slag her off for not being able to cope (the reason she asked for an abortion in the first place) for being on welfare, for costing the taxpayer in sending the child to school.

 

But critically - you are anti abortion. Fine. Don't have one. But don't try and impose your beliefs on others. If you must try to do that - don't be surprised when others try to force theirs on you.

Edited May 12, 2013 by fuzzbucket

[brairtrainer]

Ok now you've made my blood boil.

 

 

For one, don't attack beliefs.

Second: Christians aren't the only ones protesting! And we protest because it is wrong. God did not plan for these children to die.

 

Abortion is wrong. The moment an egg is conceived, there is life. Think about it, cells are alive. But if you look at the complexity of the human body, there is something magical during development. Something beyond science.

 

Thers's a heart beat at 10 weeks. There is life at conception.

 

Abortion in most cases is an easy way out. Next it is a rash,.forced descision.

Christians may not be the only ones protesting, but they are the loudest on several subjects. This meme is meant not to just poke fun but to make people think. Really I'm a Christian and I see nothing wrong with this, heck it made me giggle.

 

IF abortion is wrong then should we deny the nine year old who was raped by a close relative/family friend go through with a pregnancy that can hurt her reproductive health, cause her to die, and even mess with her mental health all because she is forced to be a mother before she is matured because of someone elses actions?

 

What about the teenager who decides to have sex? Should she be forced to give up her schooling because she gets pregnant? What if she followed all precautions except abstinance, ie. condom, a method of female contraceptive, etc.

 

What about the couple who finds out that their child will never be compatible with life? Shouldn't they have the choice of removing the child before it has to fight a losing battle of life? Especially when that date is a few months away?

 

What about times when birthing the child would be risky to the mothers health, causing a high chance of death?

 

What about cases of ectopic pregnancies?

[Spelunker]

I "confess" that I am a Christian. I am pro-choice in every situation. I am also completely for homosexual rights being equal to those of hetero people, racial equality, and animal welfare. I am against anybody inhibiting another's way of life or choices based on beliefs or other reasoning.

 

I believe that if you have a relationship with God, it's completely and totally your own. Sure, others may share the same, or very similar beliefs, but ultimately, it's yours.

 

Therefore, reasoning based on "God's will" or some other such reason is crass. It's stating something that you BELIEVE to be true about an entity you BELIEVE in. Since that entity may or may not exist, I take reasoning based on "the word of God" as your own statement (Or the statement of your religious affiliation, if you have one, or your activist group of choice). Nothing you say regarding God and/or what God intended holds any ground until you can provide me with conclusive, irrefutable proof that God exists. Then, you'd have to get God to state what xe intended. Since that is unlikely to happen in my lifetime, or yours, I'd suggest you stop hiding behind excuses of "GOD WANTS THIS!" or "GOD WANTS THAT!", because I'm just going to replace "God" with "[insert your name here]" and take it as your argument.

 

And if I take it as your argument, I'm probably going to find an irrational, "birth-ALL-the-babies!" type person.

[senyi]

I'm going to state this simply, and clarify something for anyone reading this that is Prochoice. I hope this will change your mind.  *It's a child, not a choice. Would you kill your own baby? A LIVING, BREATHING baby? It's stated that just after a few WEEKS after conception their is a heartbeat and recorded cells in the womb.  *In the holocaust, would you shoot down Jews? If not (hopefully), why would you murder a baby?  *If the world is "too populated" and abortion is a "nessesary evil" then why was the baby concived in the first place?Polls show that 87% of children aborted are by teenagers. That's way to young to have a baby, but is it too old to be a killer?  I'm now stating some quotes I found on Pro-Life websites. If you think there is a logical explanation for abortion, make sure and tell me because I may change your mind.  *Our value should not be detirmend by our size- babies  *If you do not believe in miracles, perhaps you forgot you are one.  *Ever notice everyone Pro-Choice is already LIVING?!?  *When scientist find a cell on other planets they say, "We found life." When scientists find a cell in the womb they say, "Its a choice, not life, not a child."  *If you're pronounced dead when your heart STOPS beating? Why aren't you pronouced alive when your heart STARTS beating?  Be pro life, and respect life <3

 

To tell the truth, none of your quotes made me change my mind about being a pro-choice person. First of all, your quotes are from multiple Pro-life websites, what about the quotes on some Pro-choice websites?

 

*It's a child, not a choice. Would you kill your own baby? A LIVING, BREATHING baby? It's stated that just after a few WEEKS after conception their is a heartbeat and recorded cells in the womb. 

A baby is a zygote and becomes a fetus later on...

 

Polls show that 87% of children aborted are by teenagers.

I want to see that data, is it worldwide or in a specific place?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[pudding]

I just think it is horribly fascinating that the earliest part of the Bible is dated in early BCE years (Early being between 1000 and 1 BCE). Don't quote me on that because I don't know exactly the date but its somewhere around there. But abortion and the concept of abortion has existed for over 5,000 years. Before we even knew about cells and bacteria, people were preforming abortions. Modern times have only allowed us much safer ways of giving abortions in comparison to those times. But, essentially, abortions and the concept of abortion is older than the bible. The same can be said with suicide. The idea of killing yourself is far older than any group condemning it today. We have safer ways for people to kill themselves now compared to back then. But we still feel the need to meddle in the affairs of a life not belonging to us. Physician-assisted suicides are usually illegal. But if the physician doesn't help that person pass on peacefully, they're liable to just take a gun to their head. People will still die without their physician's help. And people will still get abortions without a doctor's help as well. All you are doing by condemning these things are preventing people from doing these two things in a safe and secure environment, under the guide of someone who knows what they are doing.

All you're doing in the case of abortion is giving the mother a higher risk of dying by denying her the ability to abort legally. All you're doing is killing a life and a clump of cells as opposed to just killing a clump of cells. For people that are pro-life, it really is silly that you all would value a clump of cells more than the value of a living, breathing person.

 

 

I'm going to draw all my statements back home with a post I saw. I can't remember where I saw it but it can be applied to pretty much all controversial issues like gay marriage, abortion and assisted suicide.

"Say your beliefs say you can't watch Doctor Who on Saturdays. Well thats fine. But don't go out and try to stop the rest of us from watching Doctor Who on Saturdays as well."