Tales of...

[Ryuu2]

At this point, I may just order the game in case I ever date someone with a PS3.

That, or I could get the WII version, and start working on my japanese at a faster pace...

 

 

 

Actually... I guess I could download the Japanese thing on my computer, and translate it like that... eh...

[KageSora]

I got Tales games for Christmas!

 

Legendia (still-sealed, so yay, cover art and manual!), Phantasia for the GBA (again, still-sealed, so yay for box and manual! I HAVE a copy of the game, but not having the box and manual were driving me nuts, lol), and Destiny! (in really great condition! )

[Ryuu2]

I got a Ps3 for Christmas, and I got Tale sof the Abyss too...

And I freaking going to cry... My Ps3 doesn't play ps2 games...

I was reeeeaaally hoping it would...

 

 

I will definitly pre-order Graces F though. No more 17 week starvation plan~!

 

[7Deadly$ins]

Most PS3s don't. Only the very first ones were backwards compatible.

[KageSora]

It really sucks, but like 7Deadly$ins said, most aren't backwards compatible. >_> It's lame, but... ' (At least it plays PS1 games...)

 

You'll need a PS2 to play it.

[Ryuu2]

I kind of knew it wouldn't play ps2 games.

But, I hoped if I loved Kenji(the ps3) enough, that it would play them...

 

.-.

 

 

The guy at GameStop said I could buy the game on the store connected to Kenji(??? What store?) and play it that way.

So perhaps in a few months I will get the courage to ask chichi if I could stalk the store. After locating it of course.

...

I was really hoping it would be backwards compatible.

[7Deadly$ins]

He probably meant the Playstation Network Store. I don't think PS2 games are downloadable though.

[KageSora]

I think some of them are for sale on the PSN, but certainly not every PS2 game ever made, and I doubt any Tales games would be.

 

 

ETA: Nope, no Tales games on the PSN store.

 

 

ETA2:

 

3DS Owners: Hey, if you're interested in the Tales series, and have a 3DS, think you could help spread the word about the series?

 

Future localizations hinge at least in part on the sales of Abyss and Graces f--Bamco doesn't see a big market for the games here, so if they don't sell well, they're not going to want to release more games. And that makes sense, they want to make money and if they can't, there's no point in trying to please the fans--they just don't have the resources to release games outside of Japan if they won't be sure to make a decent profit on 'em.

 

So, this is where 3DS owners come in! A friend of mine posted a nice idea on FaceBook (I did help refine it a tiny bit).

 

If you have a 3DS, go to the Mii Plaza, and change your greeting to "Get TotA3DS 2/14" (without the quote marks)! Then, when you use the StreetPass, others will see the greeting. Hopefully they'll be curious enough to look up what TotA is. They'll know it's a 3DS game, and they have a date.

 

 

A little bit after TotA, change it to "Get ToGfPS3 3/14" to spread the word!

 

(Obviously, this applies to the NA release. When the EU gets a release date for ToGf, you can do that, but for now you can mention TotA anyway since it's out in the EU...)

 

 

Just figure it's an intersting idea, since Bamco is... Likely not going to advertise the games properly. So, it's more up to us fans to try to advertise the games...

Edited January 2, 2012 by KageSora

[KageSora]

Hey all, just a reminder: TotA 3DS hits the states in a little over a month!

 

Be sure to pick it up, and ToGf in March (sometime in summer for the EU, IIRC) if you want to even have a chance of seeing more games (like Xillia) leaving Japan.

 

 

Honestly, Tales is pretty dead outside of Japan--and if these two sell poorly, why should they even bother spending money to localize more games if they won't sell anyway? They're a company first, and they don't have the money to spend on localizing games that won't sell.

 

So if you want to have any chance to see more games, help out by buying them if you can!

[7Deadly$ins]

I would be more interested in grabbed TotA if there was something... different about it.

[lightningsky]

A Kratos fan! -pounces- Why is he your favorite? What do you like about him? I'm always curios to find out why his fans like him. :3

 

 

Hah, that's funny, considering ToS one is a PREQUEL to Phantasia! ToS2 helps explain some of the discrepancies between the end of ToS and the start of ToP, IIRC. It's also kinda funny considering that most of the other Tales games aren't "canon" in relation to one another--they're set in entirely different worlds, that work different ways. Most people just don't like ToS2 because the main cast from ToS1 doesn't show up as more than fanservice, they changed a lot of the VAs, and people felt it wasn't a properly finished game... To be fair, though, it's not a "mothership" title and is a side-game.

 

The game gets a great deal of hate even as it gets some very intense love--it's very much a "love it or hate it" game. I don't think I've actually talked to more than a tiny handful of people, if that, who played the game start to finish and were in the more middle ground on it. I'm firmly in the "love it to death" camp myself. I personally would say give it a shot, but keep in mind that it's a prequel that's a sequel to another prequel.

 

 

 

Abyss is fun. :3 I should finish it, lol.

i like kratos because...i just do. he is that typical cool, calm character and i always found those types to be most intriguing. not to mention he has cool-ass wings and judgment is my favorite attack ever. also, i like his voice & character design (purple, hell yeah). so no real reason to liking him other than i find him 'cool' imo.

 

okay well, here's the brother who would like to argue about ToS2 being non-canon:

 

First off I know Tales of Symphonia is the prequel to Tales of Phantasia. I have played Tales of Symphonia, Abyss, Phantasia, and Vesperia. Symphonia and Phantasia take place in the same world and Vesperia and Abyss are of course seperate from them and each other. In Tales of Symphonia 2 Ratatosk tells Lloyd and everyone else that he will use the world mana to seal Niflheim meaning he was going to utilize all the mana including the world tree to keep Niflheim sealed. When you start in Tales of Phantasia you are see the world tree withered and dead meaning no mana is left in the world evidence of this is shown when magic is no longer able to be used and summons no longer exist meaning no mana is being used to keep Niflheim sealed meaning the world should have been made into Niflheim. I do not care if you love Tales of Symphonia 2 and its characters it can not coexist with Tales of Phantasia for the fact the tree died and stopped producing mana. I know what I am talking about I play the games and do the research needed to fully understand the plot and characters. Also if symphonia 2 was a sequel to Symphonia 1 one would think that they would have mentioned the existance of Ratatosk or even the centurions since they were important in the plot of the second game. Also because in the second game Ratatosk is the the "summon spirit" of the Great Tree, at least in the Tower of Mana or Welgaia. The creators of this game put little to no thought in making it work with either games that came before or after it. Technically it is in it's own deluded world. That is why it is not canon to the rest of the series it is supposedly belonging to. It has no disregard for any of the facts that have been drawn out before hand. This game is a joke, it was made to make the first game look better and just make money off of the title given to it. Seeing as though the first game was such a success and made them so much money to begin with. Hence why it was the best selling gamecube game of it's time. Tales of Symphonia 2 fails in completing the saga and connecting the games together.

[AAurion]

 

Tales of Heroes is coming in Japan with some theater shorts, and the first two episodes have been released and subbed. They're pretty damn cute and I can't help sharing them X3

 

First has Luke, Guy, and Yuri, and second has Asbel, Cheria, and Zelos.

[KageSora]

RE: Kratos:

 

:3 That's reason enough. It's the reason I like several characters myself, haha.

 

In Tales of Symphonia 2 Ratatosk tells Lloyd and everyone else that he will use the world mana to seal Niflheim meaning he was going to utilize all the mana including the world tree to keep Niflheim sealed.  When you start in Tales of Phantasia you are see the world tree withered and dead meaning no mana is left in the world evidence of this is shown when magic is no longer able to be used and summons no longer exist meaning no mana is being used to keep Niflheim sealed meaning the world should have been made into Niflheim.  I do not care if you love Tales of Symphonia 2 and its characters it can not coexist with Tales of Phantasia for the fact the tree died and stopped producing mana.  I know what I am talking about I play the games and do the research needed to fully understand the plot and characters.  Also if symphonia 2 was a sequel to Symphonia 1 one would think that they would have mentioned the existance of Ratatosk or even the centurions since they were important in the plot of the second game. Also because in the second game Ratatosk is the the "summon spirit" of the Great Tree, at least in the Tower of Mana or Welgaia. The creators of this game put little to no thought in making it work with either games that came before or after it. Technically it is in it's own deluded world. That is why it is not canon to the rest of the series it is supposedly belonging to. It has no disregard for any of the facts that have been drawn out before hand. This game is a joke, it was made to make the first game look better and just make money off of the title given to it. Seeing as though the first game was such a success and made them so much money to begin with. Hence why it was the best selling gamecube game of it's time. Tales of Symphonia 2 fails in completing the saga and connecting the games together.

You claim to have done your research to "fully understand the plot and characters" but I don't believe that's quite true.

 

It was stated in ToS2 that Ratatosk's core and those of his Centurions could have been used as a seal. Could it have been possible that he fell back on such a plan when the mana flow began to weaken as the new world tree approached death?

 

Aside from that, the way it's stated in the game about the mana as a seal could be read two ways. First, obviously, that the mana needs to continue to be produced for the seal. However, it could also be implied that once enough mana has flowed into the seal of the door, the seal won't need MORE as it will already be completed--but maybe that's just me, sometimes I read into things differently than other people.

 

Quoting a script of the game here:

 

RATATOSK: Mana itself will remain in the world.  It'll just disappear from all living beings that comprise it.  And as long as the new World Tree keeps continuing to produce more mana, it will surround the world and will eventually flow freely into the door's seal.  And from there on I will control the flow of mana in this world from the Ginnungagap.

 

 

Now, the bolded part would lead one to believe that the mana must be constantly produced. However, to me, the part indicated in red implies that there is a finite amount of mana required for the seal, and once enough has been forged into a seal Ratatosk will then control the flow of mana and ensure a proper distribution of mana.

 

Also, considering how he lost his own tree, I would think that Ratatosk would have come up with some sort of backup plan in case the humans and half-elves repeated their mistakes and killed the new world tree. He may have agreed that mankind was not as evil as he though, but that doesn't meant he has to trust them and believe they'll never screw up again.

 

Additionally, no, there needn't have been mention of him or his centurions in the first game even though they were central to the plot of the second game. With the birth of Martel the Spirit of the new tree, it makes it quite easy to believe that there was a Summon Spirit that was bound to the original tree. Besides, this is a sequel, and sequels often introduce new elements that build on those that existed in the previous work(s) but may not have been specifically mentioned. Or are you saying that ANYTHING that plays any sort of significant role in a sequel HAS to have been mentioned in the previous work(s)?

 

Besides, what would Ratatosk have done for the original Symphonia crew? Had they gone to him, he would have killed them (or at least tried to)--especially if Kratos was with them. Ratatosk hated Mithos because Mithos betrayed him when he broke the pact, correct? And wasn't Kratos a traveling companion of Mithos in those days? Thus Ratatosk would have known Kratos, correct? I see no reason why he wouldn't have at least tried to kill all of them for daring to bring Kratos into his presence--or at the very least have refused to make a pact with them at all. I see no reason why Ratatosk, as he was when Richter and Aster awakened him, would have even considered agreeing to make a pact with them.

 

 

Could you please clarify what you mean by "Also because in the second game Ratatosk is the the "summon spirit" of the Great Tree, at least in the Tower of Mana or Welgaia."? I honestly have no idea what it is that you could possibly be trying to say here.

 

 

You seem to be rather hell-bent on hating the game, though. It doesn't matter how much you hate it--you can wish it never existed all you want, but the fact of the matter is that the game exists, and the creators have not stated that it was not intended as canon. Not as far as I know, anyway. Find me proof saying otherwise and I'll retract that argument and concede that ToS2 is not canon.

 

 

 

 

Mrf... Let me know if something doesn't make sense. I've read my post a few times and it all looks like it makes sense to me, but it's like 5:20am here and I've been up all night so I could have missed something.

Edited January 7, 2012 by KageSora

[lightningsky]

(okay first my friends are using my forum acc to talk to you about this, it isn't actually me.)

 

friends:

 

First of all everything you're saying is hearsay, you can not state how the mana is used when Ratatosk explains how he is taking the mana from the world and using it to seal Niflheim (the Ginnungagap, which again you think would be mentioned. AT LEAST that, seeing as though it is simply a doorway between Niflheim and their world). He does not state how much or how little mana it will take, or how long the seal will last. He states that he is "rewriting" the world's law, which would make him one powerful ass summon spirit. All I am saying is if Ratatosk was so powerful and important as stated in the second game he should have been mentioned, even the true nature of Mithos and his companions ended up coming to light in the first game. Nothing was kept secret, so why would that? Because they did not like Ratatosk? No, at some point someone would know and at least mention it. Not everyone (YUAN) is on Mithos's side. Idc about the mana distribution bull. Where is Ratatosk in phantasia? Nowhere, not even mentioned. You fail to mention anything about that phantasia which is the sequel of the symphonia series. He states that he is a summon spirit within the game, but he takes mana out of the world. Which Ratatosk even states himself that taking mana out of the equation takes out the summon spirits (including him, which makes no sense). In phantasia there is summon spirits, riddle me that. Also in tales of phantasia they use magitechnology, how do you figure if there is no mana in the land. Not canon, at all. It has so many flaws and was pieced together so loosely. Lol they created phantasia first, so how could they make such a design flaw like that. The fact is, and it is no ones fault but the creators, the second symphonia game is not canon. It does not follow any of the plots of the ones previously made.

 

Examples and quotes from the game itself, youtube it's glorious.

 

 

Mana Cannon and Summon Spirits in Phantasia. Yeah they exist.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qIO65UWDKUs

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nV1pP07V9rg

[Dragon393]

If it irritates you so much that the plot of Symphonia 2 doesn't match up with the rest of the plot lines (I don't know exactly what they are because I have only played ToS2 from the tales series) then why don't you consider it an offshoot rather then an actual part of the coherent story line? Like, more of a what if scenario? Though for what it's worth even though I haven't played the other games I loved ToS2 for what it was and a couple elements both in plot and gameplay where a bit different then the games I had already played and I found that refreshing and pleasant. Long story short, this is a game I am happy to have in my library and won't be trading in anytime soon.

[7Deadly$ins]

That's pretty much what people mean by not considering it canon.

[KageSora]

(okay first my friends are using my forum acc to talk to you about this, it isn't actually me.)

I know. :3

 

First of all everything you're saying is hearsay, you can not state how the mana is used when Ratatosk explains how he is taking the mana from the world and using it to seal Niflheim (the Ginnungagap, which again you think would be mentioned. AT LEAST that, seeing as though it is simply a doorway between Niflheim and their world).

 

 

About that first clip--yes, I'm aware of what's said. I quoted it, and explained how I was able to interpret it differently from what you appear to be interpreting it as. More about the ridiculousness of linking to that clip later, though.

 

Additionally, knowing Ratatosk's history, WHY would he simply abandon all caution and not believe that there was a chance for history to repeat itself? It would make sense, seeing how deeply he was hurt, that he would be cautious and would have some sort of backup plan in case the new world tree did die. It would just make sense. He suffered terribly because of the loss of his tree, even if he was willing to accept that not all humans and half-elves are terrible, he does not need to simply decided that they'll never screw up again.

 

See, the thing is... I'm taking what I know of the games and the characters, and drawing conclusions based on that. Because of this, it makes sense to me that ToS2 could fit into the ToP timeline. You, however, are apparently taking only what is expressly stated into account (and ignoring some of what's stated too, or perhaps you just missed it, but more on that later). Neither, however, is a WRONG way to go about thinking about the games--they're simply two different ways of handling what is presented to us players. The thing I love about the Tales series is that not everything is laid out for you--you're left to draw your own conclusions, you need to find your own answers to things. That's what I'm doing--I'm drawing my own conclusions based on what I DO know in order to fit ToS2 into the timeline.

 

 

 

As for the Ginnungagap being mentioned in ToS1... Why would it be? What significance did Niflheim have to the main plot of ToS1? (I admit that it's been a while since I played ToS1. I know there is a sidequest/series of sidequests relating to it, but that is NOT part of the main plot, as you can easily beat the main story without completing that whole thing. Can you tell me where it plays a large enough role to merit mention in the main plot, or where you think it could have fit in being mentioned in the main plot? I suppose it could have fit in with the sidequest(s) about Nifleheim, but I don't think I actually completed that one and even if I did it's been some time so my memory relating to it is rather fuzzy, any further information to help me understand would be appreciated.)

 

He does not state how much or how little mana it will take, or how long the seal will last. He states that he is "rewriting" the world's law, which would make him one powerful ass summon spirit. All I am saying is if Ratatosk was so powerful and important as stated in the second game he should have been mentioned, even the true nature of Mithos and his companions ended up coming to light in the first game. Nothing was kept secret, so why would that? Because they did not like Ratatosk? No, at some point someone would know and at least mention it. Not everyone (YUAN) is on Mithos's side.

 

Exactly--he never states the exact amount needed to forge and maintain the seal/. For all we know that means it needs a finite amount that was gathered before the new world tree died. It could also mean, though, that he needs a constant flow of mana. We don't know. And, as you pointed out, he doesn't say how long it will last. It could be temporary, or permanent. We don't know for sure.

 

Here's how I see it: Ratatosk's role was not needed at the time of the first game. The worlds were split, and mana distribution was likely being handled by Cruxis, considering the whole flourishing/declining system in place. Additionally, as the world had always had Ratatatosk before (well, since mana arrived on the planet, anyway) to maintain the balance, it wouldn't have been known perhaps that things would go haywire once the worlds were joined if he was not awake to control the mana flow. Therefore, nobody thought to mention it as a possible complication to the reuniting of the worlds. As for how powerful he is... How doe we even know that anybody knew that Ratatosk could do such a thing like rewriting the laws of the world? And perhaps he can only do such with mana. Besides, it'll take him 1000 years to do it--it's not like that kind of power is just instant, therefore even if he's powerful he has limitations that would have made him rather useless if that power over mana was all they needed from him.

 

Also, the true nature of Mithos and his companions was relevant to the plot of ToS1 while the fact that Ratatosk exists is not. He was not relevant to ToS1, therefore there was no reason for him to be brought up.

 

 

Idc about the mana distribution bull. Where is Ratatosk in phantasia? Nowhere, not even mentioned. You fail to mention anything about that phantasia which is the sequel of the symphonia series. He states that he is a summon spirit within the game, but he takes mana out of the world. Which Ratatosk even states himself that taking mana out of the equation takes out the summon spirits (including him, which makes no sense). In phantasia there is summon spirits, riddle me that. Also in tales of phantasia they use magitechnology, how do you figure if tere is no mana in the land.

 

Wow, really? I just can't even. Wow, just wow.

 

Okay, um, here, let me explain what's wrong with this argument in relation to that first clip (the ToS2 one) that you linked me to.

 

Go watch that clip. You can just skip to 3:13. Here, let me quote that for you for convenience:

 

Mana itself will remain in the world.

 

That right there explains how Summon Spirits and magitechnology can continue to exist in ToP despite the ending of ToS2.

 

Additionally, I would assume that Ratatosk is still in the Ginnungagap. He sealed it off to prevent anyone from entering from the outside. It stands to reason that after the original cast of ToS died off, nobody would remember that it existed, thus how would the cast of ToP even know of Ratatosk's existence? Records of it, such as ancient texts or elven tales such as those that likely led Aster and Richter to learn of his existence and helped them find Aqua in the first place could easily have been lost during the time passing between ToS2 and ToP. Even if they WERE to find a way to get to the inner chamber, it was sealed, so they would have had no way to get in to see him--I would assume that only Ratatosk himself could undo the seal, as he specifically states that it will prevent anybody from getting in again.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Also, you never clarified for me what you meant by "Also because in the second game Ratatosk is the the "summon spirit" of the Great Tree, at least in the Tower of Mana or Welgaia."

[Ryuu2]

I don't have much to add to your conversations, but.

I preordered Graces F~

 

The guy at gamestop(I think he and the other two people are the only ones working there. I've never seen anyone else there lately.) had a debate with my Father about why I should be allowed to preorder the game.

It was awesome, I really wish I could have video taped it.

[KageSora]

Was he arguing for or against you getting the game? Can you tell us more about what happened? That sounds awesome.

[Ryuu2]

The guy at gamestop was for it. He was totally awesome about, he said since there he and only one other person had ordered it, that we should order one. Because Easton apparently has 3 people who like that series, and so we wouldn't be helping the Tales localization. At one point he brought up that it would make me sad if the Tales didn't come to America.

I think I go there to much... >.>

 

There was a bit more, but I don't remember the rest of it at this moment. I ish tired...

Edited January 10, 2012 by Ryuu2

[KageSora]

He sounds really awesome.

 

 

 

So, my assistant manager is getting TotA 3DS because my manager told her to. Every order helps! (Or it will, assuming that the NA release isn't botched like the EU one was...)

[Ryuu2]

I know, with is why I'm kind of sad we only have three people who like the game where I live.

[KageSora]

Still, three is better than none!

 

 

So, I checked out the JP demo for ToGf. I have no idea what I'm doing for the most part, but I kinda get the battle system. It's fun, even if I'm mostly juts hitting buttons and killing things because of button mashing.

 

 

Also, working on my promotion of Tales.

 

Got some fabric the other day to make some stuff with. Cut it to the size to fit nicely over the bag I wear everywhere, then used some duct tape on the edges because it was fraying--the silver border it made was nice. :3 Took out some of my collection of sharpies to put some text on it and I've got myself a portable advertisement that I'll basically have showing everywhere I go. I plan to put the same thing for ToGf (this one's for TotA) on the side that you can't see here and flip it when TotA is out. :3

 

 

 

Linky for size

[Ryuu2]

That's so awesome! I would do that, but a. I'm too lazy and b. I can't do that to my backpack(even if it was only 6 dollars...).

[KageSora]

That's so awesome! I would do that, but a. I'm too lazy and b. I can't do that to my backpack(even if it was only 6 dollars...).

I'm usually really lazy too, lol, but I said I'd do something, and hey--I gotta follow up my promises, right?

 

And I know what you mean, I love my bag--that's why I'm glad it's not permanent!