ANSWERED:allow props on concepted Drake sprites/domesticated drakes

[Jazeki]

If you can justify domestication and items with lore, go ahead. If you can do it with a BSA, go ahead. 

 

Some things to keep in mind if a BSA: What dragon gets the BSA? Why does this dragon get the BSA? Does this apply to all items or just some? Do we see the items? Do we get a badge (like the magicarp) for performing a BSA? Is there a cool down? What does the BSA do exactly?

 

Finally, creativity--much like this suggestion--is subjective. Good luck. I'm out.

[HeatherMarie]

1 hour ago, Murkydepths said:

 

And on that note, do people think domesticated dragons would fit with Dc's lore? It's mentioned they're trainable but the step to domestication, which involves breeding, is a pretty big one. It's mentioned that the dragons will often do things for humans like carry messages, would the jobs usually performed by pets be taken by paid dragons? Would humans feel weird about owning a pet drake when they look so similar to dragons? Does it clash with any existing lore?

 

What kind of items would you consider fitting for dc? Only natural, man-made too, man-made 'clothing' like harnesses and collars? What restrictions might have to be made if this was implemented to keep within dcs general style? Should the items maybe be optional, added with a BSA like thing, to get around the fact you get the eggs from the wild, as if you're the one putting the item on? Or would it be better to keep all the sprites the same in order to not mess with lineages, and hand-wave the weirdness the same way all dragon sprites are technically the same sprite for different dragons.

 

Is there anything else that could be a visual difference for drakes, unique to them? 

 

Domesticated dragons? No. Domesticated *drakes*? ...... It depends on a lot of variables, including the extent of 'domestication'. While I know drakes are often compared to dogs, in terms of 'domestication' I would compare them more to wild horses, in that sure maybe you could 'tame' them and get them to do things for you but they are still their own creature with their own personalities and can probably still be fairly unpredictable.

 

Personally, I would feel uneasy about any deliberate step to make drakes 'domesticated' in the obvious ways you are talking about here. There is a huge difference between being friendly enough with a drake that it doesn't mind doing things for you, and treating it like a pet with collars and dressing it up. DC in general has this whole world built around humans and dragons/drakes/etc co-existing and having a very healthy respect for each other. I could easily see a *different* species-category being kept as pets and domesticated in those ways, such as introducing a new species category specifically bred/developed/etc to fill that role, but I can't see drakes fitting it unless the game just outright changes how drakes are seen by humans.

 

The more I think about it, the more strongly against blatant domestication I feel. It just doesn't fit with this game. What sort of 'items' could possibly fit? Well, we already have things like dragons wearing mana and flowers, collecting gems, etc. I could see a human being friends with a drake and gifting them a flower-crown, for instance, and the drake liking it enough to wear it all the time.

[Nine]

3 hours ago, Moonlightelf said:

Though if I really have to imagine a drake sprite with some sort of prop or two... and I can come up with a lot of lore stuff at middle of night even. So lets imagine this!

While some may see just a collar and think "aww, how cute", I can definitely imagine a lot of people in Dragon Cave lore donning their pet drakes with choke collars, prong collars, collars with lightning mana to make them shut up when being too loud by shocking them into silence, and muzzles because they can't possibly risk their poorly trained drake biting someone's arm off (though totally okay with drakes catching criminals, riiiiight?). Wouldn't be far-fetched given how dogs are treated in reality either. A very dark and disturbing image of having drake's sensitive skin on throat being poked by prong collar.

 

Whoa these are some great ideas! I love the concept of trained police attack-drakes chasing down dangerous criminal mages. Some good description writing inspiration here, and normally I ignore my drakes when writing stuff.

 

Anyways, this has sure been an educational thread. I didn't realize there was a "no-prop" rule in effect for sprites. I do recall a hoarding dragon concept another person mentioned, I'm amazed to hear it got scrapped because of that rule. But then again, DC has always been incredibly pretentious about itself and its rules, so perhaps not so shocking. While a dragon holding a mailbag is a bit too on the nose for my liking, I think there is merit to the idea of allowing things like gemstones, flowers, whatever. If nothing else can be gleaned from this suggestion thread, I think it's that a gemstone or flower =/= dragon holding a mailbag or ukulele.

 

Gee, I remember that treasure hoarding dragon being pretty sweet too. What a shame.

[soullessheartofsteel]

Yeah, as some of the other people earlier said, the answer to getting people to pay more attention to drakes would be expanding their breeding pool. Unique species design and interesting lore will go farther to pique people's interest in drakes than giving them a prop and canonically playing specific roles in human society. It's why I don't personally care for some of the OG dragons' lore (ie White and Black dragons) since it asserts every member of that breed as benevolent healers/violent warriors. More recent species like Pitfires handle those ideas better, since it attributes their behavior to culture rather than innate genetic behavior, and it's clearer that any ideas of them being "good" or "bad" are something that us humans thrust upon them when writing their descriptions. It's not that drakes should canonically be incapable of using tools or working for humans, because there's nothing in the lore disallowing that (which is the beauty of it) but I think that's something that's better expressed either in their lore descriptions or just in fanfiction/roleplay.

 

DC's lore is deliberately vague and I know a lot of people don't like it and have valid reasons for disliking it, but I really do feel that it's for the best-- DC was made as a casual thing and by now we're over a decade into the game. To revamp and rebuild everything again in a more waterproof way would fix the lore discrepancies, but it would definitely upset a lot of people who've built up their own headcanons over time. Fan engagement and headcanons play a huge part in why DC has become as popular as it is, and I'd prefer everyone to have different ideas of just how the DC world works than there to be one grand unified theory. (I definitely do think that DC should either commit to its lore being entirely up to the interpretation of the users, or standing more stringently by its established ideas and just revamping so it's watertight, since this ambiguity in enforcing lore rules is what spawns a lot of disagreements in the forums, but that's a subject for another thread and time.)

 

So, unfortunately OP, I have to disagree with your suggestion, but I do think that your desire for drakes to get more love is entirely valid and you shouldn't give up on that. I recommend writing a drake concept and submitting it to the dragon requests thread. I'm personally working on a drake species right now, and I know of a few others that are

[Silverwatermist]

7 hours ago, Murkydepths said:

And on that note, do people think domesticated dragons would fit with Dc's lore? It's mentioned they're trainable but the step to domestication, which involves breeding, is a pretty big one. It's mentioned that the dragons will often do things for humans like carry messages, would the jobs usually performed by pets be taken by paid dragons? Would humans feel weird about owning a pet drake when they look so similar to dragons? Does it clash with any existing lore?

 

What kind of items would you consider fitting for dc? Only natural, man-made too, man-made 'clothing' like harnesses and collars? What restrictions might have to be made if this was implemented to keep within dcs general style? Should the items maybe be optional, added with a BSA like thing, to get around the fact you get the eggs from the wild, as if you're the one putting the item on? Or would it be better to keep all the sprites the same in order to not mess with lineages, and hand-wave the weirdness the same way all dragon sprites are technically the same sprite for different dragons.

 

Is there anything else that could be a visual difference for drakes, unique to them? 

The poster above me already said how DC's lore is purposely vague in a lot of places since it's an old game slowly created over time, and since people create their own head canon to fill in the gaps, there might be some differing opinions on whether or not domestication fits or how strange it would be to own "pets" that look similar to intelligent dragons. Personally, I think it would be a bit weird? It's why I liked the idea of natural features (Drake with glowing antlers who happens to be able to be trained to help humans) rather than lanterns affixed to their antlers (which seems more domesticated to me). But the idea of paid dragons/Drakes is interesting! Huh...

Either way, on that note, I'd prefer natural items. Flowers and gems and such are already decorating many dragons, so if some are added by a BSA, maybe that could be interesting? But I'll echo what some other people said, in that I feel like a BSA would work best for a specific Drake that someone designs by scratch, so if you or anyone else comes up with such a concept, I'd love to see it and follow its progress in Dragon Requests!

 

Some questions I have for the OP as well, that I think might clarify some back-and-forth, circular talk in this thread:

1) Someone said this suggestion won't work as you intend, because several regular Dragons in-cave already have item props, like Whites. Also, the old, already-released Drakes don't have props/items, and you said this idea absolutely doesn't have to change old sprites... it would be a restriction being lifted for new Drakes that are created, just an option for artists to use. So if old Drakes don't need to get items retroactively added to their sprites, and a few other non-Drakes in-cave already have items, how do you feel that a new rule where the prop restriction is lifted solely for Drakes will make Drakes unique as a whole group? Do you feel that your idea will have the same effect if the old Drakes stay just as they are? Do you feel like it will be strange or dilute your suggestion at all if none of the old Drakes have this new option, or do you think it's fine/a non-issue?

2) Do you think it's possible that a dragon having a prop might make that individual sprite feel limited or overly specific? For example, the idea of a Drake breed having lanterns put on their antlers: Do you think a sprite like that implies that all of those Drakes are guides/helpers for humans, or do you see it as a mere suggestion of what can be? Do you think casual players who aren't on the forums to see these discussions will agree with your conclusion (whichever it may be!) or see it differently? I'm asking because I believe this is one of the reasons why the item/prop restriction was put in place, and if your suggestion seeks to lift it for Drakes, you might want to address this in depth ... especially if you believe that your suggestion opens creative doors, when others believe that items/props close those doors by giving a more limited view of what a dragon does or looks like. Just a thought.

3) On a similar note, do you feel like the lanterns or other props might imply that all Drakes in that breed are domesticated when that isn't necessarily the case? Or do you feel like that's a matter for the artist/creator of the Drake to sort out in their design process?
 

Edited February 20, 2021 by Silverwatermist

[Mewtie]

The same reasons why props are not desired in dragon sprites are also applicable for drakes, and for those reasons I rather wouldn't include props anyway, so I doubt this would encourage me to create more drakes.

I am not sure what is meant with the other idea, but it seems to assume that drakes are very trainable, which I don't think is generally true.

[Murkydepths]

2 hours ago, Silverwatermist said:

The poster above me already said how DC's lore is purposely vague in a lot of places since it's an old game slowly created over time, and since people create their own head canon to fill in the gaps, there might be some differing opinions on whether or not domestication fits or how strange it would be to own "pets" that look similar to intelligent dragons. Personally, I think it would be a bit weird? It's why I liked the idea of natural features (Drake with glowing antlers who happens to be able to be trained to help humans) rather than lanterns affixed to their antlers (which seems more domesticated to me). But the idea of paid dragons/Drakes is interesting! Huh...

Either way, on that note, I'd prefer natural items. Flowers and gems and such are already decorating many dragons, so if some are added by a BSA, maybe that could be interesting? But I'll echo what some other people said, in that I feel like a BSA would work best for a specific Drake that someone designs by scratch, so if you or anyone else comes up with such a concept, I'd love to see it and follow its progress in Dragon Requests!

 

Some questions I have for the OP as well, that I think might clarify some back-and-forth, circular talk in this thread:

1) Someone said this suggestion won't work as you intend, because several regular Dragons in-cave already have item props, like Whites. Also, the old, already-released Drakes don't have props/items, and you said this idea absolutely doesn't have to change old sprites... it would be a restriction being lifted for new Drakes that are created, just an option for artists to use. So if old Drakes don't need to get items retroactively added to their sprites, and a few other non-Drakes in-cave already have items, how do you feel that a new rule where the prop restriction is lifted solely for Drakes will make Drakes unique as a whole group? Do you feel that your idea will have the same effect if the old Drakes stay just as they are? Do you feel like it will be strange or dilute your suggestion at all if none of the old Drakes have this new option, or do you think it's fine/a non-issue?

2) Do you think it's possible that a dragon having a prop might make that individual sprite feel limited or overly specific? For example, the idea of a Drake breed having lanterns put on their antlers: Do you think a sprite like that implies that all of those Drakes are guides/helpers for humans, or do you see it as a mere suggestion of what can be? Do you think casual players who aren't on the forums to see these discussions will agree with your conclusion (whichever it may be!) or see it differently? I'm asking because I believe this is one of the reasons why the item/prop restriction was put in place, and if your suggestion seeks to lift it for Drakes, you might want to address this in depth ... especially if you believe that your suggestion opens creative doors, when others believe that items/props close those doors by giving a more limited view of what a dragon does or looks like. Just a thought.

3) On a similar note, do you feel like the lanterns or other props might imply that all Drakes in that breed are domesticated when that isn't necessarily the case? Or do you feel like that's a matter for the artist/creator of the Drake to sort out in their design process?
 

 

1. The suggestion was primarily made for new concepted drakes. I view the dragons who currently have props as the same kind of 'outdated' as things like hangbutt or full sprite sized pygmies (pumpkin). They exist and I wouldn't want them changed, but it's obvious Tj doesn't want more of it. In my example though more items would be encouraged by the fact there is no restriction. It doesn't mean people would have to put an item on a drake, but if they have a concept that only really works with an item, they have an avenue to do so. 

 

2. I see how people could see it that way, I just personally view the item thing the same as dragons all having the same sprite/description. In game, our scroll is more like a representation of dragons rather than the actual dragon. I will happily ignore lore about all of a certain dragon species being evil, cause I see it more like a guideline? Like describing the human species vs describing an individual human. When I imagine tinsel dragons existing in Valkemare, I don't actually imagine them with the green plants on them. I don't imagine white dragons always have a stick or always have it on them. I see those items are more a representation of what the dragon is commonly known for. So a drake with lanterns, I wouldn't think that ALL of that drake species have that exact job and lanterns, but that it's the general concept for the species. I can see how others might think differently, but this is how I see dragon sprites. 

 

3. Opps I kind of answered this in question 2.

[schenanigans]

Soulstones ALWAYS have their pearls. Whites have a tidbit in their encyclopedia about adult behavior indicating they make their staves and often pass them down to their offspring, which would indicate it is likely out of the norm for a white dragon to not have a staff. You can have your personal opinions and perceptions about a dragon all you want, TJ is not going to release a dragon that contradicts the lore in HIS game. So whether you like it or not, you do need to respect it. 

 

I feel like this thread is going in circles, with the OP defending an idea and yet not acknowledging what I view to be valid concerns. People have asked and pointed out multiple times now that regular dragons already have props, and there is no reason to limit props to drakes other than "well I want it." Additionally, claiming these regular dragons are "old and outdated" is a personal viewpoint, and not a fact. We got Soulstones in 2017, after all. 

[DragonLady86]

13 hours ago, Murkydepths said:

More options are always going to appeal to more people. Wider audience and all that. If a drake with items existed for you to dislike, then whoever made it must have liked it which cancels out your dislike. If a large amount of people were really against items then that'd be more of an argument but there's only about 5-10 people consistently replying on this thread which really isn't an indicative of how the playerbase would take it. 

Except its not more options. props = a handicap because you have to have lore reasons for that prop.

 

and 5-10 people is about all you will EVER see on a Suggestions thread.  Not everyone comes to the forums and only a few of those come here. So you will NEVER have a way to judge the "playerbase" opinions.

 

Change for the sake of change is not a good reason. I actually support quite a few suggestions even if I'd never use them. but they need an actual reason for that change. This suggestion does not contain an actual reason. and repeating yourself instead of addressing the actual counter-arguments does not create reasons.

 

 

[Murkydepths]

2 hours ago, schenanigans said:

Soulstones ALWAYS have their pearls. Whites have a tidbit in their encyclopedia about adult behavior indicating they make their staves and often pass them down to their offspring, which would indicate it is likely out of the norm for a white dragon to not have a staff. You can have your personal opinions and perceptions about a dragon all you want, TJ is not going to release a dragon that contradicts the lore in HIS game. So whether you like it or not, you do need to respect it. 

 

I feel like this thread is going in circles, with the OP defending an idea and yet not acknowledging what I view to be valid concerns. People have asked and pointed out multiple times now that regular dragons already have props, and there is no reason to limit props to drakes other than "well I want it." Additionally, claiming these regular dragons are "old and outdated" is a personal viewpoint, and not a fact. We got Soulstones in 2017, after all. 

 

Yes it is going in circles, because I've already answered why drakes should have props while other dragons don't - because they could do with something to make them visually different from regular dragons like the other breeding groups. You might not think drakes 'need' this but I have already answered why I think it'd make them better. I do not know why everyone is acting as if I am demanding Tj change his lore to make drakes more sparkly, I'm merely suggesting something, if Tj saw this and decided the cons outweigh the pros then that's entirely fair. But that's why I'm not particularly caring if people personally dislike items, it's up to Tj and if he thinks it's worth it.

 

What valid concerns are there I've missed? I have addressed things like how would they be domesticated if born in cave, or does having a prop mean every species of the breed would have exactly the same purpose. I'm NOT addressing 'I don't like props/I think drakes are fine the way they are' because those are opinions, not problems with the suggestion. I'll answer actual issues with the suggestion, not just 'should this suggestion exist' because that's up to tj to decide.

 

 

 

 

Edited February 20, 2021 by Murkydepths

[Murkydepths]

40 minutes ago, DragonLady86 said:

Except its not more options. props = a handicap because you have to have lore reasons for that prop.

 

and 5-10 people is about all you will EVER see on a Suggestions thread.  Not everyone comes to the forums and only a few of those come here. So you will NEVER have a way to judge the "playerbase" opinions.

 

Change for the sake of change is not a good reason. I actually support quite a few suggestions even if I'd never use them. but they need an actual reason for that change. This suggestion does not contain an actual reason. and repeating yourself instead of addressing the actual counter-arguments does not create reasons.

 

 

 

Props are not required. You have the option to add a prop, if you like. It's no handicap. 

 

And this is not change for the sake of change, it's change for the sake of making drakes more visually different from regular dragons to bring them in line with the other breeding groups, hopefully expand the amount of drake concepts as they have more options, and add a new form of lore or concept to the world of dc. You can disagree with the conclusion, but I've made it pretty obvious my reasons behind suggesting it.

[Fuzzbucket]

6 minutes ago, Murkydepths said:

 

Yes it is going in circles, because I've already answered why drakes should have props while other dragons don't - because they could do with something to make them visually different from regular dragons like the other breeding groups. You might not think drakes 'need' this but I have already answered why I think it'd make them better. I do not know why everyone is acting as if I am demanding Tj change his lore to make drakes more sparkly, I'm merely suggesting something, if Tj saw this and decided the cons outweigh the pros then

 

Why you think they should. Not quite the same thing as why they actually should.

 

I wish @TJ09 would come in here....

[Murkydepths]

Just now, Fuzzbucket said:

 

Why you think they should. Not quite the same thing as why they actually should.

 

I wish @TJ09 would come in here....

 

Yes. Suggestions are subjective like everything else is. Can we talk about the actual suggestion, since Tj is the one who decided if a suggestion is worthy or not?

[purplehaze]

I am totally neutral on this suggestion. I like drakes and wish we had more of them. I am not horrified by the idea of change.

 

But I fail to see the logic of your argument. Drakes need something to make them different from other breeding groups. Enter props, which only they would have, so they are different. But props are optional. So drakes are not inherently any more different than they have always been.

[Fuzzbucket]

That's a very valid point, actually.

 

But @Murkydepths - just as you feel no-one has given a good reason why not, you haven't actually given a good reason WHY. Just that you want it because CUTE, and that it would make you value drakes more. But that doesn't seem to apply to most posters in this thread - even those who quite like the idea don't see it as making drakes more appealing as such, just as a bit of fun and so why just drakes ?

 

Why don't you flesh out a  drake concept with a prop, put it up there and see if it flies. The proof of the pudding and all that... It's the only real way to find out. If it's rejected for prop reasons - then you know. If people like it or don't like it - you'll know how well it would go down.

 

I think the phrase is "put your money where your mouth is."

[Murkydepths]

It's about giving drakes a visual difference, it doesn't necessarily have to be props, but that'd the thing I found the biggest potential. I'd love to hear if people who would like drakes to have a visual difference that's unique to them have any suggestions. Because all their features have already been seen on regular dragons, they can't have something on every Drake without changing old designs of dragons or drakes. But the option would be there. 

 

And I have enough sprites to work on without designing a really good prop-drake concept, where the item would be integral to the concept of the drake, for it to then get rejected. If Tj did allow props I would make some, but for now I stick to regular drakes. 

Edited February 20, 2021 by Murkydepths

[schenanigans]

Okay but what you've ignored for the most part is the fact that there are already dragons with props so therefore that immediately makes this moot and drakes won't be "unique" in this regard. I guess you addressed it when you said you felt it was "outdated"?? But I don't feel that to be a good argument and pointed out that's pretty much just your perception lol. It's literally the same argument you're providing that drakes need to be different because they already share antlers/long leathery wing membranes that some regular dragons have. And, another point that was brought up a few times by myself and some others in this thread, there isn't any reason to give drakes items and deny that to regular/2 head/pygmy dragons other than "because drake." 

 

I have to agree with purplehaze that this doesn't feel like this would make them more special. 

 

The way I view dragons vs drakes is similar to how I view wolves vs dogs. They have many similarities, with some dogs still replicating wolf like appearance and coat color. There is not as much of a drastic visual appearance in drakes vs dragons and they make up for it in the lore and written aspect of them. This helps with world building, and provides depth. 

 

 I am NOT opposed to making drakes more unique, but seeing as old ones are very unlikely to be updated, I just don't see anything drastic happening. And I'm also totally okay with that ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ I'll add that I'm actually pretty against man made items or something with human influence for personal reasons as it ruins the immersion for me and how I like to view the game. So I'd actually probably collect drakes even less if that became a thing. 

Edited February 20, 2021 by schenanigans

[HeatherMarie]

1 hour ago, purplehaze said:

I am totally neutral on this suggestion. I like drakes and wish we had more of them. I am not horrified by the idea of change.

 

But I fail to see the logic of your argument. Drakes need something to make them different from other breeding groups. Enter props, which only they would have, so they are different. But props are optional. So drakes are not inherently any more different than they have always been.

 

This is a good, concise summary of a basic issue with this idea. 

 

The whole idea, as OP has said many times, is to make drakes more 'visually different'. Gives drakes more of a visual difference than the differences they already have because the current differences are also shared by some non-drakes. ..... And yet props would be optional, would require people actually making/spriting new drakes with props, and wouldn't affect all the drakes we currently have in-cave. So it *wouldn't* actually make drakes as a whole any more visually different/special/etc. Just maybe a couple future concepts of new drakes. This wouldn't actually change anything about the drake *group*, plus it relies on other people actually making these new concepts to begin with. 

 

It seems there is a disconnect between the suggestion itself and what the OP seems to want for drakes-in-general. The OP wants drakes to be more visually different, something to set them apart and make them special, but this wouldn't actually accomplish that at all unless it was retroactive to all current in-cave drakes. 

[Murkydepths]

5 minutes ago, HeatherMarie said:

 

This is a good, concise summary of a basic issue with this idea. 

 

The whole idea, as OP has said many times, is to make drakes more 'visually different'. Gives drakes more of a visual difference than the differences they already have because the current differences are also shared by some non-drakes. ..... And yet props would be optional, would require people actually making/spriting new drakes with props, and wouldn't affect all the drakes we currently have in-cave. So it *wouldn't* actually make drakes as a whole any more visually different/special/etc. Just maybe a couple future concepts of new drakes. This wouldn't actually change anything about the drake *group*, plus it relies on other people actually making these new concepts to begin with. 

 

It seems there is a disconnect between the suggestion itself and what the OP seems to want for drakes-in-general. The OP wants drakes to be more visually different, something to set them apart and make them special, but this wouldn't actually accomplish that at all unless it was retroactive to all current in-cave drakes. 

 

Well, I'm kind of working with what we have. All of drakes biggest traits are seen on regular dragons, and I have a feeling suggesting we re-classify dragons with antlers as drakes would go pretty terribly nor would I want that. Same thing with removing the props from old dragons. If you view the drakes not having a visual difference as a problem, there'd not going to be an actual fix. But I do think they could be patched so they at least have the potential to have unique visual traits. 

[DragonLady86]

8 hours ago, Murkydepths said:

 

Props are not required. You have the option to add a prop, if you like. It's no handicap. 

 

And this is not change for the sake of change.

I said it is a handicap if you add a prop. You can't both say but its optional and say it doesn't require more work. Because it very much does require more work.

 

Yes it is. As long as 1. Other non-drakes have props and 2. Not all drakes do it literally changes nothing about them being different/having something else no one else does. None if the older sprites are likely to change even if the extremely unlikely event of this being added to the cave, thus you are right back where we are now: Some drakes have some features seen on other dragons. Unless and until you can counter this argument, there is zero reason for this suggestion. Because it actually does not make them unique. It does not accomplish what you want it to do.

Edited February 21, 2021 by DragonLady86

[High Lord November]

At the end of the day, I don't see anything that we could apply to drakes that would make them all very obviously visually different from dragons (on the scale of pygmys vs dragons, two-head vs dragons). I don't think it's possible, and I don't see it as needed - species don't need to look drastically different to be different.

 

To get more drakes into the cave, people should be encouraged to make them - but I don't think props will be the thing that makes people go "I want to make a drake because I can add props", especially not significantly enough to increase interest in the long run.

 

If you want props on some drakes, because you want to bring domestication to Dragon Cave, you could make a request and see how it turns out. I don't think it works as a general rule just universally applied to drakes.

[Murkydepths]

Y'all are just circling back again. I already said why we couldn't 'fix' the problem of drakes never being able to be completely unique from regular dragons, it'd require altering in cave dragons, but that I think the option to have uniqueness would be good. It'd be more than they have right now, doesn't have to be all-or-nothing.

Edited February 21, 2021 by Murkydepths

[High Lord November]

So all you're asking is if you have a specific concept that involves domestication, could you possibly add props/items to the sprite? That would be more of a concept specific question. I don't see it adding anything to the drake group as a whole, just some individual concepts... So if you want one, maybe make a DR and see what feedback comes out, unless TJ is willing to comment on it in this thread specifically. 

Edited February 21, 2021 by High Lord November

[DragonLady86]

@Murkydepths I'm pretty sure, you are the one thats circling. You continue to repeat the same argument over and over dispite multiple flaws being pointed out. A convincing argument provides evidence that supports it, not just repeating the same opinion as a counter everytime.

 

I can just about guarantee this suggestion will never happen. However, if what you want is closer to what High Lord November suggested and you want to make a case for an exception (singular) then design that drake and pm TJ to see if he'd allow it.

 

Honestly, I'm out. This discussion has become pointless to me. If for some reason this happens great. If it doesn't, well 😕

[TJ09]

There is no "rule" against props on sprites, but it is listed as something to avoid. If you want to submit a drake that is holding something then...submit a drake that is holding something. As others have mentioned, it's not something that makes sense to handle in any way other than on a case-by-case basis.