American Politics

[purpledragonclaw]

It's already time for The Onion to repost this timeless article, sadly.

[StormBirdRising]

9 hours ago, Kaini said:

There was an armed security guard, a 'good guy with a gun'. He heroically tried to stop the shooter and even shot him accurately, but was stopped by the shooter's tactical gear/bulletproof vest. He was shot and killed.

 

The good guy with a gun did not stop him. Even when the 'good guy' was a trained security guard and former police officer. He tried to stop this kid and died, and the kid went on to shoot more people.

 

SAY HIS NAME 

 

The security guard who saved many lives by alerting people in the store was AARON SALTER JR.  He is the hero.   He shot an ADULT criminal killer who was shooting and killing people.  AARON SALTER did nothing wrong.  He was the hero.  He gave his life to save other people. He did everything he could.  He is the man of honor.   He is the hero. 

 

 

Edited May 16, 2022 by StormBirdRising

[Marcus Pheonix]

Situations like this could be avoided by removing all guns. It's worked in so many other countries, ones that have had an extensive love of guns on par with america.

 

I didn't even hear about this latest shooting given that there are so many other important political things happening in America at the moment.

[Fuzzbucket]

8 hours ago, Marcus Pheonix said:

Situations like this could be avoided by removing all guns. It's worked in so many other countries, ones that have had an extensive love of guns on par with america.

 

 

AMEN to that.

[purplehaze]

9 hours ago, StormBirdRising said:

AARON SALTER did nothing wrong.  He was the hero.  He gave his life to save other people. He did everything he could.  He is the man of honor.   He is the hero. 

I don't think anyone is saying he did anything wrong. He undoubtedly did save lives. He is a hero. He did all he could!

But the point was that the "good guy with a gun" is not the real answer to all the bad guys with guns.

 

This was a very bloody weekend in the US! Shooter in a supermarket in NY. Shooter/s at a flea market in Texas. Shooter at a church in California. And it just goes on. Not just the mass shootings, but the everyday shootings of one or more people every day in cities like Baltimore and Chicago. When and how does it end? More guns are not the answer!

[Lagie]

9 minutes ago, purplehaze said:

When and how does it end? More guns are not the answer!

Good question.

 

We're having gun issues on our streets too, usually single-shooter drive-bys, and often gang-related or retaliatory (let a suspected murderer out on bail and you can pretty much guarantee he'll be dead by drive-by before his court date).

[Astreya]

11 hours ago, StormBirdRising said:

The security guard who saved many lives by alerting people in the store was AARON SALTER JR.  He is the hero.   He shot an ADULT criminal killer who was shooting and killing people.  AARON SALTER did nothing wrong.  He was the hero.  He gave his life to save other people. He did everything he could.  He is the man of honor.   He is the hero.

Yes, I agree - Aaron Salter jr. is a hero. But unfortunately he's dead, too. He likely could still live if that criminal racist wouldn't have gotten his hands on a juiced-up gun.

 

If there were less guns freely available in the US, I'd wager there would be much fewer deaths by guns, too.

 

For comparison:

In the US, there were 12.21 gun deaths per 100 000 people in 2017 with an average of 120 guns per 100 inhabitants.

In the UK, there were 0.2 gun deaths per 100 000 people in 2015 with an average of 2.8 guns per 100 inhabitants.

In Japan, there were 0.02 gun deaths per 100 000 people in 2015 with an average of 0.6 guns per 100 inhabitants.

 

What astonished me is that we have quite a lot of guns in Germany, too - but then, they are strongly regulated, so we get that

in Germany, there were 1.04 gun deaths per 100 000 people in 2015 with an average of 32 guns per 100 inhabitants (in 2016).

Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_firearm-related_death_rate

 

 

[Long_Before_Sunrise]

People are saying if Sandy Hook wasn't the tipping point for stricter gun regulations, then there isn't one.

 

The parents of Sandy Hook victims won their lawsuits against Remington and Alex Jones, not that it seems to make a difference. The childhood survivors of Sandy Hook are old enough to have driver's licenses now.

[Fuzzbucket]

12 hours ago, purplehaze said:

 

But the point was that the "good guy with a gun" is not the real answer to all the bad guys with guns.

 

This, so very very much.

[purpledragonclaw]

The Onion has officially posted their updated article. 

 

After Sandy Hook I knew we wouldn't change gun regulations. Dead kids are an acceptable trade-off for firearms access. The truly galling thing is many who want unlimited firearm access are from the "pro-life" crowd. 

 

By the way, the "bad guy with a gun" quote came about directly after the Sandy Hook shooting, it was the NRA's response to it. Parkland also had a "good guy with a gun" who did nothing.

[purplehaze]

1 hour ago, purpledragonclaw said:

The truly galling thing is many who want unlimited firearm access are from the "pro-life" crowd. 

Which, along with many other things, shows them not at all to be pro-life. More "pro-birth" as they want nothing to do with supporting the child after the mother is forced to birth it. So-called "pro-life" states spend the least on services and support for families with children, including less on education.

[StormBirdRising]

On 5/16/2022 at 11:10 AM, purplehaze said:

I don't think anyone is saying he did anything wrong. He undoubtedly did save lives. He is a hero. He did all he could!

But the point was that the "good guy with a gun" is not the real answer to all the bad guys with guns.

 

 

Yes, I understand what is being said, but it is not right to use the victims for the political agenda.  No one has the sympathies or the compassions for the people killed,  just always jumping on the bandwagon to get their point across.  It is very cold.  I don't even discuss these gun issues anymore,  good guy,  bad guy thing.  I just have sympathies for everyone that was killed. 

 

I didn't want to start arguments I just wanted everyone to know who he was and that he did not shoot a kid.

Edited May 20, 2022 by StormBirdRising
to add something

[Astreya]

@StormBirdRising

In my eyes the big problem is that in the US there are always so many victims and it never ends - wouldn't it be more sensible to ask what one can do to make sure that there aren't as many gunshot victims in the first place for whom one needs to feel compassion?

[purplehaze]

4 hours ago, StormBirdRising said:

Yes, I understand what is being said, but it is not right to use the victims for the political agenda.  No one has the sympathies or the compassions for the people killed,  just always jumping on the bandwagon to get their point across.  It is very cold.  I don't even discuss these gun issues anymore,  good guy,  bad guy thing.  I just have sympathies for everyone that was killed. 

I do have sympathy for the people being killed. And their families, and friends, and communities. And that is why I want to see something done to stop this sort of slaughter!

Sympathy won't bring them back, or stop the next round of killing. We have had a record number of gun deaths in this country. Since the onset of the CoVid 19 pandemic there were record numbers of gun purchases! More guns are not going to improve that situation. I don't think it is cold at all to try to find solutions! Colder indeed to just opt for the status quo and say " Oh, I am so sorry!"

 

 

Edited May 20, 2022 by purplehaze

[trystan]

so the amendment says the right should not be abridged, doesn't say anything about common-sense regulation however.

when the constitution was written, i don't think the founders could have even imagined automatic and semi-automatic weapons. i mean, what on earth do we need those weapons for anyway?

i'm for people wanting some kind of firearm for self-defense and hunting, and those guns should be licensed like a car, and you should need to take a test and prove that you can operate it safely before being granted that licence. 

and yes, i support background checks.... and references.  heck, you need references when adopting cats from a shelter.

and - better access to mental health services also.  and that's something else that should be maintained and well-staffed, not ridiculed and #1 on budget cut lists.

if that makes me an idealist, so be it.

[purplehaze]

I just came from the grocery store where some man was spouting a diatribe about Biden and his cabal in Ukraine of pedophiles and how that is why we are supporting Ukraine in the war. When asked if he really believed that he said it was absolutely true because he had "researched" it. Yeah. I'm sure he could find some crazy internet site to "prove" it.

[trystan]

that sounds like some QAnon cr@p right there!

[StormBirdRising]

On 5/16/2022 at 11:21 AM, Lagie said:

Good question.

 

We're having gun issues on our streets too, usually single-shooter drive-bys, and often gang-related or retaliatory (let a suspected murderer out on bail and you can pretty much guarantee he'll be dead by drive-by before his court date).

 

I didn't think you could be having these kind of gun problems in the Bahamas.  I haven't been there for a while but it seemed so safe and everyone seemed so friendly.  I am so sorry this is happening in your country.  I hope you are staying safe.  

[Lagie]

2 hours ago, StormBirdRising said:

I didn't think you could be having these kind of gun problems in the Bahamas.  I haven't been there for a while but it seemed so safe and everyone seemed so friendly.  I am so sorry this is happening in your country.  I hope you are staying safe.  

Back in the 80s we were a drug snuggling haven. The guns arrived then and continue to do so. The shootings seldom affect the tourists as they (the shootings) usually happen in the poorer areas of the island. I live closer to one of those than I first realized so I do sometimes hear gunshots at night. I do my best to stay safe! Thanks. (If you come again, maybe we can meet up! )

[StormBirdRising]

On 5/16/2022 at 12:27 PM, Astreya said:

 

For comparison:

In the US, there were 12.21 gun deaths per 100 000 people in 2017 with an average of 120 guns per 100 inhabitants.

In the UK, there were 0.2 gun deaths per 100 000 people in 2015 with an average of 2.8 guns per 100 inhabitants.

In Japan, there were 0.02 gun deaths per 100 000 people in 2015 with an average of 0.6 guns per 100 inhabitants.

 

 

 

 

Thank you for the statistics..  Here is the latest one that I can find...   It is for so far this year,  so from January 2022 to May 2022.  

It is very sad and shocking.  

https://www.gunviolencearchive.org/

Edited May 23, 2022 by StormBirdRising

[Astreya]

@StormBirdRising

Thank you for digging out the current US stats - I took a screenshot of today's numbers as I had to dig out a US proxy to access the site which I only use for such cases:

Spoiler

https://i.postimg.cc/qvM011sz/gunvio-20220523.png

I particularly shocked to see the number of killed children age 0-11 years and teens age 12-17! 

[Fuzzbucket]

And yet another school shooting today. How is it OK for an 18 y/o high school student to have access to guns ?

[Astreya]

Here's an article about it:

"Fourteen students and one teacher killed in Texas school shooting, governor says":

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/may/24/texas-school-shooting-uvalde-robb-elementary

 

Well, well. Time to pray again, eh?

[trystan]

let me put this in as nice a way to say this.... Greg Abbot is a !@#$%^&* !@#$%^&* idiot.

[purplehaze]

Quoting from that article that Astreya posted:

Quote

The Republican [Abbott] continued: “Our job is … first, to make sure we address exactly what happened in this crime scene. And second to make sure we take that information and do everything that is necessary to ensure that crime scenes like this are not going to be repeated in the future. And then we’re going to be able to ensure the safety and security of our schools.”

Online, Shannon Watts, the founder of Moms Demand Action, a group which campaigns for gun control reform, wrote: “Fervently lifting Uvalde up in prayer while refusing to do a goddamned thing to stop gun violence is why this keeps happening, especially in Texas.”

So sad. And so true. What would it take to get some sort of meaningful action from the gun-loving, 2nd amendment quoting officials?

It just goes on and on with no end in sight! No number of deaths seems to be too many for them to justify!

Edited May 24, 2022 by purplehaze