Coronavirus Discussion

[purplehaze]

I liked this letter-to-the-editor of the Baltimore Sun about mask wearing - excerpt below, full letter in link:

The choice to wear or not wear a mask says something about one’s definition of self and how it has or has not evolved. Because the mask primarily, if not solely, provides some protection for others getting the virus from the mask wearer, the choice to go maskless is a statement of ego. It says: “My ‘freedom’ is more important than your health.”

Those individuals have not evolved beyond self-centeredness and self-protection. In normal self-development, however, one learns that we are not separate egos; we are deeply connected. There is no distinction between my well-being and yours. Therefore, an evolved person is strongly motivated by empathy, kindness and caring for others. Wearing a mask is a small sacrifice to make for the benefit of others.

https://www.baltimoresun.com/opinion/readers-respond/bs-ed-rr-mask-freedom-letter-20200513-q4pikgal5jeylcf5otcjmz62ja-story.html

[trystan]

23 minutes ago, purplehaze said:

I liked this letter-to-the-editor of the Baltimore Sun about mask wearing - excerpt below, full letter in link:

The choice to wear or not wear a mask says something about one’s definition of self and how it has or has not evolved. Because the mask primarily, if not solely, provides some protection for others getting the virus from the mask wearer, the choice to go maskless is a statement of ego. It says: “My ‘freedom’ is more important than your health.”

Those individuals have not evolved beyond self-centeredness and self-protection. In normal self-development, however, one learns that we are not separate egos; we are deeply connected. There is no distinction between my well-being and yours. Therefore, an evolved person is strongly motivated by empathy, kindness and caring for others. Wearing a mask is a small sacrifice to make for the benefit of others.

https://www.baltimoresun.com/opinion/readers-respond/bs-ed-rr-mask-freedom-letter-20200513-q4pikgal5jeylcf5otcjmz62ja-story.html

*nods head in vigorous agreement*  makes a lot of sense to me!

[purpledragonclaw]

2 hours ago, purplehaze said:

I liked this letter-to-the-editor of the Baltimore Sun about mask wearing - excerpt below, full letter in link:

The choice to wear or not wear a mask says something about one’s definition of self and how it has or has not evolved. Because the mask primarily, if not solely, provides some protection for others getting the virus from the mask wearer, the choice to go maskless is a statement of ego. It says: “My ‘freedom’ is more important than your health.”

Those individuals have not evolved beyond self-centeredness and self-protection. In normal self-development, however, one learns that we are not separate egos; we are deeply connected. There is no distinction between my well-being and yours. Therefore, an evolved person is strongly motivated by empathy, kindness and caring for others. Wearing a mask is a small sacrifice to make for the benefit of others.

https://www.baltimoresun.com/opinion/readers-respond/bs-ed-rr-mask-freedom-letter-20200513-q4pikgal5jeylcf5otcjmz62ja-story.html

 

First of all, I love that news outlet. Secondly, that is spot-on. This mindset ties in to a great opinion piece I read in 2017 (I dislike using The Huffington Post as a source, but it was so good I'm breaking that rule here) called I Don't Know How To Explain To You That You Should Care About Other People. What we're seeing here with how some are dealing with the coronavirus is a good reminder that many have not left this mindset that started being apparent years ago. 

Edited May 16, 2020 by purpledragonclaw
missed a word

[purplehaze]

39 minutes ago, purpledragonclaw said:

This mindset ties in to a great opinion piece I read in 2017 (I dislike using The Huffington Post as a source, but it was so good I'm breaking that rule here) called I Don't Know How To Explain To You That You Should Care About Other People. What we're seeing here with how some are dealing with the coronavirus is a good reminder that many have not left this mindset that started being apparent years ago. 

Wow! Thanks for linking that. Sadly it does describe all too well what is going on now.

[JaneMcAsh]

2 hours ago, AngelsSin said:

All I could think was Fox News rots your brains kids.

AMEN! (& I'm probably in your mom's age group!)

 

I can't be the only one seeing a conflict between the "my freedom allows me to do anything I want" group and the Golden Rule - Do unto others as you would have them do unto you. A command based on words of Jesus in the Sermon on the Mount: “All things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them.” The Mosaic law contains a parallel commandment: “Whatever is hurtful to you, do not do to any other person.” 

Edited May 16, 2020 by JaneMcAsh

[Fuzzbucket]

6 hours ago, purplehaze said:

I liked this letter-to-the-editor of the Baltimore Sun about mask wearing - excerpt below, full letter in link:

The choice to wear or not wear a mask says something about one’s definition of self and how it has or has not evolved. Because the mask primarily, if not solely, provides some protection for others getting the virus from the mask wearer, the choice to go maskless is a statement of ego. It says: “My ‘freedom’ is more important than your health.”

Those individuals have not evolved beyond self-centeredness and self-protection. In normal self-development, however, one learns that we are not separate egos; we are deeply connected. There is no distinction between my well-being and yours. Therefore, an evolved person is strongly motivated by empathy, kindness and caring for others. Wearing a mask is a small sacrifice to make for the benefit of others.

https://www.baltimoresun.com/opinion/readers-respond/bs-ed-rr-mask-freedom-letter-20200513-q4pikgal5jeylcf5otcjmz62ja-story.html

 

That's wonderful. Gives you hope for human nature.

 

3 hours ago, AngelsSin said:

Today my mom said for the first time she is starting to doubt that it (Covid) is as serious as they have been saying and trashing Dr. Fauci. Saying I shouldn't be listening to what he says. This is what happens when you let Trump and his minions run their mouths. I don't know how you get 90,000 people in the U.S. alone have died from it, but sure it's not so bad (sarcasm for those who didn't pick up on it).

I mean how do you even reason with someone who can't be reasoned with? My mom has worked in the medical field for decades my grandma and grandfather too. She should know better. All I could think was Fox News rots your brains kids.

 

1 hour ago, JaneMcAsh said:

AMEN! (& I'm probably in your mom's age group!)

 

I can't be the only one seeing a conflict between the "my freedom allows me to do anything I want" group and the Golden Rule - Do unto others as you would have them do unto you. A command based on words of Jesus in the Sermon on the Mount: “All things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them.” The Mosaic law contains a parallel commandment: “Whatever is hurtful to you, do not do to any other person.” 

 

Couldn't agree more. (I'm in that age group too.) Do as you would be done by. You want the staff in stores to wear mask to keep YOU safe - wear one yourself to protect them. Simples.

[Quinney]

Very few wearing masks in my area. I did see a few more when I had to go to the town market after work yesterday but although the bus is getting a little busier now, I'm more often than not the only one wearing one. Strangely, no one will look at me either.  And it's like the lockdown never happened for most part.

[Fuzzbucket]

I bet you still have to queue at Tesco ? Those queues move AMAZINGLY fast though. The only thing that slows me down now is the one-way system - you keep having to walk all the way up the biscuits to be able to go down to the crispbreads you wanted and so on.

[Astreya]

Daily update for Oberhausen, NRW, Germany:

 

As of today, Saturday, May 15, 09:00 GMT+2,  my home town (population 211 000) has 50 active cases, while 197 people have recovered. All in all there have been 253 people who suffered from Covid-19 since the beginning of the pandemic.

The number of newly infected people per 100 000 citizens in the last 7 days is 6.2.

 

Currently 8 persons are treated in hospitals, no one of them in intensive care. 6 persons sadly died. 249 persons are currently quarantined. All in all there have been 8319 Covid-19 tests in Oberhausen so far. There are further structured tests in care home, but fortunately so far there were no new cases in such.

 

Source: https://www.oberhausen.de/de/index/rathaus/verwaltung/umwelt-gesundheit-und-mobilitat/gesundheit/aktuelle_informationen/informationen_zum_coronavirus/aktuelle_meldungen.php

 

When I was shopping for food and stuff yesterday, everybody who went into Aldi, Edeka and dm really wore a face mask here. I was positively surprised. Plus people really held their distance. Dunno if we're an outlier, but it seem people are still astonishingly disciplined

 

By the way, I have seen such an experiment conducted by a German popular science program recently and it gave pretty much the same result as this English language version:

 

 

Here's the German language experiment:

 

Edited May 16, 2020 by Astreya
I hate typos, really!

[Quinney]

1 hour ago, Fuzzbucket said:

I bet you still have to queue at Tesco ? Those queues move AMAZINGLY fast though. The only thing that slows me down now is the one-way system - you keep having to walk all the way up the biscuits to be able to go down to the crispbreads you wanted and so on.

I've been a coward and asked my eldest daughter to do most of my shopping. My problem is that I don't drive and it's a Sunday service. That's four busses an hour and I can't gauge to be at the stop for one because of queues at the shops. It's okay if I don't have anything heavy to walk home with but household stuff, milk and veg - I need help there so daughter gets a phone message! She wasn't pleased last time - 90 minutes for what should have taken her 10, she told me. 

 

Anyway, two more weeks and I'll be working at my local police station. I intend to take a shopper on wheels to keep there as it's halfway between me and the high street, so I should get on better then.

[trystan]

11 hours ago, JaneMcAsh said:

14 hours ago, AngelsSin said:

All I could think was Fox News rots your brains kids.

AMEN! (& I'm probably in your mom's age group!)

my mom is 74. i haven't asked her what she thinks about Fox News, but it's probably about the same thing she thinks of trump, which is a big "nope!"  i have a smart mom.

 

  

11 hours ago, JaneMcAsh said:

I can't be the only one seeing a conflict between the "my freedom allows me to do anything I want" group and the Golden Rule - Do unto others as you would have them do unto you. A command based on words of Jesus in the Sermon on the Mount: “All things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them.” The Mosaic law contains a parallel commandment: “Whatever is hurtful to you, do not do to any other person.” 

this.  and another one: "An it harm none, do what ye will" (emphasis mine, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wiccan_Rede).

and two from Judaism:  "You shall not take vengeance or bear a grudge against your kinsfolk. Love your neighbor as yourself" and "What is hateful to you, do not do to your fellow" (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Golden_Rule)

 

Edited May 16, 2020 by trystan
to add info

[Astreya]

Quote

'Weird as hell’: the Covid-19 patients who have symptoms for months - Researchers keen to work out why some people are suffering from ‘long tail’ form of the virus

 

In mid-March Paul Garner developed what he thought was a “bit of a cough”. A professor of infectious diseases, Garner was discussing the new coronavirus with David Nabarro, the UK’s special envoy on the pandemic. At the end of the Zoom call, Nabarro advised Garner to go home immediately and to self-isolate. Garner did. He felt no more than a “little bit off”.

 

Days later, he found himself fighting a raging infection. It’s one he likens to being “abused by somebody” or clubbed over the head with a cricket bat. “The symptoms were weird as hell,” he says. They included loss of smell, heaviness, malaise, tight chest and racing heart. At one point Garner thought he was about to die. He tried to Google “fulminating myocarditis” but was too unwell to navigate the screen.

 

There is growing evidence that the virus causes a far greater array of symptoms than was previously understood. And that its effects can be agonisingly prolonged: in Garner’s case for more than seven weeks. The professor at the Liverpool School of Tropical Medicine says his experience of Covid-19 featured a new and disturbing symptom every day, akin to an “advent calendar”.

 

He had a muggy head, upset stomach, tinnitus, pins and needles, breathlessness, dizziness and arthritis in the hands. Each time Garner thought he was getting better the illness roared back.

 

Full story: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/may/15/weird-hell-professor-advent-calendar-covid-19-symptoms-paul-garner

 

Edited May 16, 2020 by Astreya

[Classycal]

On 5/15/2020 at 10:22 PM, purplehaze said:

I liked this letter-to-the-editor of the Baltimore Sun about mask wearing - excerpt below, full letter in link:

The choice to wear or not wear a mask says something about one’s definition of self and how it has or has not evolved. Because the mask primarily, if not solely, provides some protection for others getting the virus from the mask wearer, the choice to go maskless is a statement of ego. It says: “My ‘freedom’ is more important than your health.”

Those individuals have not evolved beyond self-centeredness and self-protection. In normal self-development, however, one learns that we are not separate egos; we are deeply connected. There is no distinction between my well-being and yours. Therefore, an evolved person is strongly motivated by empathy, kindness and caring for others. Wearing a mask is a small sacrifice to make for the benefit of others.

https://www.baltimoresun.com/opinion/readers-respond/bs-ed-rr-mask-freedom-letter-20200513-q4pikgal5jeylcf5otcjmz62ja-story.html

I like this a lot.  Especially, "My 'freedom' is more important than your health."  That really is ego to the max.  Can't wait to see what SBR says about this letter to the editor.  

[Astreya]

Daily update for Oberhausen, NRW, Germany:

 

As of today, Sunday, May 17, 09:00 GMT+2,  my home town (population 211 000) has 32 active cases, while 215 people have recovered. All in all there have been 253 people who suffered from Covid-19 since the beginning of the pandemic.

The number of newly infected people per 100 000 citizens in the last 7 days is 5.2.

 

Currently 7 persons are treated in hospitals, no one of them in intensive care. 6 persons sadly died. 225 persons are currently quarantined. All in all there have been 8350 Covid-19 tests in Oberhausen so far. There are further structured tests in care home, but fortunately so far there were no new cases in such.

 

Source: https://www.oberhausen.de/de/index/rathaus/verwaltung/umwelt-gesundheit-und-mobilitat/gesundheit/aktuelle_informationen/informationen_zum_coronavirus/aktuelle_meldungen.php

[TerraAnne]

I'm just sitting here waiting for the second wave of cases to spike cause everything is opening back up again. There's no way in hell I'm coming out of quarantine until a vaccine is out since pretty much everyone in my family is compromised one way or another.

[Fuzzbucket]

I can't say I'm holding out for the vaccine, as that could take years. But I am NOT un-isolating for a good while yet. It would be madness.

 

I am ashamed of the UK here:

 

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/may/17/us-and-uk-lead-push-against-global-patent-pool-for-covid-19-drugs

 

The US is as bad.

 

Quote

 

While the US and China face off, the EU has taken the lead. The leaders of Italy, France, Germany and Norway, together with the European commission and council, called earlier this month for any innovative tools, therapeutics or vaccines to be shared equally and fairly.

“If we can develop a vaccine that is produced by the world, for the whole world, this will be a unique global public good of the 21st century,” they said in a statement

 

.

 

Quote

 

“The US, UK, Swiss and some others, pushed against the WHO taking the lead in pushing for open licensing of patents and knowhow for drugs and vaccines.

“In a global crisis like this, that has such a massive impact on everyone, you would expect the WHO governing body to have the backbone to say no monopolies in this pandemic. It’s one thing for a country to use its economic clout to buy preferential access to drugs or vaccines. It’s another to prevent others from manufacturing and expanding global supply.”

 

 

Quote

Countries with major pharmaceutical companies argue they need patents to guarantee sufficiently high prices in wealthy nations to recoup their research and development costs.

 

They make a shedload of money out of overpricing drugs,. At a time like this they should share their profits and help everyone. Do the decent thing.

Edited May 17, 2020 by Fuzzbucket

[olympe]

The thing is: These pharmaceutical companies get a lot of funding for covid-19 research - and then intend to sell the results of said paid research for the highest profit they can. It's disgusting, plain and simple.

[purplehaze]

2 hours ago, Fuzzbucket said:

“If we can develop a vaccine that is produced by the world, for the whole world, this will be a unique global public good of the 21st century,” they said in a statement

We can only dream. "America First" Trump is certainly not one who will co-operate. Actually it is more a case of "Trump First" Trump, since it all has to be about him.

[Fuzzbucket]

7 minutes ago, olympe said:

The thing is: These pharmaceutical companies get a lot of funding for covid-19 research - and then intend to sell the results of said paid research for the highest profit they can. It's disgusting, plain and simple.

 

Quite.

[trystan]

1 hour ago, olympe said:

The thing is: These pharmaceutical companies get a lot of funding for covid-19 research - and then intend to sell the results of said paid research for the highest profit they can. It's disgusting, plain and simple.

agree

  

1 hour ago, purplehaze said:

Actually it is more a case of "Trump First" Trump, since it all has to be about him.

unfortunately, this is correct.  this is also NOT presidential.....

 

my county numbers, these might be as of yesterday?

Total Confirmed Cases: 4,279

Recoveries: 1,216

Deaths: 368

 

Edited May 17, 2020 by trystan
so i didn't double-post

[purplehaze]

Latest figures from Maryland Department of Health:

Number of confirmed cases : 38,804
Number of negative test results : 156,122
Number of confirmed deaths : 1,876
Number of probable deaths : 116
Currently hospitalized : 1,460
Acute care : 898
Intensive care : 562
Ever hospitalized : 6,993
Released from isolation : 2,816

Sadly, over half of the deaths in the state (984) were nursing home residents

Those figures include, from my county:

2,856 confirmed cases

134 confirmed deaths

8 probable deaths (death certificate lists COVID-19 as the cause of death but not yet confirmed by a laboratory test)

 

It will be interesting to see how those figures change as we enter phase 1 of reopening. Right now the counties and Baltimore City are free to keep more restrictive measures in place, and many of them have, particularly the harder-hit areas..

It was terrifying to me to see on the news last night large crowds of maskless people swarming together.

 

Edited May 17, 2020 by purplehaze

[Astreya]

Daily update for Oberhausen, NRW, Germany:

 

As of today, Monday, May 18, 09:30 GMT+2,  my home town (population 211 000) has 28 active cases, while 219 people have recovered. All in all there have been 253 people who suffered from Covid-19 since the beginning of the pandemic.

The number of newly infected people per 100 000 citizens in the last 7 days is 4.3.

 

Currently 7 persons are treated in hospitals, no one of them in intensive care. 6 persons sadly died. 204 persons are currently quarantined. All in all there have been 8350 Covid-19 tests in Oberhausen so far. There are further structured tests in care home, but fortunately so far there were no new cases in such.

 

Source: https://www.oberhausen.de/de/index/rathaus/verwaltung/umwelt-gesundheit-und-mobilitat/gesundheit/aktuelle_informationen/informationen_zum_coronavirus/aktuelle_meldungen.php

 

 

Meanwhile on the other side of the Great Pond...

Quote

Lockdown protests may have spread virus widely, cellphone data suggests - Devices associated with protesters travelled up to hundreds of miles after rallies where few precautions were taken

 

Cellphone location data suggests that demonstrators at anti-lockdown protests – some of which have been connected with Covid-19 cases – are often traveling hundreds of miles to events, returning to all parts of their states, and even crossing into neighboring ones.

The data, provided to the Guardian by the progressive campaign group the Committee to Protect Medicare, raises the prospect that the protests will play a role in spreading the coronavirus epidemic to areas which have, so far, experienced relatively few infections.

Source:  https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/may/18/lockdown-protests-spread-coronavirus-cellphone-data

 

[Fuzzbucket]

Yeah - that's the same kind of reason that my  sparsely populated part of the UK has some of the highest rates in the country - tourism. Not least people escaping from London - where it was bad at the time - to holiday homes....

[Ruby Eyes]

I wish covid tests were as available (and reliable) as pregnancy tests are nowadays ...

 

[olympe]

That would be awesome.