Identical Twins

[Tehya Faye]

Even if influenced ???

You influence an egg. They share an egg. You can't influence just one of them.

 

Edit: Whoops, typo.

Edited September 17, 2014 by Tehya Faye

[Cinnamin Draconna]

Identical twins come from a single egg, which always means same gender.... and for our purposes, should also mean same breed. With that in mind, I'd say limit identical twin eggs to purebred eggs, to avoid the different breed problem altogether.

 

Fraternal twins come from two eggs fertilized at the same time, which can mean different genders.. and possibly different breeds in DC terms. BUT..... while I can support identical twins from a single egg as a rarity, fraternal twins are a whole other topic which is what the 'Bring back multi-cluthes' thread is for.

[JavaTigress]

This actually sounds really exciting. @_@ Now I'm wondering what would happen if you bit a twin egg. Would you be able to get a vampiric hatchling and a regular hatchling out of it? (I'm not asking for that, I'm just wildly speculating.)

 

FYI, I like this idea mainly for the description opportunities arising from it.

An excellent question. THOUGH I would SUSPECT that you would get vampire twins.

[Tehya Faye]

If twin eggs are fragile I think it'd make sense if all bite attempts resulted in a dead egg.

[Fuzzbucket]

You influence an egg. They share an egg. You can't influence just one of them.

 

Edit: Whoops, typo.

Oops. Good point !

[Tehya Faye]

Now, if they both had their own code even as an egg I could see being able to influence one side of the egg one way and the other side the other way (though I think the failure rate for that ought to be higher since it's a tricky job for the pinks), but that would spoil the surprise I think these are supposed to be.

Edited September 17, 2014 by Tehya Faye

[Nectaris]

Identical twins come from a single egg, which always means same gender.... and for our purposes, should also mean same breed. With that in mind, I'd say limit identical twin eggs to purebred eggs, to avoid the different breed problem altogether.

 

Fraternal twins come from two eggs fertilized at the same time, which can mean different genders.. and possibly different breeds in DC terms. BUT..... while I can support identical twins from a single egg as a rarity, fraternal twins are a whole other topic which is what the 'Bring back multi-cluthes' thread is for.

I don't think they need to be purebred. The twins should be of the species the egg is, since they are identical, no matter the breed of the parents. A man and woman, one with blue eyes, the other with brown, can still have identical twins with blue eyes. The one having brown eyes doesn't mean a thing, though I do realize that DC genetics are rather wonky.

[edwardelricfreak]

Yes please I think this is a really cool idea. c:

[DragonLady86]

Hmm, mostly neutral on this, though I do wonder where the second code would come from?

 

 

On the possibility of being locked when twins hatch, I don't see why they should be abandoned. It's not like you meant to go over. It's really more like reviving hatchlings. which can put you over the limit temporarily. (particularly at Halloween when they all revive instead of zombie-fying...grrr)

 

Of course, as most revived hatchies are out of time, you only have about 30 minutes to freeze, massive ER, or abandon them before they die again, so I suppose the 30 minutes to pick something to abandon would be about the same....but I don't think auto-ing one of them is very fair when there is no warning.

[Ruby Eyes]

I like the idea of twins. We probably don't need to discuss actual numbers if we just hypothetically align their rarity to those of Alts (Black and Dark Green, not Nebula Alts ) since we don't have exact numbers on those either.

 

However, auto-abandoning after hatching does not seem fair at all, since many dragons actually hatch during a player's absence. They would basically return a few hours later and not notice any difference because the twin is long gone ... where's the fun in that?

[Ha-Ki]

However, auto-abandoning after hatching does not seem fair at all, since many dragons actually hatch during a player's absence. They would basically return a few hours later and not notice any difference because the twin is long gone ... where's the fun in that?

Exactly... and with increased chances of death for twins, you might also return just to find two tombstones, which is why I am against this.

 

I'd like this idea if it was for a new dragon concept, where you'd at least expect that you might have to take extra care of the egg. But finding out a common egg from one of my breeding projects produced twins and they both died before I even noticed there were twins? I don't like that. And I also don't like a "feature" telling me how I have to hatch my dragons, because that's what it comes down to if they easly die in my absence with otherwise normal stats if they happen to be twins...

 

Still not very excited about this idea, sorry.

[olympe]

I wasn't thinking that these twins should die easily if you don't take special care of them from the first possible moment. What I suggested was

1. Let them need extremely high stats for hatching - and quite often more time than until they reach 4 days left. A big fat warning sign should be high stats and a big hole that stay for a day or longer without the hatchi(es) actually coming out of the egg.
2. Let the hatchlings be more prone to sickness. Since sickness only occurs when an egg/hatchie gets too many views/UVs too quickly, I don't really see it as that much of an issue - unless you get viewbombed.
3. Maybe make the twin hatchies need extra high stats or extra long to grow up, too.

So, as long as you're not too careless and know what you're doing and when to do it, your twins should be safe.

 

Vampire bites should be treated as usual: Either the embryo(s) in the egg get turned, or killed. Since it's not the egg that's more fragile, but the resulting hatchies (which must be smaller than single hatchies because they had only half the space of their egg available to grow), I don't think a bite should lead to auto-killings. I'm not even sure that one of the two hatchies might hatch normal while the other hatches as a vampire - it seems to me that the "venom" the vamp inserts into the egg would affect both babies the same way.

[Ruby Eyes]

So basically, have the twins (or their egg) behave like Prize or Avatar dragons, with regards to stats, sickness and maturing?

[olympe]

Maybe a little worse than that, but yes.

[edwardelricfreak]

ooh, I like them needing more/longer to hatch. I also like the idea of them being able to be either gender, since that *does* happen (though they technically won't be identical twins but fraternal ones, and even if they are fraternal they can look a lot alike). But since this is identical twins, maybe not gender? Because if you allow gender you'd need to allow things like one being alt or not, since fraternal twins can be very different.

Edited September 18, 2014 by edwardelricfreak

[olympe]

Yes, I'm aware of that. Which is why I asked for identical twins.

 

Worse: You breed a gold with a black dragon. The egg looks black, you abandon it - and the lucky catcher not only got an alt black out of the egg, but also a gold... That would be just too painful, and quite needless.

[edwardelricfreak]

Yes, I'm aware of that. Which is why I asked for identical twins.

 

Worse: You breed a gold with a black dragon. The egg looks black, you abandon it - and the lucky catcher not only got an alt black out of the egg, but also a gold... That would be just too painful, and quite needless.

Why would they get a Gold out of it? While I realize fraternal twins COULD be *that* different, I think we would limit them to only being the same type as the egg they come out of. So, that user would have the possibility of one alting and the other being regular, but no chance of getting a Gold.

[GhostMouse]

ooh, I like them needing more/longer to hatch. I also like the idea of them being able to be either gender, since that *does* happen (though they technically won't be identical twins but fraternal ones, and even if they are fraternal they can look a lot alike). But since this is identical twins, maybe not gender? Because if you allow gender you'd need to allow things like one being alt or not, since fraternal twins can be very different.

If they're coming out of the same egg, they would have to be identical. Fraternal twins are caused by two eggs getting fertilized at the same time, like our current multi-clutches. Identical twins happen when one egg is fertilized but splits in the womb (in this case, splits in the shell, assuming it works the same way for egg-layers as it does for live-bearers).

 

With reptiles, and our dragons, sex is determined by temperature (based on what we know about Pinks and the way Influence works). Since both dragon fetuses would be exposed to the same temperatures by being in the same egg, they shouldn't be able to come out different sexes.

 

So I say no to being able to get different breeds/alts/sexes/etc from a single egg. They should be truly identical. But I think this is a neat idea and it would be a cool thing to see pop up every once in a while.

 

I'm okay with CBs being able to "twin", as long as "event" breeds (CB prizes/holidays/GoNs) can't, but I wouldn't mind if only bred eggs could "twin."

[edwardelricfreak]

Oh, that's true, I totally forgot about that. o: *was only thinking of human fraternal twins, derp*

 

Would like to see multi-clutching come back in some form, then, but really probably only through a BSA.

Edited September 18, 2014 by edwardelricfreak

[zaverxi]

I like this idea, although the similar codes would be a lot of work to code since it's randomized. That's adding more work to TJ, which would make the odds of this being approved slim to none.

 

I also don't think it should apply to CBs, because like it was mentioned, that'd leave it up to the possibility for twin prizes or twin holidays/other exclusive dragons. Bred eggs only.

 

Also, no visual difference/special message to the egg. That would allow people to extort nice things out of people.

 

I like the idea of twins being more sickly, although the idea of them taking LONGER to hatch wouldn't make sense. Most twins are premature, being born a few months early, which explains their general weakness. So having an egg hatch at 5 days but staying sick as hatchlings until they grow up would be realistic. It'd require people to care for the hatchlings to make sure they don't die, constantly fogging them and unfogging them to get views. Sure, it's more work, but you get a free dragon out of the bargain! One to keep, one to trade? Or trade both and let someone else deal with it heh.

 

Same species and same gender, please. Most people use influence on eggs anyway, unless they don't care at all. But yes, have them be identical twins, exactly to the alt color and species.

[olympe]

If they're coming out of the same egg, they would have to be identical. Fraternal twins are caused by two eggs getting fertilized at the same time, like our current multi-clutches. Identical twins happen when one egg is fertilized but splits in the womb (in this case, splits in the shell, assuming it works the same way for egg-layers as it does for live-bearers).

Actually, that's not necessarily true. At least in birds, it sometimes happens that two yolks get put into one egg. When I did a little search ("twin eggs") on Youtube, I found one vid of twin chicken hatching from one egg. Well, actually they were helped out of their egg. The comments by the owner of the two chicken state that one of them turned out to be a hen, while the other was a rooster. So, definitely not identical.

 

However, as this doesn't have to have any bearing on DC, I'd suggest to go for the simplest way possible to implement this: Identical twins - no drama about someone else getting something rare from your AP'ed metal fail egg or anything like that.

[DragonLove234]

Very interesting idea. I personally agree with the identical twins being the same sex, breed, and having to be bred, not CB. This could become very popular and people would be breeding/catching more dragons, potentially wiping the AP of lowish-time eggs useful to some gifters, traders, and newbies as a con although more hatchies may appear from failed twin attempts. What would happen if one of the twins were frozen, would the other freeze or would it mature? (Probably mature although most identical twins stay together) The eggs having longer to hatch and needing more views will actually give away the fact of them being twins, thus people will want to trade the eggs to another user where the egg may well... un-twin?

 

Think of it being like influencing, if an egg is abandoned/traded it wont twin but then again, the embryos have already developed so maybe a bit will be added to the description after having a S5 crack like: - but a dead baby dragon can be seen inside. Probably not likely to happen but just throwing it out there.

 

Very good idea for twins! Will be frequently checking this!

[edwardelricfreak]

no drama about someone else getting something rare from your AP'ed metal fail egg or anything like that.

Again, they wouldn't necessarily *have* to. They might only be of the type of the egg; the only thing fraternal about them would be gender and possibly alts/color morphs. Why would there be a chance of a Black egg from BlackxGold hatch possibly Gold if you *don't* have that as an option? You're acting like it would *have* to be the case.

 

I do like just identical twins, though. I would love for it to be "twins" in general and have two hatch from an egg that could be different genders/colors. ;n;

Edited September 18, 2014 by edwardelricfreak

[Tehya Faye]

The reason I figured bites would autokill is because the hatchlings are fragile, so they might not recover enough from the venom to successfully turn. Granted, I've never bitten anything so I don't know what the messages are.

 

After hatching they are separate entities, so if you freeze one the other will still be able to grow up.

[olympe]

Again, they wouldn't necessarily *have* to. They might only be of the type of the egg; the only thing fraternal about them would be gender and possibly alts/color morphs. Why would there be a chance of a Black egg from BlackxGold hatch possibly Gold if you *don't* have that as an option? You're acting like it would *have* to be the case.

It wouldn't have to be the case, but if two babies in one egg are fraternal twins, they could be either breed possible from their parents' pairing (breed of mother, breed of father, potential alts, potential hybrid) - independent of each other. That's why I wanted to simplify things by insisting on identical twins.