Steubenville Sexual Offenders released

[orrrangeee]

God, those people are sick... Humanity is going down.

[Ribombee]

Sadly, this is exceedingly common. Shaming the rape victim, calling her (or him) all sorts of names and blaming the victim, etc. are all common. It makes me physically ill. The majority of rapists get off completely free, the rest mostly get poor sentencing. It's really terrible.

 

As far as football players, rugby players are a lot more violent on the field. It's not the sport itself, but the culture around it. It's the "looking the other way" for star athletes, and the rape culture. Women are "asking for it" if they wear anything even remotely revealing, but they are a "prude" if they don't. We literally can't win. Until that culture is destroyed, it won't change.

[lady_caetlyn]

This whole case from the beginning was handled improperly.

 

They should have been tried as adults on several counts besides rape (child porn, kidnapping, assault).

 

I think the person hosting the party (or parties) should also be held accountable for serving alcohol to minors, and should have been charged as accessories, for providing the means for these cretins to get drunk. Even if the adults weren't home, leaving access to alcohol gives them some liability.

 

there was not enough punishment doled out for anyone.

 

My heart goes out to the girl. Those boys should have gone away for many years.

 

Although, the fact that the rapist has to register as sex offender for the next 20 years, which believe it or not, will hurt him in many ways....(probably not enough ways).

 

Small comfort though.

 

The whole case makes me sick.

 

And I certainly will not let my daughter date a football player, or get involved in any part of that culture.

Edited February 21, 2015 by lady_caetlyn

[MorysRipper]

I won't say anything more than this:

 

The entire ordeal makes me scared to go to college by myself.

[orrrangeee]

Apparently they apologised in court.

 

What sickens me is that the first offender only apologised for taking the pictures, not for raping and taking advantage of her. The second, Richmond, actually apologized for what he did, and for "ruining her life forever". They got off way too easy. A year or two is nothing.

 

Both were crying in court. They said they felt ashamed. I say they were crying for themselves for being shamed publicly.

[auroshen]

Both were crying in court. They said they felt ashamed. I say they were crying for themselves for being shamed publicly.

I agree... I feel like this has happened many, many times before. It's never real shame.

[EnderEcho]

Sadly, this is exceedingly common.  Shaming the rape victim, calling her (or him) all sorts of names and blaming the victim, etc. are all common. It makes me physically ill. The majority of rapists get off completely free, the rest mostly get poor sentencing. It's really terrible.

 

As far as football players, rugby players are a lot more violent on the field. It's not the sport itself, but the culture around it. It's the "looking the other way" for star athletes, and the rape culture. Women are "asking for it" if they wear anything even remotely revealing, but they are a "prude" if they don't. We literally can't win. Until that culture is destroyed, it won't change.

Raven. I am now literally scared to go to anywhere public where there are older boys.

[Reidragon]

Raven. I am now literally scared to go to anywhere public where there are older boys.

I encourage all young women to learn self defense. I did and it does help a lot with both your confidence and your fear. That said this whole article makes me ill. That poor girl. My heart goes out to her. Sad age to be a teen. I worry about my neice all the time as she grows up in this day and age. Makes me want to reconsider having kids at all. The justice system in my country is so out of whack it's pathetic.

[ValidEmotions]

This is absolutely disgusting and part of what I have been saying for years. There are 10 year olds being tried as adults for serious crimes such as murder but these 16 year olds get away with nothing more than a slap to their wrist?!

[Lurhstaap]

I agree... I feel like this has happened many, many times before. It's never real shame.

THANK YOU. Glad someone else sees this. It drives me crazy when people interpret offenders' tears as signs of 'remorse'. I've seen it often enough to know for a fact that nine times out of ten, it's not remorse, it's self-pity.

 

The rape culture isn't limited to America, also, I just want to note. It's a problem in pretty much every country I can think of off the top of my head, although I will grant that some places are far worse than others. But while America is an awful place when it comes to this sort of thing, there are, shockingly and pathetically enough, places where it's even worse. For example, India, Pakistan, several African nations... In some places, women -literally- are still property. 'Rape' is hardly even a concept in those places.

 

Basically, the world is a scary place and it pays to learn self-defense. I am short and small-looking but no one has ever messed with me because I openly carry a very large knife when I am alone. (In my area this is legal so long as the weapon is a single-edged blade and openly carried rather than concealed in any way; research laws in your area.) I know how to use it, too, but the pure intimidation factor is enough that I've never needed to. Things like that DO help. Don't hesitate to take advantage. (And YES I am speaking to males as well as females here. While rape is -primarily- a female burden, I have known men who were so victimized, both as children and adults. No one is truly 'immune' to the threat of this type of crime.)

Edited February 25, 2015 by Lurhstaap

[Shienvien]

(And YES I am speaking to males as well as females here. No one is truly 'immune' to the threat of this type of crime.)

This. It may be a strange thing to admit, but I've come across almost as many male rape victims as I have female ones. Furthermore, I have also come across several examples of both males and females who were raped by females. Yes, it is possible for a female to rape a male. For one, certain body functions remain active even when the male is unconscious.

 

There are 10 year olds being tried as adults for serious crimes such as murder but these 16 year olds get away with nothing more than a slap to their wrist?!

Makes me glad you're fully criminally responsible at 14 here...

 

It drives me crazy when people interpret offenders' tears as signs of 'remorse'. I've seen it often enough to know for a fact that nine times out of ten, it's not remorse, it's self-pity.

Agreed... It is shame, but it is the shame of standing in front of people and being accused, not the same of one's deeds. You can make almost anyone cry like that, regardless of whether or not they are guilty.

[Ayesthine]

I think that a society that so heavily promotes young male sportsmen to be idolized heavily, and who at age 18 could play in a major league and earn millions, will always have that kind of problem.  Especially in football, they are expected to be the tough, mean, fighting machines, and honestly: you can't have that attitude only on the field for 3 hours a week.

 

about the sentences/comparison of both: you should NOT compare the actual sentence received to a theoretical maximum. The theoretical maximum for rape is for sure somewhere around 10 years (i am no lawyer for the us). But law has to have varying degrees of punishment, and this is where other factors come in:

first time offender?

pleaded guilty?

other circumstances that soften the punishment (like drug abuse... even if i dont like that excuse...)

age of the criminal

All of that went probably in their favour. If you don't want to take that as a reason personally, that's your prerogative, but what would you do to a repeat offender, someone who was not a minor and pleaded "not guilty"? death penalty? well. not much justice there, then.

 

now compare that to the hacker: probably repeat offender, combine that with the threats he made, and additional identity theft, and you got a triple charge easily.

I agree with this wholeheartedly, and I urge all of you to take into account how justice is served and try to extricate your personal feelings on the issue from the fairness of the punishment, or lack thereof.

This is not to say that this wasn't terrible, or that there was any justification for this crime whatsoever, but the realities of justice in the US need to be taken into account. I do mean justice, because the feelings of the victim and the victim's family DO NOT factor in to the severity of the punishment, no matter how much we may want it to. Justice is impartial and objective. The majority of the time, courts and juries are as impartial as the information they are given allows. The concept of objective punishment and review by a jury of your peers is so, so important, and it shouldn't be degraded. What is more important is understanding how attorneys can bias evidence than scrutinizing the fairness of a jury.

The way the US justice system takes into account the probability of repeat offenses is messed up, but I wouldn't say that it is wholly a screwed up system. Punishment should fit the crime, but the realities of that crime (how it was done, why, etc.) need to be taken into account, and calculating the probability of a repeat offense is one way that is done.

 

The issue here shouldn't be about the sentence given to the rapists. The issues here are a.) the ideas and culture behind the blaming of victims and the enabling of rape, however conscious that enabling may be b.) recognizing male rape victims as actual victims, and encouraging people of all genders to report rape and feel safe doing so c.) the treatment of "hacking" by the justice system; what constitutes it, what rights it actually infringes upon, what punishment it should receive, what light it should be viewed in, etc. d.) the discrepancy between the idea that punishment needs to fit the crime and treating the perpetrator of that crime with equity (meaning, taking into account their situation, their mental health, and so on) and e.) the treatment that star athletes get in trials and investigations, as well as treatment of celebrities of any kind.

[Lumikkja]

Quick, everyone come to New Hampshire, firearms are legal here! We will protect each other from ***s like these two rapists! 'Hackers' are welcome too!

 

Seriously... all those comments... I want to shoot them all in the feet and give them a very lengthy talking-to about HOW THE ****ING HELL THE WORLD WORKS. Rapists should not be congratulated, and that article about the football players' release should most definitely have spoken about the girl they raped. The thing that pisses me off about this the most is the punishment of the whistleblower. I want to see if they have evidence of this 'hacking'. He exposed a crime, a violation of basic human bodily rights, and this is his reward. Amazing.

 

I'm taking New Hampshire and transplanting it onto Mars. This kind of warped justice can't follow us there.

[EnderEcho]

I encourage all young women to learn self defense. I did and it does help a lot with both your confidence and your fear. That said this whole article makes me ill. That poor girl. My heart goes out to her. Sad age to be a teen. I worry about my neice all the time as she grows up in this day and age. Makes me want to reconsider having kids at all. The justice system in my country is so out of whack it's pathetic.

I am a Kempo white belt and am good at it.

[HeartJacker13]

I don't understand why people are attacking the girl. I mean, she has it the worst in this situation.

[brairtrainer]

I don't understand why people are attacking the girl. I mean, she has it the worst in this situation.

Because she was attacking the football players in a town that practically reveres them. That's not a good reason but that was the reason.

[Cireth]

Yeah this is disgusting. Rape is a fate worse than death and the punishment for it should be death.

 

The punishment must match the severity of the crime. The Death Penalty is the only penalty severe enough.

 

We're not allowed to bear arms here in the UK. Not even Pepper Spray. So the criminals are all armed and the citizens aren't. It's ludicrous. If the police were literally everywhere, and I do mean everywhere, to protect us I wouldn't care. As it is I want the right to stab or shoot any creep who tries to hurt me. Unfortunately though it's far more likely to be the creep stabbing or shooting me.

 

As I'm not allowed to bear arms I'm crafty and I carry Hairspray. Try chasing me with THAT in your eyes.

 

Plus I live right near the beach so while an attacker was screaming in pain and staggering around blind I'd be picking a nice big rock to hit him or her on the head with.

Edited February 26, 2015 by Cireth

[Omega Entity]

Wasp or hornet spray is also an excellent substitute for pepper spray, especially if it shoots a jet rather than a cloud.

 

Of course, finding a can that's small enough to be easily carried is the trick.

[Ayesthine]

Yeah this is disgusting. Rape is a fate worse than death and the punishment for it should be death.

 

The punishment must match the severity of the crime. The Death Penalty is the only penalty severe enough.

Woah, woah, easy there. You're talking about capital punishment. While they understand that you feel strongly about this, your viewpoints come across as extremely flippant towards death and the idea of death as punishment. That's an incredibly serious thing to wish on anyone, even perpetrators of violent crimes.

Rape is not a fate worse than death, and saying so is pretty insensitive to survivors of rape. It's a horrible experience and I wouldn't wish it on anyone, but it isn't the end of your life! That implies that rape is something you can never recover from. You might be practicing a little hyperbole, but this is a serious topic and it deserves a serious attitude.

 

Your no-tolerance approach towards fitting punishment for rapists is understandable from an emotional point of view, but capital punishment is not something to be taken lightly. Sentences for rape are usually very serious. Even being registered as a sex offender and having your past crimes haunt you for the rest of your life is hardly getting off lightly.

 

The death penalty implies that you are "unfixable". Killing someone as a punishment for rape without even attempting to rehabilitate them is really, really callous!

[Shienvien]

Woah, woah, easy there. You're talking about capital punishment. While they understand that you feel strongly about this, your viewpoints come across as extremely flippant towards death and the idea of death as punishment. That's an incredibly serious thing to wish on anyone, even perpetrators of violent crimes.

Rape is not a fate worse than death, and saying so is pretty insensitive to survivors of rape. It's a horrible experience and I wouldn't wish it on anyone, but it isn't the end of your life! That implies that rape is something you can never recover from. You might be practicing a little hyperbole, but this is a serious topic and it deserves a serious attitude.

Going to second this. Point one, the justice system is inaccurate, and applying death penalty always carries the chance of someone completely innocent being murdered. And there are no things more irreversible than biological death.

 

And yes, rape isn't "a fate worse than death." A person who was raped can recover and go on with life, a dead person cannot do anything at all, since all their options are gone and they don't even exist anymore.

 

I read an article recently wherein the victim of rape described their experiences - and one of the disturbing things in it was the fact that nearly everyone they met seemed to think that they had no right to recover and enjoy life, and were some kind of a freak for being a normal person after "all that". As if they were supposed to remain some damaged mess people could point fingers at and either set as an example of what a person who has been raped is like or be treated with rubber gloves like something infectious. I don't want to think what all those "they'll never recover from it", "it will be with them for their life", "fate worse than death" statements might make an actual recovering rape victim feel like.

 

 

(I also hope the original poster isn't as trigger-happy as they make themselves sound like. Since even - or perhaps especially - as a gun owner and a proponent of active self-defense, I find it a bit scary. People have been killed for trying to hand others their dropped wallets back before... And a hairspray is vastly more harmful than pepper spray - depending on type, you may permanently blind a person with it. Bug spray isn't notably better, either. Way to make people carry much more hazardous substances instead of mostly harmless pepper spray, UK laws... Though admittedly, sprays tend to be rather poor self-defense weapons, especially in case of strong wind or enclosed spaces. And people with very high pain tolerances.)