Religion

[prairiecrow]

About point 4 : It's more like they are trying to spread the word or showing what they stand for most times. Also words can build you up or bring you or people down if not careful; they can make a person curious too! Does that help?

Do you honestly believe that ANYBODY in the modern world (with access to the Internet) has NOT heard about Christianity and the Christian God?

 

In which case, it's not like these sigs are mentioning something that any reader hasn't been aware of for quite some time. So, what's to be curious about?

 

If Christianity were a minority religion or its members suffered systemic persecution in most parts of the world, I could see where a sig would be a way for Christians to reach out to each other and encourage each other, or to work at banishing misconceptions about their faith. As it stands... they're in a position of dominance and power, and posts like "Stand up for God, fellow Christians!" can come across as a tad overbearing to those of other faiths (or to atheists and agnostics), especially when some of us have seen Christian pride take the form of spreading lies about other faiths, or even resorting to physical violence.

Edited November 7, 2013 by prairiecrow

[High Lord November]

In my opinion, there is 100% no sort of deity. Not only is there no evidence, the whole basis of religion coincides well with human nature IMO (the need for answers to the 'unanswerable' questions, the need to have some sort of judgement or guide to live by, and the need for power).

 

I've had a couple of people say to me "It's safer to believe in God, because if there is one you'll go to heaven, if there isn't one nothing happens, and if there is one and you don't you'll go to hell." Alternatively, "you're going to hell because you don't believe in god!" This annoys me greatly. I'm not going to change my lifestyle just to appease some deity that does not exist. As well, if I'm going to "hell" for not believing (despite being a good person), I wouldn't want to go to that deity's heaven anywho. I'll be much more comfy surrounded by my own people That'd also mean that there'd be good people in "hell", so it seriously can't be that bad. And I'm a good person anyway - if I don't get judged on that, then again I wouldn't want to be associated with that deity at all. So basically I'm going to live the life I want, and then I'll pass away into nothingness as predicted. Or I'll deal with whatever comes next, but at least I'll have lived the life I want and not ruin it by pretending to believe in something that may or may not exist so I can be associated with something that I may or may not want to be associated with.

Edited November 7, 2013 by High Lord November

[Destiny Arts]

Do you honestly believe that ANYBODY in the modern world (with access to the Internet) has NOT heard about Christianity and the Christian God?

 

Actually a lot! You will be very surprised but I have seen some videos were people haven"t heard about Christianity. I agree with some Christians do have a lot of pride and it can get nasty but that doesn"t mean all of them are like that. They are a hunman being like you and me who mess up which we unfortunately can't avoid... unless your the Doctor haha. Some people who call themselve Christians aren't really Christians or just take the title of it, which I do not understand very well.

Edited November 8, 2013 by Destiny Arts

[Bacon_Strips]

Why do people feel the need to aggressively preach?! I just saw a sig saying '96% Percent of teens won't stand up for god, if your [sic] part of the 4% that will put this in your sig'

I see it a lot on social media. I doubt most of them even know much about the religion they "stand up for".

[Awdz]

'Tis the season for some newscasters to go on about the "War on Christmas".

 

Frankly, I get annoyed by much of what some folks proclaim as evidence of said war. I figure whatever war there was on Christmas was socially won long ago by commercialism.

 

I am much more concerned about the schools that tried to ban all religious songs from their winter concerts. I'm all for freedom of religious choice and freedom of speech. Furthermore, many kinds of music have been used to proclaim beliefs. Refusing to allow any religious song cuts off a huge amount of options for music teachers.

 

I would rather see a balance of songs featuring the variety of beliefs in the student population. I'm glad the schools backed off of the ban.

Edited December 7, 2013 by Awdz Bodkins

[7Deadly$ins]

I think they should've kept the ban. I don't believe schools should have a religious focus at all, and that extends to winter concerts.

[InugamiZERO]

a family member I had to stay with as a kid (for reasons)

was/is a big time Christian, church everyday as well as Sunday school on Sundays, tried to force convert me at the time. (Age 5 or 6)

but I got banned from the church after the priest yelled at me

"if I did not shut up and believe what I was told, I was going to hell"

All because I asked some questions

 

Now and as a little kid threats did not work on me, they just make me go against the people more.

also I have always lived for knowledge and books. Love Books

[TikindiDragon]

I think they should've kept the ban. I don't believe schools should have a religious focus at all, and that extends to winter concerts.

I disagree there. So many, many extremely traditional Christmas songs *are* religious in nature, and banning them massively limits the repetoir. Added to which a lot of classical choral music is religiously inspired (as well as a lot of the non-choral pieces) and, again, banning that would be a loss to any choir or orchestra. A better idea would be to extend the range to include songs from other religious traditions, rather than banning the lot in their entirety.

 

You don't need to utterly ban any and all mention of God from public life to have separation of Church and State. England is a prime example of it. We're broadly secular over here, yet school choirs will happily sing traditional Christmas carols. My partner is atheist (as are many others) and it bothers them not one iota. His school sang traditional Christmas carols, and until he met me he *still* didn't have much of an idea about Christianity, let alone feel like he'd been preached it at school.

 

So, yeah, I personally think it would be a great shame to ban people from singing joyful songs simply because they mention God.

 

Edit to add: It's not 100% true to say my other half isn't bothered by Christmas songs. He actually *is*, but not because of any religious aspect. The store he works in starts playing them on repeat in late-Novemebr, and by Christmas he's ready to kill the next person that plays him one. Funnily enough it's actually the secular ones that annoy him more than the traditional ones - I've got a lovely CD of Christmas Carols done in gregorian chant and he really likes that one, despite his being atheist and *all* of the songs being religious ones.

 

You don't have the believe to enjoy the music. And I don't see enjoying sharing good music as being 'pushing' religion on anyone.

Edited December 7, 2013 by TikindiDragon

[7Deadly$ins]

I do think it would be better to include a wide range of religious songs if you must have them, but failing that I'd rather not have any at all. I don't mind Christmas songs entirely, but I would rather not have any serenades to baby Jesus.

[TikindiDragon]

Maybe it's down to cultural differeces here - but I see an awful lot more anti-Christianity from people posting from the US than I ever encounter in atheists here in the UK (where, believe me, there are a lot of them). I rather gather a lot of you have had a worse time with overly-preachy types there.

 

But, yeah, personally I'd far rather go for including all religions than banning all religions.

 

And for religiously insipred music - I give you this

, and

. And let's face it, you can't ban Away In A Manger without banning this sort of thing to. Which, as I said, would be a massive loss.

 

Edit: typos

 

Edit 2: Kings College doing carols right

. Also

by Steeleye Span which I'm particularly fond of. Edited December 7, 2013 by TikindiDragon

[Awdz]

You don't have the believe to enjoy the music. And I don't see enjoying sharing good music as being 'pushing' religion on anyone.

And if folks are worried that the music will somehow corrupt their kids, I think they should take a much closer look at what and how they are teaching their kids about their faith. Shielding them from others' perspectives does NOT prepare them for adult life very well, imo.

[7Deadly$ins]

And if folks are worried that the music will somehow corrupt their kids, I think they should take a much closer look at what and how they are teaching their kids about their faith. Shielding them from others' perspectives does NOT prepare them for adult life very well, imo.

It's an all or nothing deal for me. Since the school districts in question didn't decide to open up to all faiths, then I don't think that Christianity should get the special treatment. If they WERE going to sing songs of all faiths then cool. But they aren't.

[ShinyTomato]

And if folks are worried that the music will somehow corrupt their kids, I think they should take a much closer look at what and how they are teaching their kids about their faith. Shielding them from others' perspectives does NOT prepare them for adult life very well, imo.

It's more (from a Jewish perspective) that it is often construed as worship, and that can be especially problematic when you're forcing kids who don't believe the Messiah has come to sing something that states he has, and/or that the Messiah is intended to be worshiped.

 

There's a distinct commandment not to do anything that can be construed as worshiping someone other than G-d.

[Obscure_Trash]

It's more (from a Jewish perspective) that it is often construed as worship, and that can be especially problematic when you're forcing kids who don't believe the Messiah has come to sing something that states he has, and/or that the Messiah is intended to be worshiped.

 

There's a distinct commandment not to do anything that can be construed as worshiping someone other than G-d.

^ I think it should be up to the kids what they want to sing or not, but it can get tricky if you've got an environment where a kid doesn't feel comfortable or even safe saying that they'd prefer they swapped out song x for something else.

[Infinis]

I no longer identify as any kind of Christian/Catholic whatever but I greatly enjoy the music. Christmas music is my favorite kind of music and "Hark the Herald Angels Sing" is still one of my very favorites, religious or not.

 

If it's the words you're objecting to I suggest going for instrumentals. Then you just get the tune and can put whatever words you want in. :B

 

Maybe it's down to cultural differeces here - but I see an awful lot more anti-Christianity from people posting from the US than I ever encounter in atheists here in the UK (where, believe me, there are a lot of them). I rather gather a lot of you have had a worse time with overly-preachy types there.

 

Over here we have a lot of extremists, like the Westboro Baptist Church and the far-right very traditional fundamentalists. The former preaches largely hate (God hates ALL THESE THINGS >.>) and I strongly avoid anything fundamental so I don't know much about the latter. We even have a lot of other religious and non-religious extremists, so I really just avoid organized religion and non-religion altogether. |D I believe what I want.

 

I never had a /bad/ experience with Christianty; I was raised as a Christian and went to mass and everything (even though it was boring as hell for me), but I started having doubts when I started looking into the controversial issues on my own and realizing what I had been told was fundamentally flawed.

 

I can't make myself believe in a God that hates everything. I'm largely agnostic anymore, I guess. I believe there is a God, and that there is at least a heaven, but because I have no proof either way with regards to the existence of my God, I have no right to deny the existence of other god(s). (Yes, I believe in a heaven still, because the thought of simply ceasing to exist is kind of horrifying for me.)

[Lythe]

This time of year always gets awkward for me, since I'm Jewish. I remember how in elementary school, you were required to sing in the Christmas concert, or fail the music class. They always had the sixth graders sing a Jewish song and another song from a different religion, but every other grade sang only Christmas music. I was the only Jewish child in my school, and was being forced to sing about Christmas. Being young, I didn't know how to respond to it, and just mimed the words during the concert, every year without fail. It also sucked how they never taught you the words, becuase everyone was expected to know them. To this day, I still don't know the lyrics to Rudolph the Red Nosed Reindeer.

 

Once out of elementary school it got better, and I've sort of accepted the fact that nobody is going to be running around yodeling Hannukah songs like they do Christmas carols. I'm totally okay with it too, as long as they don't force me to start singing with them. I just sort of wistfully wish for a more broadened view when it comes to all the religions out there.

 

I sort of feel bad for the atheists out there. I know a lot, and most of them are fine with the holiday season. But some get really uncomfortable, too.

[Lady_Lunevis]

I live in an area mostly populated by Christians, and many of my friends are Christian. That hasn't been a problem, until now...

 

In Socials class, we're studying world religions, and it's caused quite an uproar amongst certain people. There's this one girl who doesn't want to take the class, and every class she sits in the back and shouts out absolutely horrid things concerning the religion or their customs. Today, one of my friends got into a fight with my boyfriend because she believed in BC/AD, whilst he believed in BCE/CE.

 

I think it's good that the class is trying to teach us all to accept the world and the many different religions, but I think the actual effect it's having is not heading in the right direction.

 

I myself am agnostic, raised in an atheist household, so it doesn't matter much to me. However, I really do wish the class would be more understanding with each other. It's really getting frustrating having half of the class not actually care for the world or any of the religions, while the other half is getting offended with every little thing, and I'm just sitting there wishing for the hour to be over.

[KyokoYei2]

I personally find Christmas music a little uncomfortable being atheist with the sheer amount of Christian music that is out there. I've never really like Christmas music anyway growing up in a Christian household and living around my sister's Wicca even before I became Atheist.

Over here we have a lot of extremists, like the Westboro Baptist Church and the far-right very traditional fundamentalists. The former preaches largely hate (God hates ALL THESE THINGS >.>) and I strongly avoid anything fundamental so I don't know much about the latter. We even have a lot of other religious and non-religious extremists, so I really just avoid organized religion and non-religion altogether. |D I believe what I want.

 

I never had a /bad/ experience with Christianty; I was raised as a Christian and went to mass and everything (even though it was boring as hell for me), but I started having doubts when I started looking into the controversial issues on my own and realizing what I had been told was fundamentally flawed.

 

I can't make myself believe in a God that hates everything. I'm largely agnostic anymore, I guess. I believe there is a God, and that there is at least a heaven, but because I have no proof either way with regards to the existence of my God, I have no right to deny the existence of other god(s). (Yes, I believe in a heaven still, because the thought of simply ceasing to exist is kind of horrifying for me.)

I have to agree with that a lot. Most of my family is Southern Baptist and a lot of people are very stiff and controlling about Christian's and how they believe. It's a little suffocating. And out of personal opinion, why worship a God that if you don't worship their religion you go straight to hell? I understand the murderers and those stuff but everyone else? That would be a lot of people in hell if he loves everyone. Just personal opinion.

[High Lord November]

I live in an area mostly populated by Christians, and many of my friends are Christian. That hasn't been a problem, until now...

 

In Socials class, we're studying world religions, and it's caused quite an uproar amongst certain people. There's this one girl who doesn't want to take the class, and every class she sits in the back and shouts out absolutely horrid things concerning the religion or their customs. Today, one of my friends got into a fight with my boyfriend because she believed in BC/AD, whilst he believed in BCE/CE.

 

I think it's good that the class is trying to teach us all to accept the world and the many different religions, but I think the actual effect it's having is not heading in the right direction.

 

I myself am agnostic, raised in an atheist household, so it doesn't matter much to me. However, I really do wish the class would be more understanding with each other. It's really getting frustrating having half of the class not actually care for the world or any of the religions, while the other half is getting offended with every little thing, and I'm just sitting there wishing for the hour to be over.

A similar thing happened to me. In my world religion class, we had this one hardcore Christian that said many homophobic, intolerant, and inappropriate comments (I have no idea why the teacher didn't comment or stop her...) and refused to work with certain people because of their religion or worldview. The year after, the class was canceled because they deemed us "not mature enough to handle the subject" (even when really you should be introducing worldviews at an even younger age so that children get a wider, arguably more tolerant, and educated worldview). I have no idea why the teacher didn't step in or kick her out of the class. It's people like her that give the religion a bad rap.

[edwardelricfreak]

I'm not Christian, but I still celebrate Christmas. Not anything about Jesus, but the food and the gift-giving and having the family all together. c:

 

I don't mind Christmas music for the most part, as most of the songs don't even seem remotely religious (like Rudolph the Red-Nosed Reindeer, among others). Some, yes, they are rather religious, but I think the only thing someone tied to Christianity is just the sole fact that they are Christmas songs. ._.

 

So I have to ask, even though it's probably been asked before, if people get upset about Christmas songs, do the Christmas Dragons also bother them? I'm just curious.

[Syaoransbear]

I hate christmas music, the christian songs and the santa ones. The christian songs just remind me of how my atheist views are not tolerated in my family/husband's family and I'm pressured to be christian(like how my wedding ended up in a christian church instead of a universal unitarian church because of my inlaws), and the santa ones annoy me because I think it's wrong to lie to children like that. It's not at all the same thing as when you tell stories about fairies and unicorns. When I was told stories about fairies and unicorns I was never told that they were absolutely real and that if I didn't believe in them I wouldn't get presents.

[edwardelricfreak]

(like how my wedding ended up in a christian church instead of a universal unitarian church because of my inlaws)

Aw man that sucks. :c It should've been YOUR (meaning you and your husband's) choice since it was YOUR wedding.

 

Also heh I'm an agnostic Unitarian Universalist. c: Those were actually two religions that I believe both came from Christianity, if I remember right.

Edited December 10, 2013 by edwardelricfreak

[fawx]

I'm an atheist teen whose parents still keep telling her she's Roman Catholic... Sigh

[Syaoransbear]

Aw man that sucks. :c It should've been YOUR (meaning you and your husband's) choice since it was YOUR wedding.

 

Also heh I'm an agnostic Unitarian Universalist. c: Those were actually two religions that I believe both came from Christianity, if I remember right.

Yeah, I wish it was. We only finally agreed to having it in a christian church if our dog could be in the ceremony and if we could make everything as secular as possible with almost no mentions of god or jesus. It would have worked, but unfortunately our first minister bailed and the second minister to replace her had a dog phobia that we didn't know about until a couple weeks before our wedding so we had to get a third minister. He just had to read the script, that was all, but he went rogue on us and injected a lot of scripture and christian stuff. Our quick 10 minute ceremony ended up being like half an hour. And he said a lot of stuff about having babies and 'being fruitful' even though we are very much against having children and we told him that. I was unbelievably annoyed by the end of it all. It really made me sensitive and aware of how much christian pressure there is around me, and I'm a lot more negative about it than I used to be because too many people felt our wedding should be a platform to express their religious views and suppress ours.

[Lady_Lunevis]

A similar thing happened to me. In my world religion class, we had this one hardcore Christian that said many homophobic, intolerant, and inappropriate comments (I have no idea why the teacher didn't comment or stop her...) and refused to work with certain people because of their religion or worldview. The year after, the class was canceled because they deemed us "not mature enough to handle the subject" (even when really you should be introducing worldviews at an even younger age so that children get a wider, arguably more tolerant, and educated worldview). I have no idea why the teacher didn't step in or kick her out of the class. It's people like her that give the religion a bad rap.

Oh jeeze... Yeah, the teacher should have done something about that! Refusing to work with people just because of their religion...wow. Just wow.

What, really? I agree with you on that one; rather than cancel the class and let one stay ignorant, they should have introduced the class even earlier to help them get a more educated viewpoint...ugh, some things...

 

Exactly! The religion itself isn't bad; rather, it's just some of the people. She should have been kicked out or at least talked to...

 

If you don't mind me asking, what grade was this?