Parenting

[Mousia]

Okay. I may be the exception and not the rule, but I was always a well-behaved child. Even threatening a time-out or yelling would get me to stop right away.

I guess it was maybe because I have never liked people to be upset at me because it actives my "you've failed and don't deserve what you have" response, but I was never hit (except once, but I caught it and I'm pretty sure it was clear to both of us that hitting me would actually do less good than just making me feel bad about it with words) and know how to behave in public.

 

Sure, it aggravates me when people never discipline their children (IMO, a lot of people who posted here are correct in saying that rewarding children for bad behavior with phones/technology/giving in is not the right approach either), but some children honestly do better without spanking or hitting.

 

I also agree with Cecona. My mother would always get mad at me for not eating certain things she cooked, but I believe she was a little more lenient when I actually did eat it and gagged it back up shortly afterwards. I'm much better nowadays, but I honestly couldn't get certain things down. It wasn't about being bratty because, as I said, I respected my parents' words and did what they told me to do for the most part.

 

But it's also kind of in my nature to not take crap from people I'm close to. Which, I guess, was kind of bad, but my parents and I are and were close, so we learned things from each other. I learned how to be a good person and deal with life in general and they learned that complex thought is possible with a solid upbringing, which I think was also better for them.

Another thing to bring up is that parents aren't these gods that have no feelings. If the kids turn out bad, parents sometimes feel bad about it (or responsible). And it's good to note changes in parents' demeanor. It's not all about the children. Personally, I try to do them proud now principally because I am now aware of how much they feel when things don't go right.

 

I read a few things saying that parents are boss, kids shouldn't control parents, etc. But kids do anyways. I'm not saying that parents should be pets, but parents are definitely affected by events in their children's lives. A good parents knows how to react in situations and is, thus, subject to changing their ideas based on their children. It should be closer to equal exchange than dictatorship. With both parties compromising a little bit (ex. parents setting rules and enforcing them, children reacting x way, parents adjusting tactics, ...), the child should turn out okay. If it's complete control, both parties lose. If the parents are too stubborn, the child either comes away with some mental disorder or disillusion or a complete sense of rebellion. Or worse...they learn never to get caught and never to learn. If the parents are too loose, the child learns nothing and it's just a hazard to society. So people need to understand that, even with whatever their parents used to discipline them, the parents had to notice what worked and what didn't. Am I right?

[Cecona]

Definitely right, parenting can really be seen as a trial and error kind of thing. Depending on how the child is you can determine what is best. And Fuzz, I'm glad that you understand there is a difference between a child just being bratty and refusing to eat something without trying, and someone having tried a food and having had such a bad reaction to it they avoid it. I never had problems eating my greens when I was young. I would eat sweet peas as a snack- I still do that actually.

 

I don't know what Kale or rollmops are, and I'm wondering if twizzlers are the same thing over there as they are here (red licorice candy) If so eeeew turkey flavored licorice!

[Fuzzbucket]

Definitely right, parenting can really be seen as a trial and error kind of thing. Depending on how the child is you can determine what is best. And Fuzz, I'm glad that you understand there is a difference between a child just being bratty and refusing to eat something without trying, and someone having tried a food and having had such a bad reaction to it they avoid it. I never had problems eating my greens when I was young. I would eat sweet peas as a snack- I still do that actually.

 

I don't know what Kale or rollmops are, and I'm wondering if twizzlers are the same thing over there as they are here (red licorice candy) If so eeeew turkey flavored licorice!

Here they are.

 

Not liquorice- but pretty disgusting. And created SPECIFICALLY to appeal to children - and to use up "meat" that no-one else would ever eat..

 

Rollmops are picked herrings.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rollmops

 

Delicious - and expensive.... I rue the day she found them in the fridge

 

Oh - and in the UK sweet peas are pretty flowers; you gave me a turn there....

Edited September 27, 2013 by fuzzbucket

[Syaoransbear]

Here they are.

 

Not liquorice- but pretty disgusting. And created SPECIFICALLY to appeal to children - and to use up "meat" that no-one else would ever eat..

 

I've honestly only ever seen those sold in the dog section of pet stores .

[MysticTiger]

Urg, working with parents and their misbehaved brats is one of the things that makes retail just absolutely miserable. Parents who think it's okay to just open product before or without paying for it so they can keep their child preoccupied make me angry. We can't sell something that's been in your child's mouth and you don't want. Parents who pay more attention to their phones then their children are the worst. I've had children run into on coming traffic in front of the parent, who was texting for a good three minutes without paying attention to the kid.

 

Another pet peeve that parents DON'T SEEM TO GET is when they put their child on the counter/shelves/checkout belt. NO. Don't do this. It's not sanitary and we have to instantly disinfect. You'd find it disgusting if an adult sat their butt down where you put your food, wouldn't you? Why do parents find it okay to put their poopy diaper children there?

 

Do not reward your child for being bad. You know what I mean. The parents who have a misbehaved child who's screaming and kicking but then the parents give them candy to shut them up. Obviously the child is going to do that again. You just REWARDED THEM WITH CANDY.

 

And, for heaven's sake, please teach your child "Please" and "Thank You". It seems obvious to me but apparently the use of those words is foreign to a lot of children.

Edited September 27, 2013 by MysticTiger

[senyi]

Here they are.

 

Not liquorice- but pretty disgusting. And created SPECIFICALLY to appeal to children - and to use up "meat" that no-one else would ever eat..

That...just looks disgusting. Is it burnt?

 

 

And, for heaven's sake, please teach your child "Please" and "Thank You". It seems obvious to me but apparently the use of those words is foreign to a lot of children.

This all the way. It seems as if people start to stop using the "please" and "thank you" when they hit middle school (from what my mom says).

[MysticTiger]

This all the way. It seems as if people start to stop using the "please" and "thank you" when they hit middle school (from what my mom says).

I don't know about that. I just find that children around 12 or younger tend to never use please and thank you. And I don't mean when the parents are like "Now what do you say...", I mean the parents never mention anything and the kid is just like "Gimme" or "Mine". Strangely enough, the generation that seems the rudest with the "Gimme" and "I want" is the older folks (60+ age) who I assume would know better, but apparently not. I'm wondering if the kids are picking up bad habits from the Grandparents.

[Cecona]

Man I would hate to have a job in retail.... or really anywhere parents might bring their bratty kids.

 

Being an American I highly doubt I would find rollmops delicious. I'm actually not too big a fan of fish unless it's beer battered.

[Pokemonfan13]

My dad would probably like them. He's got a jar of pickled fish he eats on crackers. xP

 

 

Yea, retail jobs in kid-prone establishments must be hell. I recently met someone who worked at chuck-e-cheese [i think in a costume] who had a problem with kids kicking him in the shins.

[Cecona]

My dad would probably like them. He's got a jar of pickled fish he eats on crackers. xP

 

 

Yea, retail jobs in kid-prone establishments must be hell. I recently met someone who worked at chuck-e-cheese [i think in a costume] who had a problem with kids kicking him in the shins.

Oh man that sucks! I feel sorry for the people that work in those costumes or at kid oriented places.

[Syaoransbear]

Retail is definitely terrible for kids. It really sucks to work in a pet store. Kids will bang on fish tanks and the enclosures for other animals and parents won't do anything about it even if we tell them to get their kids to stop it.

 

There is a chain petstore in a mall where I live and parents will actually drop their kids off there while they go shopping. I'm glad I never got hired to worked there.

Edited September 28, 2013 by Syaoransbear

[Cecona]

Wow.... a pet store is NOT a nursery. I've never gone to the pet store when an ill behaved child was there as well. It's pretty much always adults and their pets.

[TikindiDragon]

Going back to the food thing - the gag reflex *can* be a learned action. My other half, for example, cannot take tablets because he gags and throws up. Doesn't matter what kind of tablet, or what size, he'll gag on all of them. Even if you put them inside bits of food the way you would with a dog (and, yes, we did try that). Yet he swallows food (without tablets in it) without any kind of trouble. It's a learned reflex from early childhood, and he doesn't now appear to be able to unlearn it.

 

Older children that are difficult with food have *already* begun learning avoidance reflexes from the moment they were allowed to get away with it. No just-weaned child gags on food, they learn how to do that to avoid eating stuff. The worse/stronger the reflex is, the more likely it is to be learnt, rather than a simple dislike.

 

That's not to say people can't honestly dislike foods. They can. But those extreme gagging reflexes? Sorry, those *were* learn at an early stage because the kid found out that meant they didn't have to eat something.

[7Deadly$ins]

Go for it. But I stick to my guns there. Picky eating is not the same as genuinely disliking something. You now get a multitude of kids who will not eat anything but chips and ketchup, and their parents LET them. They don't even try and get them to try something else. If you take it as a given that what you put in front of them is edible, they don't refuse on principle; they will give it a shot. If they GENUINELY don't like something AFTER they have tried it - that is something else. But the very fact that especially in the UK you now have all kinds of JUNK food (the most famous is the Turkey Twizzler...) labelled "kids packs" and so on - and then the kids demand it and GET it says it all. They get the idea that kids get different food. Which is very wrong.

 

When kids used to visit our place, they got what mine got -and they never routinely left it. Sure, sometimes they didn't like it. But you'd get their parents coming in wide-eyed, saying "Johnny says he had green stuff at your place and he liked it - what was it ?" and I'd say "kale" or whatever and they'd rush off to buy some., It was priceless !

 

Cuts the other way too. I love rollmops and they cost a lot. So I used to tell mine that they were VERY grown-up food and they wouldn't like them, but they could try if they liked. They didn't, for a long long time, till the older one decided to... Damn her, she liked them as much as I do

Oh, Fuzz, I'm sure you'd get along swimmingly with my parents. My little brother (9) has only been eating fruits and breads for years now. My parents will go to McDonalds or another fast food restaurant a few times a week, and order him a hamburger meal without the meat. So, a bun. Then he will only eat the top part of the bun, since the bottom part is "too hard." This is a plain bun, mind you, just bread. The rest is just french fries. This is a typical meal for him. Lunch is often something like fruit and crackers. He's very brand specific, won't eat chocolate that isn't Hershey's, won't eat Pizza Sticks (note, only eats cheesesticks, no sauce) that isn't Papa John's, etc. It'd be one thing if he had at least tried things, but you can't even get him to try other chocolates, or such, from other places. It's been frustrating me for years how my parents just let him do this sort of thing, and continue to let him eat at McDonalds like that.

 

Even when there's opportunities, like "Kids Eat Free" nights at restaurants they don't try to get him to eat anything, and then he gets a ridiculous amount of praise for trying new foods -- even though those foods are typically just other-brands of things he already eats. ("I tried the hamburger bun at Burger King today!")

[Fuzzbucket]

Yes. I was SO heartened when I went to Nando's recently and there was a gorgeous 2 y/o girl trying everything and enjoying it all. Asking her parents for this or that off their plates - even really hot stuff - and loving the lot.

 

My little angels were on curry and kippers by that age, too

[TikindiDragon]

I was brought up with a handful of base rules on eating when I was growing up (as was my sister) and neither of us are anything even approaching picky. My sister is vegetarian, but that's not the same thing at all and wasn't something she moved to until her late teens.

 

1) You must at least *try* everything once. No, putting your tongue to it does not count. And no, putting it into your mouth for a couple of seconds before spitting it out doesn't count either. If you've eaten several mouthfulls and then say you really, really don't like it then that's OK.

 

2) Plates must be clean before you get any dessert. Which means if you really don't want to eat something that's your choice, but you won't be getting anything else. Dinner is what's been put infront of you, there will be no treats or snacking of any kind later if you haven't eaten it.

Addendum to this - attempts were always made not to feed us things we had expressed that we really, really didn't like. There would *always* be vegetables, but if we really didn't like a specific one then we wouldn't be fed it (in my case - green beans. I still hate them).

 

3) If you go out to eat, you don't complain, you clear your plate, and you thank people afterwards. It's impolite not to eat something someone has gone to the trouble of cooking for you. So even if you *hate* it, you eat it. This was so well instilled into me that by the time I hit my teens I'd actually eat things I completely loathed (see the green beans mentioned above) because I felt it would have been impolite not to. I still to this day probably wouldn't send food back at a resteraunt because I couldn't be that impolite.

 

Funnily my 3 year old nephew (who is actually a very good kid in most respects) will eat everything but only if he has tomato ketchup with it. It's very odd watching him dip sticks of celery into ketchup. He seems to have got that from his Dad, who also puts ketchup on pretty much everything.

[Fuzzbucket]

Funnily my 3 year old nephew (who is actually a very good kid in most respects) will eat everything but only if he has tomato ketchup with it. It's very odd watching him dip sticks of celery into ketchup. He seems to have got that from his Dad, who also puts ketchup on pretty much everything.

Oh my grandson (12) is like that - ketchup on broccoli - weird... He also has issues with "bits" in food - dates back to when he was three (and would eat anything) and had REALLY bad tonsillitis - bits genuinely hurt terribly and since then he is wary of them, especially - for some reason - in yoghurt !

 

Celery though - well, one does have it with dips, so... I might try that some time !

 

But decent ketchup is actually quite good for you, I believe - something to do with the concentration of tomato stuff in there !

 

Mine were allowed ONE FOOD that they NEVER had to eat. Liver for one (she hated the texture, loved the taste) and onions for the other. Then they both went veggie - I think the liver one never bothered to bar another food though.

Edited September 28, 2013 by fuzzbucket

[prpldrgnfr]

Oh, golly. Food you don't like. I hated how my parents would make me eat things I didn't like. Swore not to do that with mine. She has to try a bite (chewing and swallowing) and if she doesn't like it, fine. I've also told her it can take lots and lots of tries before her mouth will "like" something. So she does try a bite (found out at her friend's house that she likes Greek style chicken, she said it didn't look yummy, but she tried a bite, and filled her plate, ) She does continue to try things she "doesn't like", such as scrambled eggs, once in awhile, so I think maybe someday she may decide she likes them after all.

[TikindiDragon]

Oh, golly. Food you don't like. I hated how my parents would make me eat things I didn't like. Swore not to do that with mine. She has to try a bite (chewing and swallowing) and if she doesn't like it, fine. I've also told her it can take lots and lots of tries before her mouth will "like" something. So she does try a bite (found out at her friend's house that she likes Greek style chicken, she said it didn't look yummy, but she tried a bite, and filled her plate, ) She does continue to try things she "doesn't like", such as scrambled eggs, once in awhile, so I think maybe someday she may decide she likes them after all.

This actually works very well for getting the palette used to things. We used be be given ONE sprout with a roast dinner - which we had to eat. As children we both hated them. Now, as an adult, I *love* sprouts.

 

There is a difference between actually not liking the taste/texture of something and having psychologically convinced yourself that you *won't* like it (then either refusing to try, or sticking your tongue on it and gagging). It's perfectly acceptable to have things you don't like, I've just personally always drawn a line at refusing entire food groups because you "don't like them.".

 

Incidently my other half was one of the worlds pickiest eaters when we first got together. He's much, much better now. Largely through a combination of my going "I am not having baked beans with every meal", and insisting that he try some of pretty much everything I was eating. So the man that didn't like red meat, didn't like Chinese, didn't like anything spicy... Now loves Venison, loves Chinese (with the exception of sweet & sour - turned out in the end that he'd decided he didn't like any chinese food because he hadn't liked the jars of sweet & sour with plain boiled rice. I mean, really.) and has a bit of a chilli obsession. He still doesn't do Indian, but I've traced that down to him not actually liking tumeric, which is fair enough.

 

@fuzz - yeah, I think it's because ketchup isn't exactly the worst thing in the world for him that he's allowed as much of it as he is. And given that he does willingly eat veggies (and a large amount of other stuff) it's not the worlds most massive problem either. It's kinda cute that when we're having buffet-style food at family get togethers he goes around pinching carrot sticks and grapes off of people.

 

But, yeah, kids in our family have always eaten what the grown-ups in our family were having, albeit in smaller portions. I think they're less likely to balk at eating something if they see you eating it too. My sister is weaning her little lad on processed versions of what she and her husband are eating.

[raybrd]

Even though I'm only 13 I'm polite, respectful of my elders and well diciplined. When I whine or do something bad I get a dragon on my scroll renamed to something weird. Or I get yelled at (mostly that). I can't stand people that don't follow the rules of something or are brats!

Being one of five kids has taught me to not be selfish.

[catstaff]

Mine were allowed ONE FOOD that they NEVER had to eat. Liver for one (she hated the texture, loved the taste) and onions for the other. Then they both went veggie - I think the liver one never bothered to bar another food though.

*chuckles*

 

Oh, I remember negotiating that one with my mother when I was a kid!

 

Her original rule was what she called the "no-thank-you portion" which meant about 1/4 to 1/3 of a normal-sized serving of the food in question, and we had to eat it all. This worked okay with veggies in general, and since my sister and I both loved broccoli and green beans, she served those often and regulated the lima beans to not more than once a month. We'd still complain a bit when we had to eat something we didn't like, but we did eat it.

 

But liver... Mom loves liver and onions. My sister and I would literally cry all through dinner whenever she served the stuff. Finally, when I was about seven, I asked her if we -really- had to keep eating liver. She admitted that she'd hoped we'd have gotten more used to the stuff, and our reaction to it disappointed her because she really liked it. So I suggested that if she wanted liver and onions, she could have it, and I'd make soup and sandwiches for myself and my sister on those nights. (Dad worked for a newspaper back then, so five nights a week he left for work around 4 pm and got home between midnight and 2 am.) She agreed, with the proviso that we cease all whining over any other foods we disliked. We agreed, and all of us were happy with the end result.

[Syaoransbear]

I always ate food in front of the TV so I'd end up just mindlessly eating everything instead of focusing on whether or not I liked something. I'm not a very picky either. I'll try everything once and I'll eat stuff I don't really like if it's on my plate. Even if it's something I know I hate, I'll usually try it again anyway just to see if I still don't like it. If I'm at a restaurant and someone got liver, I will try it just to see if the restaurant was able to make it tasty, but I usually don't like it because I hate the smell and texture.

 

My SIL's kid only eats peanut butter and refuses pretty much all other foods. But he's lactose intolerant and they didn't figure that out until he was two years old, so I think he's associated many kinds of food with horrible stomach pain. But that's still no excuse, they should be making more of an effort to introduce him to different foods. Right now if he doesn't want what they made him, he'll just have a tantrum and then they'll go make him whatever he wants instead.

Edited September 28, 2013 by Syaoransbear

[TikindiDragon]

*chuckles*

 

Oh, I remember negotiating that one with my mother when I was a kid!

 

Her original rule was what she called the "no-thank-you portion" which meant about 1/4 to 1/3 of a normal-sized serving of the food in question, and we had to eat it all. This worked okay with veggies in general, and since my sister and I both loved broccoli and green beans, she served those often and regulated the lima beans to not more than once a month. We'd still complain a bit when we had to eat something we didn't like, but we did eat it.

See my Mum used to say "Let's do a deal. If you eat all your vegetables then... [x thing I liked]".

 

She says she really knew I was growing up when she got the response "I don't want to do a deal - it always ends up with me eating the vegetables.". That was the point at which the ones I really didn't like came off the menu permanently.

[babybluefire]

That's not to say people can't honestly dislike foods. They can. But those extreme gagging reflexes? Sorry, those *were* learn at an early stage because the kid found out that meant they didn't have to eat something.

This is 100% wrong. Yes people can dislike foods, yes people can have worsened learned gag reflexes. But to say everyone with a naturally strong gag reflex is learned is not true. There are humans born with swallowing problems. Even relatively minor tongue ties can cause gagging on breast milk. My son and daughter both had to have tongue ties clipped. Their gagging was not for dislike of milk.

 

 

My son continues to have a very sensitive gag reflex because of the way his mouth and throat are shaped genetically. It may or may not get better as he grows. My son can gag and vomit even when there is no food involved. A hard enough cough or post nasal drip can cause it while he is asleep. And trust me he is not doing it for attention, he hates vomiting and gagging with a passion.

Edited September 29, 2013 by babybluefire

[babybluefire]

I was trying not to come across as super aggressive in my last post. It is honestly a trying subject for me. I prefer greatly that people are not judged on aspects of their parenting that are working for them because of obvious or undetectable hurdles.

 

 

For example my mother had leashes for my twin and I, we were both awe full bolters and super early runners. My mom had a twins then a singleton right after. She had broken both her ankles several times each and it limited how fast she can run. At that point grocer's stores were not always easily accessible to large strollers. So the baby was in a wrap on her chest and the twins had leashes. She figured a leash was better than a dead or injured twin. Because we didn't always go in the same direction. She received horrible comments, but not once were we hurt and as soon as we were able to mentally understand the leashes were no longer needed.

 

 

My mom kept the leashes and passed them on to a coworker. The husband and wife had adopted a part of twins from Russia. The twins understood no English and very little Russian. It took most of a year to teach them enough English for their physical safety outdoors. That mom got horrible comments about both the leashes and the ill behaved children. The mom and dad saved the twins lives and are to this day wonderful parents. The children are now successful adults. It might not have looked like that to an outside observer twenty years ago.

 

 

Thus why barring true abuse or slovenly neglect I tend to give parents more leeway before I judge.

Edited September 29, 2013 by babybluefire