Increase zombie turn chance based on last zombie success/revive attempt

[Shadowdrake]

Breeding and GoN summon have increased chances based on how long it had been since you last bred the dragon/how many fails you've had consecutively. I think undead creation could have a similar but longer-term boost, allowing people to prioritize a special zombie if they have something they must have turn, and lowering the odds of someone getting zero zombies on Halloween if they only try once a year.

They could be boosted based on either how long it has been since the user attempted to revive, or how long it has been since they've gotten a successful zombie (preferably a multiplicative boost, so it's strongest on Halloween and lowest on regular days to avoid people getting accidental zombies when they just want to revive their forgotten hatchie, or something). Ideally the boost would build over a month, several months, or even a year. Lore-wise, this could be handwaved as a concentration of death magic over time, or something.

Since zombies are untradeable, I think this would be difficult and very niche for multi-scrollers to abuse.

 

 

Boost based on last revive:

+ prioritizes people who only try for zombies on specific days of the year

- resets boost if you use it on something incidental like a forgotten hatchie

 

Boost based on time since last successful zombie: 

+ allows people who try for zombies often but are unlucky to still gradually increase their undead chance

+ allows people who don't try for zombies often to also increase their undead chance for the one day a year they do just by waiting

 

I dunno there's probably more points to be had, feel free to suggest them.

Edited January 31, 2021 by Shadowdrake

[High Lord November]

The boost based on last successful zombie sounds like the best option between the two you've presented here, although it would encourage people to kill dragons even when the chances are low (ex during the day, not on the 31st) in order to increase the multiplier. The boost based on last revive doesn't really make sense, especially since there are two hatchling sprites to collect for each body type.

 

I'm also partial to the amount of zombies you have on your scroll increasing your chances up to a cap. I think my favourite overall is zombies having a Bite BSA that makes it more likely that the bitten dragon will successfully be revived as a zombie, almost like a Fertility for zombies. 

[Shadowdrake]

2 minutes ago, High Lord November said:

although it would encourage people to kill dragons even when the chances are low (ex during the day, not on the 31st) in order to increase the multiplier.

Not really; the idea I had wasn't to increase it based on failures, just the period of time it had been since the last zombie appeared.

[High Lord November]

1 minute ago, Shadowdrake said:

Not really; the idea I had wasn't to increase it based on failures, just the period of time it had been since the last zombie appeared.

 

Thanks for clarifying, that works out better. I'm in support of almost any way to make Undeads a bit more accessible. Since the 31 only appears once every two months (with two exceptions), what kind of scaling would you be recommending for boost vs time.

[Shadowdrake]

Personally? I'd go for a small boost at 1 month, medium at 6 months and large at 364 days. Works out for both the revive-based and zombieless-based ideas. Alternatively it just scales over time with a cap at 1 year.

[Lost_Unicorn]

55 minutes ago, Shadowdrake said:

Lore-wise, this could be handwaved as a concentration of death magic over time, or something.

Breeding and GoN don't give you a decision where to spend your chances, so it doesn't matter to expose the mechanics for those, but with your ideas the player can only make a decision if they are aware the mechanics exist. It's not what I think it really matters, but ideally there should be an explanation given in-game, so that it doesn't turn into another hidden mechanic which you have to read on wiki or forums.

[Shadowdrake]

21 minutes ago, Lost_Unicorn said:

It's not what I think it really matters, but ideally there should be an explanation given in-game, so that it doesn't turn into another hidden mechanic which you have to read on wiki or forums.

The whole breed of zombies is already a hidden mechanic. They're untradeable, and there is technically no info telling you that revives can turn a dead dragon into a zombie. (Before you say that's ridiculous, we just had someone today learn that killing dragons doesn't automatically turn some of them into zombies.)

 

Between the different odds on different days, the best ways to max out zombie chances, and the fact that you can unlock encyclopedia sprites with just their tombstones, zombies are chock full of secret mechanics. I think having a hidden passive bonus fits into their system fine, plus it means less work for TJ to write up words for.

[Lost_Unicorn]

10 hours ago, Shadowdrake said:

(Before you say that's ridiculous, we just had someone today learn that killing dragons doesn't automatically turn some of them into zombies.)

No, that's completely understandable. Things like this are the reason to advocate for transparency of the game.
 

 

11 hours ago, Shadowdrake said:

Between the different odds on different days, the best ways to max out zombie chances, and the fact that you can unlock encyclopedia sprites with just their tombstones, zombies are chock full of secret mechanics.

I know all the game is like that, it's not of a concern to many and there are people who like figuring out stuff, but I still decided to point out something what could be taken as an issue.
(Sounds contradictory though? 🤔 Maybe I shouldn't have said it, but whatever now)

[FeatheryWings]

Although I like the unique mechanics you propose in some way, I dislike the idea in this case because of the reason that this bonus basically will reward (directly for the first case and indirectly for second) the people who do not attempt revivals often and the people who attempt for revivals more often will only get a much smaller bonus. 

 

Now I don't like this idea because it is kind of discouraging for people who attempt zombies in a regular basis as waiting and then months later trying for a zombie would basically make it more efficient if you care about getting a specific dragon to be zumbed. 

 

As someone who has been liking the recent increase of people who regularly attempt for zombies and even zombie lines, I'd be sad to see a new mechanic cause a drop on these numbers. I also find it a nasty trade-off as it basically means that if you like to regularly attempt for zombies, this mechanic ensures that you'll never have an as good chance on zombifying some specific dragons you wish as those who don't regularly go for zombie attempts. I am basically against any kind of mechanics that might reward the players who don't attempt something to those who have been putting more effort to it.

 

I know that it is very frustrating to have your very special zombie fodders fail, especially those you have been putting all your hopes for, but I think this would not be a nice method to give you more chances on that. If it was not related to the zombie attempts you made, I'd be supporting that. In this specific mechanic's case it might be something as simple as having a bonus that builds up every 6 months, without any conditions, which you can freely use on a fodder to increase its chances of turning. Or maybe even a bonus that you can buy with a certain amount of shards. Anything that might not be directly/indirectly punishing the regular attempters.

[MissK.]

I agree with FeatheryWings. While I'm all for suggestions to make zombies less of an absolute pain, this seems a bit backwards to me. The chances of summoning a GoN increase the more you try and fail, right? Why would this work the opposite way and essentialy penalize the players who put the most effort into it? Right now it's incredibly frustrating getting zombies even if you basically do it full time; I spent a good amount of time exclusively raising hatchlings, letting most die, and killing the remaining adult fodder twice every month for lack of something else to do at some point, and it was still a huge pain with the terrible odds we have now. By increasing chances for the people only trying occasionally, at best you even out the playing field, which is not only a bit unfair but also still frustratingly slow. 

 

Personally I would consider this if the boost happened in the same ways as GoN instead of the other way around, but I feel like the zombie system needs more of an overhaul anyway, whether that's in terms of kill slots, better odds, an added different mechanic or preferably a combination of those.