The Fifth Element Lineage

[Xocowolf]

I only managed to catch six, I have room for another Caligene egg/hatchie.

 

As for the voting, put me down for YES in LIFE. They cause life forms in their presence to waste away.

[airaani]

I'm gonna hold off on opening the vote until we see if there is any additional info from the creator, as often happens. Remember when voting that we like to see 3 different characteristics to fit into an elemental category!

 

So far, I'm seeing 2 for life... they make life waste away around them, and they disappear entirely in winter and spring.

[silver_tiger]

I'd like at least three more Caligenes myself... I'm trying to get to ten. I'm still hoping to catch an egg or two in the AP, though.

 

I'd like to see if there's more info as well. The malignant force certainly seems extremely elemental, as well as how strongly they're influenced by the seasons, but I'm not sure if there's really enough to include them in the lineage.

[Kaiserf11]

I know I haven't been really active on the forums lately, but been fixing my spreadsheets and all, plus have had a couple tests and projects at college so, didn't really had much time. Though I managed to get three pairs of the new dragons influenced them all to have CB pais

 

Anyway, I've read their description and I do think they are kind of elemental~ish, they do sound death oriented but they are also influenced by the seasons so, I think that counts as a plus for them to be elemental.

 

Also! Look what I got on my first day after being egglocked: https://dragcave.net/lineage/D205f

That's my 3rd CB Thunder right there!

[Lastalda]

Managed to trade 5 CB Caligenes (including the 2 from Zelda's wife) plus some of my own stuff, for 6 elemental 3rd gen prizes for the lineage (4 of them as IOUs).

Now I hope that the genders of the Caligenes I got onto my scroll will still work out to 4 pairs.

Edited November 4, 2015 by Lastalda

[Lastalda]

Opening the voting poll on the Caligenes!

 

All members are welcome to vote, but please read the following definitions carefully. Ideally we would like a breed to have 3 characteristics to qualify for an Elemental category, so if giving a YES vote please state your reasoning along with it. You may not compare a new release to an already eligible breed. They must be voted in on their own merit.

 

EARTH - Dragons comprised of, resembling, or able to control rock, metal, and/or dirt, POSSIBLY residing in the earth. For example, a stone dragon is made of stone-like material AND eats rocks. Green dragons live within the caves AND have control over the earth.

 

WIND - Dragons comprised of gas or with a strong connection to weather or the cosmos. POSSIBLY those that spend a majority of their time in the air. For example, grey dragons land only to rest and eat AND they have control of the weather. Thunder dragons land only to sleep and breed. They get moisture from the clouds and control the weather.

 

FIRE - Dragons who control or are comprised of fire or electricity. Also those that resemble fire or the sun or which are controlled by or strongly tied to the sun. For example, magma dragons are coated in magma, live in volcanic regions AND are capable of withstanding intense temperatures. Sunsongs control light AND are controlled by the light.

 

WATER - Dragons who control or are comprised of water in either it's liquid or solid state. Also those that live the entirety of their lives in the water. For example, ice dragons form icicles on their skin, and can freeze a predator with their cold breath.

 

LIFE - Dragons who rely on or are affected by a very specific part of nature, which must be different than the majority of other breeds. Dragons who possess mana pertaining to magical, mental or spiritual control or consisting of magic in a way that is different from other breeds, or having a significant positive role in the world that is different from other breeds, or having a significant effect on a very specific part of nature, which must be different than the majority of other breeds, including both positive and negative effects. For example, a qualifier can not be that the dragon depends on living in the trees alone. But Pumpkin dragons would qualify because they live specifically in pumpkins AND can only be bred during Harvest time.

 

 

Dragon Description:

Caligene Dragons have long been considered omens of death—reinforced by the skeletal markings on their bodies. They exert a malignant force on the world around them, causing other living things to slowly waste away in their presence. Caligenes favor the seasons of summer and autumn, disappearing entirely from the forests they inhabit during winter and spring. These malevolent dragons are physically weak, though this is countered by their natural stealthiness and alarming speed—enabling them to close in on large targets quickly and silently to create ambushes from which prey cannot escape.

 

Additional Info from the wiki:

I wasn't actually aware calligare was a word, I just modified it from caliginous (also of Latin origin and means essentially the same thing...)!

 

~~

So, "a while" ended being "in a few hours" but anyway...some short bits of info

 

The design is based on this species of death's head hawkmoth. :3

 

They do have four eyes. Caligenes don't like bright light (like sunlight or fire), so they're principally nocturnal. They don't come out during the day unless it's sufficiently dark (for example, heavy canopy that blocks out a lot of the sunlight).

 

They communicate largely with body language.

 

Females are a bit taller and a bit more stockily built.

 

((Quote: So, this 'malignant force' they give off- is it a conscious thing, or are they sorta radioactive?))

Conscious. :3

 

 

yes - Xocowolf (Life), Fiona (Life), silver_chan (Life), Ryu (Life), airaani (Life)

no - Lastalda, Cathie

 

Edited November 10, 2015 by Lastalda

[silver_tiger]

I think that, given they're apparently in control of this malignant force they give off, as well as their connection to the seasons, they barely squeak by as a Life dragon. I'm voting 'yes' on them in LIFE.

 

...also I forgot to influence so now I have mostly girl Caligenes. Oh well.

[Fiona]

I think I'm going to vote yes in Life for caligenes. Yes because:

 

1. They exert an "anti-life" force that drains life from others around them

2. This draining force is magical in nature

3. It is under conscious control

 

The fact that they are seasonal dragons would be an additional minor factor, plus they avoid light due to photosensitivity. (which is anti-fire I think)

[Grandmother_cathie]

I'm voting no.

[Lastalda]

I think they have some Life tendencies, but to me, those are not really strong enough to accept them, so I'm voting No.

[airaani]

Ehhh this is tough. I like them for Life, but with their seasonal thing, and their malignant force, I still feel like there should be a third thing.

Abstaining until I can think this over a bit more.

[Kaiserf11]

I'm voting YES and on LIFE because of:

 

1.- Their anti-life force, may be contradictory to want them in LIFE due t this but I think there is were they fit better anyway.

2.- They do control that anti-life force so we can assume they choose who or what to kill without actually using their physical abilities which I can only consider magic, so another vote for LIFE in my opinion.

3.- Their seasonal influenced behavior.

[airaani]

Milestone gifted!

GIFTER: Lastalda

RECEIVER: airaani

GIFT: CB nebula

MILESTONE: 15 moonstones

Thank you Lastalda!

 

Also, I have been remiss in reporting, Fiona has also been sending me nebbies <3

 

Milestone gifted!

GIFTER: Fiona

RECEIVER: airaani

GIFT: CB nebula

MILESTONE: 15 neotropicals

 

Milestone gifted!

GIFTER: Fiona

RECEIVER: airaani

GIFT: CB nebula

MILESTONE: 15 pumpkins

[Lastalda]

Milestone Sheet updated.

 

I'll leave the voting on Caligenes open until Thursday, to announce the result on Friday.

 

Meanwhile, I'd love some more input on the current state of the New Milestones, especially the "Requestable Gifts" column, but also the 6th vs 7th gen Leeloos (and everything else, of course).

Edited November 9, 2015 by Lastalda

[airaani]

After much deliberation, I think I will vote Yes in Life.

[silver_tiger]

I like the new milestone rules! I definitely appreciate that you left the 6th gen Leelo in, and I like the reward changes. Thank you for working that out for us!

 

Also this reminds me I really really need to get back into breeding more. Halloween prep and the holiday itself really knocked me out of my rhythm.

[Lastalda]

The vote on Calligenes is now CLOSED!

Votes: 5 yes / 7 votes = 71% is lower than the required 75%.

 

At this point, we will NOT add Calligenes to the lineage.

As always, if you feel strongly about them, feel free to bring them (or other breeds) up again next time we vote on another breed.

[Lastalda]

I'm currently working on the wording of the new Milestones, and have just stumbled:

 

4f. Members who complete an even 4th gen Wyvern Leeloo Element containing 8 different CB wyvern breeds (nebula, hellfire, copper, falconiform, gold wyvern). All 8 CB's must be on your scroll, with at least one of each pair containing an Elemental name. You must use all 5 breeds, but the other 3 can be your choice of nebula and/or copper color variation.

 

The wiki also lists Tsunamis, Spirit Wards and Waverunners as wyverns. So shouldn't we incorporate these, too?

Should we keep the milestone striclty diverse, meaning you can only use one Nebula and one Copper, or should we just specify "any 8 different Wyvern breeds"?

 

~~~

 

Also, about the "all standard-available breeds" Milestone. We currently have:

4e. Members having 54/66 eligible breeds appropriately named on their scroll (not including Pumpkins, shallows, tinsels, heartseekers, ghost walkers, summons, winter magi, or shimmers)

 

I wanted to replace this with something more generally-worded, so the numbers don't have to be updated all the time. Something like "all routinely available breeds (everything except GoN, holidays and prizes)".

But then I wondered whether we actually need this restriction anymore at all? Since we can now keep an unlimited number of holiday dragons, it shouldn't be too difficult to get one of each Holiday registered (requesting 2nd gens from project members is pretty easy, as experience shows). And getting bred prizes is very easy if you're not concerned about very low gen.

I can see making an exception for GoNs, since we're restricted to 3 per scroll, so I'm willing to leave these out. But everything else should, I think, be ok to require for this milestone.

 

Thoughts?

Edited November 17, 2015 by Lastalda

[Zeldarax]

I'm currently working on the wording of the new Milestones, and have just stumbled:

 

 

 

The wiki also lists Tsunamis, Spirit Wards and Waverunners as wyverns. So shouldn't we incorporate these, too?

Should we keep the milestone striclty diverse, meaning you can only use one Nebula and one Copper, or should we just specify "any 8 different Wyvern breeds"?

 

~~~

 

Also, about the "all standard-available breeds" Milestone. We currently have:

 

 

I wanted to replace this with something more generally-worded, so the numbers don't have to be updated all the time. Something like "all routinely available breeds (everything except GoN, holidays and prizes)".

But then I wondered whether we actually need this restriction anymore at all? Since we can now keep an unlimited number of holiday dragons, it shouldn't be too difficult to get one of each Holiday registered (requesting 2nd gens from project members is pretty easy, as experience shows). And getting bred prizes is very easy if you're not concerned about very low gen.

I can see making an exception for GoNs, since we're restricted to 3 per scroll, so I'm willing to leave these out. But everything else should, I think, be ok to require for this milestone.

 

Thoughts?

I agree with both suggestions, they are making sense.

[Lastalda]

Er... in the case of the Wyvern-milestone, there were actually 2 suggestions ("as diverse as possible" (meaning you can only use one Copper) vs. "any 8 wyvern breeds"), so a preference there would be helpful, as they both make sense in their way...

Edited November 17, 2015 by Lastalda

[airaani]

The wiki also lists Tsunamis, Spirit Wards and Waverunners as wyverns. So shouldn't we incorporate these, too?

Should we keep the milestone striclty diverse, meaning you can only use one Nebula and one Copper, or should we just specify "any 8 different Wyvern breeds"?

 

~~~

 

I wanted to replace this with something more generally-worded, so the numbers don't have to be updated all the time. Something like "all routinely available breeds (everything except GoN, holidays and prizes)".

But then I wondered whether we actually need this restriction anymore at all? Since we can now keep an unlimited number of holiday dragons, it shouldn't be too difficult to get one of each Holiday registered (requesting 2nd gens from project members is pretty easy, as experience shows). And getting bred prizes is very easy if you're not concerned about very low gen.

I can see making an exception for GoNs, since we're restricted to 3 per scroll, so I'm willing to leave these out. But everything else should, I think, be ok to require for this milestone.

 

Thoughts?

I think 'as diverse as possible' is in the spirit of the original wyvern milestone, so let's use that.

 

~~~

 

As far as the 'all breeds' milestone goes, I think holidays and GoNs should be left out. It's not that it's hard to get the holidays, but what if someone joined the lineage right now? They'd have to wait an entire year to be able to get that milestone, no matter how dedicated they are. While it's not a bad thing to have milestones that take time to achieve, they should take time because you're working on something complicated (i.e. leeloo), not because you're twiddling your thumbs until it's the right single week out of the year.

Prizes can be included because it's quite easy to get them now. I for one am always willing to breed elemental prizes as long as the gen isn't a factor. Most of mine are nice lines anyway.

 

My two cents.

[silver_tiger]

I also think we should go for 'diverse as possible'. It's more interesting, and it would give the poor Coastal Waverunners some recognition! Idk, I just feel like they're overlooked a lot because they're not as 'pretty' as some other breeds. I'm probably wrong /laugh.

 

As for the all-available breeds, I agree with airaani that Holidays should be left out. They're hard to grab unless the right time of year is around; plus, all the Holiday dragons in the lineage are already named, so simply changing it to 'Holidays' is a pretty good way to do it.

I also agree on the Prizes being easy to get, I have several I could try breeding for anyone who asked nicely :3

[Lastalda]

Sounds reasonable to me.

 

Ok, so this is the new Milestone post as I have it now. I have tried to compile the repetitive parts that apply to all milestones into a 'general rules' preamble. My hope is that this way, it's easier to see what makes each milestone unique.

 

~~~

 

General Milestone Rules:

 

(1) The counting of Elemental generations starts with the oldest dragon in a lineage which carries an Elemental name.

(2) All number-of-elements milestones refer to dragons you have registered on your spreadsheet.

(3) All bred milestones must always be bred completely from CBs on your own scroll, except where otherwise specified.

(4) All bred milestones must be “unrelated” to your other bred milestones, except where otherwise specified. Dragons count as “unrelated” if they have no 2nd+ gens in common. (The same CBs can be used to breed “unrelated” milestones.)

(5) Instead of a CB gift, it is always possible to request a lineaged dragon of up to one category higher, or a CB of any lower category. Requesting specific lineages is ok, within reason (you cannot request a 2nd gen prize-kin, for example). When in doubt, ask.

Exception: For categories 12 and 13, you can alternatively request anything of category 9 and lower.

(6) A Leeloo is always an even-gen dragon where all CBs are of a different eligible breed.

(7) For all even-gen milestones, including Leeloos, at least one member of each CB pair must have an Elemental name, except where otherwise specified. All 2nd+ gens must have an Elemental name.

(8) For Leeloos of 6th or higher gen, you may include 2nd gen offspring from CB prizes (or CB hybrids that cannot be bred from elemental parents), even if the parents are not on your scroll and not elementally named. These 2nd gens can, but do not have to, be the same breed as their prize/hybrid parent.

 

Milestones:

 

Category 1 milestones:

a. Having 15 total Elements registered.

b. Having registered Elements in all 5 elemental categories.

c. Breeding a 5th gen Elemental dragon from your own scroll.

 

Category 1 Gifts

CB eggs:

• day/night glory drake

• magi

• purple ridgewing

• red

• seasonal

• vine

• white

 

Category 2 milestones:

a. Having 50 total Elements registered.

b. Having registered at least one dragon for every available breed within 1 elemental category. This milestone may be repeated once for each category.

c. Breeding a 5th gen stairstep using one CB from each of the 5 Elemental categories.

 

Category 1 Gifts

CB eggs:

• blue opal

• golden wyvern

• nebula

• pyrope pyralspite

• tsunami

 

Category 3 milestones:

a. Having 100 total Elements registered.

b. Having registered 50 Elements in a single elemental category. This milestone may be repeated once for each category.

c. Having registered 15 Elements of a single breed. This milestone may be repeated once for each breed.

d. Breeding a 10th gen Elemental dragon from your own scroll. You may use a claimed 5th gen to build your 10th gen.

e. Breeding a 4th gen Leeloo where all CBs belong to the same Elemental category.

 

Category 3 Gifts

CB eggs:

• green opal

• ice

• magma

• tan ridgewing

• thunder

 

Category 4 milestones:

a. Having 200 total Elements registered.

b. Having registered 100 Elements in a single elemental category. This milestone may be repeated once for each category.

c. Having registered 50 Elements of a single breed. This milestone may be repeated once for each breed.

d. Breeding a 15th gen Elemental dragon from your own scroll. You may use a claimed 10th gen to build your 15th gen.

e. Breeding a 4th gen Wyvern Leeloo containing 8 different CB wyvern breeds (copper, falconiform, golden wyvern, hellfire, nebula, spirit ward, tsunami, waverunner). All breeds must be used at least once (coppers count as one breed for this milestone), but you can choose which color of nebula and copper to use.

f. Breeding an even 5th gen using 4 purebred (PB) 3rd gens - 1 from each of 4 Elemental categories. You may choose which 4 of the 5 categories to represent.

 

Category 4 Gifts

Bred hatchies:

• alt undine

• alt vine

 

Category 5 milestones:

a. Having 300 total Elements registered.

b. Having registered 200 Elements in a single elemental category. This milestone may be repeated once for each category.

c. Having registered 100 Elements of a single breed. This milestone may be repeated once for each breed.

d. Having registered at least one dragon of each routinely available breed (all except GoN, Holidays or Thuwed hellhorse).

e. Breeding a 20th gen Elemental dragon from your own scroll. You may use a claimed 15th gen to build your 20th gen.

f. Breeding a 4th even gen seasonal Element, alternating each generation with a different season.

g. Breeding an even 5th gen Element containing only breeds within a single Elemental category (for example, you can arrange 16 CB green, stone, silver, and gold in any combination to complete a 5th Earth).

h. Breeding an even 5th gen Element containing only drakes.

i. Breeding an even 5th gen Element containing only pygmies/pumpkins. CB pumpkins and their mates can be on another scroll and then need not be elementally named.

 

Category 5 Gifts

CB eggs:

• any xenowyrm

Bred eggs:

• 2nd gen silver

 

Category 6 milestones:

a. Having 500 total Elements registered.

b. Having registered 400 Elements in a single elemental category. This milestone may be repeated once for each category.

c. Having registered 300 Elements of a single breed. This milestone may be repeated once for each breed.

d. Breeding a 25th gen Elemental dragon from your own scroll. You may use a claimed 20th gen to build your 25th gen.

e. Breeding a 5th gen 'perfect' (even-gen and purebred) Element.

f. Breeding a 5th even gen Blue Leeloo Element containing 16 blue breeds. All bred dragons in the lineage must be blue, as well. May contain 2nd gen offspring from a CB silver and his mate, who are on another scroll (these need not be elementally named).

List as of Nov. 2015 (30 breeds): astrapi xenowyrm, bleeding moon, blue lunar heralds, chrono xenowyrm, daydream, deep sea, electric, falconiform, frostbite, guardian of nature, hellfire (female), ice, moonstone, nebula (blue female), nocturne, purple ridgewing, red-finned tidal, royal blue, silver (male), skywing, solstice, spirit ward, spitfire, striped river, thunder, tsunami wyvern, water, waterhorse, waverunner, winter)

 

Category 6 Gifts

CB eggs:

• 2nd gen gold

 

Category 7 milestones:

a. Breeding an Element containing all standard-breedable eligible breeds (not including drakes, Thuwed hybrids, prizes, or holidays). You may use AP finds for this one, but it must contain at least 32 breeds from your own scroll. This milestone can be combined with failed breedings for other goals as long as breeds used in those lineages are still represented elsewhere.

b. Breeding a 5th gen Rainbow Leeloo Element, containing any 16 different eligible CB breeds from your own scroll, with the CBs arranged in rainbow order.

 

Category 7 Gifts

CB eggs:

• spessartine pyralspite

• liver of sulfur copper

 

Category 8 milestones:

a. Breeding a 6th gen Leeloo Element, containing any 32 different eligible CB breeds from your own scroll.

 

Category 8 Gifts

CB eggs:

• rainbow copper

• verdigris copper

Bred eggs:

• 4th gen prize

 

Category 9 milestones:

a. Breeding a 7th gen Nonmetallic Leeloo Element, containing any 64 different eligible CB breeds from your own scroll.

 

Category 9 Gifts

CB eggs:

• almandine pyralspite

Bred eggs:

• 3rd gen prize

 

Category 10 milestones:

a. Breeding a 7th gen Metallic Leeloo Element, containing any 64 different eligible CB breeds from your own scroll. This Element must have 1 silver and 1 gold in the starting base. If they are from your scroll, the resulting 2nd gen can be either common or metallic (they can also be bred with each other, if you want). If they are not from your scroll, the resulting 2nd gen must be metallic. 2nd gen prizes may be substituted for 2nd gen metallic, if you are lucky enough to get one!

 

Category 10 Gifts

CB eggs:

• silver

 

Category 11 milestones:

a. Breeding a 7th gen All Inclusive Leeloo Element, containing any 64 different eligible CB breeds from your own scroll. This Element must contain all our ‘alt’ breeds in all incarnations, ideally bred from each other (seasonals, ridgewings, sunrise/sunset, coppers, xenowyrms, lunar heralds, and all our hybrids that are breedable from 5E parents (incl. avatars)).

There is a chart here. (Many thanks to Fiona!)

 

Category 11 Gifts

CB eggs:

• gold

 

Category 12 milestones:

a. Having gifted 10 milestones.

 

Category 12 Gifts

Bred eggs:

• 4th gen descended from a CB Thuwed shallow water

• 4th gen descended from a CB Thuwed hellhorse

 

Category 13 milestones:

a. Having gifted 25 milestones.

 

Category 13 Gifts

Bred eggs:

• 3rd gen descended from a CB Thuwed shallow water

• 3rd gen descended from a CB Thuwed hellhorse

 

~~~~~~

 

Please discuss!

Edited November 20, 2015 by Lastalda

[airaani]

It looks great! I really love having the rules up at the top, it really helps to streamline the milestones themselves.

 

Side note: ARHGLBLGRHLB. I can not breed an undine to save my life. I'm being weird and I want an alt undine in my all-inclusive leeloo, but no matter what I mate them with I can't get undine eggs!

At this rate I'll have to rearrange my whole plan to get a metal free to use. And then I'll get a 2nd gen metal egg, watch

[silver_tiger]

The only side note I see is we don't really need the Thuwed Shallow Water rule. Now that Magi are in the lineage, anyone can breed a Shallow Water with enough time and patience and dragon cooperation.

 

If you intended to keep that because tbf Thuwed dragons of any kind are very neat, that is just fine. Looks good, carry on, etc.

 

(also if this has been discussed and I just missed it, just ignore me lol)