The Allure of Neglected Dragons

[bbik]

Edit for two small clarification points:

- If there is money available above the cost for a single year, it will either be saved for the next year's renewal, or be used towards purchasing multiple years up front, depending on the amount.

- I intend to hold off on purchasing the hosting until I have as much of the site redone as I can, before it gets too close to the current site going offline.  Once the new version is up and running, I will post to let everyone know.

FYI.

 

 

Alright, so one might better do a hard refresh before hitting that button.

That shouldn't be necessary, but it never hurts. As long as the button says "Support AoND", it'll be the right one.

[Ruby Eyes]

How's the hosting plans going?

 

 

Bug report:

In the egg ER, there are codes of two eggs that do not exist: XwFEv and 477ZK

Problem with them is, the removal function doesn't work on non-existing eggs.

[bbik]

How's the hosting plans going?

 

 

Bug report:

In the egg ER, there are codes of two eggs that do not exist: XwFEv and 477ZK

Problem with them is, the removal function doesn't work on non-existing eggs.

The false codes are out. Not sure what happened there.

 

 

Hosting has been purchased. Website progress has been very nearly at a standstill otherwise, though, thanks to business trips and weekend events and the like. I'm hoping I can catch up on sleep enough tonight and tomorrow that I can maybe get a little more done again before Easter comes around to screw things up again this weekend. And someday I'll get you guys a more detailed update, as well, but for now, at least it's not forgotten!

[Confused Cat]

Will we some day be able to remove eggs from the ER without fogging them?

[Ylvanne]

Will we some day be able to remove eggs from the ER without fogging them?

I'd truly like that.

 

And....

Wondering if would it be possible to add scroll security? So you need to add your Dragcave pass to add your eggs, or be logged in on drag cave for at least one time on that specific computer...

 

I'd been viewbombed greatly recently, and I think that might help a lot u.u

[rabbithaver]

I posted this on another thread, but it would be a good thing for this fansite to consider.

Oh, a good alternative is that you need to create an account on dragondump that you link with your DC scroll. That way no one else can add your eggs, and you wouldn't need your DC password.

[Ruby Eyes]

Anyone can create an account and pretend that scroll X belongs to them, that wouldn't protect anyone.

 

Nah, scroll security like Evina's is using it would be better. Evina's isn't getting any access to anyone's password, and they don't need to handle accounts this way, just set a cookie after the player confirming on DC itself that they are actually the scroll's owner (and a mini table somewhere that says scroll X is using scroll security).

[bbik]

Will we some day be able to remove eggs from the ER without fogging them?

Wondering if would it be possible to add scroll security?

Both are already on the list, hopefully in time for the site migration, but we'll see how things work out.

 

In fact, I have a question about this for all of you! How would you feel about having to confirm your DC identity before being able to add an ER by code? Security for the daycare would be separate, and optional on a scroll-by-scroll basis; only code-based ER-adding would always require security.

 

I know plenty of people like being able to ER by code, but I also know there are people who never want to deal with security, ever. The second group would still be able to add ERs without security; they would just have to do so through their unsecured scroll. How do people feel about this approach as a compromise?

[Ruby Eyes]

Could you make that dependent on that "acceptaid" field? As in, only request your identity if the egg's owner does not accept help?

[Confused Cat]

Is AoND down for anybody else?

I get "Firefox can't find the server at www.coup-detat.info". Other websites work fine.

 

I know it's not down for everyone, because downforeveryoneorjustme says it's just me. But my phone can't find the site, either, so the problem ist not just on one computer or one IP address.

[rubyshoes]

Is AoND down for anybody else?

I get "Firefox can't find the server at www.coup-detat.info". Other websites work fine.

 

I know it's not down for everyone, because downforeveryoneorjustme says it's just me. But my phone can't find the site, either, so the problem ist not just on one computer or one IP address.

It's working fine for me.

[Nakeisha]

Is AoND down for anybody else?

I get "Firefox can't find the server at www.coup-detat.info". Other websites work fine.

 

I know it's not down for everyone, because downforeveryoneorjustme says it's just me. But my phone can't find the site, either, so the problem ist not just on one computer or one IP address.

It's down for me as well.

[Ruby Eyes]

It was inaccessible for me roughly an hour ago, but now I can get to it. Maybe there's traffic jam in the intertubes somewhere.

[Confused Cat]

Now it's back for me, too. Whew.

[painless_j]

Still down for me

[Tigerkralle]

Try to delete your cache and cookies?

[pinkgothic]

I'm guessing this is just me, but I wanted to mention it: When I submit my dragons and I wait for the page to load, Chrome hangs in the status processing request and doesn't load up any Dragon Cave images. This seems like a Chrome bug to me, but it's not happening anywhere else, and I can't find anything about what might be causing it. Searching only nets me posts that look like red herrings to me, e.g. mentioning the limit of simultaneous downloading connections to a server (every fansite is affected by this limit, there's no reason NDER would react to it with processing request when the others don't).

 

Anyway, no action necessary; unless you can reproduce it and feel like investigating, that is.

 

(It's been happening for about two weeks, approximately. Sometimes I can force it to load the page by re-submitting my dragons, but only very rarely.)

 

[ Edit: To clarify, the view rotator works fine. It's really just the post-submission page that's wonky like this, for reasons currently opaque to me. ]

Edited April 17, 2015 by pinkgothic

[bbik]

Could you make that dependent on that "acceptaid" field? As in, only request your identity if the egg's owner does not accept help?

That could be an option too, perhaps. I'll have to see how that would affect the other ideas I had tied in with it. Would people prefer if it worked that way?

 

@pinkgothic: That's... odd? I'm not really sure what to say about that, beyond that I'm definitely not going to spend the time looking into it unless/until it continues with the new site.

 

 

@Everyone: I'm estimating that the current site/URL has a maximum 1-2 months before it goes poof.

 

I have purchased the new URL and hosting. Since doing that, I have had next to no time to work on anything, though, between business travel, illnesses, holidays, post-winter chores, and now a very sick cat. I am still hoping to at least get the barebones Daycare/ER parts of the new site online before the current one goes away, but unfortunately, I have little expectation that I will be able to do any more than that in time. I don't want it to be gone forever, but it may be a multi-step process to get everything back online, and I'll probably skip importing old data in the interest of getting it up and running again sooner. So, I would suggest that everyone who has data saved on the site (especially those who use the Trackers) make a copy of that data sometime between now and mid-May so they don't lose it.

 

As soon as I have something useable online, I'll post a link so you can all start transitioning. I'll also try to post a warning on the site itself. Cross your fingers for no more complications so I can finally get this thing done!

[Jedi40]

So, I would suggest that everyone who has data saved on the site (especially those who use the Trackers) make a copy of that data sometime between now and mid-May so they don't lose it.

 

As soon as I have something useable online, I'll post a link so you can all start transitioning.  I'll also try to post a warning on the site itself.  Cross your fingers for no more complications so I can finally get this thing done!

Not sure how to do this

 

 

(Ruby Eyes @ Apr 15 2015, 04:16 AM)

Could you make that dependent on that "acceptaid" field? As in, only request your identity if the egg's owner does not accept help?

But would we who enter our own eggs still be able to add on our own eggs like we have been able to do so far?

 

 

[purplehaze]

I use the trackers for Fertility, Influence, and Incubation. I am not sure how to save the information, so I would probably just have to recreate those trackers later. I hope they are not unavailable for long because I so much prefer them to the mess that you get when you temp sort for available BSAs on the main DC site!

 

This is my very favorite site, so I hope it will get back to full functionality soon. Besides the trackers, and of course the daycare and ER, I also use the lineage viewer and inbred checker a lot!

[bbik]

Not sure how to do this 

Highlight the Tracker tables (or whatever else you might want) and copy/paste them into Excel, Google Docs, Notepad... Or write the parts that are important to you in a notebook. Or however you want to store it until it can be put back on AoND. It'll be a manual process, however you choose to do it, so do whatever works best/easiest for you.

 

But would we who enter our own eggs still be able to add on our own eggs like we have been able to do so far?

I believe what Ruby was suggesting was this:

 

Case A: Dragon accepts aid

* No login required

* Anyone can add the dragon

 

Case B: Dragon does NOT accept aid

* Login required

* Anyone logged in can add the dragon

=> Still not restricted to the owner, but at least restricts it to a DC player, and allows it to be tracked if necessary

 

The lack of owner restriction for ER code adding isn't so much a suggestion from Ruby, as a restriction based on the available information. The owner can't be reliably confirmed by code, because the API doesn't provide that information when the scroll name is hidden. So rather than forcing people to change their visibility settings on DC, the ER-adding would be left a bit more flexible. For the same reason of potentially forcing DC setting changes, I'm a bit reluctant to treat accepting aid or not differently, but I think those may be unique enough that it'd be reasonable. Worst case, perhaps we do a trial run one way, and see how it goes, and change it to the other way later if necessary.

 

I use the trackers for Fertility, Influence, and Incubation. ... I hope they are not unavailable for long ... Besides the trackers, and of course the daycare and ER, I also use the lineage viewer and inbred checker a lot!

Yeah, I use them all too. I don't want them to go away any more than any of you do. I just don't realistically see it all getting done in time, as things stand now. There might have been enough time, when I started it all, but then life happened... We'll see.

Edited April 23, 2015 by bbik

[purplehaze]

Yeah, I use them all too. I don't want them to go away any more than any of you do. I just don't realistically see it all getting done in time, as things stand now. There might have been enough time, when I started it all, but then life happened... We'll see.

Oh, I do understand how real life interferes and I don't want to put any more pressure on you than I am sure you already feel. I just hope things will not be unavailable for too long.

[Jedi40]

Highlight the Tracker tables (or whatever else you might want) and copy/paste them into Excel, Google Docs, Notepad... Or write the parts that are important to you in a notebook. Or however you want to store it until it can be put back on AoND. It'll be a manual process, however you choose to do it, so do whatever works best/easiest for you.

 

 

I believe what Ruby was suggesting was this:

 

Case A: Dragon accepts aid

* No login required

* Anyone can add the dragon

 

Case B: Dragon does NOT accept aid

* Login required

* Anyone logged in can add the dragon

=> Still not restricted to the owner, but at least restricts it to a DC player, and allows it to be tracked if necessary

 

The lack of owner restriction for ER code adding isn't so much a suggestion from Ruby, as a restriction based on the available information. The owner can't be reliably confirmed by code, because the API doesn't provide that information when the scroll name is hidden. So rather than forcing people to change their visibility settings on DC, the ER-adding would be left a bit more flexible. For the same reason of potentially forcing DC setting changes, I'm a bit reluctant to treat accepting aid or not differently, but I think those may be unique enough that it'd be reasonable. Worst case, perhaps we do a trial run one way, and see how it goes, and change it to the other way later if necessary.

 

 

Yeah, I use them all too. I don't want them to go away any more than any of you do. I just don't realistically see it all getting done in time, as things stand now. There might have been enough time, when I started it all, but then life happened... We'll see.

So if I don't use the Tracer tables I don't have to worry about this part correct? I just use the daycare and the ER (Once and a while)

 

 

Log into what the new site or your scroll if your not accepting outside help?

[Ruby Eyes]

I believe what Ruby was suggesting was this:

 

Case A: Dragon accepts aid

* No login required

* Anyone can add the dragon

 

Case B: Dragon does NOT accept aid

* Login required

* Anyone logged in can add the dragon

=> Still not restricted to the owner, but at least restricts it to a DC player, and allows it to be tracked if necessary

Actually, if I'm NOT accepting aid, I would prefer if other players could NOT add my scroll, no matter if they are on DC or not.

 

Either way, if someone enters their scroll and is logged in with that name, they should be able to remove any ERs that are on their scroll. This is what has been requested, right? Removing ERs without first fogging them ...

 

Once a player is logged in, you can optionally set a cookie. That way, players wouldn't need to log in all the time, only once in X weeks or so, as long as they don't toss their cookies.

 

The lack of owner restriction for ER code adding isn't so much a suggestion from Ruby, as a restriction based on the available information.  The owner can't be reliably confirmed by code, because the API doesn't provide that information when the scroll name is hidden.  So rather than forcing people to change their visibility settings on DC, the ER-adding would be left a bit more flexible.  For the same reason of potentially forcing DC setting changes, I'm a bit reluctant to treat accepting aid or not differently, but I think those may be unique enough that it'd be reasonable.

As far as I can see, that's exactly what that "acceptaid" thing is for - why else would the API provide this? When you're accepting aid, it doesn't matter if you show your scrollname or not - people can take care of your eggs if you need help. If you feel like you're doing well on your own, you do not "accept aid" - you set it and forget it, and deal with fansites on your own.

 

It's different with your username, which you sometimes may need to display for forum game reasons and sometimes want to hide in order to avoid being bothered regarding a egg you currently have on hands.

 

It's also different from hiding your entire scroll, because doing so also disables yourself to add your own scroll to a fansite. Currently, a player under viewbomber attack (or view-depriving attack) is forced to hide and unhide their entire scroll every time they want to deal with fansites because only one (1!) of the many fansites actually enables them to control access to their scroll, and none (0!) bother reading and dealing with the acceptaid flag.

 

 

Now, that's just my view on the use of settings ... I do have a few ideas regarding implementations.

 

So, someone enters a scroll name.

 

If scroll/egg owner accepts aid:

- Leave things as they are today: everyone can add and remove regular growing things, and add ERs.

- Make logging in (per session or set cookie) optional for ER removals {owner login only? any DC player?}.

 

If scroll/egg owner does not accept aid:

- Require logging in or check session / cookie. If login/session/cookie matches the scroll entered, proceed as usual, ER removals included.

 

 

So, someone enters a single to the ER.

 

If egg owner accepts aid:

- Leave things as they are today: everyone can add ERs.

 

If egg owner does not accept aid and does display username:

- Require logging in or check session / cookie. If login/session/cookie matches the scroll entered, proceed as usual.

 

If egg owner does not accept aid and does not display username:

- refuse adding to the ER - many trades have been spoiled by an untimely ERing done by someone else.

(Obviously, there are still enough other sites out there which would accept that egg, but you gotta start somewhere ...)

 

 

For a more refined interface, you could create a table with user settings, e.g.

allow

- anyone

- logged-in players

- only myself

to

- manage my scroll (excluding ERs)

- add ERs only (for ND experiments)

- remove ERs

Defaults for someone logging in for the first time could depend on "acceptaid", like "allow anyone to manage my scroll and add ERs" for those who accept, and "allow only myself to do everything" for those who don't accept aid.

Of course, someone who doesn't accept aid yould still allow everyone to do everything - but it would be verified by that person themselves via a one-time login (set and forget).

(That table might also need a "last used" date field so that users who haven't used the site in a period of time can be pruned from that table.)

 

 

Obviously, all of that would probably take more time than you have available. Personally, I would be glad if the site could just consider the acceptaid flag at all, via scroll owner's login.

Edited April 23, 2015 by Ruby Eyes

[bbik]

Following up on one of my earlier posts...

 

The Allure of Neglected Dragons will probably be going offline...

 

... But hopefully it will be very temporary!

 

Here's the deal:

 

The current website is on a domain and a hosting plan sponsored by Agrona. Agrona has since quit DC, and I have not been able to reach her in the past few months. If she does not have both the hosting and the domain set to auto-renew (which I'm guessing she doesn't), they will be expiring any time now -- I don't know precisely when, but I expect it to happen any time between right now and a couple months from now.

 

Updated website code, which I have been wanting to do for ages, is well underway, but there is still so much more work to do.

 

A new website, using the updated code, will be going online as soon as I can get enough finished for it to be usable. Thanks to AoND's wonderful donors, I was able to purchase a new domain, and also new hosting. I will post the new URL as soon as there is something functional online. I am hoping I get that done before the current site goes offline, so I can make it a proper redirect, but if that does not work, check this thread for news.

 

In the meantime, feel free to continue using AoND as usual. However, I strongly recommend that you make a copy of any data that you store on AoND -- especially if you use the Trackers. There is no automated way to do that, and I won't be spending the time to make something when I still need to get the new website ready to go, but you should be able to save the full web page, or highlight/copy/paste the data into a text file or spreadsheet without too much difficulty.

 

If there are any questions, I will do my best to answer them, but keep in mind that for the time being, my priority will be on getting the new website up and running, so responses may take a while. On which note, Ruby Eyes, I did read (most of) your post, and for a lot of it, I think I just wasn't clear with my last statements. Beyond that, let's see what you (and everyone else) think of what the new version offers, and then we'll adjust from there, once we have that as a starting point.

 

If there are any bugs (and I suspect the check all box is broken again), you are welcome to continue reporting them. I do not intend to fix any of them on the current site (again, the new site is my priority), but I will absolutely keep them in mind when working on the new version!

 

Thank you everyone for all of your support, patience, and help in making this site as useful, loved, and expansive as it is! I never expected it to become anything this significant, but I hope it continues for many years to come!