Abandoned Page Compendium - Display Suggestions

[olympe]

10 hours ago, schenanigans said:

The blacktip breeder has kept stats of her breedings and the blacktip percentages. For over a year. There is physical proof that she has improved the blacktip ratios. 

No, she hasn't. The people who've been stuck with raising her eggs have.

 

8 hours ago, Auriene said:

I am probably repeating myself, but I am going to repeat it ad nauseam:

 

10. Fix the ratios.

 

Any other solution would be little more than slap a Band-Aid on a much deeper problem.

 

I understand that people have various reasons for mass breeding, but honestly... 'One person's freedom ends where another person's freedom begins.' It surely takes a lot of effort to mass breed a wall that lasts for days, it takes a lot of work to keep records and to make a desirable impact on ratios (or rather, to force other players to make that impact by raising wall eggs). I can respect that, but... I'll be frank: seeing those regular walls of Blacktips and Celestials and sometimes also Nocturnes - often messy ones - makes me not want to build any lineages with them. Even with ratios fixed. Walls made me simply dislike those breeds, and I am not even as active in AP as many other players.

 

This, so very much. At least the breeding ratios. It's no fun breeding lineages of two breeds if you only ever get the newer one. It discourages breeding with new breeds, which aggravates the ratio problem. So, the way breeding ratios are handled at the moment are counter-productive at best.

 

37 minutes ago, Kila said:

Whether or not you agree with their reasoning or not they're taking the AP hostage and forcing people to either A. Wait for the wall the end or B. Raise all of the eggs that *they* bred.

You're taking the words out of my mouth. Or fingers. Whichever.

 

38 minutes ago, Kila said:

That's why this conversation is happening, not because "people are mad that one way of play has been taken away" but because the system has been outgrown by the playerbase, and it's not no longer viable to sit back and do nothing.

I'd say that the system isn't so much outgrown by the player base (or amount of players), but by the sheer size of certain scrolls. 

 

39 minutes ago, Kila said:

I do like the idea of splitting the AP into biomes, though! Lore wise it would make sense that you'd put an egg back in the environment where you found it.

There are some teeny, weeny problems here. Where would you put a bred gold/silver/pink egg? (Gold parent's biome? What if both parents are golds - randomly assign the egg one of the parents' biomes? What would then happen to an egg bred from two "market" eggs?) Where would you find tinsel and shimmer eggs? Or geodes, blunas (coast?), shallow waters (coast?), hellhorses, setsongs and risensongs, avatars, carinas, soulpeaces, dusk pygmies, vampires and neglecteds? What about holiday eggs?

 

Also, since the introduction of the biomes, many players have been enjoying the AP exactly because it's more like the old cave. Splitting the AP into biomes would take this away from them.

[Sazandora]

Ah shoot, here we go again...

 

I still say no to putting limits on breeders and an even bigger no to AP biomes -- it sounds cool and makes sense on paper, but in-game I think it'd spread the playerbase too thin. Not to mention the problem with eggs that normally spawn in multiple biomes. Focusing everything into a single AP brings everyone together into the same place so I believe it's best to leave it be. But, I am still very much in support of limiting how many eggs from a single breed (or breeder) are visible in the AP. It lets people breed as many things as they want, and it keeps the AP varied like it should be (at least, that's how I understand it). Nice and simple.

 

Yeah, people could still organize mass breeds to still block the AP if they really, really wanted to. But it's nowhere near as easy to get a whole lot of people to all breed the same things at roughly the same time vs. doing it all by yourself, so I don't think it'd happen anywhere near as often as these walls made by single breeders. But that's just my two cents.

 

and now that this storm has started up again, time to grab some popcorns and enjoy the ride while it lasts.

Edited February 28, 2020 by Sazandora

[darkladyselenity]

Would it be possible to rotate the whole page of eggs? Similar to how click sites work, where the whole page refreshes with different eggs after a certain number of seconds.

 

I personally like the unpredictability of the AP.

Edited February 28, 2020 by darkladyselenity

[Sazandora]

@darkladyselenity I like the sound of that. Though I'm not 100% sure about it, it is a pretty drastic change to the AP so I'm not sure how people would react to it. Would it shuffle in eggs with a random amount of time left, or stick to the old formula of "lowest time eggs first"?

[darkladyselenity]

6 minutes ago, Sazandora said:

@darkladyselenity I like the sound of that. Though I'm not 100% sure about it, it is a pretty drastic change to the AP so I'm not sure how people would react to it. Would it shuffle in eggs with a random amount of time left, or stick to the old formula of "lowest time eggs first"?

 

My thought was make it completely random, so there would be some low time, some newer drops. 

 

It would help eliminate walls and float more desirable eggs where people can see them.

 

When I'm on the AP I look for specific breeds. For example, I don't like black tips, so if I see a wall of those, with other eggs I don't really care for, then I'll just leave the AP.

[olympe]

1 hour ago, darkladyselenity said:

 

My thought was make it completely random, so there would be some low time, some newer drops. 

 

It would help eliminate walls and float more desirable eggs where people can see them.

 

When I'm on the AP I look for specific breeds. For example, I don't like black tips, so if I see a wall of those, with other eggs I don't really care for, then I'll just leave the AP.

What it would do is allow people to cherry-pick the good stuff and leave the stuff they don't like to die. Because that's what would likely happen.

[meeps114]

Anand we're back to mostly celestial/aqualis eggs in the AP. @TJ09 anything in the works to fix the AP? Thoughts on adjusting the ratios?

[Infinis]

I like options 3, 4, and 6. Either that or a way to filter it, by breed, bred/cb/generation#, etc.

 

I absolutely do not want to be limited to a set number of breedings per scroll. I like to breed a number of things all at once, like when I breed all my cb metals at once to try and get shiny kids out of them. I do not want to be forced to spread breedings across multiple days because for me that's just dumb and annoying. I would prefer a solution that doesn't place unwanted restrictions on me; I would like a change in how the AP displays the eggs. 

[Tawanda001]

59 minutes ago, olympe said:

What it would do is allow people to cherry-pick the good stuff and leave the stuff they don't like to die. Because that's what would likely happen.

OTOH it would eliminate people camping out in the AP waiting for certain bred eggs to hit (cough,2g thuweds, prizes, alts, cough) and picking up them up would be absolutely random. Not sure if that's a good thing or a bad thing, but it would certainly shake things up!

I just don't know how difficult it might be to randomize eggs enough that several hundred eggs of a particular breed would actually be scattered enough to make a difference?

[tjekan]

1 hour ago, olympe said:

What it would do is allow people to cherry-pick the good stuff and leave the stuff they don't like to die. Because that's what would likely happen.

 

I doubt it. People eventually pick up anything when it gets low-time enough, even if it's not blocking anything. I mean you can breed just ONE messy mint and drop it, and someone will pick that up eventually even though a single messy mint does not block the page.

 

Under current user behavior, even the garbagiest unwanted lineages will still get picked up eventually under ANY of these plans, but not till they're below 4 days and take no effort for people to raise.

 

Now, if the changes to the AP cause users to CHANGE their behavior and start leaving unwanted eggs to die, that's something that would be impossible to predict in advance-- but if they did, breeders would just have to change their own behavior to adapt. I don't see anything horrible about the idea of people cherry-picking by refusing to pick up "stuff they don't like." It's a game, people shouldn't be obliged to spend their time doing stuff they don't like. Breeders will always have the options of breeding different, more desirable lineages; breeding fewer eggs; lining up homes for their eggs in advance; putting all their abandoned eggs into a hatchery; starting a group to grab them all and hatch them and drop them (nobody EVER turns down a hatchie.) There are a lot of things they can do if users start completely rejecting the stuff they don't like. I still don't think that's going to happen at all, though.

[olympe]

27 minutes ago, Tawanda001 said:

OTOH it would eliminate people camping out in the AP waiting for certain bred eggs to hit (cough,2g thuweds, prizes, alts, cough) and picking up them up would be absolutely random. Not sure if that's a good thing or a bad thing, but it would certainly shake things up!

I just don't know how difficult it might be to randomize eggs enough that several hundred eggs of a particular breed would actually be scattered enough to make a difference?

Yes, because people would be camping out there as soon as TJ breeds - and refresh as fast as possible in the hope of getting one of the precious 2nd gen Thuweds. I honestly don't see this as an improvement at all. Not to mention that, with a couple hundred eggs of the same breed, chances are that you'll still see mostly eggs from that wall. And you'd also see a number of 7 day eggs, too - so picking up the low-time eggs will become more difficult.

[darkladyselenity]

I'm not sure what a good solution is, but anything that restricts players, I'm against. 

 

I think a change in how the AP displays the eggs, or a change of breeding ratios are the only options.

 

It's tiresome to refresh the page for hours, only to see the same eggs rarely move. During the Valentine's Event I picked up the same eggs three times, by mistake. 

 

And as for cherry-picking, people do that anyway. When Thuweds drop, those will be grabbed and nothing else. I've given up even trying to grab a Thuweds from the AP. Rares are the same way. Almost any rare, even a messy one is going to be grabbed over a common.

Edited February 28, 2020 by darkladyselenity

[Sazandora]

44 minutes ago, darkladyselenity said:

And as for cherry-picking, people do that anyway. When Thuweds drop, those will be grabbed and nothing else. I've given up even trying to grab a Thuweds from the AP. Rares are the same way. Almost any rare, even a messy one is going to be grabbed over a common.

Precisely this is why I consider all this "people will just cherry-pick the best things out of the AP" a moot point because people are already doing it. Literally nothing's going to change that. Random is random, you get a totally random selection of eggs each "shuffle" and naturally people are going to cherry-pick the best things out of it and leave the rest to rot. But with a randomized selection, you won't have to sit there for minutes on end watching the same eggs show up there each refresh.

[darkladyselenity]

16 minutes ago, Sazandora said:

Precisely this is why I consider all this "people will just cherry-pick the best things out of the AP" a moot point because people are already doing it. Literally nothing's going to change that. Random is random, you get a totally random selection of eggs each "shuffle" and naturally people are going to cherry-pick the best things out of it and leave the rest to rot. But with a randomized selection, you won't have to sit there for minutes on end watching the same eggs show up there each refresh.

 

You captured my precise train of thought.

Edited February 28, 2020 by darkladyselenity

[Stormcaller]

6 hours ago, Sazandora said:

... But with a randomized selection, you won't have to sit there for minutes on end watching the same eggs show up there each refresh.

 

But that's a good thing.  A dedicated AP hunter will sit there and try to remember just what eggs are where so that they can spot a new egg when it appears.  True, it is a bit boring, but once you've clicked on the eggs that are in there, it's the best way to catch good eggs.  If you toss them all into the air, the AP would be a total waste of time.  Of course, a wall will always make this impossible too.

[random_dragon_collector]

7 hours ago, Stormcaller said:

 

But that's a good thing.  A dedicated AP hunter will sit there and try to remember just what eggs are where so that they can spot a new egg when it appears.  True, it is a bit boring, but once you've clicked on the eggs that are in there, it's the best way to catch good eggs.  If you toss them all into the air, the AP would be a total waste of time.  Of course, a wall will always make this impossible too.

 

Not to mention missing your egg and then picking it up when the last person drops it again!  Ah--sitting there and thinking "drop it, come on, just drop it!"  Sometimes even the good stuff gets tossed again, and sometimes it's gone forever!  Good times! 😛

[Sazandora]

I know. I don't really mind it myself, either, but it has become pretty clear that something has to be done about the abandoned page and doing nothing is no longer an option. Yes, I could be totally fine with doing nothing. But there's a lot of people here who disagree with that, and out of all the suggestions posted here, I've begun to prefer the idea of a randomized AP over all the others. But... 'tis just my opinion. *shrugs*

[random_dragon_collector]

Randomized would be worse than what we have.  I'd rather miss it for a few days a couple times a month than have it randomized.  That would ruin it every day.

[Uther_Pendragon]

   Since single breed walls are becoming pretty close to a daily occurrence, doing nothing pretty much completely shuts the game down for me.     

    Since we moved to Nowheresville with Yuckternet, I primarily ap cb hunt, due to slow internet. (Bless those that toss cb's in there!)
  I don't make or collect lineages (except a very select few), nor do a lot of trading. I like cb's and am working on scroll goals.

  Doing nothing is keeping me away from *any* play more and more as single breed walls become more frequent and last longer. This is why I'm hoping (pleading) for even a band-aid fix while larger issues of ratios, etc are looked at and worked out.

 

How would a randomized ap help change the seeing only one breed for hours and hours (or days) at a time? Wouldn't mass breed eggs show up at some point and still take over?

I see the same problem occurring even if there's a many page ap, or separate biome ap or even randomized.  At some point, mass bred eggs have to filter through, no?

 
 This is why I'm still voting for seeing x amount eggs per breeder. It just seems the least disruptive.

 

 

 

[Fuzzbucket]

2 hours ago, random_dragon_collector said:

Randomized would be worse than what we have.  I'd rather miss it for a few days a couple times a month than have it randomized.  That would ruin it every day.

I agree with this. I think it needs to be sorted by time left, I really do.

[Indigo_Dragon]

After reading some people's ideas, suggestions, and very logical counters...

 

I think the restricting x amount of eggs shown from a certain scroll would be the best. We definitely need to keep the low-time sorting and not the random as it is. And Uther_Pendragon had a good point that the mass bred eggs would eventually show up in the biomes and the randomized as well. 

 

I don't have hope for the breed ratios being corrected so for now I'll settle for the limit of x amount of eggs shown by a certain scroll in the AP. No breeding limits on the scrolls themselves, but just one for the AP itself.

[darkladyselenity]

I'm probably in the minority, but I'm not going to grab an egg just because it's low time. If I don't like the breed, or lineage, nothing about how much time it has is going to make me keep it. 

 

I'd just as soon avoid the AP all together as grab a bunch of eggs I don't really want, just because they're low time. 

[olympe]

12 minutes ago, darkladyselenity said:

I'm probably in the minority, but I'm not going to grab an egg just because it's low time. If I don't like the breed, or lineage, nothing about how much time it has is going to make me keep it. 

 

I'd just as soon avoid the AP all together as grab a bunch of eggs I don't really want, just because they're low time. 

I'm usually the same - unless I have very little time and want to stuff my scroll with whatever there is.

[darkladyselenity]

This is why I thought randomization would work. 

 

Honestly not sure what a good option is, but keeping the page as it is now, doesn't seem viable anymore. 

[Fuzzbucket]

But I really don't think randomising would help. Limiting the number showing per breeder seems the best way to minimise any effect on the play style of others.