Trading Hub: attach messages to an offer

[Beldarius]

I've been trading things in the Trading Hub for a while now, and I've always thought it would be useful to attach a message to an offer.

 

For example, there's a person making a trade in the Hub and asking for a hatchie with a specific gender; I happen to have the hatchie they want, but they haven't gendered yet and I'd like to let them know. Then it turns out they don't have a forum account so there's no way to contact them. In cases like these, it would be helpful to have an option to attach a message along the lines of "precog F" as you make the offer.

 

What "offer messages" could do:

1) people can tell the trader an ungendered hatchling has been precogged or influenced correctly

2) allows for simple messages like "thank you, will take care of it" to put a trader's mind at ease, or brighten their day

3) if your offer is a CB on cooldown, you can offer a dummy and then let the trader know about the situation

 

Currently there's no way to contact members without a forum account, so I figured this could be a nice way to make trades for "off-forumers" a little easier.

 

EDIT: As I've just been told, there seems to be a ban on direct communication in the Hub. Maybe these messages could be automatic and selected from a dropdown list? That way nobody can harass the person making the trade or beg for something - the dropdown could include options along the lines of "precog M", "precog F" and "thank you" (and possibly "cooldown dummy").

Edited October 31, 2019 by Beldarius

[HeatherMarie]

There can't be any direct communication between users on the main site, for reasons beyond TJ's control. I'm figuring free-for-all messages attached to trades are a no-go for the same reasons. Perhaps if there were a few automatic messages we could choose from, like 'will precog correctly' or whatever, but free communication isn't going to happen. (This and similar has been suggested many, many times, the answer is always the same.)

Edited October 31, 2019 by HeatherMarie

[Beldarius]

Oh... huh, couldn't fathom why. I'll make a small adjustment to the suggestion then and update the first post, hopefully this version will be more acceptable.

[JavaTigress]

9 hours ago, Beldarius said:

Oh... huh, couldn't fathom why. I'll make a small adjustment to the suggestion then and update the first post, hopefully this version will be more acceptable.

My UNDERSTANDING is that it has to do with TJ's RL job... would be considered a 'conflict of interests'or some such if it were allowed.

[tjekan]

>the dropdown could include options along the lines of "precog M", "precog F" and "thank you"

 

If we did this, it would be great if the other person could respond with prefab messages too, like "need gender information," "oops you're egglocked," and "please offered fewer items."

 

Because that's what always happens to me-- can't accept a good offer because somebody is egglocked or has offered like 4 eggs I have no room for!

[UnicornMaiden]

As someone who has often been frustrated by not being able to attach a message to an offer I like the idea of the drop-down menu since writing messages is not allowed.

[Fuzzbucket]

On 10/31/2019 at 11:47 AM, tjekan said:

>the dropdown could include options along the lines of "precog M", "precog F" and "thank you"

 

If we did this, it would be great if the other person could respond with prefab messages too, like "need gender information," "oops you're egglocked," and "please offered fewer items."

 

Because that's what always happens to me-- can't accept a good offer because somebody is egglocked or has offered like 4 eggs I have no room for!

 

What we need for that is the ability to accept part of an offer:

 

Going by what people have experienced - you can say "influenced m" all you like - but clearly some people are - less than truthful about this one.... Sadly I suspect it would be abused like mad.

[GhostMouse]

9 minutes ago, Fuzzbucket said:

Going by what people have experienced - you can say "influenced m" all you like - but clearly some people are - less than truthful about this one.... Sadly I suspect it would be abused like mad.

I like the idea of preset messages. It would prevent abuse of the system as a workaround for messaging while still allowing essential communication for trades. Regarding the above, what if you could only select options that were true? If you had an uninfluenced, un-precog'd egg, you couldn't choose a message saying it was influenced or precog'd, but if you had done one or the other, that message would be available for selection? Obviously only with the correct gender result available.

[Fuzzbucket]

Lord knows how possible that is, but if there were to be a drop down, I think it would be a good solution to prevent blatant lying. Though there is that very small issue people found about precogging, teleporting, influencing and the rest confusing the egg - there's a thread...

 

 

[olympe]

I think that trading can work even without messages. The "thank you" is implied, anyway.

All we need is:

1. The ability to only accept part of an offer.
2. The ability to offer only on part of a trade.
3. An automatic message being sent if you try to accept an offer and your intended trading partner is locked (too many eggs/growing things). Yes, people can look up when you should unlock - IF your scroll isn't hidden. We get the scroll name of the person offering anyway - entering it in AoND (without actually adding the dragons!!!) will tell us how long it will take for you to unlock.
4. Precog and Influence status should be visible on trades for the other person who has access to it. So, if you post a trade with a precogged hatchling, people will see what it says there. If you offer a precogged hatchling on a trade, only the person who posted the trade will be able to see the result. (Personally, I like this mechanic much better than a message for influence/precog state because, well, mistakes and scams do happen.)

I hope I didn't miss anything crucial.

[tjekan]

15 hours ago, Fuzzbucket said:

Going by what people have experienced - you can say "influenced m" all you like - but clearly some people are - less than truthful about this one.... Sadly I suspect it would be abused like mad.

 

I wish that you could just make the precog visible on an egg or hatchling you were trading. If you can attach the dragon's pedigree papers to a trade to show the other person who its parents are--something that happens automatically--why couldn't you just attach the precog information? There's nothing that's gained by forcing this to remain a secret. All it does is disappoint and annoy people when they get the wrong gender in a trade.

I do think the problem would be reduced by people stating "influenced m" on a trade, though. I have a terrible success rate when I ask for a "male hatchling" on the trade board, really not any better than chance, but a very good success rate when somebody PMs me about a precog on the forum. I think more people are making errors, not reading the Wants box carefully, or just thinking they are "offering something close" rather than deliberately being deceptive. When they tell me in a PM that a hatchling is male, 95% of the time it really is.

[Beldarius]

On 11/1/2019 at 10:45 PM, Fuzzbucket said:

 

Going by what people have experienced - you can say "influenced m" all you like - but clearly some people are - less than truthful about this one.... Sadly I suspect it would be abused like mad.

 

The easy way to deal with people like those is to make a private list of trades, and then refuse any future offers from people who cheated you. And by private, I mean things like Notepad documents on your desktop. That way you won't be breaking the rules by making blacklists where other players can see them.

 

Note to newbies: making public blacklists has always been against the rules... don't do it, or you'll most likely get banned.

Edited November 3, 2019 by Beldarius

[Fuzzbucket]

Sure, and I have one. But the day you get stiffed when offering a CB gold is the day..... (no I never did that badly, but....)

[schmupti]

Growing things don't appear to register having been precogged - unlike Influence, the option pops up even if they've already been checked. There might not be a 'status' attached to the egg/hatchling that can be shown in trades.

 

(Not shooting the idea down, just troubleshooting.)

[Fuzzbucket]

You can check your action log, so could perhaps link an image ?

[Rainsong]

Yes! There really does need to be some way to communicate basic messages in the trading hub....right now I'd like to accept an offer, but, the person offering doesn't have room for the eggs I'm offering. ..I don't mind waiting until they have room (if possible) so I don't want to decline, but, I'm afraid they will cancel their offer if I don't accept right away (I'm assuming they don't realize they don't have room).

[Ribombee]

Don't forget that while precog (other than the bug-ish thing stated above) shows what it will be even if traded, influence doesn't always stick. People have influenced and still had it be the wrong one. I've had it happen to me, and I double checked to make sure it was influenced the way I wanted (went back and looked at my scroll log). So blacklisting anyone who ever had one go the wrong way after trading could just be a simple game mechanic, not at all anything the trader did on purpose. Precog SHOULD be much more stable, but it is also possible someone just wrote something wrong in the trade or thought they saw it precogged one way. It is not always malicious. I am sure sometimes it is someone just trying to cheat someone, but not always. So I would much prefer if that was a thing to either just leave it (with a warning in the Hub that messages are input by the trader and may or may not be accurate) or have it be forced in the coding to only allow an option if it HAS been precogged/influenced as X. The influence could still not have stuck, but at least then it is just game mechanics rather than someone being a jerk.

[Fuzzbucket]

1 hour ago, Rainsong said:

Yes! There really does need to be some way to communicate basic messages in the trading hub....right now I'd like to accept an offer, but, the person offering doesn't have room for the eggs I'm offering. ..I don't mind waiting until they have room (if possible) so I don't want to decline, but, I'm afraid they will cancel their offer if I don't accept right away (I'm assuming they don't realize they don't have room).

 

Go here and support me ! (but we will never be able actually to message in the hub - TJ has explained this.)

 

 

Edited November 4, 2019 by Fuzzbucket

[Shadowdrake]

On 11/3/2019 at 8:06 PM, Ribombee said:

People have influenced and still had it be the wrong one. I've had it happen to me, and I double checked to make sure it was influenced the way I wanted (went back and looked at my scroll log).

 

TJ said this is no longer possible--he apparently broke the fail chance awhile back and decided to make guaranteed influence official.

[DragonLady86]

On 11/10/2019 at 4:47 PM, Shadowdrake said:

 

TJ said this is no longer possible--he apparently broke the fail chance awhile back and decided to make guaranteed influence official.

Unless it was still an egg when traded. When the influence is erased by teleporting, the gender is re-rolled. So only a 50% chance it is still the desired outcome.

[Shadowdrake]

11 hours ago, DragonLady86 said:

Unless it was still an egg when traded. When the influence is erased by teleporting, the gender is re-rolled. So only a 50% chance it is still the desired outcome.

 

Well yeah, but I'm assuming that if we're going the pre-written messages route (bc that seems like the best compromise for allowing communication without socializing) then there won't be an option to say an egg is influenced when it's useless at best and misleading at worst.