ANSWERED:Undead BSA: Infect (zombie creation)

[Haloclimb]

I've gotta disagree with them loosing their 'special' factor if they got easier to make. The 'special' factor for Neglected's hasn't dropped since people figured out how to turn eggs, the 'special' factor of prizes hasn't dropped despite anything past 3rd gen being fairly easy to get now, the 'special' factor of CB holidays hasn't vanished despite people now having the opportunity to catch CB's each year in the holiday biome. Zombies won't suddenly become worthless because they are more attainable, and frankly I'll still love my undead dragons just as much as I do now even if I could whip up a bunch easier.
Zombies are already 'special' in that they can't be traded, can't be bred, and can't be acquired without you killing dragons for it. Giving zombies the ability to make more by biting would INCREASE their appeal imo. They go from 'god I'm going to have to smother another three sets of hatchlings just to get this last dang variant' to 'oh boy, one of my zombies is ready to bite again! I'm going to find the perfect candidate!'

 

And going 'oh it's easy now because we just have to bite on the 31st!' is a cop out. That's 7 chances A YEAR, in which you need to be reviving at night, for a slightly increased chance. God forbid you have a job, or live in an awkward timezone and struggle to get online in those hours. And if you weren't able to plan out 3 weeks in advance to have a scroll full of dead hatchlings and 10 dead adults, then congrats! You get 5 chances. Enjoy getting mad when they all disintegrate, and you have to wait for the next 31st.

[Stormcaller]

2 hours ago, Haloclimb said:

I've gotta disagree with them loosing their 'special' factor if they got easier to make. The 'special' factor for Neglected's hasn't dropped since people figured out how to turn eggs, the 'special' factor of prizes hasn't dropped despite anything past 3rd gen being fairly easy to get now, the 'special' factor of CB holidays hasn't vanished despite people now having the opportunity to catch CB's each year in the holiday biome. Zombies won't suddenly become worthless because they are more attainable, and frankly I'll still love my undead dragons just as much as I do now even if I could whip up a bunch easier.

 

There's very little to compare to Zombies with here.  1) While it might be known how to make Neglecteds, it's not an easy thing to do and for the average member, attempts still usually end up with failures. 2) True, third gen. and above are fairly common, but a real prize from the raffle is in a class of its own.  Also, the gold prizes seem to be more sought after than the others because they are the most rare as well as the most beautiful.  3) Holidays, except for a year or two back for breeding purposes, are not very special at all since everyone can get two of each.  It used to be great to find a Holly egg of any generation at all; now it means nothing.

 

I don't believe that Zombies would ever become worthless, but their rarity gives them an innate value that would be diminished if they were to become easy to obtain.

[Fuzzbucket]

7 hours ago, Haloclimb said:

I've gotta disagree with them loosing their 'special' factor if they got easier to make. The 'special' factor for Neglected's hasn't dropped since people figured out how to turn eggs, the 'special' factor of prizes hasn't dropped despite anything past 3rd gen being fairly easy to get now, the 'special' factor of CB holidays hasn't vanished despite people now having the opportunity to catch CB's each year in the holiday biome. Zombies won't suddenly become worthless because they are more attainable, and frankly I'll still love my undead dragons just as much as I do now even if I could whip up a bunch easier.
Zombies are already 'special' in that they can't be traded, can't be bred, and can't be acquired without you killing dragons for it. Giving zombies the ability to make more by biting would INCREASE their appeal imo. They go from 'god I'm going to have to smother another three sets of hatchlings just to get this last dang variant' to 'oh boy, one of my zombies is ready to bite again! I'm going to find the perfect candidate!'

 

And going 'oh it's easy now because we just have to bite on the 31st!' is a cop out. That's 7 chances A YEAR, in which you need to be reviving at night, for a slightly increased chance. God forbid you have a job, or live in an awkward timezone and struggle to get online in those hours. And if you weren't able to plan out 3 weeks in advance to have a scroll full of dead hatchlings and 10 dead adults, then congrats! You get 5 chances. Enjoy getting mad when they all disintegrate, and you have to wait for the next 31st.

 

I have to agree here - though we CAN try any day of the year, Haloclimb - just the chance is highest on 31sts. But also anyone who chooses to think of xyz as "special" CHOOSES to think that way; It's not as if zombies can even be traded. And as one who is back to having a cursed scroll,  I just got 7/7 disintegrated so I don't think the current mechanic is OK. At least with neglecteds you have SOME degree of control; the zombie thing is random.

 

I would prefer the turn rates to be changed - but otherwise I think I have come round to supporting this, given that there are SO MANY sprites to collect.

[DragonLady86]

5 hours ago, Stormcaller said:

 

There's very little to compare to Zombies with here.  1) While it might be known how to make Neglecteds, it's not an easy thing to do and for the average member, attempts still usually end up with failures. 2) True, third gen. and above are fairly common, but a real prize from the raffle is in a class of its own.  Also, the gold prizes seem to be more sought after than the others because they are the most rare as well as the most beautiful.  3) Holidays, except for a year or two back for breeding purposes, are not very special at all since everyone can get two of each.  It used to be great to find a Holly egg of any generation at all; now it means nothing.

 

I don't believe that Zombies would ever become worthless, but their rarity gives them an innate value that would be diminished if they were to become easy to obtain.

Haven't bothered with negelecteds myself, so I'll leave that argument alone.  Prizes, "real prize is a class of it's own" well yes, because it's the only way they can be obtained, but I would also say the value has dropped dramatically.  I've never hidden mine and rarely have people ask about it and sometimes I can't even give eggs away. Gold prizes are more sought after because they are rarer thus to most equals more value.  Where in, I would argue the silvers are the most beautiful because they are different.  Bronze and gold are only a few shades different from each other.  For holidays, come visit on Halloween and say that: So Many People wanting MARROWS!! (including me).  I guarantee if their wasn't  limit people would still want older Christmas/v-days too.

[Sazandora]

And Zombies are not tradeable and probably never will be, so the thought of Zombies being "valuable" is really silly to me. Maybe it's because to me "value" translates to "how good it is for trading stuff", but still. So what if obtaining them becomes easier? They're not going to lose their specialness because you still have to kill a dragon to get one. You can't trade them so they can't dominate the trading market. All it does is make it feasible to obtain all the unique Zombie sprites, and that's it.

[Maladjust]

I don't care how it's done, I just want it made easier to collect all the different zombie sprites! I just got five disintegrations. 🤬

[Maladjust]

On 1/31/2020 at 8:27 PM, Maladjust said:

I don't care how it's done, I just want it made easier to collect all the different zombie sprites! I just got five disintegrations. 🤬

 

And one year later, the same story! I remembered to try for zombies all year, on the 31st of every applicable month, and had three successes. So, at the current success rate, it will take about twenty-one years for me to complete my zombie-sprite collection goals. Something really does need to change here.

 

ETA: I should add that if I were more reasonable, LOL!, and wanted just one of each zombie sprite (adult, gendered hatchling, ungendered hatchling) for each type of zombie dragon (Western, Eastern, Lindwyrm, etc.), it would still take about ten years to collect what I don't have, at three successes a year. I've been a member since 2008 and have had no trouble collecting anything else. But I've already been trying to make zombies for ten years and still have a very long way to go.

Edited January 31, 2021 by Maladjust

[Murkydepths]

I like the current way of making zombies, if the rates need improving I think it should be a simple higher chance for zombie turning. 

 

It's nice having a breed that everyone has the same rng to get, and you can't increase your odds. Noobs can get a very rare dragon with just a bit of luck, no catching required.

[Moonlight_Eevee]

Support, support, support. As someone who's last successful revive was in 2019, the odds need to be bumped up. Its rather discouraging and I feel like I hit a brick wall with this

[Long_Before_Sunrise]

😧  You're not angelic, because you're trying to start The Zombie Apocalypse!

 

Aside from that, I want this, too. I'd love a zombie lindwyrm.

 

I could start a White Trash Zombie named line. 🤔 Edit: Fun Fact - Diane Rowland, the author of the White Trash Zombie series made national headlines, because instead of taking down her inflatable Home Depot dragons after Halloween, she changed them up for Christmas. One of her neighbors vehemently objected.

Edited February 1, 2021 by Long_Before_Sunrise

[High Lord November]

I believe I've voiced my support for this topic before, but I just want to say again that this works well.

 

One alternative would be instead of the zombie having the chance to directly kill a dragon (increasing your effective kill slots), it could also be just like fertility.

 

(Undead dragon) successfully wounds (dragon name). Death mana swirls around the wound...

 

This would 'mark' your dragon and increase the chances of that dragon turning to a zombie upon revival. If left alone for a week, the dragon would recover. This peaks at affecting five adults at a time (because of the kill slot limit). Hatchlings left to die would still be affected by the BSA.

 

Thematically I like it more because zombies have always required magic to conjure them. It also avoids the lore-wise issue where zombies would then run rampant - any in the wild would just infect other dragons again and again. And I know we call them zombies, but they're actually undead, so the BSA doesn't need to follow zombies exactly.  I would also support an increase in kill slots relative to the amount of dragons you have on your scroll.

 

But honestly, almost any method is better than the rates we have now, especially since the number of sprites to collect has increased by a massive amount (from 3 to 54). Support for any BSA that increases the chance of obtaining a zombie. The specifics aren't up to us to decide on, it's TJ and the team.

Edited February 1, 2021 by High Lord November

[Long_Before_Sunrise]

And we don't have very many Affinity: Death dragons.

[HeatherMarie]

I'm *still* feeling very resistant to the idea of completely changing the very unique mechanic zombies have. Yes, please increase the odds of success! Please! But don't turn zombies into just another BSA dragon. 

 

Having said that, I could more easily get behind @High Lord November's idea, because the BSA would focus on increasing the chances of the mechanic we already have instead of completely changing it. 

[Long_Before_Sunrise]

13 minutes ago, HeatherMarie said:

I'm *still* feeling very resistant to the idea of completely changing the very unique mechanic zombies have. Yes, please increase the odds of success! Please! But don't turn zombies into just another BSA dragon. 

 

Would you change your mind if I offered you massages and baked goods? 🍞

[Maladjust]

Five disintegrations. As usual. 🤬 I wonder if anything will ever be done about this.

[Fuzzbucket]

I don't think there's a hint of "anything to be done about this." They are and always have been ultra-hard to get.

[Maladjust]

Tell me about it. However, I've been told that some people have managed to collect all the zombie sprites.

[KageSora]

I figure they do things like extremely careful planning to maximize the odds as frequently as possible.

 

Personally, I'm not sure I favor the suggestion as outlined in the OP but the idea floated about basically being Fertility except for making Revive more likely to Turn something is one that I like.  Boosts the odds without also splitting obtainment mechanic, which I like.

[TJ09]

At this time I don't expect any changes to the process of zombifying a dragon. Any BSA would share the same success rates as normal revives, and I don't think there's much value in having two different flows to accomplish the same thing.