Raise CB Holiday limit to 4

[Dragon_Arbock]

Well, since removing limits altogether has pretty much be shot down, I figure we can at least still try for the middle ground.

I propose we raise the CB limit for Christmas and Valentines to 4

-4 is a better number for lineages

-4 is the number of eggslots everyone has, whether you're new or old, thus providing no advantage on initial release

-4 should not cause an extreme increase in stress and competition the way unlimited would

-even having 2 more CBs would help people be more generous

-users who are at their current limit could keep the holiday biome moving better if they're allowed to pick up 2 more

-users at their current limit could gift others CBs if they could pick up two more, without having to get rid of any existing dragons to do so

 

additional points from other users;

-allows for 2 of each aegis sprite, benefits those looking to create more enraged lineages.

Edited December 3, 2018 by Dragon_Arbock

[Keileon]

This one, I agree with and don't see why not to do it.

 

Would love to pick up a couple more Aegises and gift my friends the CBs they missed.

[Ruby Eyes]

I'd love two of each Aegis form, plus I'm sure there will be more holidays with multiple CB forms in the future.

So, yes please.

[purplehaze]

I would love to see this happen. It would make lineages so much easier and I think people would be much more likely to share if they weren't so limited. Having only two CB's means that, for the first few years at least, you are mainly breeding only for yourself to start the lineages you want. Of course there are extra eggs that go to the AP, but it is harder to get exactly what you are looking for there. If people had more CBs to work with they would be more open to breeding for others. We see that now at Halloween!

[angelicdragonpuppy]

This is not my ideal, but any increase is an improvement.

[Nove NuVonde]

I agree that raising the cb limit can only make users more generous, not the other way around. 4 seems like the perfect number here, for reasons discussed above, and is much less restrictive than 2. I don't have much more to add that hasn't already been said above, so I'll just simply toss in my support.

[Jazeki]

I support this. I don't necessarily need it, but I would love to be more generous with my Christmas and Valentine's breeds and have more breeding chances if say both of my Sweetlings decide to refuse everyone or if i had the option of having the opportunity to have two enraged aegis and two pacified ones.

[tjekan]

I'd like it. I appreciate the low-key feel of the holidays, but I have no doubt a limit of 4 would feel just as low-key as a limit of 2. The eggs drop for three days. It is never hard to grab them. And the holiday biome always stalls out anyway, so increasing the limit would actually improve things there, not make them harder. A new player having to refresh for hours waiting for the biome to cycle enough to find what he or she is missing would also be stressful/annoying, right?

[olympe]

The thing is that any increase in limit will only serve to make the same issues come up at a later date. If everyone could have 4 of each, we wouldn't have stalled biomes for the next two years or so, but after that? Most players will have their fill, and the situation is the same as before.

 

Of course, we could argue that 4 is better than 2, and 8 is most definitely better than 4, although it has drawbacks (as not every player could get 8 in their first year due to scroll limits), but all it leads to is a never ending cycle of "gimme moar".

[osean]

17 minutes ago, olympe said:

The thing is that any increase in limit will only serve to make the same issues come up at a later date. If everyone could have 4 of each, we wouldn't have stalled biomes for the next two years or so, but after that? Most players will have their fill, and the situation is the same as before.

 

Of course, we could argue that 4 is better than 2, and 8 is most definitely better than 4, although it has drawbacks (as not every player could get 8 in their first year due to scroll limits), but all it leads to is a never ending cycle of "gimme moar".

While I would love to see the limit at least raised olympe is spot on. I am dreading hunting this year for that last cb holly because I am expecting things to just sit in the biomes once the new people get their fill of the easier stuff. 

[HeatherMarie]

2 hours ago, olympe said:

The thing is that any increase in limit will only serve to make the same issues come up at a later date. If everyone could have 4 of each, we wouldn't have stalled biomes for the next two years or so, but after that? Most players will have their fill, and the situation is the same as before.

 

Of course, we could argue that 4 is better than 2, and 8 is most definitely better than 4, although it has drawbacks (as not every player could get 8 in their first year due to scroll limits), but all it leads to is a never ending cycle of "gimme moar".

 

This..... Is a very very good point. I'm sitting here thinking about this and pretty much every single argument for raising the limits would only be temporary. Move the biomes along more? In a few years everyone will have the new limit and the biomes will stall again. Promote a 'giving' spirit by allowing more space to hunt? Eventually those givers will fill those 4 spots (or 6, or whatever). Give it a few years, but it will happen. Have a 'full' set? Well what about people who want more then just one 'full' set? Aren't people going to be bored a few years down the line with just 4? 

 

I remember when we could only have 2 *ever*, including breds. That was restrictive. Now we have this, and this is restrictive. If we have new limits, in a few years those will be deemed restrictive as well. Honestly, to avoid the inevitable 'more!' down the line, I'd support no limits or keeping what we have, but not an increase.

[GhostMouse]

I very much support this.

[Dragon_Arbock]

35 minutes ago, HeatherMarie said:

 

This..... Is a very very good point. I'm sitting here thinking about this and pretty much every single argument for raising the limits would only be temporary. Move the biomes along more? In a few years everyone will have the new limit and the biomes will stall again. Promote a 'giving' spirit by allowing more space to hunt? Eventually those givers will fill those 4 spots (or 6, or whatever). Give it a few years, but it will happen. Have a 'full' set? Well what about people who want more then just one 'full' set? Aren't people going to be bored a few years down the line with just 4? 

 

I remember when we could only have 2 *ever*, including breds. That was restrictive. Now we have this, and this is restrictive. If we have new limits, in a few years those will be deemed restrictive as well. Honestly, to avoid the inevitable 'more!' down the line, I'd support no limits or keeping what we have, but not an increase.

 

Well, for one, we're talking in the present. As of right now, TJ has said unlimited won't happen, so we have to try and get what we can get.

As far as the giving thing and the slots thing- the holiday biome is a new thing. Before you had no reason not to fill your scroll to the limit because the CBs were never coming back. Now, you can consciously make the choice whether or not to hit the limit, or if you want to gift. Almost nobody is going to get rid of a dragon they already have just to give to others, but more people might just not pick up all 4 to begin with.

If 4 works for a few years, then starts to slow down again, then maybe we can have another limit raise or unlimit discussion.

 

If you still support no limits, you can try making a new topic (I prefer no limits as well), but seeing as TJ just closed that, I would rather have a plan B than what we do have now.

[tjekan]

3 hours ago, olympe said:

The thing is that any increase in limit will only serve to make the same issues come up at a later date. If everyone could have 4 of each, we wouldn't have stalled biomes for the next two years or so, but after that? Most players will have their fill, and the situation is the same as before.

 

Of course, we could argue that 4 is better than 2, and 8 is most definitely better than 4, although it has drawbacks (as not every player could get 8 in their first year due to scroll limits), but all it leads to is a never ending cycle of "gimme moar".

 

Wouldn't that be a bridge we could cross when we came to it? If TJ's primary goal is to keep holiday egg collecting from being stressful, then tweaking the limit just enough to keep the CB biome moving would be valuable, and if it needed to be readjusted again in the future to accomplish the same thing, that would be fine.

[olympe]

1 minute ago, tjekan said:

 

Wouldn't that be a bridge we could cross when we came to it? If TJ's primary goal is to keep holiday egg collecting from being stressful, then tweaking the limit just enough to keep the CB biome moving would be valuable, and if it needed to be readjusted again in the future to accomplish the same thing, that would be fine.

In that case, a limit of 2/year would be better because it doesn't involve changing anything any more. Which most likely isn't going to happen anyway.  

[Dragon_Arbock]

1 hour ago, olympe said:

In that case, a limit of 2/year would be better because it doesn't involve changing anything any more. Which most likely isn't going to happen anyway.  

 

As much as I think that would be a fair thing to do, it might be more coding than he's willing to do. You can't just make a simple code that says 'scroll is x years old, so allow y number of CBs' because then suddenly someone can be eligible for 20 in one year until they catch up.

Somehow every new release of an existing breed would have to be its own 'breed', unless it's somehow possible to make a code that can recognize and limit by date.

[TJ09]

i don't plan on doing anything like this this year since we've only had one year of event biomes. With that one set of datapoints, things still have not caught up (based on the current distribution of CB Holidays among active users, there's going to be a much higher demand for older holiday dragons than newer ones--higher than just "new people need to catch up" can explain). Until things even out, I don't think doubling the potential demand for those already hard-to-get eggs is the right thing to do.

[Keileon]

Perhaps it would be possible for a CB hatchling growing up to trigger a "flag" of sorts.

 

I have no idea how DC is coded and in what language, but it shouldn't be out of the question for a variable to be set when a CB holiday grows up on someone's scroll. Let that variable go up to 2, when it hits 2 disallow grabbing more CBs, and the variable resets sometime after the holiday window passes. (or resets right before the next holiday).

 

The only speed bump I can see is the possibility of someone releasing one of their CBs before the event ends.

 

Edit:
Oops, ninja'd by TJ. Hi bossman.

Edited December 3, 2018 by Keileon

[Dragon_Arbock]

@TJ09 I do have to ask though- you have the power to make the more in demand eggs more common, do you not? 

Also it's possible some people just were not around or did not care about getting all the CBs.

[Keileon]

1 minute ago, Dragon_Arbock said:

@TJ09 I do have to ask though- you have the power to make the more in demand eggs more common, do you not? 

Also it's possible some people just were not around or did not care about getting all the CBs.

(Emphasis mine)

 

Italics: He likely does, but that's a case of "cheating gamemaster", imo. While it'd be neat, it probably goes against the spirit of the game more than a little bit.

 

Bold: That's part of the problem. I think he wants to wait another year or two for things to even out a bit so he knows when it'd be okay to raise the limit.

[UnicornMaiden]

What if holiday breeds had to "age in" to a higher limit? Say if all holiday breeds started off at the 2 CB limit, and once they were maybe three years old the limit could be raised to 4. So breeds that were released up through 2015 could be at the higher limit, but breeds released in the past three years would still be at 2 CB per user. Then next year the dragons released in 2016 would be raised to 4 CB per user. That would give newer users plenty of time to catch holiday breeds without too much competition. And it would keep things fresh for older users because every holiday another old breed would become available for the higher limit.

[Aqub]

I still support this even if it doesn't happen this year, it would be a really nice thing to happen when the demand TJ mentioned does settle down. 

[HeatherMarie]

1 hour ago, Dragon_Arbock said:

@TJ09 I do have to ask though- you have the power to make the more in demand eggs more common, do you not? 

Also it's possible some people just were not around or did not care about getting all the CBs.

 

I'd imagine he wouldn't want to make in-demand eggs really common for the same reason he wouldn't want to make Golds suddenly common. Ratios are a thing. We don't know exactly how they work, but they are a thing. If Holiday A dragon is supposed to have a specific ratio, bumping it up just because more people want them kinda goes against the entire idea of having ratios in the first place. We don't see Golds or Silvers getting a boost just because they are the most wanted things. 

[angelicdragonpuppy]

Didn’t he do just that last Christmas, though? I thought he made the older breeds more common after people said they couldn’t find any behind the walls of newer things people couldn’t pick up. Am I crazy?

[tjekan]

That's fair. Last year, there were quite a few CB holidays nobody could pick up sitting around blocking people from reaching other eggs. If this year, we still turn out to have the same or even higher amounts of that, we could always revisit the idea of raising the limits in the 2019 season.

 

I think it's eventually going to HAVE to happen. If people exist who have two garlands and two snows but no hollies, they're not going to be able to find a holly if there are garlands and snows blocking the biome which they are physically incapable of moving.

 

But personally, I'm content to see how it goes this year and try again next year.