BSA to influence breed

[Keileon]

My only issue with the suggested noun-names is that Precognition, while a noun, is also an *action*. Grammar aside, you can "precognition" something. You can't "heritage" or "legacy" anything.

 

That said, I don't overly care what the name is-- I just want the action!

[pinkgothic]

"Sway" might be another option? Going more along the 'dominance' route, possibly "Virility". Going more along the route of us expressing a preference, maybe "Proliferate", or "Pick", or "Prefer".  I still like one of the early suggestions of "Inherit", though, even if it falls a bit short of the intended connotation, specifically because it has the additional benefit of being more easily associated with genetics, without being tied up into a static-sounding noun ('heritage', 'legacy').

(Of my suggestions, I think I like Proliferate best?)

 

But I too am not fussed how we name this thing! It'd be good to have in any case.

[DragonLady86]

On 5/31/2019 at 11:57 AM, Keileon said:

My only issue with the suggested noun-names is that Precognition, while a noun, is also an *action*. Grammar aside, you can "precognition" something. You can't "heritage" or "legacy" anything.

 

No, it is not unless you are using a different dictionary.

 

pre·cog·ni·tion

/ˌprēˌkäɡˈniSH(ə)n/

noun

noun: precognition; plural noun: precognitions

1.

foreknowledge of an event, especially foreknowledge of a paranormal kind.

2.

Scottish•Law

the preliminary examination of witnesses, especially to decide whether there are grounds for a trial.

Origin

late Middle English: from late Latin praecognitio(n- ), based on Latin cognoscere ‘know’.

[Fuzzbucket]

On 5/31/2019 at 7:55 PM, pinkgothic said:

"Sway" might be another option? Going more along the 'dominance' route, possibly "Virility". Going more along the route of us expressing a preference, maybe "Proliferate", or "Pick", or "Prefer".  I still like one of the early suggestions of "Inherit", though, even if it falls a bit short of the intended connotation, specifically because it has the additional benefit of being more easily associated with genetics, without being tied up into a static-sounding noun ('heritage', 'legacy').

(Of my suggestions, I think I like Proliferate best?)

 

But I too am not fussed how we name this thing! It'd be good to have in any case.

 

I like prefer, actually. It includes the possibility of failure (which MUST be in there !) Inherit kind of suggests that it WILL happen.

[UnicornMaiden]

Of the names that have been suggested so far I think I like Heredity best. It clearly indicates what the BSA is for, and it doesn't sound too absolute.

[Aalbiel]

I like the name "Sway" best. Would not be opposed to "Heredity". "Prefer" is extremely vague and I don't think would make a good name for this BSA.

[olympe]

What about, instead of making this a BSA, we could do this via the shop? Sounds weird at first, but hear me out, please?

Maybe we could buy "potions" to give to a dragon to make sure its next offspring is of its own breed (or a hybrid it can produce). Of course, the price of the potion would be the same as a CB egg of that breed. So, if you wanted an Aeon potion, you'd have to pay the same 1400 shards as for an Aeon egg. And you could only use the potion on an Aeon dragon. 

It would work similarly for hybrids like Carinas - you could give the Carina potion either to a Carina dragon, or to a Ridgewing or to a Nebula.

 

Just trying to throw something out there. Obviously, most people wouldn't want to pay for breeding Aeon eggs, but it would probably work wonders for very common breeds...

[Fuzzbucket]

I would HUGELY rather have a BSA. I save my shards for the CBs I simply cannot catch !

[purplehaze]

2 hours ago, Fuzzbucket said:

I would HUGELY rather have a BSA. I save my shards for the CBs I simply cannot catch !

Agree. I would never use my shards that way. I would just continue to grind away with breeding until I get the breed I need, or I would give up, but I would not spend shards for a potion like that. I think a BSA is a much more practical solution.

[UnicornMaiden]

There is also the possibility that no egg is produced when the dragons mate. If it's a BSA then you just wait out the cooldown period and try again. If you buy a potion that costs hundreds of shards then a failed breeding means you have to wait months before you get another shot at it.

[UnicornMaiden]

We never did talk much about a cooldown period when we were going over specifics earlier in the discussion. I'm thinking either one or two weeks since that seems to be typical for a lot of BSAs. I was originally thinking two weeks, same as Fertility. One week would be nice though, just because it's a shorter waiting period.

[Aalbiel]

On 7/4/2019 at 4:58 PM, UnicornMaiden said:

We never did talk much about a cooldown period when we were going over specifics earlier in the discussion. I'm thinking either one or two weeks since that seems to be typical for a lot of BSAs. I was originally thinking two weeks, same as Fertility. One week would be nice though, just because it's a shorter waiting period.

 

As far as I'm concerned, all breeding BSAs should be on a 1 week cooldown. The 2 week Fertility cooldown makes no sense, as breeding is possible once a week, raising something takes a week, Pinks have a 7d cooldown, etc.... All breeding related things are already on a 1 week schedule.

 

So I would say 7d.

[Shokomon]

So this is Influence 2.0, but for dragon breed rather than for gender? 

 

So, technically this is dragon eugenics or selective breeding, but you probably shouldn't call it that...

 

Maybe the BSA could be called "Manipulate?" Like manipulating the genes?

 

Or, OH! "Determine!" 

 

So, you could determine what breed the egg will be?

 

idk

[Sazandora]

All of my yes to this suggestion. I've been trying to get mates for my 2G Siyats for a while and none of my CBs are giving me anything but Siyats. Kind of a shame the word "influence" is already taken, it would've been perfect for this. But I like "Determine" just fine.

[Fuzzbucket]

1 hour ago, Shokomon said:

So this is Influence 2.0, but for dragon breed rather than for gender? 

 

So, technically this is dragon eugenics or selective breeding, but you probably shouldn't call it that...

 

Maybe the BSA could be called "Manipulate?" Like manipulating the genes?

 

Or, OH! "Determine!" 

 

So, you could determine what breed the egg will be?

 

idk

 

Determine suggests no fail rate. There HAS to be a fail possibility.

[Shokomon]

5 minutes ago, Fuzzbucket said:

 

Determine suggests no fail rate. There HAS to be a fail possibility.

Maybe Predispose then? You are making it more likely for a certain breed to pop up.

 

As for cooldown, probably the same length as Influence's cooldown with Pinks, since they are closely related dragon breeds and all.

 

Though, you could argue that there doesn't necessarily have to be a fail rate, since Influence no longer has a fail rate as TJ says it doesn't. Though, that was more a bug in the code, rather than something purposeful. So, eh? 

 

What is the fail rate for this BSA again?

[Ruby Eyes]

3 minutes ago, Shokomon said:

What is the fail rate for this BSA again?

If a Market Price formula is used, the fail rate basically depends on the involved breeds.

[pinkgothic]

30 minutes ago, Shokomon said:

Predispose

Just chiming in to say I like this name. ❤️

[purplehaze]

59 minutes ago, Shokomon said:

Maybe Predispose then? You are making it more likely for a certain breed to pop up.

Yes! I like that name much better than anything I have seen.

[UnicornMaiden]

4 hours ago, Shokomon said:

Though, you could argue that there doesn't necessarily have to be a fail rate, since Influence no longer has a fail rate as TJ says it doesn't. Though, that was more a bug in the code, rather than something purposeful. So, eh? 

 

What is the fail rate for this BSA again?

 

The fail rate would be necessary to preserve the ratios. If everyone could successfully influence for Golds and other rare breeds it would throw the rarities way out of balance. The current suggestion is to have the chances of success be proportional to the rarity of the breed. The BSA will be more likely to succeed when influencing for common breeds and less likely to succeed when influencing for rare breeds. Ruby Eyes came up with a great suggestion to determine the success rate according to the same formula that calculates the Market value of the dragon.

[Shokomon]

4 hours ago, Ruby Eyes said:

If a Market Price formula is used, the fail rate basically depends on the involved breeds.

 

4 minutes ago, UnicornMaiden said:

 

The fail rate would be necessary to preserve the ratios. If everyone could successfully influence for Golds and other rare breeds it would throw the rarities way out of balance. The current suggestion is to have the chances of success be proportional to the rarity of the breed. The BSA will be more likely to succeed when influencing for common breeds and less likely to succeed when influencing for rare breeds. Ruby Eyes came up with a great suggestion to determine the success rate according to the same formula that calculates the Market value of the dragon.

 

That makes sense. Thank you for explaining it!

[Fuzzbucket]

12 hours ago, Shokomon said:

Maybe Predispose then? You are making it more likely for a certain breed to pop up.

 

As for cooldown, probably the same length as Influence's cooldown with Pinks, since they are closely related dragon breeds and all.

 

Though, you could argue that there doesn't necessarily have to be a fail rate, since Influence no longer has a fail rate as TJ says it doesn't. Though, that was more a bug in the code, rather than something purposeful. So, eh? 

 

What is the fail rate for this BSA again?

 

Varies according to market price.

 

7 hours ago, UnicornMaiden said:

 

The fail rate would be necessary to preserve the ratios. If everyone could successfully influence for Golds and other rare breeds it would throw the rarities way out of balance. The current suggestion is to have the chances of success be proportional to the rarity of the breed. The BSA will be more likely to succeed when influencing for common breeds and less likely to succeed when influencing for rare breeds. Ruby Eyes came up with a great suggestion to determine the success rate according to the same formula that calculates the Market value of the dragon.

 

 Precisely. Imagine how few CB golds there would be in no time flat....

[Ruby Eyes]

Essentially, this BSA would raise the odds of getting one breed and lower the odds of getting the other, but not necessarily to the point of failproofness (unless you absolutely WANT that Fever from Gold and thus use the BSA on the Fever instead ... I guess then this BSA would turn into a guarantee that any egg laid would be the Fever )

[VixenDra]

Support, though I'm a PB breeder.

I'd still use it on my holiday pairs though, in situations like: https://dragcave.net/progeny/yse64 when I need 2 Snow frozens from that very pair and have all 2 of the Garland frozens - so the pair doesn't end up roducing nothing but Garlands next time... Especially with the outrageously long breeding cooldown of a full year. If they won't breed Snows this year, I'll loose an entire year... if they won't breed Snows in 2020, I'll have lost 2 years... and some of my holiday Pairscosnsist of breeds that are a few years apart, e.g. https://dragcave.net/progeny/paE0T

 

So it has some utilioty even for PB breeders xD because Holidays are never truly PB...

 

With rarity proportional success rate as suggested, it would defninitely not screw anything and would mostly make old common breed x new common breed checkers reasonably obtainable, unlike what they are reported to be now. They are broken, and if they can't be fixed some other way, then so be it with this BSA. I dont' care for checkers myself but they are a HUGE part of the game! overall!
OFC there are also other lineage types this BSA would help in (well, even in some instances of PBing as I've shown above xD)

[Fiona]

I hate to turn things on their heads... but I'm going to come in with a suggestion of altering which dragon the BSA is used on. There have been suggestions like this in the past and one of the drawbacks is always the problem of upsetting breed ratios. The suggestion is, rather than increasing the chance for the breed of choice, you suppress the chances of the other breed that you'd prefer not to get. For example, you'd like to get a gold egg from Gold x Spirit Ward, but you're tired of finding new homes for all the Spirit Ward eggs the pair has given you. You use the BSA on the Spirit Ward parent, which suppresses the chance of getting a Spirit Ward egg while not changing the chance to get a Gold egg. I don't know exactly how the coding works for determining if or which egg you get, of course, but it seems a more reasonable way of putting things to me. Your BSA otherwise would work pretty much as your discussion, except somewhat mirrored. Vixendra would use the BSA on her Garlands instead of her Snows, hoping not to get another Garland egg (which you can never have too many of, in my opinion [haha] but she wants what she wants) Since the chance of either of those should be approximately equal otherwise (even though Garlands currently appear to dominate) she should get her Snow on the first try. High success rate. However, in the example with Golds and Spirit Wards, your most likely result is going to be "no egg produced" because the success rate for breeding Gold eggs is low and you've suppressed the chance of getting a Spirit Ward egg. Does all that make sense to you guys?