Trading Hub Feedback

[Whirlaway]

Just now, lucidapple said:

Good to know, thank you! I was still under the impression that stating what you have is against the rules but not bannable.

 

TJ last night said it technically is, but that no one 'should' ban you for it.

[Kaini]

1 minute ago, osmarks said:

And even if you're right about 99% of people being fine, that's 1 in 100 of the many people using the hub getting permanently banned, with presumably no useful error and no useful appeals process described, with no idea what they did wrong.

 

I would like to see different consequences (permaban seems a little harsh imo - timed would be nice, or a warning first) or maybe some way for moderators to verbally warn someone without a forum account. Likely once someone is told they'll stop. So yea, I'd like to see that change. But I just think the 'rules' are fine the way they are.

[Tetelestai]

1 minute ago, Whirlaway said:

 

TJ last night said it technically is, but that no one 'should' ban you for it.

I don't use the forum that much, so I'm not sure where he said it.

 

[Sextonator]

11 hours ago, TJ09 said:

• Wants ("[helping] others understand what types of offers you are looking for")
• Haves (for now: specifically "describing what you are offering." This is technically against the rules-as-written, but will not get you blocked from trading)

Here's what you should not put in the box:

• Literally anything else.

Imo I think this would be the best option to use as the rules.

 

But with how many issues have popped up, I think the trading hub should be taken away. Until we're able to more acutely describe wants, I don't think this is a feature that can be fully utilized by the users.

[HeatherMarie]

27 minutes ago, Kaini said:

 

Doubtful that'll happen considering the rules are right there and clear. Or at least they are to 99% of the people on the hub, since the majority of the posts are perfectly fine, even if the user doesn't have a forum account. Seems to be clear enough for most, yes?

 

If you have to justify putting something there, and make leaps to justify it ('a PM link could be considered helping people understand what you want!') then maybeeee one can kinda realize it's not allowed.

 

 

This is honestly completely how I feel about it, but it does seem that *enough* people are confused about what is and isn't allowed that maybe something should be done to lessen that. I personally think the 'rules' are completely clear simply because it directly states the box is for *wants*, and nothing that anyone is arguing about is actually directly a *want* (asking for PMs is not a 'want' regardless of whether it would *lead* to a 'want' list....)..... But apparently I am in the minority on that, and it might be best for the site as a whole if there is a bit more explanation on-site about what is and isn't allowed.

 

Edit: @Sextonator I really don't think it's true at all that the Trading Hub can't be utilized, just because *some* people are having trouble with what is and isn't allowed. I have successfully made *tons* of trades through the hub, and plenty of other people have too. 

Edited August 6, 2018 by HeatherMarie

[Whirlaway]

1 minute ago, lucidapple said:

I don't use the forum that much, so I'm not sure where he said it.

 

 

Here.

[osmarks]

Just now, Kaini said:

 

I would like to see different consequences (permaban seems a little harsh imo - timed would be nice, or a warning first) or maybe some way for moderators to verbally warn someone without a forum account. Likely once someone is told they'll stop. So yea, I'd like to see that change. But I just think the 'rules' are fine the way they are.

They are not. Either the unwritten or badly-written rules (haves are allowed, links aren't, etc) must be added to the rules list or those rules must be changed so they are in line with the rule (sentence near the box) as written.

 

Well, either that or we keep the current mess.

[JavaTigress]

15 minutes ago, Suzumiya said:

 

That's a relief! Thank you! I just bred a 2G Silver from a Holly and I'm glad I get to describe it so people know what type of silver it is without clicking the link. I hope I get some Siyats. Haha. 

 

I'm glad you can describe what you have. That makes it all easier. Links and PMs...uh, no. Why would anyone post a link anyway? Also, song lyrics? Why? It's a TRADING hub for dragons, not a place to write songs.

WELL, I have seen on the forums here where some people will, when they want to trade for a mate for a particular dragon, will show that dragons lineage.

 

Kind of a 'like this!" sort of thing.

[Sextonator]

@HeatherMarie It's not just that. It's the fact that people can't link to groups and ask for mates for those dragons, people have a limited space for wants/haves, which haves are technically breaking rules, there aren't pages so trades keep getting reposted, there's so much discordance over a single feature that everyone should be able to use without problem, but we're getting people who don't understand why they were banned, or want more to the feature than what they can get.

[osmarks]

It could probably be run quite effectively as an external site. Perhaps one of the hatcheries would have come out with an implementation which actually included pagination and stuff.

 

The current version seems kind of as if it was rushed out.

[HeatherMarie]

The way I see it, this feature was implemented with the bare minimum functionality. It *does* function, it just *could* function a whole lot better. Pagination, a 'Have' box to describe what you are trading, more room in the Want box to actually accurately describe exactly what you want, those all are fairly needed things and I agree on that very much. But I don't agree that the feature is just totally useless as it is right now. Sure, you *have* to bump your trade every so often for it to be seen, but it does work, and hundreds of trades have been made successfully so far with just that bare minimum.

[49ER]

39 minutes ago, Kaini said:

 

Doubtful that'll happen considering the rules are right there and clear. Or at least they are to 99% of the people on the hub, since the majority of the posts are perfectly fine, even if the user doesn't have a forum account. Seems to be clear enough for most, yes?

 

If you have to justify putting something there, and make leaps to justify it ('a PM link could be considered helping people understand what you want!') then maybeeee one can kinda realize it's not allowed.

 

 

And again if a trade is too complex for the hub (you're looking for a specific mate for a dragon you already have, etc) we have the forum and that's always worked just fine.

 

Edit: Still need Pagination though, haha.

NO We did not already know PM references were not allowed, I only found out when I saw it on another thread several hours ago and then I told another user.  And now we are questioning it, and requesting a reconsideration.  If the rules were that clear and straightforward then why are so many people saying here that they are not?  The rules should be right at top of Trade Hub, not spread out over 30 pages of a thread in the Suggestion section.

[osmarks]

It's not useless, sure, but that doesn't make it good either. Also, time spent on filtering would have been much better served doing pagination, not that pagination is hard.

 

[Suzumiya]

8 minutes ago, JavaTigress said:

WELL, I have seen on the forums here where some people will, when they want to trade for a mate for a particular dragon, will show that dragons lineage.

 

Kind of a 'like this!" sort of thing.

 

 

I see. That makes sense, especially if you're making a particular lineage. I still don't get the song lyrics thing though.

 

Is it against the rules to say "Person who offered <insert dragon name here> you are egg locked" or would that be considered a PM or conversation, even if you do not use the person's scroll/forum name?

[osmarks]

It's not a want, so presumably. This is of course despite the fact that it's important for efficient trading.

[Whirlaway]

1 minute ago, Suzumiya said:

 

 

I see. That makes sense, especially if you're making a particular lineage. I still don't get the song lyrics thing though.

 

Is it against the rules to say "Person who offered <insert dragon name here> you are egg locked" or would that be considered a PM or conversation, even if you do not use the person's scroll/forum name?

 

Bad. Don't do that. That's against the forum only stated rules.

[Kaini]

Just now, Suzumiya said:

Is it against the rules to say "Person who offered <insert dragon name here> you are egg locked" or would that be considered a PM or conversation, even if you do not use the person's scroll/forum name?

 

Yes, that is against the rules. It isn't a want, it's a conversation.

[ninish]

The problems I have with the hub are:

1) pagination (I do use and love the filter, but while it helps sometimes, when there's too many of a single breed in the hub, I feel pain for the trades I cannot see.)

2) small space for wants vs my long long long wishlist. I need a whole lot of holiday checker mates, and hatchies for freezing, as well as a lot of random things. But if I say, in the space I have, what I want, I could write: " I want mates for the dergs in these groups xxxxx & yyyyy", I'm afraid I won't get anything because my groups are too big, and having to click on every single dragon to see their lineage bores ME to death; I can't imagine someone would want to do it too xD heck, even when seeing other people's trades who do that, and I'm interested in what they're offering, I do go to their groups but if there's 50 dragons in there, and I'm busy... Yeah I don't look at them all. 

 

You could also tell me that one can put frozen hatchies in the groups that indicate the lineage of the dragon below so people can know with a glance what you need... But I'd need so many frozen hatchies that it'd make trading, which is supposed to be a simple thing, more complicated. I already use a lot of frozen pygmies to sort my groups, but having to have another hatchie for *each* dragon that needs a mate... Please no thanks. So, could we have more room? And/or like, display only the preset characters in the main page, and whatever doesn't fit will be visible only if the interested person *does* open the trade? 

 

______

Other suggestions:

For people who don't want their scroll name publicly displayed, can they have an alias on the trading hub? It's not my case, but maybe people could opt to have a 'trading alias', unchangeable, and not hidden to mods, that makes it so that regular players can't visit their scroll by seeing their user name. I'm too asleep to consider if this is clear enough or not... But well I just left it here before I forgot *falls dead*

[Suzumiya]

1 minute ago, Kaini said:

 

Yes, that is against the rules. It isn't a want, it's a conversation.

 

Okay, thank you. That's all I wanted to know. I've come across several people who made offers I wanted to accept but couldn't because they were locked, but I was afraid to ask something like that since it isn't a trade.

[Kaini]

6 minutes ago, osmarks said:

It could probably be run quite effectively as an external site.

 

Like... the trading section of the forum? @Sextonator You can do all those things on the forum.

 

4 minutes ago, HeatherMarie said:

The way I see it, this feature was implemented with the bare minimum functionality. It *does* function, it just *could* function a whole lot better. Pagination, a 'Have' box to describe what you are trading, more room in the Want box to actually accurately describe exactly what you want, those all are fairly needed things and I agree on that very much. But I don't agree that the feature is just totally useless as it is right now. Sure, you *have* to bump your trade every so often for it to be seen, but it does work, and hundreds of trades have been made successfully so far with just that bare minimum.

 

^ It's not finished yet! It's not like there will never be improvements. Shutting it down because it hasn't been improved on yet is silly. Patience is a virtue.

 

 

I always thought of the hub as a supplement to the forum's trading section, and I'm actually surprised to see most of the trading has moved there. I would have assumed most activity would stay on the forum BECAUSE of the extended options you have on the forum, and the ability to be more detailed.

 

You still have all that on the forum. I'm grateful we now have both avenues.

[49ER]

4 minutes ago, Suzumiya said:

 

 

I see. That makes sense, especially if you're making a particular lineage. I still don't get the song lyrics thing though.

 

Is it against the rules to say "Person who offered <insert dragon name here> you are egg locked" or would that be considered a PM or conversation, even if you do not use the person's scroll/forum name?

Yes you cannot say a person's name or say I wanted to accept offer but you are locked.  That is a new one too

[Tetelestai]

21 minutes ago, Whirlaway said:

 

Here.

Thank you Whirlaway

[osmarks]

1. Not everyone is on the forum for whatever reason. This seems to be the main issue in your thinking. It might even be forum-centric behavior and all of the craziness occuring on it keeping some people off.

2. The forums, despite useful features like pagination and messaging, aren't suitable for trading - old trades aren't cleared and the filtering options are poor.

3. Posting on both and keeping links synced? Really annoying.

 

@Kaini

Edited August 6, 2018 by osmarks

[Sextonator]

Considering the forums aren't directly connected to the site, and there are plenty of people who don't want a forum account, the suggestion to use the forum is quite poor, since it's only a fraction of the user base, and can't be utilized like on site trading could be, if it were able to have features that are desired.

[Suzumiya]

3 minutes ago, 49ER said:

Yes you cannot say a person's name or say I wanted to accept offer but you are locked.  That is a new one too

 

I was never planning on using a person's name. Just saying what the person offered and mentioned that I want to accept but can't. Now I know it's not allowed, so I will not do that. We need to make a list of all these rules and pin it! Unless it's somewhere and I missed it. If I did...well, I guess I need to read stuff more carefully.