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Suggestions for Sweets

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Option 2.2, mostly

 

With maybe..

 

I have a female CB holly, that's almost an gifted alt form right?

Yet as far as I know all the cave dropped ones are male. 

 

But I know folks with 4GEG checks from female holly x gold, so either female holly always breeds female holly, or the holly egg is influenceable. 

 

Which gives precedent for two options. If an alt sweet always breeds true, you could all have one, but it would mess with alternating checks lines, if there was an influence function it would have to be for new eggs only, maybe a bsa specific only  to another sweetling?

 

Personally, I think all this ill feeling is a real shame, it would be nice to see valentines returned to love and hugs

 

I've been on DC for nearly 10 years now, and I've always seen sweetlings as sweetlings, regardless of the colour. As a collector I have an example of the breed, and that ticks the box. I don't have all the colour morphs of all the dragons and so be it, I'll never have all the colour morphs of them all (spriters alts etc). 

 

Hey ho

 

Back to poking eggs, hatch creatures, hatch

 

 

 

 

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6 minutes ago, olympe said:

 

I know that the following mechanism has been suggested for snow angels, but it might also work for sweetlings:

Rule #1: Sweetlings of any color breed true unless otherwise influenced.

Rule #2: Adult Sweetlings gain the ability to influence a Sweetling egg to hatch as their own color. (Pinks making sure a baby hatches pink, blacks making sure a baby hatches black.)

 

Problem: You need to get bred Sweetlings of the other variety in year one in order to create/continue certain lineages. Not much of a problem, IMHO, but it does take at least some dedication (like, playing for another year).

Advantages: Ability to get the variety you don't have, while still allowing for the status quo (turning the other variety into the variety your scroll was coded for) => win/win?

Plus, in later years, you'll be able to turn your own variety into the other one. 

 

This is maybe a bit off-topic, but I can just imagine Pink Sweetlings telling eggs how great love is and how when they hatch everything will be rainbows and sunshine so those little babies will be excited to hatch and will come out pink, while the Alt adults are sitting in another corner, telling eggs all about heartbreak and how everything is bleak, so little babies come out all depressed... Terrible parenting, mind you :D

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Not sure about the quality of this forum's search function, but at least in the last 5 years, Kila apparently hasn't mentioned Sweetlings at all.

It's not unheard of spriters changing opinions on things (like any other human being), plus I'm wondering if Kila even knows about these changes? Some of you seem so adamantly about someone else's opinion. :blink:

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10 minutes ago, olympe said:

 

I know that the following mechanism has been suggested for snow angels, but it might also work for sweetlings:

Rule #1: Sweetlings of any color breed true unless otherwise influenced.

Rule #2: Adult Sweetlings gain the ability to influence a Sweetling egg to hatch as their own color. (Pinks making sure a baby hatches pink, blacks making sure a baby hatches black.)

 

I honestly think this would be an idea solution. (For both)

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10 minutes ago, Ruby Eyes said:

Not sure about the quality of this forum's search function, but at least in the last 5 years, Kila apparently hasn't mentioned Sweetlings at all.

It's not unheard of spriters changing opinions on things (like any other human being), plus I'm wondering if Kila even knows about these changes? Some of you seem so adamantly about someone else's opinion. :blink:

 

I was really curious about that one as well! Because I was skimming through all of her posts and she never posted anything about them around the original release and I only saw some comments she made on how the creation went or giving some details about the size of the dragon but not much else... And yet some people here say that it was her wish to only give it to people affected by the glitch and for it to stay this way forever. I don't know, maybe something was deleted? Or it wasn't her who posted about that in the first place?

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23 minutes ago, olympe said:

 

I know that the following mechanism has been suggested for snow angels, but it might also work for sweetlings:

Rule #1: Sweetlings of any color breed true unless otherwise influenced.

Rule #2: Adult Sweetlings gain the ability to influence a Sweetling egg to hatch as their own color. (Pinks making sure a baby hatches pink, blacks making sure a baby hatches black.)

 

Problem: You need to get bred Sweetlings of the other variety in year one in order to create/continue certain lineages. Not much of a problem, IMHO, but it does take at least some dedication (like, playing for another year).

Advantages: Ability to get the variety you don't have, while still allowing for the status quo (turning the other variety into the variety your scroll was coded for) => win/win?

Plus, in later years, you'll be able to turn your own variety into the other one. 

Forgot to make a rule for spriters' alts. XD Not that they're still being bred much, but just in case.

Maybe Kila's alt could breed black offspring (unless otherwise influenced), since that's the variety it resembles the most, and Nepherim's alt could breed pink offspring for the same reason? Otherwise, all pink is fine with me, too.

 

ETA: I think someone once contacted Kila through other media (deviantart? dunno) and got permission to quote her or something. About one, maybe two years ago?

Edited by olympe

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1 minute ago, ArielGrint said:

And yet some people here say that it was her wish to only give it to people affected by the glitch and for it to stay this way forever. I don't know, maybe something was deleted? Or it wasn't her who posted about that in the first place?

I was trying to find that post too, because I clearly remember it, It was in one of the "Suggestion about Sweetlings" thread, or something like this, with a discussion similar to this topic. It was several years ago, however, and I know that inactive threads are periodically closed and deleted. And that thread was most certainly closed after Kila stated her opinion.

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I prefer a time-based solution, personally, but anything that makes it a level playing field would be fine.

 

 

Althoug if TJ insists that they were supposed to be like spriter alts, another nuclear option: Make all non-CB black sweetlings pink.
 

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6 minutes ago, Sinnarn said:

 

I was trying to find that post too, because I clearly remember it, It was in one of the "Suggestion about Sweetlings" thread, or something like this, with a discussion similar to this topic. It was several years ago, however, and I know that inactive threads are periodically closed and deleted. And that thread was most certainly closed after Kila stated her opinion.

 

Oh, ok. I haven't seen it myself(obviously) so can't comment on that one. But I do think if the change was triggered by her request for Alts to be discontinued it would be good if TJ actually announced it... This way it would make it less frustrating for everyone I think. Though to be fair updated rules don't necessarily limit the distribution of alts in a major way(in the sense that they can actually be made), so that would still not actually honour her request I guess. I don't know, I still feel a bit weird about the whole situation, the seemingly random change seems very confusing to me

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I can't help wondering what it was that made TJ decide suddenly after all these years that he needed to touch the Sweetling mechanic.

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5 minutes ago, The Dragoness said:

[snip]

 

So. Here's what I would like to see:

1. The original CB alts stay black. Yes, lineage building will still be difficult, but it isn't fair to take away a gift that some people have cherished for so many years. I know I would be devestated if I came back to a whole new sprite.

2. A feature (BSA, timing, etc.) capable of changing the color of a bred Sweetling is introduced. Everyone can use it, so it's a level playing field. Most lineages will also be preserved with the exclusion of CBs.

3. If one side gets both colors, so does the other. Not only would lineage building be easier, but there will also be far fewer complaints.

 

[snip]

 

I agree with this. 

 

People in the cave get to collect, enjoy, and build lineages with both sprites, but the original CBs stay special for the people who received them. 

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TJ did post why he made the decision over in the cave feedback thread. I quoted it in the main thread. It says nothing about apologies or the artists' wishes--just that he intended the alts to behave like spriter alts and after the first instance of black breeding black, it stayed as-is and taking alts away was his way of fixing it. Planting trees and all that jazz.

 

Unrelated, but I would support a hatchie bsa that changes hatchies to a color of choice that sticks when they grow up.

 

Edit: Kila is reachable via DA. I pmed her a while ago to get permission to have someone make me my sweetling plush.

Edited by Jazeki

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TJ's post didn't give any indication why he suddenly decided to 'fix' the issue after so many years, though. If the alts were actually intended to breed regular sweets, but didn't because of whatever, the time to fix that would've been when they were first found to breed alts. It's been *seven years* of this specific mechanic, I definitely don't understand why he decided to do something to 'fix' it after so many years when it's apparently been 'broken' since the very first time the alts bred true. It seems, based on the response of the userbase, that deciding to change it after so many years was not the right approach to take.

Edited by HeatherMarie

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Yes, @Jazeki, I saw that post. But it doesn't explain why it took him soooooooo many years after the limits for bred holiday dragons was lifted. I would not have been upset if my boys had acted like Spriter Alts and never bred true. But to try to stop that after so long and then go back on that and do something that just made things even worse?????

 

And I do hope that poor Kila will not get barraged with messages now. :(

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I completely agree that nothing should happen until Kila (and Nepherim, if they have anything to add) steps in. The Sweetlings were her creation, so it seems like the best thing to do is just wait for an answer from her. Sadly though, I don't think she's been around for years. 

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3 minutes ago, HeatherMarie said:

TJ's post didn't give any indication why he suddenly decided to 'fix' the issue after so many years, though. If the alts were actually intended to breed regular sweets, but didn't because of whatever, the time to fix that would've been when they were first found to breed alts. It's been *seven years* of this specific mechanic, I definitely don't understand why he decided to do something to 'fix' it after so many years when it's apparently been 'broken' since the very first time the alts bred true. It seems, based on the response of the userbase, that deciding to change it after so many years was not the right approach to take.

The impression I got from his latter posts was better late than never. I don't agree, but that's what it seems like.

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I don't agree, either. And if it was better then he should have stuck by it (although that would have made me sad because of the lineages that I planned to continue). But to make the second change that everyone feels gives the alt owners even more privilege was kind of a slap in the face of the whole player base.

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2 minutes ago, purplehaze said:

I don't agree, either. And if it was better then he should have stuck by it (although that would have made me sad because of the lineages that I planned to continue). But to make the second change that everyone feels gives the alt owners even more privilege was kind of a slap in the face of the whole player base.

 

Bold is exactly how I feel =/

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2 hours ago, Painter said:


Sometimes, I wish we could have discussions where people desire change to the site, and those same people would not get called selfish, ungrateful, or spoiled (most of this is just implied, but it's there.) Wanting change and seeing how much more enjoyable it would be for everyone if everyone were actually allowed to participate, is really not some radical idea that deserves scorn.

 

 

Me too... me too.

 

I see people talking about how much they love their alt sweetlings, how they're top favorites, cherished, special, and precious, and all the fun  there is creating lineages with them. I wish to see more people get that opportunity; to enjoy these pretty, unique sprites that have been excluded from so many because they were not in the right place at the right time, once, eight years ago.

 

I see how overjoyed people were about catching old CB holidays-- even Hollies, what a baseless dream that would've been years ago. Lineages thought near impossible are now being made, 2nd gens spread about. Bright pinks and Frills make a return, and even if they're not my personal top favorites, I am happy to see so many others happy to finally get their chance to own them. To make lineages, and plans, and name them silly things, and freeze cute hatchling sprites, and enjoy collecting them just because they like them. 

 

I'd like to see alt Sweetlings become available to the general populace. My favorite ideas so far are the BSA, breeding by day/night, or having them act as a different 'breed' for new limits. Ideally, the fewest current lineages ruined, the better. I'd like to see people creating fun new lineages, and cherishing their favorite sprites, and enjoying themselves... and not left wishing they had been a victim of a glitch that happened eight years ago. I'd like to see both sides (and how I loathe that it's even divided as such) be happy with blacks and pinks and able to collect and enjoy the sprites they love most.

 

I guess I'm just a radical thinker too.

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4 hours ago, Shroomlet said:

 

And now please tell me where anyone here ever said all owners want a lot for them? I just said in my experience it was very hard to get any offspring from them, and that when I saw trades, a lot was asked for them. I also didn't say that those traders got what they asked for, just that they wouldn't accept what I could offer them.

This was about emphasising how unneccessarily hard it is to get their offspring. Why does everyone assume they are bad people because of that?

[...]

 

Now how many of those second gens were bred by the person that owns the CB and not just ones found on the AP? Yeah I see lots of people wanting offers on their second gens, but as far as I know, they don't own the CB ones. Also if you wanted a second gen from one, have you tried asking someone? Someone who actually owns the CB ones that is and not something that was found on the AP.

 

I would prefer if everything would be put back how it originally was, but at this point I'm fine if they get turned pink. Whatever the artist wants is fine with me.

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4 minutes ago, OMGitsKairi said:

 

@ bolded - I got my CB Sweets from the 5-minute drop directly after the affected drop, and I was devastated when I found out about the alts.  Glitches and data loss have occurred in similar situations where the end result was not the same as the Sweetling scenario. I recall a few years ago people's CB Hallowe'ens were auto-ing, as if affected by a breed limit. Did TJ implement an infinitely cooler version of the dragon for people whose eggs were lost? No. They were simply replaced.

 

I don't think I was here for the Halloween glitch, but if any one of the artists of the halloween dragons wanted to replace them with their spriter's alt, I would have been fine with it. As with the bright pinks, I fully accepted that people had something I couldn't get. I think it should have stayed that way. I also supported the  Artist of the frills and their decision to retire them. I still wish I could replace my sweetling and I don't understand why I am allowed to have pinks too. I have a few eggs on my scroll that will end up pink if the changes stay. I'll either release them or just freeze them. I don't think I should have the pinks because I don't think it's fair for certain users to have both.

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45 minutes ago, Nine said:

 

Me too... me too.

 

I see people talking about how much they love their alt sweetlings, how they're top favorites, cherished, special, and precious, and all the fun  there is creating lineages with them. I wish to see more people get that opportunity; to enjoy these pretty, unique sprites that have been excluded from so many because they were not in the right place at the right time, once, eight years ago.

 

I see how overjoyed people were about catching old CB holidays-- even Hollies, what a baseless dream that would've been years ago. Lineages thought near impossible are now being made, 2nd gens spread about. Bright pinks and Frills make a return, and even if they're not my personal top favorites, I am happy to see so many others happy to finally get their chance to own them. To make lineages, and plans, and name them silly things, and freeze cute hatchling sprites, and enjoy collecting them just because they like them. 

 

I'd like to see alt Sweetlings become available to the general populace. My favorite ideas so far are the BSA, breeding by day/night, or having them act as a different 'breed' for new limits. Ideally, the fewest current lineages ruined, the better. I'd like to see people creating fun new lineages, and cherishing their favorite sprites, and enjoying themselves... and not left wishing they had been a victim of a glitch that happened eight years ago. I'd like to see both sides (and how I loathe that it's even divided as such) be happy with blacks and pinks and able to collect and enjoy the sprites they love most.

 

I guess I'm just a radical thinker too.

All of this. I really couldn't have said it better.

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1 minute ago, Wookieinmashoo said:

 

I'm assuming for good reasons.

 

Same. At this point, whatever has happened, has happened. I just think that if one portion of users are permitted to own both sprites, everyone should. 

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