Fixing the Current CB Prize System

[JadeEyedJasmine]

A lot of users are unhappy with the raffle system, and CB prizes in general. Some lucky people have won multiple prizes, while others (the majority) have not won any. There are massive value gaps between 2nd and 3rd gen prizes, and trades heavily favor people with CB prizes. It's a messy situation, but perhaps there are ways to improve it. Any ideas are welcome here.

 

My Ideas-Would Love Feedback-General Opinions Are in Blue

-CB Limits-beats the whole purpose of the raffle Few people like this idea, understandably

-Once you win, you cannot win again until everyone entered in the raffle has already won-similar to the above Few people like this idea, understandably

-A store-don't really like this one as dragon cave has, unlike other sites, stayed completely free to use and I appreciate that. Also a store could be exploited and the mechanics of a store just don't make for happy, fun gameplay IMO. This one is a bit polarizing

-Prizes as, well prizes for doing actual things, such as being on dc for X amount of years, completing the dragon encyclopedia, raising/freezing/breeding X amount of dragons, earning a platinum trophy, etc. Some people really like this idea, others don't think it's necessary. In particular earning prizes after X amount of years is disliked by some because it is the most unfair for newer players.

 

Ideas of Others

-Increase Amount of Prizes-The generally favored solution

-There isn't a problem and therefore there is no need for a solution- Fairly even split on this one, which is why the thread was created in the first place

-Bronze prize for bronze trophy, siler for silver, gold for gold, random for platinum- Not too many have responded either way to this idea

 

Ultimately, the goal (for me, at least) is to make prizes a little more attainable, so everyone actually has something to work towards so they can get one, or higher chances of earning one. After all, this is a collectibles game, and I favor there being steady ways to collect.

 

Edited January 5, 2018 by JadeEyedJasmine

[Paradisiske]

first off

 

NO LIMITS

 

just because someone has won more than once doesnt mean they shouldnt get their second prize. raffles are random and all about luck. we all enter for it even those who won before. there is nothing wrong with that. 

 

secondly i dont see the store happening. it would have to be such a major thing to code in and then we'd have something close to flightrising and i hate that. because with ingame currency there has to be money sinks. otherwise inflation will happen way too quickly and easily. and i hate money sinks. i have to pay 999,000 crystals in flight rising to increase my lair space because lair space in that game is limited.

 

best solution is just to increase the amount of winners. 

[Moonlight_Eevee]

And cue everyone going to talk about the store 😒

 

Also, this has been suggested in the past on how to get more people in getting prizes but everyone mostly focused on the store idea so 🤷I would say increase the amount of winners

[Tears in Rain]

I don't think limiting past winners and such would be a fair and reasonable measure  (For the record, I own no CB Prize myself  ) Maybe increasing the number of winners would be nice.

However, I do support some feature that would involve working towards CaveBorn Prizes, I see why the randomness of the raffle and no other ways to get CBs can be disappointing to a lot of players. 

 

[JadeEyedJasmine]

I am okay with people winning more than once. That's just how raffles work. My thinking is that either in addition to/in place of the raffles, we have a system that allows everyone to work towards a prize. Prizes shouldn't become common or anything, just attainable. Maybe if you get a platinum trophy, you get a random CB prize. Maybe when you get your bronze trophy, you get a random bronze prize, silver trophy a silver prize, and gold trophy a gold prize but then I have no idea about platinum. Or increasing the amount of winners might fix the problem well enough, even if that still has the faults of being a raffle.

[Guillotine]

I think slightly weighting the RNG against people who have won in the past, say, 12 months? should work, if combined with increased winner numbers.

 

That said, some kind of non-random way to get them (even if it's something that requires a great deal of effort) would be best.
 

[Paradisiske]

2 minutes ago, Guillotine said:

I think slightly weighting the RNG against people who have won in the past, say, 12 months? should work, if combined with increased winner numbers.

 

That said, some kind of non-random way to get them (even if it's something that requires a great deal of effort) would be best.
 

i completely disagree with any penalty for previous winners. they did not choose to win, they did not trade, barter, cheat or buy their way to a win. they just got lucky. there is nothing wrong with getting lucky and if someone gets lucky more than once who cares? they should not be punished for it just for people who haven gotten lucky yet.

 

im more than fine with greatly increasing the amount of winners per month. lets have a thousand winners per month. maybe more.

a way to get prize dragons through getting trophy levels or maybe even just doing ingame regular things and you'll randomly get a pop up saying you got a prize in addition to the monthly raffles fine. 

[IVIandy]

"Once you win, you cannot win again until everyone entered in the raffle has already won-similar to the above"

 

So then wouldn't that be never? If you take into account every new person who joins and enters? Or am I just not awake enough to read properly ._.

 

Also, I would like to say my only problem with the Prize Raffle (Even though it does suck when people win more than once but that's RNG for you) is the fact we can no longer put our own 'codes' as names. Kinda miffed about that. Why was that changed anyways?

[JadeEyedJasmine]

That was just me throwing out ideas. Maybe eveentually everyone would get a cb prize and people could start winning more, or maybe some people will never get a cb prize. I don't know. I think the choosing codes was too difficult for tj to code, so it no longer happens, but I am not completely sure.

[angelicdragonpuppy]

There’s a store suggestion that wouldn’t have any sort of real world payment involved. That’s my preferred solution to the problem.

 

@Dalek Raptor if people keep mentioning the store, perhaps it’s because the store is a great solution to many of the cave’s current problems  

[Whirlaway]

The only suggestion I ever thought of was preventing the previous month's winners from entering the next month. i.e December winners can't enter the January raffle, but after January they can reenter once again. 

 

It would reduce at least 60 people from entering who have already won from entering right after, but would not prevent them from ever entering again.

Edited January 5, 2018 by Dorchet

[Paradisiske]

17 minutes ago, angelicdragonpuppy said:

There’s a store suggestion that wouldn’t have any sort of real world payment involved. That’s my preferred solution to the problem.

 

@Dalek Raptor if people keep mentioning the store, perhaps it’s because the store is a great solution to many of the cave’s current problems  

im against ANY kind of currency whether real world payment or completely ingame. i dont care if theres a store suggestion that only has ingame currency and cash has no affect on it. im against it. i do not want to grind in this game. its boring and frankly i dont have the hours anymore to devote to this site and other games as i used to have thanks to uni. 

 

and money sinks will happen if ingame currency is introduced to help avoid inflation. 100% against that.

 

now i would just like to point out that while you among others may feel the store is a great solution to many of the current problems we have with this game, others including me feel that it would do more bad than good for gameplay. and when people keep bringing up the store in threads where the store has no place being mentioned then it can get a bit annoying its understandable.

 

the store cannot keep being used to derail threads that are suggesting other things for this game. now the op of this thread has mentioned the store yes but it seems to be their absolute least favorite from the suggestions they listed from what i can tell.

[Nyxity]

One can't change the past, but if a Prize Dragon was an all go deal, I would have made it something individual players could work for. As mentioned in that post about bringing about new prize types (platinum and shiz)... It wouldn't be like the 2010 voting thing - that was faultier than the actual Raffle. It wouldn't be a Raffle either. While the game does have the aspect of luck in it, the eggs we get are mostly based on our own efforts. Those who won before, sure... you won the prize fair and square. Those who want to keep the Raffle, that can be fine as well as some people may or may not have lady luck on their side. For a "main" way to distribute prizes? I'd go with how some of the forum-based prizes work: This month obtain this many common dragon. Can't put int he time? That is okay, the Raffle is still in place, just less chances to win via the Raffle and more chances if you compete.

[angelicdragonpuppy]

@CellyBean many people are worried about grinding, and because of that the store suggestion was extensively and carefully thought out to ensure it would only reward normal play and not excessive play. I’ve seen games with grinding and huge prices and I hate them too, but I think there are ways to avoid them happening.

 

The suggestion and question the OP has is how we can fix the current prize system. I think a store would do exactly that. Just because you dislike it yourself doesn’t mean mentioning it is derailing the thread. 

[HeatherMarie]

I too honestly think the store would fix a *lot* of the current issues in this game, including Prizes. The main thing against a store/currency that most people bring up is not wanting to "grind", which is why the specific store option was so good, because it was very extensively talked about and figured out, and you would get currency only from doing regular game-playing things that you'd be doing anyways, like raising dragons. Grinding wouldn't be necessary or even possible.

 

If the store is an absolute no-go, I'd very very strongly support raising the number of winners each month. At *least* 200-300 winners a month. 60 per month is so ludicrously small that it would take at *least* 4 years for every user to win once, and that's assuming there are less then 3,000 active players and that no one wins more then once, which we already know isn't true. I'd also MAJORLY support a way to actually *earn* Prizes, whether through trophy status or raising a certain number of a specific breed or whatever, don't really care. 

[IVIandy]

I can see the store also being 'exploited' like how the Win A 2G Holly Raffle went if it's being based on raising dragons. Certain people were hoarding olive hatchlings for others because they would get a 2G Shimmer/Prize from the person in return.

[Dragon_Arbock]

I agree with ADP- bringing up the store isn't derailing the thread- the OP mentioned the store as a possible solution themselves.

Obviously no to a store that would involve real money, but I'd be all for a system that rewards me with credits for raising dragons, then lets me turn those in at a store where I can get whatever I want. It helps those who are unlucky/slow/bad internet eventually get what others have.

 

@IVIandy there will be nothing to exploit if the worth of prizes crashes as a result of this. Never mind that I think it should only count raising something from an egg. And that was a competition. This isn't a limited supply, I would think, like that was.

 

The CB prizes could very much benefit from being obtainable from said store. I don't know that I mind keeping the raffle going so long as there's another way to get them that's less luck-based.

 

Another idea I like is that you could be eligible to redeem a prize every anniversary- so each year you've been a member you get one prize, or something like that; maybe starting with bronze tinsel, and working up to gold shimmer or something like that.

Edited January 5, 2018 by Dragon_Arbock

[IVIandy]

2 minutes ago, Dragon_Arbock said:

I agree with ADP- bringing up the store isn't derailing the thread- the OP mentioned the store as a possible solution themselves.

Obviously no to a store that would involve real money, but I'd be all for a system that rewards me with credits for raising dragons, then lets me turn those in at a store where I can get whatever I want. It helps those who are unlucky/slow/bad internet eventually get what others have.

 

@IVIandy there will be nothing to exploit if the worth of prizes crashes as a result of this. Never mind that I think it should only count raising something from an egg.

 

The CB prizes could very much benefit from being obtainable from said store. I don't know that I mind keeping the raffle going so long as there's another way to get them that's less luck-based.

 

Another idea I like is that you could be eligible to redeem a prize every anniversary- so each year you've been a member you get one prize, or something like that; maybe starting with bronze tinsel, and working up to gold shimmer or something like that.

Oh that is true, didn't think of the worth dropping. If you have a CB Prize/Shimmer you can really ask for anything which I think is ridiculous. I promised myself if I ever won you would see my dragon's offspring in the AP. Everyone gets a 2nd Gen haha! I like the anniversary idea, give me a reminder of how old I am.

[HeatherMarie]

I like the anniversary idea, but how do you work that with people who've been here forever? I've been playing for over 9 years now, does that mean I'll immediately get to have 9 Prizes? Or would it just start fresh from whenever the feature is introduced (in which case the entire userbase active when it's introduced will be owned a Prize 1 year later....)

 

The store suggestion thread had a cap on how much you could earn in a certain amount of time, so I don't see much of a way to exploit it. You gain points/currency/whatever by playing the game as you normally do, but only up to a certain value, and then you can't earn any more for that period (I think it was a week or so). So someone holding dragons for you wouldn't really work if you are already at that cap, and even if you aren't the cap will stop you from accumulating too much at once from the people giving you dragons.

[Kovia]

3 hours ago, Dorchet said:

The only suggestion I ever thought of was preventing the previous month's winners from entering the next month. i.e December winners can't enter the January raffle, but after January they can reenter once again. 

 

It would reduce at least 60 people from entering who have already won from entering right after, but would not prevent them from ever entering again.

This one I would support, but I feel like anything else is unfair.

 

Honestly, I'm just glad that anyone is getting CB Prizes again. I thought they were gonna be gone forever. Raw statistics state that I'll get one eventually if I keep entering.

 

There is no way to balance the market without making everything worthless. Even if everyone has a CB of everything, there will still be 2G Thuweds and spriter's alts. It's just not gonna happen.

[Jazeki]

Hmm...it seems a bit early for this thread to be popping up again, but I suppose with the other about adding more prizes, it was only a matter of time. 

 

Things I am for: the anniversary idea, more winners, a tweak to the system where you can't win prizes consecutively, the store with in-game currency or a way to earn prizes.

 

Things I am not for: new prize colors/types, spending real money for prizes, limiting prizes to one ever or one until everyone else wins.

 

Idk...feels like beating a dead horse with this thread.

[Dragon_Arbock]

Beating a dead horse, but so far any efforts to fix the inequality prizes have created has fallen on death ears. Such a topic will keep coming up until something is done, I presume.

 

@Marie19R Honestly I assume only each year from this point forward would really be fair, but I don't know that giving someone like you or me 8-9 prizes would really be so bad- it might help stabilize things faster the more there are. But I can't predict how much value they will retain even then.

It's just an idea anyway, cause I do prefer the shop.

[blockEdragon]

Kill them all and discontinue the breed forever, Problem solved! (/sarcasm)

 

Okay for real this time,

I think the luck based rarity and just how OP they are because of that is the root of the issue, this may be controversial due to how drastic of a change it would be but I think the best option to make prizes special but still attainable would be to award them based on trophy leveling.

 

How this would work:

 

When you get a trophy you get a notification for a chance to pick between two eggs that match the trophy color you have, a shimmer and a tinsel.

The platinum could be a bonus prize of any color/breed of prize you want or something else entirely (it's not as relevant as the first three)

NOTE: People who already have all the trophies could grab all three/four at once or whenever, the notification could probably sit until you're ready. (This system should not and almost certainly would not exclude older players!)

 

Extra CBs could be won through the raffle like before, and if that isn't enough new ways can be added to get extras while still leaving them as a ("pseudo-")limited breed (Maybe a new summer event of some kind). More ways could be added if 3(-4) isn't enough, since there are six breeds (12 if you want both genders) it probably won't be so new ways to get prizes would probably be welcome.

 

As for death and otherwise loosing the dragon, since you only get 3(-4?) I think it would be reasonable to not allow CBs to be traded or abandoned (similar to GoNs for a very similar reason) and possibly not allow them to get sick.

As for the dragon dying or being released, there should probably be a way to retry for a replacement since people make mistakes and sometimes regret their choices and shouldn't be permanently penalized without a fair chance to try again. They shouldn't be able to retry without a little effort to remain balanced but it should not be impossible for the average player either (perhaps a raise another _REASONABLE AMOUNT HERE_ of dragons scenario would work).

 

This system allows them to stay rare in their own way (similar to GoNs but admittedly easier and less luck based) without them being nearly unattainable unless you're very lucky and "nerfs" them so you don't get to dominate the trademarket because you won a luck based raffle.

And winning the raffle would still be cool because free extra of something that is normally very limited. 

Edited January 5, 2018 by blockEdragon

[Whirlaway]

Caveborn Prizes dragons already are not able to get sick, just so you know, nor can they be abandoned, either.

Edited January 5, 2018 by Dorchet

[Meruru]

I remember TJ being strict about not wanting anniversary or once per year free gifts and I don't know if he changed his mind since then.. do you mind if I add some of my Ideas  

 

 

incoming wall of text!!

 

 

for the raffle then increasing the amount of winners is a very good idea but it still won't guarantee us winning so I feel that adding a participation prize may help make people less annoyed?

and by participation prize I don't mean it as everyone gets something, it's more like a 4rth prize below bronze in which the prize is not a prize dragon but a selection of every super rare dragon currently available in the game but it must follow the raffle rules too so 4rth prize winners must be a big number so maybe 3000 winners? I think it gives people a reason to join the raffle every month.

as for those who won the raffle then I humbly suggest they get a 1 month break from entering the raffle to give people a chance and they are able to join the month after.

 

if we are going the anniversary rout or the once per year route then I am no so sure about this one but maybe awarding the player for being active throughout the year? and receiving a prize for the amount of years playing the game plus being active in those years so a person who suddenly was absent for a long time won't instantly wind a prize after a 5 year absence so something like a point system to prove your activity by simply playing the game or just like the raffle where you grow 3 adults per month, and i have joined this game late 2008 and have been active ever since then,

I can't help it if i love this game

so my Idea is the player can redeem these points for a prize based on the number of years being active and a rank up system every 3 years and it goes like this..

 

a new player joins and is actively playing for 3 years saves points and get the first rank where the player is able to redeem the points for a prize but since the player is only rank1 then only the bronze prize is redeemable, then the player again stays active for the next 3 years and gets to rank2  and unlocks the silver prizes and is able to redeem a bronze or a silver prize of his choice, once again 3 years of activity and player unlocks rank 3 which is the gold prizes and is able to redeem any prize of his choice (gold/silver/bronze)

maybe event introduce a special platinum prize for those who have been playing for 9+ years but only through this method.

 

just so I won't confuse anyone, the player can redeem points for a prize once per year after unlocking rank 1 (3 years) but won't be able to redeem for a silver rank2 (6 years) or a gold rank 3 (9 years)..

 

 

I honestly have no Idea how a store would work in this game, should it be a rares only shop? can we choose which biome the egg came from? and how does the currency will work, maybe we will have a new option to send our dragons to fetch for treasure to use as currency  

 

 

my ideas are not absolutely perfect so feel free to change, give advice and share your thoughts.

 

I would love to hear from all of you