Allow precognition to be used on trade offers

[blockEdragon]

I think precognition would be more helpful if it could be used on hatchlings (and maybe eggs but this is more for those ungendered hatchie offers) that have been offered to you in a teleport or if the BSA's prediction could be seen by other people after it's been made.

 

Idea A:

Allow precognition to be directly used on eggs and hatchlings that have been offered on your trades.

(idea by olympe that I blanked on when making this:) and allow either side to precog any creature in a teleport so long as they have access to the tradelink.

 

Idea B:

Leave some kind of text on the main page to showcase which way the precog said it would gender regardless of whether it's offered on any trades or not.

 

Example:

 

 

I think that either of these options would be really helpful to everyone involved in the trade, help to streamline the gender proof process and remove the possible gender-scam VIA photoshop or lying about influence.

Edited September 29, 2017 by blockEdragon

[Fuzzbucket]

I don't really care, but IF, I'd rather A - as it means the person wanting the egg uses one of their own Aeons and suffers the cooldown on it.

 

And I REALLY dislike B anyway. I might prefer not to broadcast the sex of my growing things to others ahead of time.

[blockEdragon]

The other stuff I understand but is there some possible consequence to other people knowing the precog's outcome that I just didn't realise?

Edited May 17, 2017 by blockEdragon

[Jazeki]

I don't really ever have a need for specific genders myself, but I support either A or B.

[SkyWolf25]

I support A, and B too if it's optional. Looks like this would solve some trade difficulties and problems!

[Aleoleo]

I like B the most.

 

A would be nice too... if it were added alonside B.

[AppleMango]

This is a great idea. I'm not sure if it has been taken into account, but how would this work with eggs since they can also be precog'd? As in, if someone offers an egg on a trade that was going to be male until they influenced it female, but it will lose influence once it is traded and be male again, how would that work?

[blockEdragon]

This is a great idea. I'm not sure if it has been taken into account, but how would this work with eggs since they can also be precog'd? As in, if someone offers an egg on a trade that was going to be male until they influenced it female, but it will lose influence once it is traded and be male again, how would that work?

Influence is negated by teleportation if it's an egg so it doesn't carry over and has to be influenced again, so it probably could get away with giving the future may be influenced line or something.

[olympe]

I support A, but with one addition: Eggs/hatchies that are in a teleport should be precog-able by anyone who has access to the link.

 

Example: I have a CB gold hatchling (yeah, wishful thinking) that I want to trade away for whatever. (As if...) If you're interested in offering on my hatchie only if it's a certain gender, you can precog it as long as you do so from the teleport link.

 

(I'm not sure if it's necessary to have this for one-way teleports, too - but

[Fuzzbucket]

I support A, but with one addition: Eggs/hatchies that are in a teleport should be precog-able by anyone who has access to the link.

 

Example: I have a CB gold hatchling (yeah, wishful thinking) that I want to trade away for whatever. (As if...) If you're interested in offering on my hatchie only if it's a certain gender, you can precog it as long as you do so from the teleport link.

 

(I'm not sure if it's necessary to have this for one-way teleports, too - but

Yes - this. I'm OK if someone I want to trade with can use their Aeon to check if it's what they need, but yes, to whoever asked, there are times I choose to keep the things I am growing for myself close to my chest. OK I'm weird. So hit me !

[Zeditha]

Well, you could implement a different flavour text for precog through a trade; something along the lines of 'this egg will be male, but was influenced female. It will hatch male if you trade it.'

 

I don't know how you'd word it fluidly though.

 

Perhaps a precog via trade will ignore the effect of Influence, and just tell you what gender the egg will be if you let it gender naturally on your scroll, along with (in the place of "But its future may still be influenced") "but it will become {other gender} if it is not traded before hatching."

 

Or something like that, idk

[The Dragoness]

Yes, yes, yes! I would love this. I recently asked for a male/male precogged hatchling on one of my trades and was given a precogged female instead...which I didn't really need. Sort of my own fault, but this would have been a huge help.

 

I voted for A, but B is nice as well

[olympe]

Well, you could implement a different flavour text for precog through a trade; something along the lines of 'this egg will be male, but was influenced female. It will hatch male if you trade it.'

 

I don't know how you'd word it fluidly though.

 

Perhaps a precog via trade will ignore the effect of Influence, and just tell you what gender the egg will be if you let it gender naturally on your scroll, along with (in the place of "But its future may still be influenced") "but it will become {other gender} if it is not traded before hatching."

 

Or something like that, idk

Just ignore influence for egg trades. After all, the teleport link breaks when an egg hatches.

And for hatchlings - well, gender is pretty much set into stone.

 

Talking about precog - how does the BSA work on ungendered dragons, like neglecteds?

[Imzadi]

Just ignore influence for egg trades. After all, the teleport link breaks when an egg hatches.

And for hatchlings - well, gender is pretty much set into stone.

 

Talking about precog - how does the BSA work on ungendered dragons, like neglecteds?

It does not work on NDs at all...says not available for breed. However if the egg was precog before exp, the gender will be the same, according to my 2 tries

Edited May 20, 2017 by ainisarie

[Snowwall]

I don't much care either way. Knowing what you're offered is often handy, true. On the other hand, sometimes I agree with the people wanting the secret/surprise/privacy. Optional is fine.

 

What I want is to be able to precog a dragon while it is in trade without taking it out of the teleport!

[Ruby Eyes]

I like both ideas, actually, but "both" was not an option to select

 

Option B could be displayed on the teleport page itself instead of a growing thing's /view/ page. Just a gender marker, maybe with a tilde on eggs, e.g. (~f) since eggs can still be influenced.

Edited September 28, 2017 by Ruby Eyes

[HeatherMarie]

Support for A, no support for B, for reasons fuzz stated. However, Ruby Eyes just gave a very acceptable alternative to B, and I could totally support that, since it would mean that only people who had the teleport link would see the gender message.

[TJ09]

I think the discussion here is glossing over the added complication of influence. It would be completely reasonable to show the precognition result if the owner had used the BSA on an egg and then tried to trade it, but if the egg had also been influenced, then all bets are off, and it's not exactly directly clear why (e.g. the site could simply not show the result because it's guaranteed to be unknown again after trading, but it'd be confusing why it doesn't show up. Directly saying "this egg has been influenced, so its gender will be unknown after trading" is a little more clear, but still feels awkward).

[angelicdragonpuppy]

Perhaps precog could only be used (and results would only be shown) on eggs under 3 days or ungendered hatchies? I mean, sometimes someone might run out of influences and want to know what an egg would be without using it, but that's going to be a very small amount of cases for most, I'd wager.

[pinkgothic]

Since Influence has been mentioned here as a BSA that might be broadcast similarly, how about we allow people to Influence eggs on a trade link as well? (Idea A, applied for Influence.) It would have absolutely no effect, unless and only if they receive the trade. When they do get the egg, it would be as though the egg was influenced by them all along.

 

I feel like this would be fairly intuitive for use (even if not intuitive to implement ) and really convenient, in that it gives control to the people who are interested in getting the trade - especially interesting for 2Gs, where some people might want a spiral and others a stair/checker, for example. You don't need to worry about a trade hitting your scroll a few minutes shy of hatching and you don't catch it in time to influence it the traditional way.

 

It would also help with potential future problems as discussed in the dedicated thread about not breaking teleports when eggs hatch:

In that scenario, as long as hatchlings are ungendered, the recipient's Influence would still 'hold', applied once it hits their scroll.

 

Lore caveat: This is actually very different to the precog suggestion. Precog is easy to imagine working the same for creatures you own versus creatures you don't own. But being able to maybe-influence the gender of a dragon is, lore-wise, very different from the Influence we already have. After all, it's not exactly conceivable the pink dragons still do their temperature-regulating trick if the result is optional, taking effect only on receiving of the egg. So it might be better suited for a different BSA we've yet to get.

[osmarks]

@Fuzzbucket Why do you not want people to know what gender stuff will be? Seems weird.

 

Anyway, I think it would make sense to show if a thing has been influenced/precogged a certain gender on their view page.

[daffy]

Personally I'd find it useful even if precog was only available on hatchlings. 

[Aalbiel]

To me, idea B is better because it's helpful in cases other than trades. Support.

[DarkEternity]

I like both ideas 

On 9/29/2017 at 12:57 PM, TJ09 said:

I think the discussion here is glossing over the added complication of influence. It would be completely reasonable to show the precognition result if the owner had used the BSA on an egg and then tried to trade it, but if the egg had also been influenced, then all bets are off, and it's not exactly directly clear why (e.g. the site could simply not show the result because it's guaranteed to be unknown again after trading, but it'd be confusing why it doesn't show up. Directly saying "this egg has been influenced, so its gender will be unknown after trading" is a little more clear, but still feels awkward).

I think that most people who would actively use and regularly trade would have already taken this into account.  

[Jack_Indivisible]

I support A or B.