Larger Release Suggestion

[Silverwatermist]

I think a good point was made that even if dragons are ON the completed list, many times the artists/creators are no longer around on DC, so their work can't be used. But I wonder, what is the ratio of Dragon Requests that TJ would have used, but they sat around unseen/unused for so long that the artists went inactive, to Dragon Requests TJ was never interested in thus they never got used? If there's a problem with solid Dragon Requests going unseen/unused until the artists are no longer here, perhaps a more tame release could be scheduled for winter? What if every year in November or January or March (whenever you guys feel would be the best time, I don't know) one or two new releases from the completed Dragon Requests were scheduled for release? I feel like one per year might be reasonable if TJ feels like there's generally at LEAST one request per year that meets cave standards and his vision. Obviously it's a little unpredictable as to if there would be one he's totally convinced on every year, but if there's a great request that goes unnoticed in favor of established artists and then, in that interim time, the creators of that request vanish, I think that's a shame. Again, I don't know how often that actually happens or if at all. I'm merely saying, if it DOES, maybe one dedicated Dragon Requests Release per year could solve it.

Edited October 6, 2016 by Silverwatermist

[Jazeki]

I like the idea, but I prefer for it to be executed as C4 suggests. (Or we have more regular monthly releases right on through the "holiday" season excluding October and December, of course.)

[Cinnamin Draconna]

TJ just posted in another thread that the CL was recently reduced by around 50%. So that says that something IS happening, it's just behind the scenes WHERE WE DON'T SEE IT. So we don't know that anything is happening and we get frustrated.

 

If the 50% that is left on the CL is maybe good enough for release... or not. There are still a LOT of dragons there.. and many of them are awesome and I would LOVE to see them in the Cave.

 

Between Halloween and V'day things get VERY boring around here. There's like 3 days of excitement for Halloween, 3 more for xmas and then 3 for v'day. I'm pretty much burnt out on Holiday lineages and thinking about releasing a bunch of my dragons from said lineages, just because I'm totally bored with them.

 

I need more stuff to do that is NOT holiday related that I can do between the holiday hype. And since DC doesn't really allow for anything except collecting, breeding and trading (and I don't do much trading).. new lineages are about all that keeps me interested. But new lineages require new dragons and I'd rather do something NEW, instead of just collecting more of the same dragons that have already been used for lineage after lineage after lineage.

 

So I'm asking for more and bigger releases. I thought the 12 days of Winter/christmas might be interesting enough to get some support. I guess I was wrong *sigh* oh well. But I still like the idea and if 78 dragons is too many maybe we can find another number, but one that still gets a LOT of new dragons in Cave. 1 or 2 a month is just NOT enough.. I haven't really been impressed with many of the recent releases, so once I collected my male/female pair, I didn't collect any more. New releases always bring a little excitement waiting to see the adults, but after the hype is over, it goes back to the same dull routine.

 

But maybe if we got more than 1 or 2 per month it would keep the hype going longer. If I'm still hunting for the last release when the next release happens, WOW what a concept. Continually having something NEW to do would be awesome and the only thing on DC that makes that happen is NEW RELEASES.

 

Sorry, but I get bored easily and without my lineage projects I'd leave DC due to boredom. But making a lineage fun can be hard to do, unless you can get a lot of players involved.. or a few that are really dedicated and keep things interesting. To do that you need interesting concepts and great dragons.. and finding both in the same project is the ultimate goal.

[olympe]

If you think that the concepts on the CL are amazing, you should have seen the concepts that have been removed. *sigh* I really, really hope that many of them will turn up in the cave some day soon.

[Obscure_Trash]

I like the general idea of it, but there are two main problems I have:

 

78 dragons that are all high enough quality by current art standards, all have concepts that don't somehow clash with TJ's vision for site lore or his vision of what's dragony enough, don't somehow have some other problem I can't anticipate, AND have ALL of their artists still active and able to sign the artist agreement?

 

+ have been hidden long enough

 

This just isn't going to happen. The reason we don't get a ton of completed releases these days (and the reason we recently changed how completion works) is because a lot of them aren't up to the standards the in cave artists have achieved. It's unfortunate. Very unfortunate. There are a lot of dragons on the list that I love, but I don't think they have a very good chance of being released. Dx

 

The second problem is that you're suggesting the release for an already busy time. All our holidays/events are already shoved into a few months of the year rather than being spread out through the year. I would love a large release (I'm not quite sure about the magnitude you've suggested, though), but I would prefer it occur in May, June, or July, so that I'm not so preoccupied with holiday stuff. A small release in between events - yespls - but a huge one? Nopls.

[silver_tiger]

TJ just posted in another thread that the CL was recently reduced by around 50%. So that says that something IS happening, it's just behind the scenes WHERE WE DON'T SEE IT. So we don't know that anything is happening and we get frustrated.

 

If the 50% that is left on the CL is maybe good enough for release... or not. There are still a LOT of dragons there.. and many of them are awesome and I would LOVE to see them in the Cave.

 

Between Halloween and V'day things get VERY boring around here. There's like 3 days of excitement for Halloween, 3 more for xmas and then 3 for v'day. I'm pretty much burnt out on Holiday lineages and thinking about releasing a bunch of my dragons from said lineages, just because I'm totally bored with them.

 

I need more stuff to do that is NOT holiday related that I can do between the holiday hype. And since DC doesn't really allow for anything except collecting, breeding and trading (and I don't do much trading).. new lineages are about all that keeps me interested. But new lineages require new dragons and I'd rather do something NEW, instead of just collecting more of the same dragons that have already been used for lineage after lineage after lineage.

 

So I'm asking for more and bigger releases. I thought the 12 days of Winter/christmas might be interesting enough to get some support. I guess I was wrong *sigh* oh well. But I still like the idea and if 78 dragons is too many maybe we can find another number, but one that still gets a LOT of new dragons in Cave. 1 or 2 a month is just NOT enough.. I haven't really been impressed with many of the recent releases, so once I collected my male/female pair, I didn't collect any more. New releases always bring a little excitement waiting to see the adults, but after the hype is over, it goes back to the same dull routine.

 

But maybe if we got more than 1 or 2 per month it would keep the hype going longer. If I'm still hunting for the last release when the next release happens, WOW what a concept. Continually having something NEW to do would be awesome and the only thing on DC that makes that happen is NEW RELEASES.

 

Sorry, but I get bored easily and without my lineage projects I'd leave DC due to boredom. But making a lineage fun can be hard to do, unless you can get a lot of players involved.. or a few that are really dedicated and keep things interesting. To do that you need interesting concepts and great dragons.. and finding both in the same project is the ultimate goal.

I think that the main issue with your idea of a huge release happening during this 'down time' is that it isn't really. I'm sorry you get bored, but the events probably take a huge chuck of planning time behind the scenes, which might or might not be the real reason we don't have many releases beyond the holiday dragons at this time.

 

Personally if I get bored with DC I just go to one of my other hobbies, so it's not such a big deal for me /shrug.

[HeatherMarie]

Yeah, I really really do *not* support the suggestion as-is. No way. PLEASE no. That many dragons in 12 days (or 24 days, or three months!!) is just wayyyyy too many. It takes the *fun* out of the release when you know you physically *can't* get them all, even *one* of each, because of scroll-limits. And yes, they may be common and permanent, but even 'common' new-releases get hard as heck to catch after a certain amount of time. It takes all the *guessing* and *spriter praise* and *community* out of it when there are soooooo many dragons released that you literally can't comment on all of them. No no no and please no.

 

[stardust13]

This is funny, because I see the DC "dead zone" as the summer months. I will say, though, I thought it was nice that there was more than one dragon in every release this past Summer. I could have done with 4 dragons at a time every month from May - September.

 

(I feel sorry for June. Since 2008, it's only had one release to itself - 2015. The 7-day release bled into June, but the month is usually reserved for site updates. More June dragons, please!)

 

Then again, the reason I'm probably so hungry for new dragons in the Summer is that I've come out of the winter with only 3 - 4 new dragons for 5 months. Could you try adding at least 1 new dragon in November and in January, just to help alleviate other people's boredom?

 

I mean, I wish we could have 78 new dragons all at once, but until a plan is reached, couldn't something be done this year to help just a little? I know the people behind the scenes are very busy making the holidays great for us, so maybe one new person could be brought into the fold to handle a couple normal releases of normal dragons. It would be a start.

 

We spend a lot of time trying to work out the Big Ideas here, but that means nothing is done in the meantime. I hope my Little Idea isn't too off-topic. It's meant to lead to Bigger Things.

[Pokemonfan13]

I love the idea of a release in that time, but releasing dozens of dragons at once is just insane and unworkable, especially with such short notice (if you expect it to happen this year) and the fact that it would be in the middle of a really heavy coding time for TJ will all the holiday events. 12 dragons over 12 days might be workable, especially if their numbers are heavy with hybrids and limited breeding group dragons. That way there's less pressure for those who really do like the holiday breeding season, while still giving those of us who are kind of bored then something else to hunt and raise.

 

 

I think the thing most people were objecting to was the idea of a release of literal dozens of dragons during that busy time. And the idea that those dragons would be coming from the dragons currently visible on the completed list is pretty much impossible for various reasons. The basic idea of releasing some dragons during the winter lull is a good one, it just has to be reasonable.

[blah]

You know what? I like the idea.

 

I'm currently looking for reasons to get back into DC and so far there aren't many. I have a more or less complete scroll and it is absolutely no fun to refresh the cave for hours on end to try and stumble upon one of the few critters I don't have.

 

Having a huge, as in really huge, release would be just like starting DC for the first time.

 

I don't really care whether it's feasible, I've never liked the "but TJ couldn't" train of discussion. If it isn't he can just not do it but he does ask for opinions here.

[Wildmoon]

Personally, I love the idea of a large permanent release, rather than a small release of Holiday only dragons. With holiday only dragons, it's kind of annoying in my own opinion, to have so many dragons that are onyl ever available for a small amount of time, and then not obtainable anymore, so if you miss it, there's no chance.

 

Whereas with more permanent dragons, it gets a lot of dragons out of the completed list (since there is HUNDREDS on there, that are all awesome in there own ways and I would love to see in cave), and it gives you a chance to actually be able 'reto collect them all in time. New dragons are always fun if you can collect them all, make lineages, ect.

 

Plus, my scroll is far from complete, it feels really empty, but i get more excited and motivated to actually collect dragons when they're new releases for some reason, (possibly because I see all over dragons in peoples scrolls already) so it gives a chance to fill my scroll with cool new dragons that I haven't seen

 

[Cinnamin Draconna]

Changed the OP because I'm really serious about bigger releases. While the massive release would be wonderful, I have to agree that it might not be feasible.

 

BUT releases bigger than just 1, 2 or 3 dragons SHOULD be doable... 4, 6, 8, maybe even 10 or 12. But these teeny little releases just don't do it.. catch a pair x 3 on release day, and you're done 5 days later. How is THAT supposed to keep me interested?

 

Yes, we're limited on eggslots (and I would love one more of those too, but that's another topic), and yes it takes at least 5 days to grow a dragon from egg to adult.. and yes, eggs hatch faster than hatchlings mature. So we learn to manage our scrolls better. Personally, I've learned that I do NOT have to have a full scroll at all times, and that works for me. Your mileage may differ, but until we get a hatchling 'grow faster' type BSA or Action, slot management is essential.

[Bison]

I would absolutely love bigger releases. We need more to do because honestly, DC is getting stale. 1 new dragon a month isn't much. Since I stopped breeding I realized how little there is to actually do. I mean, I can't lie. Of course in a way I enjoy the "one and done" method of 1-2 breeds released at a time. Its great to be able to pick up the new dragons immediately and then not have to worry about DC until next month (or next time I want to grab weird codes from the AP).

 

But that's not really how a game should be designed. We should have things to work for, things to do. And not just lineages! Those aren't everyone's cup of tea and can only keep certain people interested long-term. Especially since now we know they can be changed at any time, ruining possibly years of hard work. Pet sites are a dying breed so they really need cool stuff to wow people into sticking around, especially younger people who didn't grow up on pet sites and are used to things like app/FB/etc games.

 

If you only collect sprites in some fashion (full set, favorites, whatever) there's a finite amount for you to do. And once that runs out why even play DC? There's nothing to keep you around except for maybe 1-2 new dragons a month, which don't even require active play. All you have to do is check DC once a day for 30 seconds. Its nice that DC is casual and all, but its way too casual. We need stuff to do.

 

I think some huge releases of commons would be a awesome steps towards revitalizing the game with some fresh new content actually able keep us busy for some time.

[Pokemonfan13]

Part of the problem is different people play differently. People like me who have a really basic collection (4 adults, 3 frozen hatchlings) could definitely benefit from having more dragons released. But there are other people who have scroll goals that keep them busy. They collect dozens of caveborns of each breed, they breed giant lineage projects, they scour the AP for pretty things of whatever nature. Is it really fair to stomp on those people just because others chose a play style that leaves them bored without more releases? Because having huge releases each month will kill those play styles, with them having to either change their scroll goals or have a lot less time to build those lineages or ignore some new dragons.

 

We can probably find a middle ground. Maybe three or four breeds a month. But remember that things need to be balanced so that it doesn't just benefit the people with minimal scroll goals, because there are other ways to play that keep people busy.

[purplehaze]

What PF13 said!

 

I can handle a release of 3 or 4 or even 5 dragons, but I wouldn't want that many every month and I certainly don't want more. My basic scroll goal is 4 male and 4 female caveborns of each breed, for breeding and lineage-building purposes. But if I have to spend all my time and egg slots gathering in the new releases then I have no time or egg space left to actually do any breeding or lineage-building.

 

I'm sorry for those who are bored, but please don't ruin the game for me and the many other players like me just to make it more interesting for them!

[silver_tiger]

What PF13 said!

 

I can handle a release of 3 or 4 or even 5 dragons, but I wouldn't want that many every month and I certainly don't want more. My basic scroll goal is 4 male and 4 female caveborns of each breed, for breeding and lineage-building purposes. But if I have to spend all my time and egg slots gathering in the new releases then I have no time or egg space left to actually do any breeding or lineage-building.

 

I'm sorry for those who are bored, but please don't ruin the game for me and the many other players like me just to make it more interesting for them!

Yeah, my SGs are 5 CBs of each gender, as well as 3 frozen hatchies (these don't have to be CB though), for each dragon released (other than rares because lol that would be crazy). I'm not even done with the hatchlings, and each dragon released sets me back even further. I always look forward to the holiday time to give me a little breather to try and gather up some more CBs since I'm still missing quite a lot.

Edited October 7, 2016 by silver_chan

[Bison]

I'm sorry for those who are bored, but please don't ruin the game for me and the many other players like me just to make it more interesting for them!

The problem with this kind of statement/opinion is that it goes both ways.

 

I could say the exact same thing to those who collect massive numbers of CBs for every species and do huge lineage projects.

 

Why should only people with that sort of playstyle be catered to?

[silver_tiger]

The problem with this kind of statement/opinion is that it goes both ways.

 

I could say the exact same thing to those who collect massive numbers of CBs for every species and do huge lineage projects.

 

Why should only people with that sort of playstyle be catered to?

Yes, it does go both ways. I am of the opinion that all these multiple dragon releases lately are catering more toward the playstyle of the people who collect few dragons, especially CB dragons, and don't breed.

 

I mean no offense, I really don't, but just be mindful that people with my playstyle are just as frustrated with the state of the cave as you are, but for opposite reasons, and TJ has to try and balance out all our playstyles--which inevitably annoys all of us to some degree, for a number of different reasons.

 

Edit because my sentence made no sense.

 

So I don't spam the comm more than I already have--I'm not saying I don't like releases, I really do love them. I love the slow reveal, and how people talk about them, and getting to see the full adult at last. It's like christmas once a month or so.

 

But unwrapping presents constantly doesn't leave me any time to go shopping myself, to wedge a tortured metaphor in here. I'm just saying I want a *little* downtime in the year, and I usually depend on the Holiday season for that.

Edited October 7, 2016 by silver_chan

[Pokemonfan13]

The problem with this kind of statement/opinion is that it goes both ways.

 

I could say the exact same thing to those who collect massive numbers of CBs for every species and do huge lineage projects.

 

Why should only people with that sort of playstyle be catered to?

That's why I was suggesting finding a middle ground. Maybe a little higher release rate than is currently typical, but not as high as would really satisfy someone with very minimal scroll goals, because it's impossible to satisfy someone like that without making it impossible for the people who do more extensive collecting of whatever sort.

 

But it sounds like even what's currently happening in the way of releases is too fast for silver_chan =(

Edited October 7, 2016 by Pokemonfan13

[purplehaze]

The problem with this kind of statement/opinion is that it goes both ways.

 

I could say the exact same thing to those who collect massive numbers of CBs for every species and do huge lineage projects.

 

Why should only people with that sort of playstyle be catered to?

I am not really asking to be catered to.

 

All I am asking is that the game not be changed in a way that makes it impossible for me to play the way I have always played it.

 

 

[Bison]

I am not really asking to be catered to.

 

All I am asking is that the game not be changed in a way that makes it impossible for me to play the way I have always played it.

But that's asking to be catered to. You don't want the game to change because you like it exactly how it is. Other people don't. Why should our opinions mean less than yours?

 

 

I used to breed and do lineages. Trust me, I get how balancing can be stressful. I've had to dump project eggs to catch releases I really loved before. It was always annoying because, like most of the site, I was stuck in the mindset of "gotta catch em all immediately". But honestly, there are so few releases on DC. Its the slowest pet site I've seen when it comes to releases. 1 or 2 permanent releases per month for like half the year doesn't make for much to do, especially since there's nothing else to the game but catching eggs and breeding. We don't need 30 new dragons every month or whatever but 1 or 2 is nothing. The new content is eaten up and gone so fast every time.

 

People who want to focus on lineages/catching certain things can adapt to a few more dragons per release or larger ones every few months or however TJ decided to do it if he liked the idea. The "gotta catch em all immediately and if I can't its a bad release" attitude is harmful to the game because people only want immediate satisfaction and finished dragon sets. But no one needs to have 20 CBs of every new dragon within two weeks of a release. That's just not necessary. More common dragons would mean more things to do, more eggs to catch, more lineages to play with, and more activity on the site. That's not a bad thing unless TJ purposely wants to keep DC small, not played very often, etc. I don't know what kind of goals he has so I have no idea if he even wants DC to grow or be more active. He might prefer it as it is.

 

But really, the only actual goals we have are 100% player made (lineages, codes, names) or collecting all the sprites we want (a finite resource). There's no games, there's no activities, there's no achievements, there's nothing to earn the way there is on other sites/games. Its boring. Its nice to not have to be glued to the screen all day but its frustrating to want to play and have nothing to do. As a player, it feels like the game hasn't evolved much from when I first discovered it years ago and just picked up a few eggs whenever I thought of it. Once you catch up that's it. Just wait for the next release and finish that almost immediately.

[Pryanka]

Popping in here because...am I the only one baffled by how 1-2 releases every month is considered slow? I'm honestly truly confused by that attitude, probably because the other petsites I've played extensively before this (Neo and FR) did new breed releases so infrequently once they had their base breed set established. I'm in here thinking...oh wow, ANOTHER new release already? Oh wait, they're every month? Whaaaaat.

 

It doesn't make any sense why people want more new releases lol. As it is, I have trouble getting any of my commons to breed themselves from the new releases. I don't need even more new releases making it impossible to breed a mint or fog dragon anymore. Not to mention...none of my checkers with new release dragons have even made it to 4th gen yet.

 

It strikes me as odd (and okay, mildly greedy haha) that people want more dragons when I already see it as too many new breeds coming out every year. Especially since older breeds don't get discontinued (with the 2 that ever were coming back), and new breeds just keep coming in...iunno. There has to be a saturation point of the types of dragons to collect at some point, right?

 

helpamialoneinthis?

Edited October 7, 2016 by Pryanka

[626lavaheart]

honestly imo TJ should just release everything he wants to in one day. It'd be like a completely different game, almost like starting your scroll over again and I'd personally find it really fun. Just 100+ dragons in one day no regrets. hehe I mean we're gonna reach 1000s of dragon breeds one day in the distant future It's the inevitable unless releases stop all together, and I have a feeling the day that DC stops releasing dragons is the day the site dies.

 

I do see an issues with quality though In any sort of larger releases. Quite a few dragons have like minor grammar, spelling or sprite errors even in normal releases we have now. So I can see a bit of an issue with that sort of thing... but I mean that's the only problem besides running out of dragons to release, which would be a problem if we simply just release more dragons every month than DRs that are completed every month.

 

I DO feel FlightRising is NOT a good comparison as well as neopets. Just because unlike DC both those sites have your pet wearing clothing. Which I mean from a player standpoint isn't that big of a deal but from an artist's standpoint it's an EXTREMELY daunting task to put all those hundreds of articles of clothing and tailoring them custom to every new breed. So obviously they don't get new breeds like ever.

Dragoncave on the other hand isn't about dressing up pets or playing with them. It's more of a pokemon game where you just sorta are looking to catch em all.

Edited October 7, 2016 by 626lavaheart

[Pryanka]

I DO feel FlightRising is NOT a good comparison as well as neopets. Just because unlike DC both those sites have your pet wearing clothing. Which I mean from a player standpoint isn't that big of a deal but from an artist's standpoint it's an EXTREMELY daunting task to put all those hundreds of articles of clothing and tailoring them custom to every new breed. So obviously they don't get new breeds like ever.

Dragoncave on the other hand isn't about dressing up pets or playing with them. It's more of a pokemon game where you just sorta are looking to catch em all.

Okay this is hugely relevant, but I was thinking of pre-customization and conversion Neopets -sigh- When they converted things and introduced the concept of Neocash and clothing for your pets, the site just kinda went to -badwordshere- for me and I pretty much quit shortly after that. Even before customization, we didn't get new breeds often. I think the Yurble and the Lutari were pre-NC, but before that, my mind is foggy on if new breeds came out.

 

I guess the fundamental difference in our approaches is how we feel about the # of breeds that should/could/will be on DC at any given point. I don't see the necessity to have anywhere near 1000 breeds to collect, but that being said, if users continue to submit and TJ continues to release new breeds, that will probably happen. To me, there shouldn't be an infinite # of dragon breeds to collect. Whether that means retiring/discontinuing breeds to "make room for" new ones, i don't know ><

 

I just feel like at some point, there have to be too many different breeds available that makes it very overwhelming for new players to join. Even when I came back from a few year hiatus, I was like....shocked that the # of dragons I could collect had more than doubled. It's a lot. I still don't have way too many common dragon breeds. Right now, with only metals, neglecteds, and prizes having any sort of trade value (and even for metals, they better be 2G or 3G...), adding a massive influx of new breeds, most common, does nothing for me except make it even more impossible to ever breed anything uncommon or rare again.

Edited October 7, 2016 by Pryanka

[bluesonic1]

Not a big fan of bigger releases, and even far less of a fan of big releases during the holiday period. I might mention, if someone else hasn't already, that back in the day Christmas and Valentine's dragons (or maybe just one of them? Memory is foggy here) were dropped for just one day like the Halloweens- this got changed because the reality is, the holiday periods are really busy times. We shouldn't have to choose between video games or family during this period, and this is something the majority of the player base will face. For this reason, I'm very strongly opposed to extra releases during the holiday periods.

 

As for my reasons opposing big releases in general, others have already pointed out the frustration that was the 7th birthday release. Also I'd like to add I'm not one of those people who works on collecting or lineages during the down-time, I just do a lot IRL and it's actually the main reason I'm still playing DC- it's relaxed and chill-paced. Also, someone way back in the start mentioned 78 new breeds in a month?? That's a crazy number considering we only just have 170+ breeds on the site as a whole, and it took us around 10 years to get to that number.