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olympe

Foiling Scripters

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well scripts rely on the description so it would stop them for a while

It would not. As I've mentioned previously, as far back as 2011 there were whispers of people sitting in the AP with scripts to catch bouncing Neglecteds and Hollies at Christmas-time. The AP didn't show descriptions back then any more than it does today; these scripts identified the images and caught accordingly.

 

As I've also mentioned, image recognition software has hit the point that I don't think changing descriptions to images, or removing descriptions and showing egg sprites, will accomplish much without taking other steps alongside it.

 

Your best case scenario, as you note, is that you stop the scripts "for a while." After that you're back to square 1, and now the playerbase is unhappy because accessibility, because lag, because whatever you broke to deter the scripts doesn't work as well for players anymore either.

 

Teleport was created because of an exploit in the game. An exploit that people openly used and posted about, and it was stated that it was going to be fixed eventually regardless of whether Teleport was going to happen or not.

 

Just because an exploit/glitch/loophole/other unintended behaviour has been around for a while doesn't mean it won't ever get fixed. Anybody who has been on DC for several years can tell you that.

Are you referring to the /get/CODE catching ability? That wasn't an exploit o.o It worked completely within the predesigned DC system. Being able to /view/ uncaught things isn't an exploit either. It's still working completely within the predesigned system. If someone had found a way to use /get/ as a guaranteed teleport in the days before teleport, I would agree that's an exploit. As it was, /get/ was still very fallible, as anyone who used it a few times knows. /view/ also has its drawbacks, as fuzz notes.

 

If /get/ had been an exploit, I see no reason TJ wouldn't have handed out bans over it. Instead, entire communities of players openly and publicly used it, on a regular basis, with no repercussions I'm aware of. Ditto /view/.

 

I understand you're thinking from the perspective of an admin, whose logic may be "I didn't design it to work this way, therefore it's an exploit." But from the perspective of a programmer, you wrote it that way, it's working as written. Nobody's breaking into anything or feeding the site garbage to make it puke up abnormal things. Nobody's modifying code.

 

The most you can claim here is bug abuse, but I can hardly imagine a reasonable case that posits A) that such widely-known and long-standing "bugs" haven't been fixed cool.gif that these "bugs" haven't even been commented on by TJ and yet C) that using these "bugs" is abuse.

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It would not. As I've mentioned previously, as far back as 2011 there were whispers of people sitting in the AP with scripts to catch bouncing Neglecteds and Hollies at Christmas-time. The AP didn't show descriptions back then any more than it does today; these scripts identified the images and caught accordingly.

 

As I've also mentioned, image recognition software has hit the point that I don't think changing descriptions to images, or removing descriptions and showing egg sprites, will accomplish much without taking other steps alongside it.

 

Your best case scenario, as you note, is that you stop the scripts "for a while." After that you're back to square 1, and now the playerbase is unhappy because accessibility, because lag, because whatever you broke to deter the scripts doesn't work as well for players anymore either.

 

 

Are you referring to the /get/CODE catching ability? That wasn't an exploit o.o It worked completely within the predesigned DC system. Being able to /view/ uncaught things isn't an exploit either. It's still working completely within the predesigned system. If someone had found a way to use /get/ as a guaranteed teleport in the days before teleport, I would agree that's an exploit. As it was, /get/ was still very fallible, as anyone who used it a few times knows. /view/ also has its drawbacks, as fuzz notes.

 

If /get/ had been an exploit, I see no reason TJ wouldn't have handed out bans over it. Instead, entire communities of players openly and publicly used it, on a regular basis, with no repercussions I'm aware of. Ditto /view/.

 

I understand you're thinking from the perspective of an admin, whose logic may be "I didn't design it to work this way, therefore it's an exploit." But from the perspective of a programmer, you wrote it that way, it's working as written. Nobody's breaking into anything or feeding the site garbage to make it puke up abnormal things. Nobody's modifying code.

 

The most you can claim here is bug abuse, but I can hardly imagine a reasonable case that posits A) that such widely-known and long-standing "bugs" haven't been fixed cool.gif that these "bugs" haven't even been commented on by TJ and yet C) that using these "bugs" is abuse.

I agree with you 100 percent.

And it's reassuring when the concepts that I've been (I guess inadequately) trying to convey, are quite better expressed by someone that cannot be accused of not being enough years in DC rolleyes.gif

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Are you referring to the /get/CODE catching ability? That wasn't an exploit o.o It worked completely within the predesigned DC system. Being able to /view/ uncaught things isn't an exploit either. It's still working completely within the predesigned system. If someone had found a way to use /get/ as a guaranteed teleport in the days before teleport, I would agree that's an exploit. As it was, /get/ was still very fallible, as anyone who used it a few times knows. /view/ also has its drawbacks, as fuzz notes.
It was still unintended behavior, with unintended consequences. Also, all you needed to do in order to make the /get/CODE method foolproof was to fill up the AP with really lots of eggs by breeding half your scroll, then breed the egg you want to send. (Of course, this didn't work with older eggs...)

 

And I also mentioned the unintended behavior, which was also openly posted about. Someone used this method to send not one, but all four holly eggs they bred to four players of their choosing. (That was at a time when there were merely 109 or so hollies on active scrolls - can you imagine just how rare hollies used to be?) I still believe that it was that situation that made TJ actually close that loophole and implement teleport instead.

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Hi what's a scriptor?

Someone who cheats to receive special or rare eggs without spending the time to hunt for them.

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Someone who cheats to receive special or rare eggs without spending the time to hunt for them.

Wow, that's crazy. Do they use cheat codes or something?

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I really can't imagine that scripters are such a wide-spread problem as to need such extreme and inconvenient methods to catch them. Most people that cheat just make multiple scrolls.

 

Heck, a number of people do that anyway when new because they didn't read the rules and didn't realize. I see posts in help all the time asking how to get of those extras.

 

 

If you see a suspicious scroll report it to a Mod or TJ so it can be looked into. If it doesn't get burned, then they probably aren't cheating, just had a small run of good luck. Which does happen.

 

 

"The speed at which technology advances is matched only by the speed at which technology to fool it advances." source unknown. but IF scripters as bad as this thread thinks, then nothing is going to prevent them, because new scripts will be immediately written to get around whatever is set to block them. So, I still don't see any reason to inconvenience everyone else.

Edited by DragonLady86

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for 2 days running i have been in a Biome with 1 person showing as active, sitting over an egg slot on the 5 min change, an egg i am looking for pops up and i still miss when supposedly only person in there smile.gif eggs missed were a Silver and Thalassa so IMO scripters are not just on the Metals but Coppers Pyrals , Xeno's even Dino's the later i find hard getting my head around as who in right mind cant catch a Dino (Me not anymore) ohmy.gif

 

Even with the ones that got scorched few week ago Golds as still being sucked up and fogged quicker than you can blink blink.gif

 

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for 2 days running i have been in a Biome with 1 person showing as active, sitting over an egg slot on the 5 min change, an egg i am looking for pops up and i still miss when supposedly only person in there  smile.gif

Pretty sure the online counter only updates once a minute or so. Dunno about anybody else, but I tend to hop from biome to biome if I don't see anything I like. So in your case, if I was to drop into your biome right at the 5m drop, race you for whatever egg you want, and walk away with it - I still probably wouldn't be in the biome long enough to show up as there.

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for 2 days running i have been in a Biome with 1 person showing as active, sitting over an egg slot on the 5 min change, an egg i am looking for pops up and i still miss when supposedly only person in there smile.gif eggs missed were a Silver and Thalassa so IMO scripters are not just on the Metals but Coppers Pyrals , Xeno's even Dino's the later i find hard getting my head around as who in right mind cant catch a Dino (Me not anymore) ohmy.gif

 

Even with the ones that got scorched few week ago Golds as still being sucked up and fogged quicker than you can blink blink.gif

Dinos seem to be popular right now, saw trades asking for them. That's a bit unusual and maybe that's the reason why you can't get them.

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for 2 days running i have been in a Biome with 1 person showing as active, sitting over an egg slot on the 5 min change, an egg i am looking for pops up and i still miss when supposedly only person in there smile.gif eggs missed were a Silver and Thalassa so IMO scripters are not just on the Metals but Coppers Pyrals , Xeno's even Dino's the later i find hard getting my head around as who in right mind cant catch a Dino (Me not anymore) ohmy.gif

 

Even with the ones that got scorched few week ago Golds as still being sucked up and fogged quicker than you can blink blink.gif

I've heard of people missing an egg when the biome claimed there were 0 people, so that's just the counter not keeping up.

 

And of course Golds get snapped up and fogged ASAP, they always will be. Unless you see them all go to the same scroll, there's no proof that's not just everyone lunging at the rare egg and the lucky finder hiding it to keep it safe from jealous viewbombers.

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Dinos seem to be popular right now, saw trades asking for them. That's a bit unusual and maybe that's the reason why you can't get them.

I'd like to know where... I have an egg that I want to get rid of - trade for a cheese, chicken or uncommon dragon - and no response.

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I am not seeing TJ or commander wymsy in the link you posted. I figured it out.

 

 

Just keep in mind that people who you may think are scripters may actually simply be very good at trading. Or having stuff that people want that trade at the price of CB golds.

 

There are way less scripters than skilled traders.

Edited by Starscream

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I am not seeing TJ or commander wymsy in the link you posted. I figured it out.

 

 

Just keep in mind that people who you may think are scripters may actually simply be very good at trading. Or having stuff that people want that trade at the price of CB golds.

 

There are way less scripters than skilled traders.

I found the coincidence quite interesting.

 

Oh I agree with you. 100%. Unless I see a dozen of scrolls called xxx22, xxx21, xxx20 etc. with only CB Golds and one Magi and I see another scroll where, mysteriously, all those Golds end. That makes me think "scripter & multiscroller". Otherwise, I don't. I tend to think "skills, luck, being in the right place at the right moment".

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