Pokemon Sun and Moon

[Felixr2]

My mind is officially blown.

In fact, this was only a third of his notes. A part 2 is coming up.

[Syiren]

In fact, this was only a third of his notes. A part 2 is coming up.

Are you serious?! I'm looking forward to the second vid, but still holy crap. I just hope that his theory of it being the last pokemon game/s is wrong. Everything else is perfectly accurate and awesome, but hopefully we still get future games because I enjoy collecting the cards, but the anime isn't the same as in its early years. The games are still the best part of pokemon imo.

[Jet Raptor]

<this is a link btw.

((Sailing101's mind is currently inactive at the moment, please disregard any nonsense he says))

Just popping in to say I had to stop the video at about 5:30 in because of his pronunciation of Kane. It's KA-ney. Ka with an A like "father," and ne with an E like the A sound in "ate." [/minirant]

 

ANYWAY, while I'm here, Cutiefly is just too adorable. I actually love Drampa. It's just so goofy and asdfeanjea I want one irl. It kinda reminds me of something that would be in Pikmin. I didn't realise what Bruxish was at first, but in the middle of that video introducing it I yelled "it's a Humu!" Didn't care for it at first, but the psychedelic colours are growing on me. Tapu Koko, now...I'm definitely not an expert on Hawaiian mythology and whatnot, but the colours and patterns are obviously referencing ancient Hawaiian featherwork. These works take hundreds of thousands of feathers, though supposedly only a few feathers were taken from each bird and they were released alive. A majority of these birds are extinct now, so maybe Tapu Koko is the angry bird spirit coming back to get revenge for people stealing its feathers.

The design of Tapu Koko itself, other than the whole feather thing, I'm not sure why they chose a bird-like design. Probably based of of some mythological story I don't know. I know there's plenty of them. I was hoping we'd get some extinct honeycreepers or something, so this is cool. I quite like the O'o myself.

 

*is actually going to finish the video now*

[Pixxelation]

Prediction: Once you beat all gyms on an island, you'll be entrusted that island's pseudo-legend, such as Tapu Koko (is that the first two-word name?).

Edited July 1, 2016 by PieMaster

[LadyNightshade]

Gonna be honest guys, they won't end pokemon games until they stop selling (profitably). Companies need $$$$$ and pokemon main games are guaranteed sellers.

 

 

Yes, Tapu Koko is the first two word name pokemon. I've warmed up to it, it's kind of funky but cool. (Funky chicken!)

[SheridanCharon]

Gonna be honest guys, they won't end pokemon games until they stop selling (profitably). Companies need $$$$$ and pokemon main games are guaranteed sellers.

Exactly what I was thinking.

[Ashywolf]

I think the argument is not that Pokemon games are ending, but more that the story is. That's on the basis that all main series games are based along on a story line, which until recently with XY and ORAS didn't appear to be the case.

Edited July 1, 2016 by Ashywolf

[sailing101]

Yes, Tapu Koko is the first two word name pokemon. I've warmed up to it, it's kind of funky but cool. (Funky chicken!)

[UniqueZephlyn]

-sits here with my cup of tea after watching exactly 5 min of that infamous video circulating the internet-

Y'all are bonkers

[Switch]

i didnt watch the video because im not that interested but if this is the last pokemon game ill cry a whole lot

 

still i kinda doubt it since the franchise is seemingly doing very well... pokemon is eternal

Edited July 2, 2016 by Switch

[octopi]

I think the argument is not that Pokemon games are ending, but more that the story is. That's on the basis that all main series games are based along on a story line, which until recently with XY and ORAS didn't appear to be the case.

I haven't watched whatever this video is, but hasn't it been canonically stated that gen 6+ takes place in a different universe than the previous games? The big divergence point being the existence of mega evolutions. Like, Zinnia pretty much states this outright in the Delta Episode:

 

"My people know it. From generation to generation, we pass along the lore about the distortions in the world borne by the Mega Evolution mechanism. And about the existence of another world, which we have long observed to be just like this one and yet not the same... That's right. A Hoenn region that's almost exactly like this one we live in. Filled with Pokémon and people like us. A world where maybe the evolution of Pokémon took a slightly different path, where Mega Evolution is unknown... A world where that war 3,000 years ago...never happened. A world where the ultimate weapon was never even built."

 

Unless the overarching plot involves travelling between the two universes (which would open a very messy can of beans and I doubt they'd go through with it), that wouldn't really make any sense.

 

Edit: I looked at the video but gave up halfway through because I found it dull and unwatchable. idk, XY has a lot of very prominent unanswered questions so I always thought it was pretty obvious that Sun/Moon was going to tie into that. And everything else seems like kind of a stretch.

Edited July 2, 2016 by Fractional Pi Day

[Felixr2]

I haven't watched whatever this video is, but hasn't it been canonically stated that gen 6+ takes place in a different universe than the previous games? The big divergence point being the existence of mega evolutions. Like, Zinnia pretty much states this outright in the Delta Episode:

 

"My people know it. From generation to generation, we pass along the lore about the distortions in the world borne by the Mega Evolution mechanism. And about the existence of another world, which we have long observed to be just like this one and yet not the same... That's right. A Hoenn region that's almost exactly like this one we live in. Filled with Pokémon and people like us. A world where maybe the evolution of Pokémon took a slightly different path, where Mega Evolution is unknown... A world where that war 3,000 years ago...never happened. A world where the ultimate weapon was never even built."

 

Unless the overarching plot involves travelling between the two universes (which would open a very messy can of beans and I doubt they'd go through with it), that wouldn't really make any sense.

 

Edit: I looked at the video but gave up halfway through because I found it dull and unwatchable. idk, XY has a lot of very prominent unanswered questions so I always thought it was pretty obvious that Sun/Moon was going to tie into that. And everything else seems like kind of a stretch.

Well, there was a great war in the history of gen 1-5, how else would lieutenant Surge have earned his title? Another point is that everything has been done already, there is nothing left to make a legendary of. Sure, they can add some new types, but I don't think it'd make any sense to add more than up to 3. Then we might get to see Deoxys' dimension, and get pokémon based on animals that weren't pokémon yet, but that's pretty much it. Oh, and new eeveelutions.

 

They've used up all originality, so restarting with a new plot and all would give more freedom... Perhaps they start making the games more mature, like they've already been doing in XY and ORAS, with themes like mass extinction and environmental disorder being some of the examples.

[octopi]

Well, there was a great war in the history of gen 1-5, how else would lieutenant Surge have earned his title? Another point is that everything has been done already, there is nothing left to make a legendary of. Sure, they can add some new types, but I don't think it'd make any sense to add more than up to 3. Then we might get to see Deoxys' dimension, and get pokémon based on animals that weren't pokémon yet, but that's pretty much it. Oh, and new eeveelutions.

 

They've used up all originality, so restarting with a new plot and all would give more freedom... Perhaps they start making the games more mature, like they've already been doing in XY and ORAS, with themes like mass extinction and environmental disorder being some of the examples.

 

"They've used up all originality" is something people have been arguing since gen 2. I'm firmly unconvinced that Pokemon has run out of ideas in any capacity. Is there somehow a finite amount of deities/animals/fictional characters/mythological creatures/inanimate objects/etc that they can use for inspiration? Even if there is, I'm still really enjoying the different takes on similar base concepts that they've done so far. Besides, if they wrapped up gens 1-7 in a nice bow and said "we're starting a new storyline now"... would that change the fact that they've allegedly "run out of ideas"? The fact that they've used the concepts seen in gens 1-7 remains true, and if they reuse them after a big storyline change, they'd still be reusing them.

 

Obviously there must have been wars in the history of the Pokemon world, but the specific war 3000 years ago with AZ and the ultimate weapon didn't happen in the original universe. I also don't take much stock in gen 1 for lore/theory stuff in general because there was a lot of early installment weirdness there (references to real world locations and animals, etc., which has been retconned out by later gens). I'm sure there's interesting stuff in the history of the gen 1-5 universe that could be expanded upon, but I don't think it's evidence of some kind of grand unifying theory.

 

Shrug. I'm not an expert on this stuff and I honestly do not want to get too far into it, but I personally I don't believe that 1) there's an overarching Pokemon storyline spanning all the generations or that 2) it's ending with gen 7.

Edited July 2, 2016 by Fractional Pi Day

[Felixr2]

"They've used up all originality" is something people have been arguing since gen 2. I'm firmly unconvinced that Pokemon has run out of ideas in any capacity. Is there somehow a finite amount of deities/animals/fictional characters/mythological creatures/inanimate objects/etc that they can use for inspiration? Even if there is, I'm still really enjoying the different takes on similar base concepts that they've done so far. Besides, if they wrapped up gens 1-7 in a nice bow and said "we're starting a new storyline now"... would that change the fact that they've allegedly "run out of ideas"? The fact that they've used the concepts seen in gens 1-7 remains true, and if they reuse them after a big storyline change, they'd still be reusing them.

 

Obviously there must have been wars in the history of the Pokemon world, but the specific war 3000 years ago with AZ and the ultimate weapon didn't happen in the original universe. I also  don't take much stock in gen 1 for lore/theory stuff  in general because there was a lot of early installment weirdness there (references to real world locations and animals, etc., which has been retconned out by later gens). I'm sure there's interesting stuff in the history of the gen 1-5 universe that could be expanded upon, but I don't think it's evidence of some kind of grand unifying theory.

 

Shrug. I'm not an expert on this stuff and I honestly do not want to get too far into it, but I personally I don't believe that 1) there's an overarching Pokemon storyline spanning all the generations or that 2) it's ending with gen 7.

Well, just think of it. Are we seeing anything original in Alola so far? We've got a bug with a full evolution line, a new tiny bird, again grass, water and fire starters, a sun and moon legendary (Ho-Oh and Lugia... derp), Tapu Koko, which is the guardian of one of the 4 islands (Zygarde? Hmm?), a little bug (WOW! IT'S A BUG FAIRY TYPE! THAT'S HOW VIVILLON SHOULD'VE BEEN!), a pikaclone (cuz we didn't have enough of those yet), a slimy dragon (Drampa -> Goodra)... I would honestly be surprised if they actually manage to come up with something new this time around... I'm not saying I'm certain they've used up all originality, but, they've used so much they start to duplicate things. Arceus created everything, but all life originated from Mew, but Xerneas is the pokémon of life, but Zygarde is the guardian of nature, but celebi is the voice of the forest...

Edited July 2, 2016 by Felixr2

[Felixr2]

I suddenly memorized one thing that is likely to prevent pokémon to ever stop doing the main pokémon anime series: at the end of Mewtwo Strikes Back (I think) Ash sees Ho-Oh fly through the sky. He was told by professor Oak that upon seeing Ho-Oh one can make a wish, and Ash's wish was that he could be together with pokémon forever. Kind of an uncareful wish imo, as it could just get you to heaven or an alternate universe where time doesn't exist.... but that didn't happen and in fact, this explains why he didn't age in 19 damn years (the first episode priginally aired in Japan April 1, 1997, one year, one month and 2 days after the release of the first game). He should've been in his 30s by now!

[octopi]

I really don't want to have this conversation and I doubt either of us is going to convince the other, so I'm just going to say I still disagree and leave it at that.

 

On an unrelated note: there's a bunch of flavour text on the new Pokemon on the official Sun/Moon website!! I'm probably late to the party but I haven't seen anyone discuss it here yet, so. It sounds like Bruxish might evolve into an anglerfish, and I am more hyped for the possibility of a psychedelic magenta anglerfish Pokemon than anything else I've ever imagined in my life.

 

Cutiefly has a really cute empathy gimmick going on too. How can you possibly remain sad when you're being swarmed by tiny fuzzy bee flies.

[Felixr2]

How can you possibly remain sad when you're being swarmed by tiny fuzzy bee flies.

Well, there's two options on that, either they're not doing anything and you smile, or they try to attack you and you're scared as hell. Either way you're not sad anymore lol.

Edited July 2, 2016 by Felixr2

[dragontamer44722]

I saw the video and while it took a bit to get going I found it pretty interesting (theory videos are always something I enjoy watching just to see if it has any significance) and while it certainly does fit together, it does seem a bit too deep. Its a super neat theory and if it comes true then yay (and boohoo cause I don't want it to end) and if not then its still a cool theory. But I guess we'll all find out in a few months right?

[Dragoniclove123]

Pikipek - A WOODPECKER?! So much for all those people betting it was a toucan of some kind.

Yungoos - I thought it looked more like an otter. But eh, I'll wait to see what its evos are like, if it has any.

Grubbin - So, this is the early bug type of Sun/Moon? Interesting. Wonder how the evos will look. Perhaps a beetle-looking Pokemon, since the offspring of certain beetles are called grubs? Or will it be a multi-evolution one, like Wurmple and Burmy?

 

Battle Royal - OMG YES! I have wanted this for so long!

Wait, they have a battle royale?

 

Yassssssssss! Now if you excuse me, I need to beg my parents for a new DS for my birthday.

[TCA]

Hey, hey guys.

 

Drampa looks like Falcor from The Neverending Story.

[Guillotine]

Well, just think of it. Are we seeing anything original in Alola so far? We've got a bug with a full evolution line, a new tiny bird, again grass, water and fire starters, a sun and moon legendary (Ho-Oh and Lugia... derp), Tapu Koko, which is the guardian of one of the 4 islands (Zygarde? Hmm?), a little bug (WOW! IT'S A BUG FAIRY TYPE! THAT'S HOW VIVILLON SHOULD'VE BEEN!), a pikaclone (cuz we didn't have enough of those yet), a slimy dragon (Drampa -> Goodra)... I would honestly be surprised if they actually manage to come up with something new this time around... I'm not saying I'm certain they've used up all originality, but, they've used so much they start to duplicate things. Arceus created everything, but all life originated from Mew, but Xerneas is the pokémon of life, but Zygarde is the guardian of nature, but celebi is the voice of the forest...

...Have we seen the same gen one? Because Rock With Arms, Orb that evolves into Upside-Down Orb, two different lines that end in "the same as before but three of them", several direct copy-pastes of actual animals, and three different blobs (one of which is unrelated to the others!) isn't creative either. If anything, recent gens have actually been better about it (even if it means we end up with a battery that evolves into Vic Viper).

 

e: And all the roles you mentioned are distinct. Arceus created matter/the universe, basically being a living Big Bang, and Mew is just the ancestor; neither directly created all Pokemon. Xerneas is simply a supplier of life energy to balance out Yvetal, Zygarde acts as an ecosystem watcher and does not seem to intervene unless things have passed a breaking point, while Celebi speaks for the forests before things go horribly wrong (and even then, it may be localized to only Johto). Lugia was more involved with the Deep Sea while Ho-oh was more the general phoenix myth; neither were representative of the sun and moon. e3: Actually, i believe Lugia was likely based on a Japanese myth involving an ocean deity, although I don't remember the specifics.

 

Unrelated: Cutiefly is a bee fly, which is rad because they are based off adorable flufforb pollinators with parasitic larvae. The most perfect candidate for bug/fairy. :]

 

And yeah Drampa is totally a luck dragon and if fluffy rather than gooey. :v

 

e2: sorry for the salt I've just seen the same arguments from genwunners since fricking RSE and they never change and are always really weak. Pokemon's a game for Literal Children; having the three elemental starters helps teach new players the type system, having a specific archetype set for early 'mons helps young kids learn the new games by building parallels to what was before, and... ugh. You may disagree with the game design, but that doesn't make it uncreative by default.

Edited July 2, 2016 by Guillotine

[TCA]

Lugia was more involved with the Deep Sea while Ho-oh was more the general phoenix myth; neither were representative of the sun and moon. e3: Actually, i believe Lugia was likely based on a Japanese myth involving an ocean deity, although I don't remember the specifics.

Lugia is probably Ryujin. Its red and white shiny form is the colors of the coral that Ryujin's palace on the seafloor was built of, and it's a draconic deity associated with storms and the sea with incredible power, and controlled the tides with jewels. And what do you summon Lugia with? The Tidal Bell.

Edited July 2, 2016 by TheCompleteAnimorph

[sailing101]

Ho-Oh! and Lugia both blend together several Japanese Deities.

 

To anyone who says that Lugia has nothing to do with the moon, There is in game dialogue referencing a time it caused a solar eclipse, as was discussed earlier in the thread.

 

Sogaleo and Lunalla are both Emissary's of the sun and moon, not the specific dieties. Also, Solgaleo's a land based legend, like Ho-Oh!'s legendary beasts. And Lunalla is Airborne like Lugia's legendary birds.

It all comes together

 

[Switch]

whenever people say that the new gen pokemon games are running out of ideas & back up that statement by reducing newer pokemon designs to their most basic possible descriptions as if one couldnt do the same thing to pokemon from gens 1-3 i just like to remember the good old Gen One classic design that always puts a smile on me face:

 

Six Eggs With Faces

 

anyway i think Tapu Koko is really cool and unique and im excited to see the other guardians (esp with the theory that they can combine.) i think the setting for sun and moon is helping to bring in some really creative ideas for pokemon. i was initially mostly excited for togedemaru but drampa and cutiefly are growing on me too. i really want togedemaru to have some kind of evolution line but the other pikaclones dont so i kinda doubt it will :\

 

by the way unless someone can come up with a more creative nickname for togedemaru i have to name mine Sonic

Edited July 3, 2016 by Switch

[LadyNightshade]

VERY LARGE SCARY IMAGE

DANGIT I TRIED TO FORGET THAT ONE

 

*nightmares*