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Any new sprite updates have a poll

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Random thought. Give a time related dragon a BSA that can switch another dragon back to it's old sprite if you want to.

Would be fun, satisfy the people not into newer sprites, and wouldn't affect gameplay or people who only wanted new sprites.

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I am back after a long hiatus, and love the looks of the new sprites. So anyone out there that doesn't like the new sprites, Send them to me...I have a few silvers but they have long messy lineages. I'd love to work on pretty lineages but you have to have the CB and short lineages to start with. So anyone who wants to get rid of theirs because they don't like the sprite, let me know, I'll take them all!!

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Random thought. Give a time related dragon a BSA that can switch another dragon back to it's old sprite if you want to.

Would be fun, satisfy the people not into newer sprites, and wouldn't affect gameplay or people who only wanted new sprites.

Would it be like the potions where everyone sees it, or more like "only this dragon shows up for you, but everyone else sees normal lineage". I believe that option was discussed, at length in one of the discussion threads, but had been shot down.

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There isn't really a good way to solve this... As others have said, it's hard to please everyone, even if you have a majority vote. That, and I thought the whole point of the sprite updates was to surprise everyone with new and wonderful art. It might not even be up to the public which sprites are changed! It might be entirely up to the discretion of the sprite artist(s), concept-creator(s) of that dragon, and TJ himself. So having a public poll, in my opinion, would be pretty useless in that respect. Perhaps we weren't ever supposed to know or even suspect that the Silvers and Two-Headeds would be the next to be polished up.

I think the only way to "fix" an issue like this is to have a Nostalgia option on DC: like a site skin, it would reapply all of the old sprites in the database to the dragons, as though the updates never happened. Other than that though, I can't think of any good way to help, or how this solution would help.

I personally think all of the sprite updates so far have been gorgeous, and really showcase the pride of the artists in how far they've come from their original skills and work. But I know not everyone agrees with me. Still, it can be hard to find compromises for these things. Maybe there's a better option?

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Polls are inherently biased due to limited choice, never mind polls in SD that see a mere fraction of the userbase, even if all the SD userbase did vote in an SD poll. Holding a poll is just not going to even make sure the majority of users actually prefer a certain sprite.

 

I just don't think this is necessary. It's going to make things take longer and end up with people attached to certain sprites and heartbroken when they aren't the most popular sprite. There's going to be people who just miss out in voting in the poll who are upset because the poll was "too short". And what if the only options are updates, not to keep the same sprite because the update is going to happen regardless, that's also just going to frustrate people.

 

Now, I do think it's fair that sprite updates have a place to be done in public for some public critique, at least for a little while before they are finalized. However, as seen from the silver updates, not even that would help probably as much as users are hoping.

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I know I'm not alone in being somewhat less than pleased with the new updated Silvers. Several people stated not even KNOWING that the Silvers were being updated.

 

For the next updated sprite, how about having a PUBLIC thread on Site Discussion for all to see and vote on or discuss so there aren't so many badly surprised people.

Much as I wub.gif you - you've effectively said it already:

 

Several people stated not even KNOWING that the Silvers were being updated.

 

And wherever anything is posted, they still wouldn't. The discussion thread started for a REQUEST for that. But "didn't know" - and yes, I've seen it too - it was announced in NEWS a couple of months ago. That's pretty damn public. (SO is site discussion, where the thread asking for it was.)

 

Only people who check religiously - like you and me - see everything. Most people don't, and wouldn't see this anyway.

 

And we already know that TJ disregards polls because they are by definition skewed in a place like this. (HE posted as much when he stopped allowing them in suggestions.)

 

I wanted the old ones to stick around too, but - them's the breaks sad.gif

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Polls aren't very useful in getting the general opinions of players because

 

1. Not everyone uses the forum

2. Not everyone who uses the forum would read the topic.

3. Not everyone that read the topic would follow it for however long it went on.

4. Not everyone that followed the topic would vote.

5. A person can not change your answer in a poll even if you change your mind

6. New options that come up can not be changed without wiping the poll and starting over.

*I could also list that TJ has stated a dislike of polls and their "usefulness". but I can not presume to speak for TJ who, being a human being, can change his mind anytime he wants.

 

The announcement was in the News section, which also appears on the Cave page, so anyone that didn't know about the silvers being updated didn't bother to read that, which is much more prominent than SD, so why would they read a topic there?

 

Also, the sprites belong to their artists. If they want to update them and submit better versions, that is their right. They do not need the player's permission to do so. And I'd much rather artists update sprites they don't like than have them removed from the site altogether. cough-bright pinks-cough

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I am back after a long hiatus, and love the looks of the new sprites. So anyone out there that doesn't like the new sprites, Send them to me...I have a few silvers but they have long messy lineages. I'd love to work on pretty lineages but you have to have the CB and short lineages to start with. So anyone who wants to get rid of theirs because they don't like the sprite, let me know, I'll take them all!!

I second that! biggrin.gif (Okay, so I do have a couple of low-gen silvers... Still, if you'd want to get rid of some, I'll be more than happy to take them.)

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I'm very divided in my opinion to this... while on one hand, communication is key in any community (a thing that is severely lacking here, even in private sectors), allowing the community to bring up a poll on sprite updates, or to choose from a set of update sprites, is asking for the thread to devolve into a mess of fighting and disaster and chaos.

 

The way sprite updates should be handled is that the artists involved in a perceived sprite update project need to all be in communication with one another, keeping everyone involved - or those who want to be involved - in the loop. This is mostly done in private, as we already know, in a space designated for artists due to the above reasons.

 

The public, after the sprite update (or in many cases, updates) have been completed, should be notified that there is an update coming. After reviewing what the public would like to see in an update, any sprite sets can be tweaked with those thoughts in mind, and put out as released to keep as many people as possible happy. We make sprites for you, the public, to enjoy, as well as ourselves. Thus, doesn't it make sense to keep an update as true as possible to the already-existing ones? The public can let us know what to change and what not to change, in a majority, and it doesn't even have to be a poll. The best sprite set should be chosen, always.

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As an artist, I feel like the staff spriters should never have to ask permission, ask acceptance, or offer justification for wishing to update their old art. The sprites belong to the artist and to TJ. No, they do not belong to the memberbase. They belong to DC, and that means the staff, not us. In that vein, it is the staff's decision if they want to have a spriter redo someone else's work.

 

People not knowing about the updates is their own fault. The main page shows recent news, and we were alerted multiple times as to what was going to happen with the Silvers.

 

Personally I *adore* the new Silvers. So shiny and elegant and beautiful. ^^

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As an artist, I feel like the staff spriters should never have to ask permission, ask acceptance, or offer justification for wishing to update their old art. The sprites belong to the artist and to TJ. No, they do not belong to the memberbase. They belong to DC, and that means the staff, not us. In that vein, it is the staff's decision if they want to have a spriter redo someone else's work.

I have gathered that TJ has been updating because he wants the site to be better, not to cater to artists who want to show off their best work.

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I have gathered that TJ has been updating because he wants the site to be better, not to cater to artists who want to show off their best work.

If the spriters didn't want to update their work, they would not have made the new sprites.

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I wonder what'll happen if the SD poll was a sprite poll instead of a "regular" poll? We've got the "entire overhaul" silver, but it feels very much like "we wanted a change, but not like this, never like this".

 

Also:

Several people stated not even KNOWING that the Silvers were being updated.

 

Did they just skim the thread? We've been warned about this since October. As Kiryu has said, it's their own fault, especially since news are in the main page now. Hell, the warning about the silvers changing are still in the main page!

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If the spriters didn't want to update their work, they would not have made the new sprites.

Yeah, I just didn't think that was the purpose behind it.

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I meant to reply to this earlier. I was one of those who said something about how I didn't know Silvers were going to be updated; I meant that in response to LadyLyzar's comment that we had plenty of time to voice our opinions in the thread that was discussing revamping the Silver's sprite. I mostly said it because I felt my concerns were dismissed by her, since I had no clue that thread was happening until the sprite revamps were announced, and I of course did not comment on it when it was open.

 

Personally I don't think the poll will do much. People are naturally resistant to change; there are some sprite updates that I really really love (the Gold dragons, for one), some I'm ok with (pretty much everything I don't love) and I'm sure some day there will be an update that I cannot stand. Everyone's tastes differ. I just hope that any future changes are more subtle ones, like the Holly, or at least subtle-looking, like the Two-headeds. Those seem to go over much better with the community as a whole.

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