2015-05-21 - Dragon Cave's 9th Birthday

[Whitefire]

 

Sadly the drake lacks the inner wing-elbow membrane. How.

Pls add that in.

Also the wing arm looks overly beefy, and just what on earth are those back legs doing? Also the shading on the near hind leg makes it look detached from the body

 

Just because a dragon has already been release doesn't mean it cannot be edited. It is NOT passed time for critique. The shadowwalkers were edited soon after release, and the whiptails and horses have also been improved. At the very, very least, please please put in the wing elbow membrane.

 

 

The other two are great though! Love the pygmy <3

I KNEW IT WAS A WYVERN WOO HOO

 

The split looks like blood this is great

Edited May 24, 2015 by Whitefire

[danicast]

I haven't loved every sprite, but I also haven't felt the need to climb on the refreshments table and drop a turd in the punchbowl so everybody knows I didn't like the sprites. There's a difference between having a right to an opinion and having to shout it over everyone's heads in the middle of the release party, long after the work-phase when that criticism might have been useful and constructive.

 

That said...

 

I loved the 'raptors in the tall grass' vibe of the Greater Spotted juveniles, and wish it had carried over to the adults - but they look like they'll get along with my Harvests, who have been waiting for company. And if anyone reading takes that as a request for raptoriffic dragons... *whistles*

Criticism is VERY important to give the artists the very needed feedback that they need to continue to improve their work. I would never call a criticism "climb on the refreshments table and drop a turd in the punchbowl" because thats definitely a wrong metaphor, and a very RUDE one.

Criticism is VITAL to keep the site quality.

I'm happy that there are some people in this community brave enough to express their thoughts and don't simple make empty praise if they don't really feel that the work deserves praise. The criticism is more useful to the spriters than hundreds of meanlingless "oohs" and "ahhs".

 

If there is something that Dragon Cave needs more is criticism. Much more.

Edited May 24, 2015 by danicast

[Nerei]

But I'm sure the artists won't be editing their sprites as they receive critique from the news thread… Do they do that?

[danicast]

But I'm sure the artists won't be editing their sprites as they receive critique from the news thread… Do they do that?

I'm sure the spriters will take in consideration what the users are saying in their next works. That's why is so important to keep posting HONEST opinions.

[The Flash]

Had to abandon a Pygmy to get a CB Thunder. Oh well. I hope they don't run off again.

[Whitefire]

But I'm sure the artists won't be editing their sprites as they receive critique from the news thread… Do they do that?

Yes, yes they do. They have in the past so there is no reason for them to not to now.

[inlaterdays]

Hooray, just caught and influenced my second set of these pretties.

[dragontamer44722]

I personally think it will be up to Tj and the artists to decide if they will change anything on them. I'm sure they will take the crits that were given here into consideration (provided they were helpful and not the "I hate these things" crits). I wasn't around for the dragons that were edited soon after release so if people say it has been done before, if TJ thinks its needed then they can do the same now right?

 

edit: I type slow, Whitefire said the same thing

Edited May 24, 2015 by dragontamer44722

[The_Bucket]

Ooh, can anyone else imagine little kids putting their pet Pygmies in carved out pumpkins? Like little Jack-o-lanterns!

Before they had grown I thought the Magelights were birthday candles, and this was my thought as well. Magelight x Pumpkin will be pretty.

[purpledragonclaw]

I love the adult Pygmies, I'm glad I prioritized catching them first! Once I unlock I'll have to catch the other two species, I don't have any of them yet.

[kammo]

I'm not working on any two-headed lineages but the Hooktalons looks absolutely amazing!! I'm totally breeding atleast PB 3G, they're gorgeous. And thanks to all spriters for new breeds!

[Nerei]

Before they had grown I thought the Magelights were birthday candles, and this was my thought as well.

That's what I thought! The hatchlings all seemed birthday themed. The Magelights (I love that name omg) looked like birthday candles, the Hooktalons were little treats dipped in chocolate, and the Spots were mint chocolate chip ice cream

[dragongrrl]

Red - The Hooktalons have me hooked there! I will eventually want to spend more time breeding the splits I already have, and these will be what I need for color in any of the lines. I still haven't decided whether I like the male (so red!) or female (what energy!) sprite better but I love the fact that Odeen planned them with the Bloodscales in mind. Those will be stunning lineages. Thank you, Odeen! <3

 

The Greater Spotted Drakes - These will be especially beautiful with the Ochredrakes. The Ochredrake was one of my first faves when I started collecting, but beyond an even 4th gen PB, I haven't done much with them, so the Spotteds will be a wonderful color choice for them. They'll look good with the Howlers too! Thank you, JOTB! <3

 

The Magelight Pygmy Wyvern - My only objection to Pygmies in general is that apart from the Pumpkins, the images are too small to really interest me. The Magelights are a step in bringing more interest because the images aren't so small. They are also very pretty little dragons, and the stories for them are already rattling around my brain. I wish I had the CB Pumpkins to go with them, and may try the block evens referred to earlier in this thread. I think I'll like them with the Dark Myst too. Thank you, Marrionetta! <3

[Whitefire]

I personally think it will be up to Tj and the artists to decide if they will change anything on them. I'm sure they will take the crits that were given here into consideration (provided they were helpful and not the "I hate these things" crits). I wasn't around for the dragons that were edited soon after release so if people say it has been done before, if TJ thinks its needed then they can do the same now right?

 

edit: I type slow, Whitefire said the same thing

Exactly, if its just 'i dont like this' then thats not really a crit. If there's something anatomically wrong, then thats a legitimate crit and should be at least given some real consideration. \ o3o /

 

 

like if were talking things we 'dont like', then wehh i dont like the color of the new drake its like uhh idk baby puke and mud and i dont like the markings weh u should make it like PURPLE with PINK MEMBRANE and ZEBRA STRIPES woo hoo wouldnt that be somethin'*

 

 

*please note that absolutely all of this is sarcasm and the markings were done well and everything fits with their concept oki <3 also i like the little ridges and how JOTB went about the wing struts since actually 'elbow fingers' are anatomically very wrong yet all the more common in drakes for some reason so thank d ouo b

[SickSoul]

@.@ The pygmys though!!

[KrazyKarp]

Hooktalons with Bloodscales, Magelights with Misfits, Spotted Drakes with Howlers. I'm looking forward to trying all three of these! (And around Halloween some 2G Pumpkin x Magelight eggs!)

[Odeen]

also i like the little ridges and how JOTB went about the wing struts since actually 'elbow fingers' are anatomically very wrong yet all the more common in drakes for some reason so thank d ouo b

Only one breed (two if you want to call the glories two separate breeds) of drake has elbow fingers?

[lightningsky]

I just HAD to go back and grab more of those pygmies!! I looove their colors <3 So amazing. Good job spriters.

[Sundew]

But I'm sure the artists won't be editing their sprites as they receive critique from the news thread… Do they do that?

It doesn't matter. Whether or not they edit previous pieces, an artist should find it useful to know what the flaws are. If I paint a dragon with a broken-looking foot, I can't go back and change it. But if someone tells me that the anatomy is wrong, I can make changes so that my next dragon has working feet.

 

If you get an answer on a test wrong, it's wrong, and you can't change it. But you can study the correct answers to your mistakes and make sure you ace it in the future.

[JOTB]

 

Sadly the drake lacks the inner wing-elbow membrane. How.

Pls add that in.

Also the wing arm looks overly beefy, and just what on earth are those back legs doing? Also the shading on the near hind leg makes it look detached from the body

At the very, very least, please please put in the wing elbow membrane.

No.

We tend to shoot for realistic anatomy but there's so much wrong with most DC dragons' flying abilities that I feel it's a moot point. I don't wanna.

 

I'm not claiming that they're 100% anatomically correct (my knowledge is far from complete), but here are some of my intentions regarding the anatomy that may (or may not) address your conerns.

 

The hind legs are supporting the dragon's weight and providing balance. They switch between bipedal and quadrupedal gaits, hence why the hind legs are so long. Was that your concern? Think of his pose as having previously been up on his hind legs eating leaves, but then he heard something interesting and came back down on all fours without readjusting his limbs.

 

Wings look much larger fully extended (the membrane pulls back and folds). I don't really remember but I'm pretty sure I made this after seeing some pictures of birds with very short, thick wings and wanted to mess around with that anyway?

 

I'm not really sure what's wrong with having muscular wing arms though?

 

Far foreleg should be darker, good point.

 

 

And yes, they do primarily eat plants but when they eat meat they ambush it. Most of the meat eating occurs in the winter, or in areas where there is already heavy browsing from other species.

 

Also, the blacktip dragons have mean, aggressive females and submissive males as well. They were influenced by the breeding system of the jacana and then I ran with it. I chose this because I like aggressive, grisly dragons and because I wanted it to be at the extreme, polar opposite end of the spectrum of what is expected (or at least what I think is expected), not what I think is desirable. Nature is ugly and brutal at times, and sometimes horrifying. Wise, noble, peaceful dragons are boring to me.

 

On the flip side though, the bluebanded dragons do have an elephant-like matriarchal system. It does exist.

Edited May 24, 2015 by JOTB

[Whitefire]

Only one breed (two if you want to call the glories two separate breeds) of drake has elbow fingers?

Ah i may have been taking into account ones in DR, my bad.

 

Still though it's nice to see all the new dergs without it d ouo b

[dragontamer44722]

I'm happy that we have different hierarchal dragons, with some having patriarchs, others Matriarchs, and some not having one at all. I've had a few dragon concepts that have had larger females, not necessarily "mean" females, but they are head honcho for the groups. It adds variety, which is far from a bad thing in my opinion.

[Whitefire]

No.

We tend to shoot for realistic anatomy but there's so much wrong with most DC dragons' flying abilities that I feel it's a moot point.  I don't wanna.

 

I'm not claiming that they're 100% anatomically correct (my knowledge is far from complete), but here are some of my intentions regarding the anatomy that may (or may not) address your conerns. 

 

The hind legs are supporting the dragon's weight and providing balance.  They switch between bipedal and quadrupedal gaits, hence why the hind legs are so long.  Was that your concern?  Think of his pose as having previously been up on his hind legs eating leaves, but then he heard something interesting and came back down on all fours without readjusting his limbs.

 

Wings look much larger fully extended (the membrane pulls back and folds).  I don't really remember but I'm pretty sure I made this after seeing some pictures of birds with very short, thick wings and wanted to mess around with that anyway? 

 

I'm not really sure what's wrong with having muscular wing arms though?

 

Far foreleg should be darker, good point.

 

 

And yes, they do primarily eat plants but when they eat meat they ambush it.  Most of the meat eating occurs in the winter, or in areas where there is already heavy browsing from other species.

 

Also, the blacktip dragons have mean, aggressive females and submissive males as well.  They were influenced by the breeding system of the jacana and then I ran with it.  I chose this because I like aggressive, grisly dragons and because I wanted it to be at the extreme, polar opposite end of the spectrum of what is expected (or at least what I think is expected), not what I think is desirable.  Nature is ugly and brutal at times, and sometimes horrifying.  Wise, noble, peaceful dragons are boring to me. 

 

On the flip side though, the bluebanded dragons do have an elephant-like matriarchal system.  It does exist.

1) Just because a some other dragons have screwy anatomy doesn't mean we should be perpetuating it.

 

2) The length of the legs weren't a problem really. it's just a hella awkward pose, even if it was just standing on two legs [image] unless it walks like it has bowed legs or something which is fine.

 

 

3) Ok but it still needs the elbow membrane.

 

 

4) Muscle is HEAVY, and having too much will make it really really hard to fly, especially on the wings of all places. I didn't find anywhere that said these guys were flightless but if thats the case then it's fine carry on.

[Nerei]

4) Muscle is HEAVY, and having too much will make it really really hard to fly, especially on the wings of all places. I didn't find anywhere that said these guys were flightless but if thats the case then it's fine carry on.

I really thought they were flightless, judging by their appearance, but you made me go back and check.

 

Greater Spotted Drakes are found in open pine and oak forests. They are among the larger end of the spectrum, but are quite laid back and feed mostly on plant material. They are ambush predators and rely on their dappled markings for camouflage. Females are usually larger than males, though males are brighter in color. In the breeding season the male attracts a mate by making loud, low-pitched bugles, followed by an aerial courtship dance to as proof of his quality as a father to her offspring.

[Nicola]

I agree about the legs. Their placement seems off. Like they don't really go with the position of the body.