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Trader's Canyon

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36 minutes ago, Rekha said:

So then why do we need to change this if everyone has the ability? I understand the odds aren't in everyone's favor, the odds are the same for everyone who enters. The odds suck if everyone wants one right away but I don't think everyone should be able to get them right away.

Because at the current rate, it would take over 55 1/2 years for every currently-active player to potentially win one. That is not okay in any way.

(Source: TJ having mentioned there being 40,000 active players in a summary about the site)

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It seems to come down to people seeing Prizes in different ways. Some people seem to like that they are so exclusive and not available in any sort of normal way. Many of us don't like that and don't think there should be a dragon like that in this game.

 

In a game that is, at it's very core, a *collecting* game (ie, breeding/trading/describing/etc is all completely optional, but the basis of this game is collecting dragons), I simply don't think it's right to have a type of dragon that can *only* be obtained through a purely luck-based raffle. The suggestion to have them available in the store would certainly *not* mean everyone can get one 'right away', as each user would have to save up their currency for months in order to afford one, and that's only if they don't spend *any* currency on anything else. I honestly don't see how users being able to get one CB Prize every 5 months or so would ruin Prizes any more then the vast majority not having access to them at all has ruined them. I guess some people want them to stay exclusive and unobtainable for the majority of players. I just don't think that's the way to go in a collecting game.

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On 1/7/2018 at 7:16 PM, Marie19R said:

It seems to come down to people seeing Prizes in different ways. Some people seem to like that they are so exclusive and not available in any sort of normal way. Many of us don't like that and don't think there should be a dragon like that in this game.

 

In a game that is, at it's very core, a *collecting* game (ie, breeding/trading/describing/etc is all completely optional, but the basis of this game is collecting dragons), I simply don't think it's right to have a type of dragon that can *only* be obtained through a purely luck-based raffle. The suggestion to have them available in the store would certainly *not* mean everyone can get one 'right away', as each user would have to save up their currency for months in order to afford one, and that's only if they don't spend *any* currency on anything else. I honestly don't see how users being able to get one CB Prize every 5 months or so would ruin Prizes any more then the vast majority not having access to them at all has ruined them. I guess some people want them to stay exclusive and unobtainable for the majority of players. I just don't think that's the way to go in a collecting game.

I think you might be correct, there. 

 

The bad thing is I am unsure WHAT can be done that wouldn't create some form of controversy. BOTH sides have their opposing priorities as regards prizes.  If things stay as they are now.... some people will not be happy, and IF changes are implemented, again, there will be some people that won't be happy. Bottom line IS that, in the end, TJ may end up being stuck doing what will tick off the fewest users. I personally think it is a pity that shimmers are at the heart of so much debate and contention.... because I happen to think they are really lovely dragons ( AND I like to hoard the lineaged ones every chance I get!:D)

 

Personally, I'd be in favor of the store/trader canyon solution...

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@Marie19R yes, I completely agree. I really dislike adoptable games with lots of exclusives / retireds because they tend to create an upper class of elites that no amount of hard work can let newer players catch up to. What drove me to DC in the first place (beside my love of dragons and enjoyment of its simplicity :P) was the lack of such critters. Prizes aren’t quite as horrible as they could be, but they still create an upper tier based on pure luck rather than perseverance or skill, and I don’t like that at all. Given DC’s recent and much appreciated trends to reverse such things (returning old holidays, Frills and Arias returning), I hope Prizes follow suit.

 

@JavaTigress not being able to please everyone is true of almost any choice a person can make, but TJ’s already shown willingness to make such choices. Believe it or not, there were people against the return of CB old holidays, and thankfully (and to huge success!) it happened anyway. Prizes have been one of the most contentious issues on the site for years, so I really think more tweaking is needed.

 

And of course, Prizes aside I like the store for other reasons, too. :P 

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@angelicdragonpuppy-I, for one, am grateful that I had a chance to catch some CB holidays I thought I'd NEVER get a chance to own ( Huggles her CB graves and winter magi and solstices!)

I presumethat such things would ALSO be available in the store? During their seasons at least?

 

ETA- I looked at the Original post and yep, it looks like Old Holidays would be included in this thing! :lol:

 

Edited by JavaTigress

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1 hour ago, angelicdragonpuppy said:

And of course, Prizes aside I like the store for other reasons, too. :P 

 

Definitely! I've said it before and I'll say it again, I don't really care about the whole 'cavebreds are better' thing, and not having an cavebred of something doesn't really bother me. Personally, I would probably use the store to get something much less rare then Prizes but that I just have crappy luck getting, like Thunders (or maybe a yellow Undine or red Dorsal, if they are part of the store).

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5 hours ago, JavaTigress said:

Bottom line IS that, in the end, TJ may end up being stuck doing what will tick off the fewest users.

With anything, whether it be TC or something else, doing whatever the majority prefers is the smartest decision. You get the greatest user retention that way, and you get an increase in happiness among users who play the game. It's why a different method of obtaining CB Prizes (TC or not) is clearly inevitable. Though I do think TC is the best way to fix Prizes, and it even fixes other problems, too.

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Regarding the stuff that should be available in the shop: We cannot have CB alts/hybrids/other breedables in there, but how about an "alt potion" that can be applied to a bred egg to guarantee it hatches into an alt? 

For PB stripes, it could also come in all the colors available (white, black, red, green, blue) to recolor the egg.

Could also work for gemshards (red, green, blue), dorsals (red, purple) and ridgewings (tan, purple).

 

Or a "hybridizing potion" that makes sure that a breeding that could result in a hybrid offspring will actually do so.

 

Prices should depend on the kind of potion. True alts with higher rarity (black, vine, undine) might priced somewhere between trio and copper price. Tan ridgewings and red dorsals seem to be a little less rare than those alts, so maybe totally Tier 2 (as seen in the OP)?

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4 hours ago, olympe said:

Regarding the stuff that should be available in the shop: We cannot have CB alts/hybrids/other breedables in there, but how about an "alt potion" that can be applied to a bred egg to guarantee it hatches into an alt? 

 

I like this idea (and I'm pretty sure I've seen it come up before). Maybe affect breeds like Xenos and Zyus with such a potion as well.

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Or, you know, and "unhybridize" potion if all you get is a super-new hybrid like a Carina instead of the Nebbie or Ridgewing you actually need for your project XD It would still have a 50% chance at the wrong parent's breed, but it would help! Add the "alt" potion for the wrongly coloured Nebbie and be happy XD

 

It would be great if the "alt" potion would also work as an "unalt" potion, because sometimes you just need a regular Dark Green or Black for your lineage.

Edited by Ruby Eyes

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So, mutagene (for anything not resembling the parents) and anti-mutagene (for anything resembling either parent)? :ph34r:

Of course, we'd need differently priced stuff for hybrids (low price) and alts (high price)...

Edited by olympe

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I was just thinking about the alt potion idea and wishing it was already here.  Yet another red nebula when I need a blue one for someone a valentine's mate by this season's holiday. :dry:

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On 1/13/2018 at 12:31 PM, Marie19R said:

 

Definitely! I've said it before and I'll say it again, I don't really care about the whole 'cavebreds are better' thing, and not having an cavebred of something doesn't really bother me. Personally, I would probably use the store to get something much less rare then Prizes but that I just have crappy luck getting, like Thunders (or maybe a yellow Undine or red Dorsal, if they are part of the store).

Bred only alts are not available as cbs. IIRC the yellow undines are bred only, so would not be available. Red dorsals can be caught in the cave, and therefore are available. This can be pretty good guideline for how to know what is and isn't available.If you have to breed to get it, you cant have it as a cb.

Its seems the game is slowly moving to a point where this idea is going to become less and less useful to a lot of people. The potions people were pitching could be useful though, and if someone wants to develop that particular path of ideas further, for this idea, please feel free to make a new post, to keep potion options separate from the dragon portion of this. I do think the pricing that was set up could be scaled back for potions (earned quicker) but should probably land on a similar scale for how long they take to earn (so if it takes up to 2 months to earn a specific alt as a cb, then it should probably take about that long to get a potion that can force it). 

Im not really sure how things would need to be changed to make this idea any more clear cut than we have already gotten it. But the potion specific things have lots and lots of wiggle room to be expanded, and would probably be best served in a post that links back to this, rather than being handled in this thread specifically.

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Is NOT less and less useful.

 

Earning a CB gold or a prize is an awesome idea.

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I mean, just because CB holidays are back doesn't make the idea no longer good. There's still several things people either flat out can't get, or are very hard to get still.

Edited by Dragon_Arbock

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8 hours ago, Fuzzbucket said:

Is NOT less and less useful.

 

Earning a CB gold or a prize is an awesome idea.

 This. I see this idea as being more useful than ever, tbh.

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8 hours ago, Fuzzbucket said:

Is NOT less and less useful.

 

Earning a CB gold or a prize is an awesome idea.

 

What Fuzz said. For some of us, even a CB Holly or Val '09 might be worth buying. Or maybe even a lineage-less vampire (if TJ is willing to include them - I'm not going to argue about that at all.)

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Can't speak for everyone, of course, but I'd bet there are quite a few people who would love the option to save up 'currency' gained by simply playing the game, in order to get a CB Gold or Silver, instead of camping in the biomes for hours upon hours every single day in hopes of just *seeing* one. It seems that some people have amazing luck at seeing *and* catching those, but a lot of us never even see them, let alone catch them. And I can't predict how holiday rarity will change in the future, but this past holiday showed that there were a *lot* of users who simply weren't fast enough or lucky enough to be able to catch CB Hollies, so people may be very interested in buying those as well.

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Going from what Marie said, I am one of those people who would like to save up currency and know that I can get a CB gold, silver, prize, or whatever else I need without having to rely on luck or the perfect opportunity of being in the cave at the right time--which is apparently "never" when it comes to cb golds.

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Yes, I'd still say the need for this is as a great as ever. I tend to promote the store as a solution in a lot of suggestion threads (to the annoyance of some XD), but it's because it really does solve so many things that I think need solving. DC is a fun simple game at the core, but the pure luck based nature of Prizes and the fact that players can be active for years without ever having the good luck and quick reflexes to snatch a CB Metal are both two of the biggest downsides. A store that doesn't use real money and actively prevents grinding while still allowing people to save up for rares at a rate that still keeps them rare is basically the cherry on top of DC. I think it would cause no harm and brighten up some parts of the game that have caused frustration for years. Aside from just the dragons, things like potions or expanding Trader's Canyon to allow, you know, some sort of in-cave trading system are examples of just a few of the many ways this idea could be expanded even more. I think it's great.

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20 minutes ago, angelicdragonpuppy said:

 A store that doesn't use real money and actively prevents grinding while still allowing people to save up for rares at a rate that still keeps them rare is basically the cherry on top of DC.

 

This is like the *perfect* summary of the store and why I want it. I would never ever support a store that used real money, or that required hours of grinding every single day, *or* that allowed people to get rares so easily that they became common... And that's the beauty of this suggestion. 

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9 hours ago, Marie19R said:

 

This is like the *perfect* summary of the store and why I want it. I would never ever support a store that used real money, or that required hours of grinding every single day, *or* that allowed people to get rares so easily that they became common... And that's the beauty of this suggestion. 

 

Perfect response to a perfect summary. This would be SUCH a great thing.

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On 1/18/2018 at 12:29 AM, Marie19R said:

Can't speak for everyone, of course, but I'd bet there are quite a few people who would love the option to save up 'currency' gained by simply playing the game, in order to get a CB Gold or Silver, instead of camping in the biomes for hours upon hours every single day in hopes of just *seeing* one. It seems that some people have amazing luck at seeing *and* catching those, but a lot of us never even see them, let alone catch them. And I can't predict how holiday rarity will change in the future, but this past holiday showed that there were a *lot* of users who simply weren't fast enough or lucky enough to be able to catch CB Hollies, so people may be very interested in buying those as well.

This.

 

I seldom see CB golds in biomes. Let alone be quick enough to catch.

 

I had to trade for mine.

 

So yes, support...CB prize availability as side.

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I 100% support putting CB Metals in the Store(/Canyon, oops), that'd be super-helpful to people who don't want to spend all their time scouring trade threads or camping the biomes. Also I like Golds a lot more than shimmers or tinsels XD 

BTW, is there a current status on whether it's likely we'd see CB Hybrids/Alts released in the Store?

Edited by lolahighwind

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TJ said a long time ago that they were never meant to be a thing. He has said nothing since, and I suspect he's sticking with that.

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