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Thuban

Trader's Canyon

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Aren't honorary mention prizes generally deemed to be of less value than the 'grand prizes'?

 

As in a free week's vacation rather than the expensive sports car, or a nice dinner for two rather than the $10,000 cash?

 

 

 

Edit: good point, Sin, lol.

Edited by Syphoneira

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Aren't honorary mention prizes generally deemed to be of less value than the 'grand prizes'?

 

As in a free week's vacation rather than the expensive sports car, or a nice dinner for two rather than the $10,000 cash?

Maybe... but I would choose a Holly CB every day over a Tinsel or Shimmerscale CB smile.gif

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I...no support for this.

As DC stands right now, I have a chance of getting any dragon breed available with patience and a quick reflex or the help of a kind player now and then. It's one of few "fair" games I've ever found, or as fair as it ever gets.

 

I don't have the time in my day to be here every day for more than a moment or two to check my scroll and now and then I have an hour to putter with the Cave and catch or breed another batch of babies.

 

I don't want to see DC become another on a very long list of currency-based websites on which a) the games are either very hard or very very long and time sucking, B ) there are retired/ridiculously rare/limited dragons some of us will never have a shadow of a chance of owning (outside CB prizes/hybrids etc. from this mysterious raffle, of which I know nothing) Or c) an option is added to purchase Mana for RL currency (not all of us would have the money for that kind of thing)

Edited by Aang

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The proposal here would not do any of these things as it currently stands:

1. -Have very long or difficult games. - the most currently popular method of gaining points to spend is doing regular game things like breeding, catching eggs, etc. Another was bringing back the event games from the past. If not event games, then something similarly simple.

 

2. -Introduce any new dragons through the store. Many of us are interested in the prize dragons and honorable mentions from the raffle being available through the store as an additional way to get them or an alternate to the raffle. We are also talking about making regularly dropped cave dragons available through the store and possibly pasts holiday dragons but only during their holiday.

 

3. -Involve real money. No one is suggesting real life money be involved in any way. Everyone's expressed opinion on involving real money is a resounding "NO WAY!" No one wants to see real money become involved. Any store would be using some kind of point system solely earned in the game.

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Aren't honorary mention prizes generally deemed to be of less value than the 'grand prizes'?

 

As in a free week's vacation rather than the expensive sports car, or a nice dinner for two rather than the $10,000 cash?

For some, but CB hybrids/bred-only alts and CB past holidays are just as unattainable as a Tinsel or Shimmer. While holidays wouldn't need to to be quite as highly priced* since you'd only have a week to get them, the others are theoretically attainable year-round and thus should probably be priced in a similar weight class as the Prizes.

 

*Note that this isn't saying that they should be cheap, only that they don't need to cost as much as a Shimmer or Tin that's available year-round.

 

And yes, the most popular suggestion is that you get all your points through normal gameplay, which I like.

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I know one isn't supposed to say TJ said - but TJ DID say, in this thread (back on Jan 23rd) that he wasn't happy about HMs being in ANY way widely available.

 

Prize dragons are way more likely to happen than CB hybrids. I'd rather not have CBs of breeds that were never intended to be CB becoming anything close to the "norm."

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But how many people would actually go for them instead of Hollies or Prizes, really?

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But how many people would actually go for them instead of Hollies or Prizes, really?

Quite a few. CB Prize's as rare as they are I believe are over shadowed by the possibility of obtaining a hybrid as a CB. No need to have those pesky parents in the lineage, you get your awesome soulpeace or hellohorse nice and clean.

 

Bred with other rares like prizes, metallics, etc, you're talking about one of a kind lineages with a breed that should only be obtained through breeding but is currently CB.

 

So I think their value is quite high and honestly if TJ wants to continue offering CB Hybrids it should be exclusively in the raffles and to a very small number of users.

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Problem with that idea of yours is, he *removed* them from raffles.

 

(I still think more people would go for Hollies ...)

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But how many people would actually go for them instead of Hollies or Prizes, really?

I would. Like a shot. Especially "as well as".

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Problem with that idea of yours is, he *removed* them from raffles.

 

(I still think more people would go for Hollies ...)

He removed them last year. Whats to say It won't be an on off thing where one year there is no HM and the next there is? On top of that, there were quite the complaints about there being no HMs in last years raffle (mine included) so there is always the possibility it could come back.

 

Hollies and CB Hybrids are popular choices. I know I would get a CB Hell horse over a holly any day though.

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He removed them last year. Whats to say It won't be an on off thing where one year there is no HM and the next there is? On top of that, there were quite the complaints about there being no HMs in last years raffle (mine included) so there is always the possibility it could come back.

 

Hollies and CB Hybrids are popular choices. I know I would get a CB Hell horse over a holly any day though.

Problem is that this is a highly personal thing.

 

I would pick a Tinsel or Shimmer over a HM at any given time.

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I'd be hard-pressed to choose, myself. But if TJ doesn't want them to be widely available but won't have more HMs in future raffles, maybe having them very highly priced but only available for a few weeks/days a year would be good?

 

I mean, as long as they're available in some manner I'd be fine with them not being in the store. This is strictly for if HMs don't make a comeback in some manner.

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I love this idea!

 

- CB holidays (near the holiday itself)

I sometimes get busy around holidays and miss eggs and hatching alts can be a pain when you're really looking for one. This would be delightful for new players as well! The two per person rule for Christmas should still apply. Older year dragons should cost more than last year's. The stock shouldn't be limited as long as each player is below the max number per breed.

 

- CB Alt

Perhaps just the ability to turn a regular dragon you already own into an alt? Think "Influence" only for dragon colors instead of genders.

 

- CB hybrid

Hybrids are there to give super commons some value, I think. If the CB hybrids were sterile and just scroll deccorations, I think that's a fun idea.

 

- Points Only Dragons

Frankly, I don't see a problem here. Surfing the cave can be a pain. The AP ic clogged with unwanted commons from this. If you could just snag a dragon with points it would alleviate both issues and the dragon would stay rare-ish in comparison to caveborns as the players had to earn the points to buy it.

 

- Prize Dragons

To keep this rare, maybe it should actually be a raffle that you spend points on to win? This way only a limited number of these are released every month and everyone has a chance. Otherwise just make them super expensive and give the option to be able to buy more more than 2 of each per person.

 

More ways to get points- all of these are limited actions already to keep things fair.

 

Freeze dragons. This would give people reason to hatch worthless supercommons and would lower the unwanted dragon population a little.

 

Release adult dragons. Same as freezing, but should be worth less points than freezing as the dragon might have grown up and bred.

 

Sucessfully bite a dragon. Vampires would gain value and it would further help weed out the flood of unwanted supercommons.

 

I like the idea of "summoning" points. I think a former supercommon with no alt should do this. Storm dragon makes it rain money? Nocturne shared their hoard? Terrae dug up some treasure?

Edited by injenn

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If you read through the whole thread you'll see that people aren't fond of the idea of any dragon being unbreedable. We don't want cb hybrids to be unbreedable scroll decorations. People who want cb hybrids available (and the same applies to cb alts) want to be able to do things like this. Whatever is decided for hybrids, in my opinion ought to apply to anything breed-only - hybrids, breed only alts, colored stripes. I'd like to see them available but only in very limited numbers.

 

I don't know about others, but I think making sure they aren't generally available is a good thing. Limiting the number that can be purchased sitewide in the course of a year makes the most sense to me.

 

On the store points toward prize raffles idea, people were not in favor of spending points to enter a raffle and then not having those points if they lost, if they only get a limited number of points per time period. The idea of the more points you spend the better your chances of winning got a resounding "no fair" as it would lead to players with more time to spend "buying" up huge chances and locking out others. Game tilt.

 

While people were not opposed to any of your methods of gaining points they weren't in favor of those actions being the only way to earn points as it places more value on certain play styles as opposed to others. For example, some people never freeze hatchlings. Some people never release adults. Some people never use bite. To require people to take these actions in order to gain points in the store is unfair. The more popular idea was most normal game actions would earn you a point but there would be a cap on how many points you could earn in a time period. The time periods more commonly endorses are per day or per week.

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Any player who simply wants to play the game, as it stands - collect, breed raise, and earn any points they may need to use this "store" that way should be able to do so. The store should NOT only be available to people who play extra games, change their playstyle specially by having to kill, bite, release.

 

One particularly good thing about this idea is that it would encourage people just to PLAY more. Which is what gets the biomes emptied, the ratios moving and so on. Making points available in other ways (which many people would not want to join in) would have no such benefits.

 

And ESPECIALLY no to ANY more raffles than we already have. (For the record I am one who could, if I liked, spend far too much time here and join them like mad. I still hate the idea.)

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More ways to get points - all of these are limited actions already to keep things fair.

 

Freeze dragons. This would give people reason to hatch worthless supercommons and would lower the unwanted dragon population a little.

 

Release adult dragons. Same as freezing, but should be worth less points than freezing as the dragon might have grown up and bred.

 

Sucessfully bite a dragon. Vampires would gain value and it would further help weed out the flood of unwanted supercommons.

 

I like the idea of "summoning" points. I think a former supercommon with no alt should do this. Storm dragon makes it rain money? Nocturne shared their hoard? Terrae dug up some treasure?

 

Freezing dragons: IMHO, this should award as many points as raising them to adulthood. For the ratios, there's supposed to be no difference between an adult or a frozen hatchling. Maybe even make Freezing a little cheaper regarding points than raising solely because you can unlock a hatchi-locked scroll sooner this way. (However, I'd be fine with equal value for both actions.)

 

Releasing Dragons: No from me. After all, this game is abot raising dragons, not releasing them. Plus, you already got your points for raising the dragon(s) in question. Another reward for releasing the adult isn't necessary and would impede most people's play styles.

 

Bite: Not really. You'll already get the points for raising or freezing the dragon.

 

Summoning points: Not really. Dragons are not known for showering you with presents. Plus, it would mean we'd be "grinding" to advance, which is not something I like to think of.

 

Personally, I'd recommend points for...

  • Hatching and Raising/Freezing dragons
  • Giving a Click to an egg/hatchling.

Everything else is problematic as it would either impede play styles or could be exploited.

 

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Alright lets break this down for future reference <3

 

- CB holidays (near the holiday itself)

I sometimes get busy around holidays and miss eggs and hatching alts can be a pain when you're really looking for one. This would be delightful for new players as well! The two per person rule for Christmas should still apply. Older year dragons should cost more than last year's. The stock shouldn't be limited as long as each player is below the max number per breed.

 

Many have agreed that this is a good idea. Regardless there is an auto limit of two CB per person so showing a clear limit of how many you can get isnt a bad idea. I don't know about making prior years more expensive than more recent years seeing as the more christmas dragons that are added the more expensive dragons like Hollies, Yulebucks, Snowangels, etc will get. I would rather see them all a specific price regardless of when they were added to the site to make it easy for causal players as well as players with more time/points.

 

- CB Alt

Perhaps just the ability to turn a regular dragon you already own into an alt? Think "Influence" only for dragon colors instead of genders.

 

- CB hybrid

Hybrids are there to give super commons some value, I think. If the CB hybrids were sterile and just scroll deccorations, I think that's a fun idea.

 

Honestly Alts and Hybrids should just be made randomly available once a year. Never the same time every year so that way their numbers remain limited and the same people can't always get them. Even then they should be very expensive. Like they should be available for lets say 3 random days on a random week in a random month of the year. This way Alts remain mostly a must breed to obtain thing and not just a "Play DC long enough and you can have every alt and hybrid available in the game as a CB." They were not meant to be widely and readily available that way. So I am against anything that makes them too available to the public.

 

- Points Only Dragons

Frankly, I don't see a problem here. Surfing the cave can be a pain. The AP ic clogged with unwanted commons from this. If you could just snag a dragon with points it would alleviate both issues and the dragon would stay rare-ish in comparison to caveborns as the players had to earn the points to buy it.

 

The issue with points only dragons is that DC doesnt work that way. DC has always been about being able to obtain your dragons at almost no cost. Even raffles are free with no more than little to mild participation required. On top of that not everyone plays as hard core as most people. Some people only collect certain numbers of dragons before simply enjoying the forums, some barely breed or collect at all and mostly just enjoy the forums over the game. So having points only dragons means we are completely if not mostly excluding players who will not be able to get every dragon. In a game where collection and completion is the goal, excluding some from doing this is a no no.

 

- Prize Dragons

To keep this rare, maybe it should actually be a raffle that you spend points on to win? This way only a limited number of these are released every month and everyone has a chance.  Otherwise just make them super expensive and give the option to be able to buy more more than 2 of each per person.

 

Prize dragons shouls be available both in raffles and in this store as normal every day of the year available for purchase egg. Of course it would have to be very expensive since they are rare. Having them available normally like this would also allow for prizes like lets say tinsels to be retired while still readily available and as such allowing other prizes to be made and distributed in new raffles. Making more raffles is only going to aggrivate people further, especially those who have a spacial hate for raffles.

 

More ways to get points- all of these are limited actions already to keep things fair.

 

Freeze dragons. This would give people reason to hatch worthless supercommons and would lower the unwanted dragon population a little.

 

Release adult dragons. Same as freezing, but should be worth less points than freezing as the dragon might have grown up and bred.

 

Sucessfully bite a dragon. Vampires would gain value and it would further help weed out the flood of unwanted supercommons.

 

I like the idea of "summoning" points. I think a former supercommon with no alt should do this. Storm dragon makes it rain money? Nocturne shared their hoard? Terrae dug up some treasure?

 

I like quite a few others rarely freeze or release dragons. As such adding these in is a bit unfair because avid players who freeze or release often will have a higher/unfair advantage over those of us who chose not to do it. If there is one thing I absolutely hate, loathe, is being forced to do something I don't want to for the sake of reaching my goal. That also includes being forced to collect certain dragons I don't want/like to be able to do something worth while in a game. As such I would say quite a few people would be agains the whole summoning points being a dirt common dragon's BSA. For example I am not fond of brimstones. I dont want them on my scroll. If this action was given to that dragon, I and many who do not want anything to do with those dragons would be ata severe disadvantage as well as this would be forcing us to do something we would rather not in order to keep up. Just no. No. No biting either. the risk of killing an egg is too much for some who would never bite using their own vamps so no.

 

Edited by AnanoKimi

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Personally, I'd recommend points for...
  • Hatching and Raising/Freezing dragons
  • Giving a Click to an egg/hatchling.
Everything else is problematic as it would either impede play styles or could be exploited.

NOT to the giving a click. There are a lot of people here who like to raise clickless dragons, and people trawling around to give clicks could spoil that for them. Unless you mean a click to your OWN, and ONLY to your own ?

 

No to ANYTHING that leads to grinding, as olympe says. Which would include this summoning points idea.

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We're not entirely all in agreement over what gives points, but in general, I think many normal actions ought to. Stealing a dragon from the cave ought to give one, breeding ought to give one, hatching ought to give one. Raising it to adult ought to give one. Freezing could give one. The limiter is saying no one can earn more than X points a day, or a week. Then, no matter how many eggs you breed, for example, you can't earn more than someone who never breeds at all. That way, no matter what your play style you have the ability, using that play style of earning as many points as someone with a different play style.

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What if we just simplified the way you gain points down to the most basic idea. You get x points for y number of actions a day.

 

 

If it involves using the "action" button, you get a point (half point.. something), period, up until the point cap per day is reached. This way, there are no specific types of actions that have to be used to get things, which doesnt interfere with anyones game play (unless they never touch their dragons again after they grow...)

 

This is in addition to the pitched thing of having to catch and raise dragons as well.. but for the "action" related point gains, it just makes sense to make it /any/ action that said dragons have available to them...

Edited by Thuban

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NOT to the giving a click. There are a lot of people here who like to raise clickless dragons, and people trawling around to give clicks could spoil that for them. Unless you mean a click to your OWN, and ONLY to your own ?

Thank you for your comments here, fuzzbucket! <3

 

I'm still not entirely convinced about the need for a store, but if it happens, the idea of getting points from clicking absolutely terrifies me because I do try to raise all my babies without any clicks. From my perspective, it's sort of an unconsented touching, the definition of battery in rl. While random clicks do happen, I work very hard to prevent them, and it is heartbreaking whenever I see someone has decided to click all the unfogged babies on my scroll. Giving points for clicking other people's dragons would destroy one of my primary scroll goals.

 

Since raising a dragon with 0 clicks is harder to do, maybe 0-click adults should gain points. smile.gif

 

I do like the idea of Actions being the primary way of gaining points, since that wouldn't affect any other players scroll, although killing and releasing do seem to go against the basic playing idea of collecting dragons. Maybe killing or releasing would lose a point, but successful biting or zombification would restore or add to those points?.

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With a daily cap on gathering points, I don't think anyone will feel pressed to use the Release or Kill actions just for that.

 

Also, I could imagine just hiding and unhiding my eggs X times a day and I'd be done?

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With a daily cap on gathering points, I don't think anyone will feel pressed to use the Release or Kill actions just for that.

 

Also, I could imagine just hiding and unhiding my eggs X times a day and I'd be done?

That's exactly what I meant when I said that everything but hatching, raising and freezing could be exploited. Unless you have extremely low caps, you'll need to use actions.

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There is still the limit imposed on you by the number of available dragons for the various BSAs, per cooldown period.

 

Abandoning, hiding, naming and describing should probably not give points. Teleporting? Probably not either.

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