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Trader's Canyon

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I agree with Mysfyt, except:

I think a failure on the lower level spells is fine (ie, you "rushed" and kaBOOOM! mana explodes), but I think for the ones that take months to save for, there needs to be no failure. Or... Maybe only up to 5% of the total can go boom for the Advanced ones?

 

And to work it into the lore, perhaps you have to "graduate", ie, you have to succeed at several lower level spells before you can attempt the higher level ones?

 

I like the idea of getting CB Avatars, but I think that since they are demi-gods, they need to be limited to whatever the GoN are limited to, and need a VERY large number of mana-crystals.

 

Also, slap a 4 to 6 month cooldown on each spell, and you wont get hoarding. If you can only have 1 CB Bluna every 6 months... Its going to take a while to get a lot. tongue.gif

 

Cheers!

C4.

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*snip*

Also, slap a 4 to 6 month cooldown on each spell, and you wont get hoarding. If you can only have 1 CB Bluna every 6 months... Its going to take a while to get a lot. tongue.gif

 

Cheers!

C4.

6 moths sound reasonable... That's half a year. That's 2 per year, granted people will not only focus on hybrids then that's fine. Really dedicated long term players will be able to get more. No shorter than 6 months. I don't like the idea of CB Hybrid hoarding with no limit. they are hybrids they are not CB releases. they are hybrids for a reason. Lets keep them hybrids as much as possible and limit CB hybrids to a good extent.

 

Edited for typos

Edited by AnanoKimi

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It seems as though only CB Christmas and Valentines are obtainable via the 'store'. I understand that Halloweens are not included because there are no scroll limit of CB Halloweens, but I'd like a way to get the CB Halloweens as well. Perhaps they are only available during Halloween season, and the limit is how many eggs slots you have at your current trophy level (because I don't think the eggs should be tradeable, so you can't hoard tons of Halloweens by IOU Halloween hatchlings) Thoughts? If the store does get implemented somehow, I'd like past CB Halloweens to be included as well.

have included them in my idea.

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I'm going to reiterate that I'd rather there not be a fail rate for the CB alts in the store. If I wanted a regular CB black or vine, I'd hunt for one in the cave. If I wanted an alt, I'd save up mana for it. If this is a known "limited edition" store, I'd rather not spend mana on something that would more than likely fail.

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I'm going to reiterate that I'd rather there not be a fail rate for the CB alts in the store. If I wanted a regular CB black or vine, I'd hunt for one in the cave. If I wanted an alt, I'd save up mana for it. If this is a known "limited edition" store, I'd rather not spend mana on something that would more than likely fail.

Well I would say its either a fail rate from 50% or higher or a cool down to stop CB Alt hoarding. As nice as it is there should still be some challenge to getting an alt,not just poof, handed to you on a silver platter. If we were handing out CB alts and hybrids on a silver platter there wouldnt be any challenge or much logic/reason to the game.

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Mysfyt:

Perhaps instead of "summon", use "Call", because SUmmon already has a specific meaning in the game?

 

Cheers!

C4.

 

PS: I like the idea of things going kaBOOM, but with initials like mine what do you expect? tongue.gif

 

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This is my first opinion, as I haven't read this thread thoroughly.

 

I agree, but isn't this completely devaluing the idea of 'you had to be there to get it'? Sure, it's not totally fair, but that's what breeding and trading is for. Not that I don't support it, but I was thinking that it might undermine the time-release aspect of DC that makes its holidays so important.

 

Also, if shimmers and tinsels that are CB appear on every scroll, then the holiday raffle is essentially useless, because everyone will have them. Again, correct me if I'm missing something critical.

 

Either way, I'd be okay with a store, but I'm iffy about the concept of limited dragons like holidays and prizes. You'll have to give me some more time to think... |D

Edited by cheese456

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This is my first opinion, as I haven't read this thread thoroughly.

 

I agree, but isn't this completely devaluing the idea of 'you had to be there to get it'? Sure, it's not totally fair, but that's what breeding and trading is for. Not that I don't support it, but I was thinking that it might undermine the time-release aspect of DC that makes its holidays so important.

 

Also, if shimmers and tinsels that are CB appear on every scroll, then the holiday raffle is essentially useless, because everyone will have them. Again, correct me if I'm missing something critical.

 

Either way, I'd be okay with a store, but I'm iffy about the concept of limited dragons like holidays and prizes. You'll have to give me some more time to think... |D

CB Prizes have destroyed the trade market, and the only way to ease the problem is to make them more readily available.

 

If it takes 4 to 6 months to earn just one, and you can only run that particular spell once (ie, only get one scroll-locked egg), then the Prizes will gradually appear on the market.

 

An idea like this would make Prize owners special in 2 ways:

1. THey can have more than 1 of a given color morph on their scroll (everyone else is limited to 1 or 2, depending on what is chosen)

2. They get a custom code, which these types of ideas do not allow for.

3. The raffle takes no effort. This and others will take effort and dedication. So the Raffle is free, while these.... you have to earn in one way or another.

 

Cheers!

C4.

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CB Prizes have destroyed the trade market, and the only way to ease the problem is to make them more readily available.

 

If it takes 4 to 6 months to earn just one, and you can only run that particular spell once (ie, only get one scroll-locked egg), then the Prizes will gradually appear on the market.

 

An idea like this would make Prize owners special in 2 ways:

1. THey can have more than 1 of a given color morph on their scroll (everyone else is limited to 1 or 2, depending on what is chosen)

2. They get a custom code, which these types of ideas do not allow for.

3. The raffle takes no effort. This and others will take effort and dedication. So the Raffle is free, while these.... you have to earn in one way or another.

 

Cheers!

C4.

I'd just add to that that if you win a raffle, the prize is relatively instant, whereas getting one through the store would take months of work and patience.

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I'd just add to that that if you win a raffle, the prize is relatively instant, whereas getting one through the store would take months of work and patience.

Instant in like a few weeks to get announced, another few weeks to actually get em. X3

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Instant in like a few weeks to get announced, another few weeks to actually get em. X3

Well... okay, yeah. But you take my meaning. laugh.gif

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This thread exploded while I was gone. It took me awhile to catch up so now that I feel confident I am informed I will comment.

 

I am still vehemently against this entire idea. I could be impartial to it and even ignore it if everything that can be had from this 'store' could also be gotten from the cave. I do not want to be forced to play some game to collect sprites that I can't get otherwise. (Don't tell me people won't trade these store eggs for ridiculous prices because I refuse to believe that)

 

Besides that I am completely against CB hybrids being given out as prizes. The whole point of a hybrid is that you have to BREED to get them. That's what makes them special. Being able to get them as CBs completely negates their purpose entirely. Before you start screaming, but the raffle!....

 

Yes I realize they were a possible HM prize in the raffle. But they are few and far between. Because face it if you could have the Holy Grail, (CB Holly), why would you pick a CB hybrid? I haven't seen many around so I don't think they are that plentiful. If this is put into effect then they will be, and I see no reason for that. It will mess with Hybrid ratios and pretty much makes their mechanic null and void.

 

So no. Still a huge resounding no from me. If this is implemented it will no doubt be the end of my DC career. Maybe I am in the minority, or maybe there are others who feel like I do who are just afraid to speak out. Regardless the day DC moves to currency and gaming, like every other petsite, is the day when I start finding another game to play.

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Well I would say its either a fail rate from 50% or higher or a cool down to stop CB Alt hoarding. As nice as it is there should still be some challenge to getting an alt,not just poof, handed to you on a silver platter. If we were handing out CB alts and hybrids on a silver platter there wouldnt be any challenge or much logic/reason to the game.

I was under the impression that there would be a cap on the alts, just like the hybrids. And it wouldn't be "handed over on a silver platter" if I worked to collect mana to summon/buy it. I also don't totally understand why there would be normal things in a limited edition store--aside from the RP aspect, which I'm not really a fan of. I don't want to waste mana on dragons that I can catch in the cave just to prove that I'm not going to hoard the CB alts. I would expect that the depletion of mana after summoning/whatever scroll caps/time caps were in place would be deterrent enough.

 

Edit: Also, Reidragon, if I won, I would pick a CB hybrid over a holly and I don't have any CB hollies.

Edited by Jazeki

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[...]

First thing is I agree with cyradis4 in the comment that it is now less of a 'store' and more of a Mana Summon, and I like thinking of it this way better. In a store you can trade both ways - even if the practice is phased out by commercial giants in the late part of last century 99% of the time if you can buy an egg/creature, then you can sell one as well, setting your own price. 

 

Making it a summon and therefore a part of DC magic lore is a whole new kettle of fish and I think fits the game a whole lot better. The mana you collect is controlled by you, you use some to try and magically make an egg appear from a list much like a spell sheet - less complicated spells requiring little mana for common eggs can be performed by the average farmer in Galsreim, while the more rare eggs can only be used by qualified mages type thing. There are 13 types of mana, perhaps you need certain numbers of each for each different egg summon. Maybe some mana types are harder to get so they can be highly attached to the rarer items. The only way to get the mana is of course play the mana game - possibly during holiday events mana may drop like treats to pick up.

[...]

THIS.

 

I think that being able to collect up hoards of mana would be awesome, but having extended spell cooldowns/having to "find" specific scrolls/having super rare mana that has to be collected for higher level spells is AWESOME.

 

Leveling up would be sensible as well, even to having had to level up in specific types of mana use (say, you want to summon an ice dragon, you would have to summon so many common dragons with an ice trait, say, frostbites) before trying your hand at more advanced spells.

 

On the topic of failure rates: I don't mind a failure rate, but I think that there should be a "Mastery" level that you can obtain with a spell that negates any failure rate. (or perhaps per mana type--it would take a while if you had to do say three summons (every 6 months) before you could gain mastery.)

 

On the topic of store-only sprites: I do not support having dragons here that you cannot obtain in other places. I think that this could be a wonderful addition, but it needs to very definitely be 100% optional at least for a good while. Perhaps after a couple of years, exclusive dragons could be added to the store, but hopefully by that point, TJ has a staff to help him run the website and be his code monkeys.

 

ETA:

 

[...]

Besides that I am completely against CB hybrids being given out as prizes. The whole point of a hybrid is that you have to BREED to get them. That's what makes them special. Being able to get them as CBs completely negates their purpose entirely. Before you start screaming, but the raffle!....

 

[...]

It will mess with Hybrid ratios and pretty much makes their mechanic null and void.

 

[...]

CB dragons do not "appear out of thin air," "are made from rocks" nor do they "spontaneously appear." They are, in fact, bred. The reason that we CALL them CAVEBORN is that they were laid by WILD DRAGONS AND WE DON'T KNOW WHO THEIR PARENTS ARE. So a CB Hybrid is one that just happened to have that special combination of parents, but that happened in the wild, you know, naturally.

 

As to CB Hybrids messing with the Hybrid ratios, I want to say that may not be in any way the case, because they could be ruled by a completely separate mechanic. Just saying.

 

I do not support the store as a place for dragons that were not released elsewhere, but I do support it. I think it should be designed in such a way that even if a player never goes there that it will not affect their game play, scroll goals, and whatnot.

Edited by amthystfire

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This thread exploded while I was gone. It took me awhile to catch up so now that I feel confident I am informed I will comment.

 

I am still vehemently against this entire idea. I could be impartial to it and even ignore it if everything that can be had from this 'store' could also be gotten from the cave. I do not want to be forced to play some game to collect sprites that I can't get otherwise. (Don't tell me people won't trade these store eggs for ridiculous prices because I refuse to believe that)

 

Besides that I am completely against CB hybrids being given out as prizes. The whole point of a hybrid is that you have to BREED to get them. That's what makes them special. Being able to get them as CBs completely negates their purpose entirely. Before you start screaming, but the raffle!....

 

Yes I realize they were a possible HM prize in the raffle. But they are few and far between. Because face it if you could have the Holy Grail, (CB Holly), why would you pick a CB hybrid? I haven't seen many around so I don't think they are that plentiful. If this is put into effect then they will be, and I see no reason for that. It will mess with Hybrid ratios and pretty much makes their mechanic null and void.

 

So no. Still a huge resounding no from me. If this is implemented it will no doubt be the end of my DC career. Maybe I am in the minority, or maybe there are others who feel like I do who are just afraid to speak out. Regardless the day DC moves to currency and gaming, like every other petsite, is the day when I start finding another game to play.

The number of CB Alts and Hybrids we are talking about would be a drop in the bucket compared to the numbers bred in any given month. They won't affect the ratios anymore than my mass-breeding all of my hybrid producing pairs and hybrids. Which is to say... really won't.

 

Actually, I would have a lot of trouble between picking a CB Holly and a CB Hellhorse. I love the Hellhorses to bits! But the Holly has lots of trade value... But I already have reached my scroll goals (except for some alts).... And back and forth. And I know of several (at least 3 that I know of) who made that exact choice: A CB Hybrid or alt instead of a CB Holly. And I know one person who chose an Alt Black instead of a Bronze Shimmer! (yes I thought she was nuts... still do, actually).

 

And if you can only get one every 6 months per scroll... I'm not sure how that would void their breeding mechanic?

 

If you chose to leave over something like this, I would be truly sorry. But I still think that a mechanic like this, that rewards dedication and loyalty to the site, needs to be added to the "great system / catching skills" and "blind luck" mechanics already in place.

 

Cheers!

C4.

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I don't like the currency idea either, which is why I am proposing the sideways idea of alchemy instead.

To me it just seems more logical and more likely to be accepted than a 'shop' where you just buy stuff - this way its still you have to work at it and set goals

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@Mysfytt - oh please no fail rates. That's not even remotely fair and would just cause all manner of drama. If you've worked for it, you should succeed.

Second this. If I spend months gathering the needed materials and wind up empty handed, I'm going to be the one to fizzle bang. The idea was to work for a result and not have to deal with the luck factor. Some of us have bad luck. Some of us have had over 40 years of bad luck, and we're not looking at that changing anytime soon. It would be nice to finally have a small window in this game where the unlucky can succeed as long as they are willing to put forth the effort it takes to reap the reward.

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It seems as though only CB Christmas and Valentines are obtainable via the 'store'. I understand that Halloweens are not included because there are no scroll limit of CB Halloweens, but I'd like a way to get the CB Halloweens as well. Perhaps they are only available during Halloween season, and the limit is how many eggs slots you have at your current trophy level (because I don't think the eggs should be tradeable, so you can't hoard tons of Halloweens by IOU Halloween hatchlings) Thoughts? If the store does get implemented somehow, I'd like past CB Halloweens to be included as well.

No, actually Halloweens are included, they just dont have the cap on them like the others do. And its already been established that CB holidays will not be tradable, alongside the prizes if they are included.

 

First thing is I agree with cyradis4 in the comment that it is now less of a 'store' and more of a Mana Summon, and I like thinking of it this way better. In a store you can trade both ways - even if the practice is phased out by commercial giants in the late part of last century 99% of the time if you can buy an egg/creature, then you can sell one as well, setting your own price.

 

What comment is being referenced here? If it happened in this thread.. I missed it, and I would like to see it in context. NONE of what came immediately after that makes any sense in relation to what the thread was discussing as of the last time I commented, and really, it seems to overcomplicate the basic framework of this suggestion.

 

Certain eggs will not be tradable, if included (Like Prizes and CB holidays)

Other ones will be.

They would already have an existing point value. The points would not be tradable between scrolls. Sure, people will trade points in for things to trade, but its not really abusable. The person trading in points will still have had to go through the process of earning the points that they used to trade in the first place. I guess I dont really see a reason to complicate it more by adding random story building that has nothing to do with it in (at least not until a point where this is actively being discussed as an actual possibility between tj and the artists anyhow)

 

And NO, Absolutely not am I ok with the idea of fail chances in the store (outside of the cb alt thing) Whether we call these things points, or mana (I'd really rather not...) or whatever the worlds currency name is.. the point is that if you save up long enough, you will be able to get anything you want (within established limits)

 

Only in my examples have I used small numbers. I fully expect it to take some time to be able to get any of the things available in the store. Its not really going to be something thats going to be exploitable in the sense of "im going to get 101 Black Stripes using only my points" because that person would have to collect 101 x whatever the red stripes price might be. For all we know, it could end up being something that takes 6 months to earn one of on average. It could only take a week, it could take a month. I am sure that if this thing is going to happen that anything offered in there that is explicitly common is going to take at least a couple days to a week, because I dont think they would be something everyone could get one a day of. There are a lot of factors that would need weighed together before setting point values, that would have to worked out behind the scenes.

 

 

 

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I think we should propose the basis of this idea and leaving the background aspects to TJ and its team. We could propose the simple mechanics behind this (you earn points with minigames in order to buy a rare dragon) and if this idea is relased it will be up to TJ to transform points in mana cristals and buy in summon. Of course the best thing to do is to add a "store" completely fine with DC background, something fun and useful to know more about Valkemare.

 

If Prizes will be included I strongly support to be able to summon/purchase 2 of each color for each breed. 2 bronze tinsel, 2 silver tinsel, 2 gold tinsel, 2 bronze shimmer, 2 silver shimmer and 2 gold shimmer. This would be useful in order to have male and female of each breed and color and I think that if we don't introduce it from the beginning it will still be proposed after, so... Yes to be able to do more lineages xd.png It would still require a loooot of time to summon all of them so. you could also win one with the raffle while you're trying to buy them in the store due the years i will require xd.png

Edited by Naruhina_94

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In my opinion:

I think a more traditional approach would be better. Gaining mana would be from:

1. (some) Passively from raising dragons and (a very tiny bit from logging on)

2. (a little more) Participating in the seasonal games (eg decorating and mana alchemy etc.)

3. Maybe a minigame minigame awarding a small amount but I think the focus on a seasonal activities will make it less grindy

 

All have daily caps.

 

Accumulating mana adds to your bar. Mana spells can be cast whenever. However, each casting drains the bar completely and the success rate of the spell is determined by the amount of mana accumulated. For every type of dragon, there is a mana threshold which will give 100% success rate in casting once it's reached so you can choose between gambling (like a raffle) or getting a 100% chance. (Higher for prize dragons, for example, so say you max out your bar and select the dragon you will always obtain them).

 

Perhaps deciding what species of dragon is summoned could be based on seasonal/player influences, rather than 'click a menu and select what dragon you want'

 

1. Conditions: For example, casting a spell on Valentines will always result in Valentine's dragons, casting a spell at night will allows Dark affinity dragons to be summoned and day for Light. Filling up your scroll with all water dragons except for the last scroll slot allows you to summon Water affinity dragons. And so on.

 

2. Experience: Raising more dragons of a specific Elemental Affinity allows the player greater control over what dragon that person belonging to that specific affinity,

 

I also envisage a level up system where casting more spells gives the player experience:

1. Lowers the cooldown rate of spells

2. Allows more spells to be cast simultaneously.

 

I'm more of the 'don't charge absolutely extortionate amounts for spells but have long cooldowns between them' opinion.

Edited by DarkEternity

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I don't understand why Blacks/Vines/Undines need a chance to fail to alt. Just because their eggs look the same as non-alt eggs? Obviously, what would distinguish them from regular eggs would be that they would be untradable, like other things from the store, no?

 

 

Also, I don't see any reason to put a hard scroll limit on alts or hybrids (Avatars included). A per-year-limit I could understand, but a hard limit like holiday CBs makes no sense at all. They breed like rabbits anyway; it's currently nigh impossible to NOT get a Geode from 2 Green dragons: http://dragcave.net/progeny/9TfL9

I would understand if CB Avatars came at a higher cost, but not with a hard scroll limit.

 

 

Another thing I've seen it mentioned already within the past few pages:

Just because a dragon shows no parents doesn't mean it has none - it only means we don't know them. So if we happen to find a hybrid egg in a store, we don't know if the store owner bred it or if they found it, the store owner keeps the lineage a secret, so we just won't know it. This would not really impact the secrecy around hybrids and how to get them. In fact, a new hybrid could show up in store at the same time as TJ releases it - people would still try to breed dragons first to acquire the fancy new hybrid and build pretty lineages with them. Hybrids also wouldn't lose their appeal of "oh, so you breed dragon X with Y and get Z!" because that mechanic still works.

 

 

@DarkEternity: That sounds like an entirely different suggestion, actually. In fact, it sounds like a totally different game to me.

Edited by Ruby Eyes

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Second this. If I spend months gathering the needed materials and wind up empty handed, I'm going to be the one to fizzle bang. The idea was to work for a result and not have to deal with the luck factor. Some of us have bad luck. Some of us have had over 40 years of bad luck, and we're not looking at that changing anytime soon. It would be nice to finally have a  small window in this game where the unlucky can succeed as long as they are willing to put forth the effort it takes to reap the reward.

Third this. If we pay for something in a store, we should get what we pay for, not a chance that there will be something else in that box.

 

And I wouldn't pay for anything unbreedable either.

 

But I like this suggestion best of them ALL smile.gif

Edited by fuzzbucket

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*joins the fray*

 

There's a lot of good ideas and suggestions being thrown around here I think.

I like the idea of having another way to earn a dragon as a small supplement to cave-hunting (not replacing). Naturally the cave is still the main feature, as it should be, and everything available in the store should still be available to other players as well, either by trading, breeding or grabbing in the cave.

 

As for the rewards, I would have loved to see rare dragons (Gold, Silver, Bluesang, Copper ect.) available in the store as well, at a fair price ofcourse that would not flood or crash the trading market, but I think the suggestions about the rewards curretly in play are really good.

 

From my personal perspective/position: I would much rather work on getting my very own CB shimmer or holly than just one gold, which I can technically grab off the cave. And if/when I finally were to get my reward after half a year of collecting points I might be able to trade the offspring to some of the dragons I want from the cave but are unable to grab.

But that thought aside.

 

I like being able to grab CB hybrids and alts as a reward and the idea of tinsels and shimmers is interesting as well as grabbing old CB holiday dragons.

Having recolours of existing dragons, ultra rares like GoNs, exclusives and re-releases of old dragons, I do not like.

GoNs work fine as they are, however fustrating and rare they might be I do not support being able to buy them.

I don't support recolours because it's unfair to sprite collectores who dose not want to play the minigame and collect points. Unless ofcourse these recolours were able to breed offspring of their own colour, then I might support it, but it still seems a bit off to me, no matter how you put it.

Exclusives I do not like because this is more like a supplement for the cave and new releases should always happend in the cave in my opinion. Same with re-releases (if they were to happend) they should have priority in the cave.

 

Edit: The idea of passively earning points from doing simple things like trading, grabbing and raising eggs from the cave/AP is interesting too. I like it smile.gif

 

Sorry for any mistakes in my gramma and/or punctuation ^^,

 

And.. I think that's me out ninja.gif

Edited by Phenri

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