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Alse15

Stronger Anti-Harassment System

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As the title states it's high time to implement a bigger, better anti-harassment system. As it stands, right now you're options are flagging a post or contacting a Mod. And getting a mod involved is kind of like a slap on the wrist. And if you're a prize owner or even a Mod, you can't take the mass swarms of PMs or talk to someone about every single person who just won't leave you alone.

 

So I think the following changes should be implemented:

 

- A way to flag PMs. At this point in time you can only flag posts made on the forum as against the rules. If someone messages you with something outside forum content your only option is to either block them or report them directly to a Mod.

 

- "This user is not currently accepting PMs". This being a little check box any user can use at their discretion. Are you a forum celebrity of any kind? Do you have an awesome rare thing on your scroll that people keep messaging you about? Is your inbox filling up with unwanted mail? If yes, check this pretty little box and people will be unable to send you PMs.

- If this is added, I recommend added a "white list" people can make for their friends and trusted trades. This way it would not completely cut off communication among the forums.

 

- One-time user flag. Meaning a user can personally flag a user once per lifetime. Viewable to Mods only. One flag should be overlooked for petty arguments/discrepancies in trade. After an (x) amount of users flag one person, Mods are notified to investigate and take action.

 

- Bigger punishments. Right now harassing someone on the forums is a bit of a slap on the wrist and a "don't do this again". Taking inspiration from things I've seen with other games, there needs to be a step system. Because right now the risk vs reward is skewed. Put their forum privileges at risk. Put their scroll at risk. Make it so they can't use their magi BSA for x amount of time. Just something to make people second guess themselves when they think about pming someone for the 34th time asking for the same trade.

 

 

NOTE:

A lot of these suggestions are purposefully more clinical because not a lot of people (especially on DC) have the confidence to approach a Mod with their problems. Be it because they don't want to be a burden, they don't want to make their situation worse or legitimate anxiety disorders; this is not a safe way for the harasee to protect themselves.

 

I would like to see other user feedback and suggestions with this.

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Its called a PM Buddies / Block list. You add someone to the block list and they can't PM you any more.

 

And if you don't want to receive any PMs at all? Simplicity itself: PM yourself a few hundred times to fill your inbox and you'll never get another PM again.

 

So, I really don't feel we need any stronger system than what's already in place. People just need to start utilizing what's already there.

 

Cheers!

C4.

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I think this is heading in the right direction, though I don't feel I know the situation well enough to say whether it goes far enough or too far.

 

I think the major problem you'll run into is that most of these suggestions are for board features, and board features aren't usually something the board's owner(s), admin(s), mods etc can change. IP board would have to implement these things.

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First of all, what do you exactly intend by harassment?

Because the only official thread I found about the subject states:

Recently we have witnessed and heard of several instances where users were being harassed in regards to breeding and trades. A user has the right to deny any breeding or trading request; if they say no or decline your offer do not continue to pester them to accept. This behavior can be considered harassment and may lead to moderators' intervention. Please take the time to consider before requesting eggs; if the owner does not wish to breed/trade there could be consequences for continued asking.

 

If you feel you are being harassed by another user, it is also within your rights to contact a moderator to see to the situation. We encourage you to seek assistance if the problem should arise.

 

Some examples of what is viewed as harassment:

 

-Continually PMing a user and begging them to breed/trade after they have clearly stated no or have made it clear they are not accepting requests.

-Making attempts to forcefully demand a certain breeding or trade from a user.

 

Are you including also harassment in the forums, for example when people are called "whiners", "greedy", "demanding" etc. etc.?

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I think the major problem you'll run into is that most of these suggestions are for board features, and board features aren't usually something the board's owner(s), admin(s), mods etc can change. IP board would have to implement these things.

Not necessarily. For free boards hosted by forum hosting places yes definitely, but I'm 99% sure TJ's not using such a service, but has the board installed on a server with a regular website host (or even on the DC server itself, I can't really recall the details). This means TJ has access to the board code and with his coding talents and knowledge, I'm pretty sure he's able to implement quite a few things - the problem is time, I'm guessing. He's working his arse off to get the site updated to what he showed a while ago, and there's a million and more things the userbase also wants once he's done with that.

 

In other words, it comes down to what TJ feels has priority.

 

(Note: the above is deduced purely from things TJ has posted on the forum and what he seems to be able to do. I don't know him so there's of course a chance I'm wrong xd.png)

 

Anyway, I like the idea of being able to turn off the ability to receive PMs. With a whitelist, and some people (mods, pretty much) permanently whitelisted.

 

I'm actually somewhat surprised it's not already possible to report PMs. I know it's a feature on other forums, but that's probably using different software smile.gif

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Harassment includes all forms of harassment. Be it from trade harassment, to personal harassment (example: bullying). Any unwanted contact or communication. Anything that makes someone feel uncomfortable because someone is stepping in their boundaries.

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Harassment includes all forms of harassment. Be it from trade harassment, to personal harassment (example: bullying). Any unwanted contact or communication. Anything that makes someone feel uncomfortable because someone is stepping in their boundaries.

Oh my... the mods will be VERY busy...

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While I think the ability to report a PM just as we can now with posts would be helpful I don't think we need anything else. If I feel I'm being harassed by another user I simply forward the PM to a mod with a note from me why I'm sending it. Being able to report it would mean all the mods would see it and not just the one I forwarded it to. That way action wouldn't have to wait until that particular mod has time to deal with things.

 

For the rest, I think sufficient measures are in place as long as people actually use them.

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I definitely think that we need something about harassment. While a long-lasting system would work, I would definitely appreciate something about harassment in the raffle posts, as a lot of Prize owners have trouble with harassment, especially at first.

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Harassment includes all forms of harassment. Be it from trade harassment, to personal harassment (example: bullying). Any unwanted contact or communication. Anything that makes someone feel uncomfortable because someone is stepping in their boundaries.

The thing is that different people have different boundaries and some people are easier to offend than others. Some of them can feel offended by misinterpreting other's intentions or messages, even the polite ones.

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While I think the ability to report a PM just as we can now with posts would be helpful I don't think we need anything else. If I feel I'm being harassed by another user I simply forward the PM to a mod with a note from me why I'm sending it. Being able to report it would mean all the mods would see it and not just the one I forwarded it to. That way action wouldn't have to wait until that particular mod has time to deal with things.

 

For the rest, I think sufficient measures are in place as long as people actually use them.

I agree (I've never actually gone as far as reporting a PM, though I have been sorely tempted once or twice).

 

Also, I don't believe it is possible for sanctions to be applied to a reported forum-goer's scroll, since forum and scroll accounts are completely separate.

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Harassment includes all forms of harassment. Be it from trade harassment, to personal harassment (example: bullying). Any unwanted contact or communication. Anything that makes someone feel uncomfortable because someone is stepping in their boundaries.

Some people might take exception to being PMed at all.

 

Goodness, after these holidays, I contacted several people out of the blue asking for bloodswaps and the like after seeing them post in one of the threads in SD. (Most were happy to trade offspring, one PM was left unanswered.) The recipients of my PMs might have simply reported me for, well, contacting them because they might not have wanted to be contacted for a trade after all. blink.gif

 

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While I think the ability to report a PM just as we can now with posts would be helpful I don't think we need anything else. If I feel I'm being harassed by another user I simply forward the PM to a mod with a note from me why I'm sending it. Being able to report it would mean all the mods would see it and not just the one I forwarded it to. That way action wouldn't have to wait until that particular mod has time to deal with things.

 

For the rest, I think sufficient measures are in place as long as people actually use them.

^^This!

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Some people might take exception to being PMed at all.

 

Goodness, after these holidays, I contacted several people out of the blue asking for bloodswaps and the like after seeing them post in one of the threads in SD. (Most were happy to trade offspring, one PM was left unanswered.) The recipients of my PMs might have simply reported me for, well, contacting them because they might not have wanted to be contacted for a trade after all. blink.gif

I've done worst than that, I saw a messy lineage egg in the AP, saw part of the mess had a lineage I was desperately trying to find (Val 09 x Royal Blue), checked the scroll and followed the offspring / parents back to someone who had their scroll name showing who could breed said Royal Blue for me. I found them on the forum, and less than 8 hrs later I had the Royal Blue, and I was able to help them with something they needed, too.

 

From what I hear from what most Prize winners say, its not the content of most of the PMs, its the volume. And really, I listed two already existing methods you can use if you don't want to be contacted.

 

Cheers!

C4.

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We should have a Mod that handles member relations anyways. Flags should not go to any and all mods, but those assigned to handle that task. It's why every company has an HR department. And there should be punishment for people who send people in for review willy nilly.

 

When it comes to people not wanting to receive PMs they should have the right to turn it off. The system we have obviously isn't working and my ideas aren't fool proof but something does need to be done.

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Harassment includes all forms of harassment. Be it from trade harassment, to personal harassment (example: bullying). Any unwanted contact or communication. Anything that makes someone feel uncomfortable because someone is stepping in their boundaries.

(Emphasized with Bold)

Just a question: how are people supposed to know that contact or communication are unwanted unless that is expressed somewhere in the profile of the user they would want to contact?

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Our HR department is called moderators. The flags on posts don't go to all the mods, only the global mods and the mods for that section.

 

I believe the current system does work when users actually use it.

 

 

If people put something in their signature and/or profile that they don't want PMed over something, most people here respect that. If they don't respect it, the person has a right to report that PM by forwarding it to a mod.

Edited by Fiona BlueFire

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I think that what is in place seems to work well enough, imho. People can block other users and also report offensive or harassing pm's. Harassment, as in repetative 'begging' pm's or verbally offensive pm's. I think sending multiple pm's (more then one) 'asking' for something surely falls under harassment.

Edited by Dubious

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First of, ANY unsolicited message can always be seen as harassment.

Just because I do not have a "don't PM me sign" in my sig, doesn't mean everyone should expect an answer or think it's cool to just go on PMing.

 

What do you do if someone just calls you on your phone, out of the blue saying:

Good Day, we are with XYZ Relations and want to trade with you? Most likely, you'll hang up. If the do it again, depending on the country, you might be able to report them to an organization, or you'll just block them.

 

--

 

Our PM System on the Forums already HAS a block list. what else more do you need to be safe from people you don't want to chat with?

 

--

 

As for TJ implementing changes: He's said somewhere in the past, that he has no inclination to hack the boards for additional features, unless there is a high security risk. After all, its a source he has licensed from another company, so it's not like it's his own. (Making it both harder to change/understand and depending on the license used, maybe even illegal)

Edited by SockPuppet Strangler

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I support this.

 

I can't speak for the prize owners but I have had several Demands for other things. And while if asked nicely I would gladly help them out, but demanding I do something is a different beast entirely. It would also work well for people who reneged on IOU's after they received a trade. Even though i do keep a list, there is nothing stopping them from contacting me. (edit: yes there is, thank you whitebaron!!)

 

I personally do keep my messages box nearly full, but this would mean i could clean it out. The current meathod works, but seems rather silly that you have to do this just to stop people from bugging you. Or when it gets to full and you miss good offers.

 

The warning ping to a mod is good as well. I have had a person who asked very nicely for something they said they always wanted, then when i trade it to them for a few common hatchies because they said they have nothing of value/can't get anything else, I see them posting it for trade. Then a week later ask for another *for a friend*.

I have never PM'ed a mod for this as it seems rather petty. yeah they got me. But if the same person gets 10 pings and the mods inquire and find out this person has done this sort of thing to multiple people... then what?

Edited by tjsweepers

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(Emphasized with Bold)

Just a question: how are people supposed to know that contact or communication are unwanted unless that is expressed somewhere in the profile of the user they would want to contact?

those that do not want contact usually have it on their profile. I do. I still get contacted.

 

I have had situations where people ask "Does anyone have Alt Sweetlings"

 

I will respond "I do but I am not taking requests for breeding and trading"

I will still get some lugnut asking me to trade/breed even after my statement.

 

If there was an ability for a user to turn "is open to trade contact, is not open to trade contact" on the board, maybe.

 

As a moderator I get a sort of problem zone as I cannot really block members incase they are trying to contact me for IRC issues. Maybe a ban, or a problem connecting. I cannot close off contact. I usually choose to ignore and delete the uninvited trade requests. I won't dignify them with a response either way as it was in my signature and profile and even on my scroll.

 

I would like to see clarification as to what users need to do when they feel they are getting harassed.

 

I would like to see a request by the site to allow new winners to decide themselves if they should get contacted - through profile, signature and scroll.

 

I would like to see some sort of respect toward prize owners, Alt owners (spriter or otherwise, or owners of desirable lineages) from the user base in general.

 

I would like to see users understand that NO. Does not up the offer, or intensity or escalate the PM-s. Which happens

 

I would like to see Prize owners not feel compelled to buckle to the demands of users and do what what is right. (PMing a mod in those cases)

 

In a nutshell, I would like to see clarification. but some users really want each itty bitty senario of harassment outlined. Just because a situation is not outlined it does not mean this is acceptable.

 

I would like to see these actions of harassment, depending on severity, be dealt with in respect to severity and repeatability.

 

I will touch back on my thoughts a little later because my spouce currently has me entirely distracted with silly videos.

 

 

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First of, ANY unsolicited message can always be seen as harassment.

I can't help but feel that is a bit harsh. The pm system exists for people to communicate and that communication starts from one person contacting another. I have made a lot of friends by people out of the blue dropping me a pm. If we say that every 'unsolicited' pm is an harassment, it pretty much nullifies the entire system.

 

Surely sending one doesn't constitute harassment, but repeated pm's do. huh.gif

Edited by Dubious

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Harassment includes all forms of harassment. Be it from trade harassment, to personal harassment (example: bullying). Any unwanted contact or communication. Anything that makes someone feel uncomfortable because someone is stepping in their boundaries.

I don't really agree with this statement either. I don't feel harassed when someone sends me a polite PM out of the blue. If I have a note in my sig or profile saying I don't want to be PMed I still wouldn't feel harassed by a polite PM; I'd simply ignore the PM or send a quick, equally polite message back.

 

If then they keep PMing, I might feel harassed.

 

Similarly, I might feel harassed by a rude PM out of the blue. Such are the things I want to be able to report with a simple report system.

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I can't help but feel that is a bit harsh. The pm system exists to people to communicate and that communication starts from one person contacting another. I have made a lot of friends by people out of the blue dropping me a pm. If we say that every 'unsolicited' pm is an harassment, it pretty much nullifies the entire system.

 

Surely sending one doesn't constitute harassment, but repeated pm's do. huh.gif

This would fit the legal definition. Once is no crime. Twice after clear direction to stop starts heading towards murky waters. Otherwise people could be baited into a warning. PM Dubious for a free gold egg!

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Dubious, mostly I agree with you. However, if someone has something in their sig or profile that says don't PM that should be respected, and the tone of the initial PM could by itself be considered harassment. Depends on how things are put.

 

I've had harassing PMs. I have also had polite PMs from people asking if I'll breed something for them. Since I don't have anything telling people not to PM me I always answer them. If they're rude I answer back tersely and say no. If they persist I forward the PM to a mod and block them. If they're polite I answer politely, usually with "what are you offering in exchange?" I've never had an ongoing problem.

 

Of course, I don't have a CB prize either. But I do have spriter's alts.

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