ANSWERED:No Raffles

[Ashes The Second]

What about them ? If we keep getting new prizes every couple of years the effect will be just the same. I just wish it had started out that way, so we didn't have all the angst.

 

Your sterility thing would have the same effect but more so - as there'd be no chance to get ANY gens of those already out there. This way at least those who love raffles can have them, without all the "discussion" afterwards.

Why wish it if it wouldn't happen? Sterility wouldn't be bad if it was for /all/ prizes.

[angelicdragonpuppy]

Why wish it if it wouldn't happen? Sterility wouldn't be bad if it was for /all/ prizes.

No. No no no no more Frills / Old Pinks, please. As much as I want more low gen Shimmers about I would much rather have ANY than none. I'm sure most others agree with me!

[KageSora]

...funny how I couldn't spot anyone mentioning the Guardian of Natures in this thread, when saying how hard something is to obtain. *shot*

Probably because those are unbreedable and untradeable, so there is literally zero market for them because they're impossible to transfer between accounts.

 

To obtain one is a pain, yeah, but it's much easier to get Trios than it is to get 2nd gens from the prizes for the average player. After that, it's a matter of time and patience--not a matter of managing to acquire enough "wealth" to be able to "afford" one.

[626lavaheart]

:/ but really guys. The chances of winning are really too small for you to consider it a viable option for completing CB scrolls.

 

It's like getting struck by lightning. if you had no CB hollies, CB frills, CB pinks, or CB prize dragons.. You are more likely to die before you won them all...

 

The raffles really should not be seen as a way to get certain dragons but as a gift.

 

I feel like sterilizing them would drop the drama a tad... but really it's pretty much what everyone in this thread seems to be against. not getting 2nd gens.

 

also >.> I feel like all these threads should go back into one thread... there's too many suggestions floating around that don't work by themselves and should be combined imo...

 

[Wymsical]

:/ but really guys. The chances of winning are really too small for you to consider it a viable option for completing CB scrolls.

Well, you can't get CBs of old Holidays if you weren't around at the time of their release (barring Christmas dragons, and only if you win the raffle and decide you want one).

[Marrionetta]

:/ but really guys. The chances of winning are really too small for you to consider it a viable option for completing CB scrolls.

Adjust your goals. Don't campaign to tear down everything that complicates your goals, be adaptive.

[annageckos]

also >.> I feel like all these threads should go back into one thread... there's too many suggestions floating around that don't work by themselves and should be combined imo...

It was TJ himself that said to separate all these suggestions into their own topics, and it really doesn make it easier. That way everyone is mostly on the same page instead of talking about 15 different things.

 

For this suggestion, I am 100% against it. I like the raffle. I don't care if the chance of winning is low. If you were to pull it now it would cause more problems then it would 'solve'. I really don't think there are many problems with the raffle itself, maybe add a few more winners but otherwise it works. I do hate how the prizes have taken over the trading forums, but it's not a reason to nix the raffles. Nothing is perfect, and if you really hate all the drama just don't read those topics.

Edited February 11, 2014 by annageckos

[Jazeki]

 

It's like getting struck by lightning. if you had no CB hollies, CB frills, CB pinks, or CB prize dragons.. You are more likely to die before you won them all...

 

The raffles really should not be seen as a way to get certain dragons but as a gift.

 

If this were the case, I think some raffle winners that won twice would already be hypothetically "dead" since they won something more than an HM.

 

I don't see the reasoning behind thinking of winning a raffle as a gift rather than a way to get dragons. Isn't that exactly what the raffle does? Make CBs of some breeds obtainable that otherwise wouldn't be the case any other way? Even though I dislike parts of the raffle, it still gives me hope that I can maybe one day win a main prize or an HM like a CB hybrid.

 

Also, TJ is not gifting the dragons. There is a minimal level of participation involved. If I didn't participate and get my raffle ticket, then I wouldn't have a chance at getting an egg. It is generous of TJ to let people win X amount of dragons and choose codes (and breeds for HM), but it's not a gift. If it were a gift, then everyone would win and we wouldn't need these raffle improvement suggestions in the first place.

[solairehighwind]

I personally wouldn't care if the raffle stopped, but a lot of people seem to like it. (As the original post says, it's just been disappointment for me, although it's mainly only because of how special Prizes are and not because they're my favorite dragon types or anything.)

This may have been suggested already, but maybe for the raffle there could be "consolation prizes" with dragons that are hard to get in the wild like Dinos and Coppers or just uncommons like Nebulas; that way people might be disappointed that they didn't get a Prize Dragon but they'd still get something nice. That might be too much work, though; I don't know how websites work >_>

(Hm, is there a thread for "consolation prizes" for people who didn't get a Prize Dragon? That'd be fun but then again since winners have time to claim their prize people would probably say they had no Prize dragons and claim them after they got something from the thread. :-/ )

[dawdrkqueen]

I like playing the raffles. I loved building my snowfort. It was a nice way to spend time when I was egglocked.

 

I also enjoy playing the lottery.

 

I have not won either. But doesn't mean I wouldn't enjoy playing them.

 

My tinsels are no way CBs. They have messy lineages. And I caught them in the AP. But I still enjoy them. And am grateful for those original raffle winners who bred their prizes... which eventually led to the dragons I have on my scroll.

[626lavaheart]

oh well I loved building the snow fort too of course

As I stated in the OP we could focus more on fun events and minigames for the holiday season.

 

Jazeki

they haven't won all the prizes yet. just HM twice :/ and we haven't even had the raffle for 6 years... I didn't claim that winning twice would spell someone's doom. I simply meant no one is actually going to win every single prize. If someone does, then obviously the code is playing favorites lol.

 

lolahighwind

ya they are a viable and easy escape solution. >.> I hate the idea of "pity prizes" though.

 

Marrionetta

I'm confused do you mean like my scroll goals or the goals of this thread?

 

overall I feel like the goal of this thread is /not/ to end all prize dragons as we know it. Simply to do away with the raffle system.

 

 

 

[Marrionetta]

The raffle system favors no skill. The raffle system is blind to haves and have nots in terms of existing scroll wealth. The raffle system bestows on each entrant an equal chance at winning a prize dragon. The raffle system is anonymous and automated, and does not carry the potential for allegations of favoritism among elite or better-known users. The raffle system allows the forum-shy to be included in the prize pool. The raffle system redraws the economic pulse of the community by virtue of its randomness every year.

 

It's a pretty good deal, all things considered.

[Fuzzbucket]

The raffle system favors no skill. The raffle system is blind to haves and have nots in terms of existing scroll wealth. The raffle system bestows on each entrant an equal chance at winning a prize dragon. The raffle system is anonymous and automated, and does not carry the potential for allegations of favoritism among elite or better-known users. The raffle system allows the forum-shy to be included in the prize pool. The raffle system redraws the economic pulse of the community by virtue of its randomness every year.

 

It's a pretty good deal, all things considered.

Right on. But as so many people seem not to understand that it IS fair and that a prize is a prize, something only a few people will get, not something everyone is ENTITLED to, they aren't going to work terribly well here

[cyradis4]

Right on. But as so many people seem not to understand that it IS fair and that a prize is a prize, something only a few people will get, not something everyone is ENTITLED to, they aren't going to work terribly well here

I've seen very few people demanding CBs. I've seen precious few even demanding 2nd gens! Most people just want the 2nd gens more available so that more people can work with these 6 really beautiful sprites. I will gladly trade with 2nd gen owners, give them even gen mates so that I could get a 3rd even gen. I've done it too.

 

So I'm getting fed up with people saying that those who want to work with these sprites are "feeling entitled". They aren't, they just have a different way of playing the game from you. If people were demanding that 2nd gens become common, I might agree with you. Or uncommon! Or hell, be worth just one CB metal! But they aren't: they just want to have a snowflakes-chance-in-hell of trading for one, with multiple metals (equivalent of, say), in any given year. Right now? Can't do that.

 

Other than that, yea.... In theory the raffles are a good idea. I still have concerns which have not been addressed (they've been deleted with indecent haste) about the RNG used. Some of what happened this year to last was.... extremely improbable.

 

Cheers!

C4.

[Hisa]

I like the slight chance of winning a prize rather than no prize at all.

I don't see this idea in any way helping the situatuion, drama? just ignore it or don't use forums at all, you can get those shimmers from the AP then, there's no solution which will satisfy everyone 100%.

 

Why not just disable everyone from posting forums to not spread drama.

Lets disable thuweds from breeding too then since all you can get out of them are 2nd gens and people want them too and not everyone will get one ever?

And next thing lets stop holidays because you can only get a CB from those once a year and they are always different so people wouldn't be whining joining year later and complaining about not having a CB Rosebud?

[this is what I feel like future would be if this would be accepted]

 

I'm against this idea, it would just increase the interest towards 2nd gen ones.

Instead the more prize dragons are given the more there will be CB ones to breed 2nd gens, you may not be getting a CB one but lot more 2nd gens each year are avaible.

 

If people want to make drama let them make, unless you are on the forums specially for following the drama.

Drama you find in the other threads, if you stick to trading one you won't see the drama you just see the "WANT:" 2nd gen things and if you close your eyes you wont see those either.

 

ah true I forget that not everyone has the same opinion for addictive substances like I do.

you should go put those ideas in the more raffles thread. they fit more there.

 

This is probs out of topic but I can't recall why this part of you earlier posts bothers me a lot, are you telling all other people who don't agree with you to go instead to the "more raffles thread?" I feel like you are making more personal attacks on everyone who doesn't agree with you.

 

And yes I'm also wondering how this topic ain't closed yet, maybe we get another mass drama thread made?

[Fuzzbucket]

I've seen very few people demanding CBs. I've seen precious few even demanding 2nd gens! Most people just want the 2nd gens more available so that more people can work with these 6 really beautiful sprites. I will gladly trade with 2nd gen owners, give them even gen mates so that I could get a 3rd even gen. I've done it too.

 

So I'm getting fed up with people saying that those who want to work with these sprites are "feeling entitled". They aren't, they just have a different way of playing the game from you. If people were demanding that 2nd gens become common, I might agree with you. Or uncommon! Or hell, be worth just one CB metal! But they aren't: they just want to have a snowflakes-chance-in-hell of trading for one, with multiple metals (equivalent of, say), in any given year. Right now? Can't do that.

 

Other than that, yea.... In theory the raffles are a good idea. I still have concerns which have not been addressed (they've been deleted with indecent haste) about the RNG used. Some of what happened this year to last was.... extremely improbable.

 

Cheers!

C4.

No more improbable than that guy who has been struck by lightning SEVEN time - no RNG used there !

 

And no, I know people aren't demanding CBs in this thread - but there is another thread asking for them to be released in cave after x years, because it isn't fair if everyone hasn't access to CBs in the end. I'm for the multiclutch option myself, but I'd rather see no more raffles at all - or at least not with exclusive prizes !

[Firebirdwyvern]

Wait! what about the people who don't use the forum? We need to think about those people who probably can't have a forum account or really just don't want one.

 

The Raffle is done on forum, so they have little choice more or less if they want to know their luck. I think I'm one of the few people who seem to think about those members and it's not fair they often get at disadvantage because of things they might not be able to control (which is why I want Release Events in cave that can annouce the new eggs or maybe other events, like when Holidays can breed).

 

We need to think about those people too!

 

Maybe something can be worked out...the Frills aren't obtained anywhere unless by Raffle, maybe something can be worked out so they will not longer be just for prizes (I grown fond of the breed and wish they were still being released).

Edited February 11, 2014 by Firebirdwyvern

[cyradis4]

No more improbable than that guy who has been struck by lightning SEVEN time - no RNG used there !

 

And no, I know people aren't demanding CBs in this thread - but there is another thread asking for them to be released in cave after x years, because it isn't fair if everyone hasn't access to CBs in the end. I'm for the multiclutch option myself, but I'd rather see no more raffles at all - or at least not with exclusive prizes !

Total world population: 7.143 billion. Or.... 7,143,000,000

Odds of getting hit by lighting: 1 in 300,000.

Total number of people who have ever lived: estimated as 107 billion, or 107,000,000,000

Average lifespan of a human: somewhere between 60 and 80 years

 

With that many people in the world, the odds aren't bad for there to be some people who are hit multiple times. Actually they are quite good that somewhere in history, someone will get hit multiple times. And given how rare said event is, it of course would be well remembered. People don't remember things that happen all the time. But something that has never happened before does tend to get remembered.

 

As for the other thread, some people are asking for that reason, but for the most part what I've been seeing is people trying to find some way, anyway, to help with the problem, and they just came up with a less than optimal solution. That doesn't mean that everyone who wants it is "entitled" or "greedy". Only that they see a problem and want to fix it, but have come up with a less than optimum way to do it. History is replete with "solutions" which were put into place with the best of intentions and instead made the situation worst. So don't assume that there is a less-than-savory motive involved. Hanlon's Razor says: "Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity." The US government has done many such things. They've also done many things because of malice. Such is life. They should post that saying on the wall!

 

Which.... is how I see this thread. They are trying, with the best of intentions, to fix the problem... but would in the end make it worst.

 

Cheers!

C4.

Edited February 11, 2014 by cyradis4

[Fuzzbucket]

Wait! what about the people who don't use the forum? We need to think about those people who probably can't have a forum account or really just don't want one.

 

The Raffle is done on forum, so they have little choice more or less if they want to know their luck. I think I'm one of the few people who seem to think about those members and it's not fair they often get at disadvantage because of things they might not be able to control (which is why I want Release Events in cave that can annouce the new eggs or maybe other events, like when Holidays can breed).

 

We need to think about those people too!

 

Maybe something can be worked out...the Frills aren't obtained anywhere unless by Raffle, maybe something can be worked out so they will not longer be just for prizes (I grown fond of the breed and wish they were still being released).

The raffle is actually on scroll- you went to the fort and the announcement was there. In my view that's how all DC events should be.

 

@ cyradis:

 

Which.... is how I see this thread. They are trying, with the best of intentions, to fix the problem... but would in the end make it worst.

I agree in many ways. But all I meant about the guy struck by lightning was that it is NOT in any way suspicious if people win more than once, or you hit two in the same household.

[626lavaheart]

Which.... is how I see this thread. They are trying, with the best of intentions, to fix the problem... but would in the end make it worst.

lol I'm known for that You should see me in arts channel. You have to probe possibilities though man even if they could be the worst idea in the world.

 

marri

true that. in one hand it is nicely fair, fairer than the contest was in some ways. but the other In the other hand It probably frustrates a lot of people that CB prizes are going to people who get bored with DC quickly and leave. although that doesn't concern us what people do with their prizes lol.

 

FBW

ya it's harsh on all of us. But Lythiaren had their reasons.

 

Hisa

ya I was mostly trying to make sure people didn't get off topic ^^; sorry that my lame hinting and attempts at it annoyed you.

also I feel you're being a tad dramatic. There's a very good chance at getting on TJ's list and it's year round. CB holidays should be seen as a reward to people who have been here longer. I won't deny that if this suggestion (with no other ones to counterbalance) was implemented all hell would break loose and 2nd gens would get rarer.

 

also ya. :l the winning twice in such a short amount of time... just felt extremely improbable... I feel bad for them though. They're skiing on thin ice from the code favoring them for random reasons. I'd hate to be them really even if It meant being able to make PBs... I myself would of lotto'd the CB... or given it to a friend... just to not deal with it lol.

[Marrionetta]

Can anyone suggest an objectively fairer prize dragon distribution method than a raffle?

[cyradis4]

Can anyone suggest an objectively fairer prize dragon distribution method than a raffle?

Not me. I personally think the best way to hand the current problem is two-fold:

 

- Increase CB and 2nd gen Prize breeding rates, so the 2nd gens and 3rd gens spread further, faster. They will always be slow than the higher gens, but right now its pretty glacial.

 

- Keep the same prize breeds for a few more years, to boost the current population. There really aren't that many CBs, and we loose a few more every year as people come and go from the game. So... If we don't want them pulling a dodo on us.... The CB numbers need to keep increasing. Part of the problem with the prizes is that there are three colors of each sprite, and people use them as if they were different breeds (I view them as different breeds). If there was only one color Prize for each breed, then the 2nd gens would have spread a lot further, a lot faster.

 

As for the rest.... I'm thinking on the idea you have, of some sort of in-cave games that can earn prizes that are less. I think its a good idea, if implemented properly.

 

Cheers!

C4.

Edited February 11, 2014 by cyradis4

[Fuzzbucket]

Can anyone suggest an objectively fairer prize dragon distribution method than a raffle?

I'd like to know that too.

As for the rest.... I'm thinking on the idea you have, of some sort of in-cave games that can earn prizes that are less. I think its a good idea, if implemented properly.

But please not to get exclusive dragons - unless CB hybrids and other HM prizes. Many players have a life, and simply have not the time to add games in order to collect all the sprites...

Edited February 11, 2014 by fuzzbucket

[DarkEternity]

Objectively: adding a single untradeable gold prize egg to every scroll in existence

 

It's not happening period, though. (It shouldn't happen)

Edited February 11, 2014 by DarkEternity

[LibbyLishly]

As for the other thread, some people are asking for that reason, but for the most part what I've been seeing is people trying to find some way, anyway, to help with the problem, and they just came up with a less than optimal solution. That doesn't mean that everyone who wants it is "entitled" or "greedy". Only that they see a problem and want to fix it, but have come up with a less than optimum way to do it. History is replete with "solutions" which were put into place with the best of intentions and instead made the situation worst. So don't assume that there is a less-than-savory motive involved. Hanlon's Razor says: "Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity." The US government has done many such things. They've also done many things because of malice. Such is life. They should post that saying on the wall!

 

Which.... is how I see this thread. They are trying, with the best of intentions, to fix the problem... but would in the end make it worst.

 

Cheers!

C4.

Basically this.

 

While I definitely see the appeal of removing an event that seems to cause so much drama, at this point, I feel very strongly that it would just make things worse. Several people have already pointed out that Tinsels and Shimmers would likely go the way Hollies had before this last year - almost impossible to get any decent lineage without paying an arm and a leg, and you were lucky to get your hands on a messy, inbred disaster of a lineage just to have the sprite. The raffle was actually among the ways that Hollies made a comeback, since (correct me if I'm wrong) many people chose a Holly as their HM prize. Removing the raffle won't remove drama. It will just create more hard feelings towards the people who won while the raffle existed, and drive up the prices of good lineaged Tinsels and Shimmers, which are already high enough.

 

For myself, even though I know there is pretty much no chance that I'll ever win a raffle prize, I'm okay with that. I'll happily watch people getting them every year and trading for as low-gen offspring as I can (this is also why I support the suggestion to not add any new prize dragons). I don't see why other people's drama should prevent me from ever having a chance at winning one of those prizes, or why it should prevent any of us - including the people who unexpectedly won for the second time (good for them!) - from enjoying the raffle event and holding that 'lottery ticket' to see if we've won on the big day.