Spell Scrolls

[RainDear]

After a lot of thought and self-debate I opted to open this idea in its own thread, and give the mods the option of merging it with the other unfreeze thread if it is deemed appropriate.

 

The reasons I chose to open a separate thread:

1. This idea could be used for other things than unfreezing.

2. The unfreeze option is getting very refined in the attempt to quell all possible objections.

3. I feel this option is enough different to warrant its own thread.

 

Now, the Idea:

 

What if we could find "Spell Scrolls" in cave? The text could be something like: "You see a "Spell Scroll" among the eggs." They could fall as commonly or rarely as TJ sees fit.

 

The spells could include "Unfreeze", but would not necessarily be limited to "Unfreeze".

 

With this idea, there is much less concern about abuse of the action, because there it would be difficult for one person to catch enough scrolls to do any real abuse of the action, at least in my opinion.

 

The scrolls could be tradeable, abandonable, and/or they could "run out of time" in 7 days, like eggs do if unused. Alternatively, spell scroll stays on scroll til use.

 

Could either be one scroll can be used for any one of several spells- or each scroll is used for one specific spell.

 

Any thoughts?

 

Other uses:

 

From SockPuppet Strangler:

 

My ideas for other things they could do:

-Influence/incubate/fertility/teleport(?) - maybe a new user who doesn't have a BSA dragon or a user who doesn't have enough BSA dragons will be lucky enough to pick one of these up and use it. New user with one pink who managed to grab a second pink but just has to hope it genders right - perhaps they'll find a spell scroll and not have to worry.

-Perhaps this is a way to introduce a hatchling incubate - we'll just use magic to further the hatchling along. (Can only be used on hatchlings that weren't incubated as eggs due to the chance of sickness or something? Perhaps only takes off 12 hours? Or it can work on whichever dragon for 24 hours. Depending on how common spell scrolls are, maybe.)

-Heal sickness in a growing dragon/protect it from death. (Protects it until it hatches or has matured? Or protects it for 12 hours and if after that it still has too many views it could still get sick and die.)

-Give eggs/hatchlings one more day. Perhaps for new users who are still getting a hang of the game and they haven't gotten enough views yet and don't know about fansites.

 

Another idea from me:

 

-Scroll name change. A way to get this ability TJ has said he is working on.

 

DragonLady86

 

*Unfreezing: I would use it if added, but I can live without it.

-Freezing eggs: does this get rid of the "what happens to the hatchling inside" argument? I do want to collect eggs, but not sure how the spell would implement this.

*BSA spells: great for Newbies or others that haven't collected those dragons. and doesn't hurt those who have the dragons already.

*hatchling incubate: comes down to rp mechanics again.

*Scroll name change: TJ has said he is working on a way for users to do this themselves, so if it can be coded to this, then great.

-ascension: is that still a maybe future thing? or did it die?

-Ungender/gender: this was in the should freezing be permanent thread? Some individuals wanted only to take S1 to S2 hatchies and others suggested going the other way. If it can be done, I see no reason a spell couldn't take a frozen hatchling to a different state.

-Youthen: Something I suggested as a BSA a long time ago. unfortunately the only dragon that made sense was the Time dragon which never made it off the completed list and was later axed. But the ability to take an adult back to a gendered FROZEN hatchling would be very nice. (I've had over 50 dragons grow up while waiting for them to gender on me. I've gotten better over the years but it is still annoying as heck) and yes, auto frozen so they can't be traded is must. (just like unfreeze needs to auto grow up)

 

Stars indicate repeated suggestion. Dashes indicate start of suggestion.

Edited February 11, 2014 by raindear

[angelicdragonpuppy]

If they could be traded I could see people charging high prices for them, unless they were very common. Right now I prefer the general unfreezing idea; did you have other uses for this in mind? If so my opinion might change, but overall I think standard actions and BSAs are the best way to go.

[RainDear]

I have no objection to making them untradeable, though it seemed like a good idea for people who catch them and have no use for them. I have no other uses in mind though I did think there would be other uses that people would see for them.

 

If there are enough rejections of the idea, I will have no problem closing this thread and forgetting the whole thing. It was just a passing idea.

[Fuzzbucket]

I can't see why they shouldn't be tradeable. It seems like a reasonable idea, and a lot less complicated than all the suggested conditions in the unfreeze threads.

[angelicdragonpuppy]

I can't see why they shouldn't be tradeable. It seems like a reasonable idea, and a lot less complicated than all the suggested conditions in the unfreeze threads.

Again, it depends on how common they are. If they're common as dirt, sure. But if they're anything less, the people who already rule the trade markets can now obtain a lot of control over how others simply use their scrolls as well. I'd be ticked if an unfreezing option was added, but I had to pay someone to be able to do so because I couldn't catch the darn things myself.

 

I also don't think the unfreezing idea is half as complex as you think. Current idea is unfreezing happens only after a year, one month scroll wide cooldown, instant adults. Hardly rocket science. Indeed, those same conditions would likely have to exist even here as well, unless you want people amassing frozen Holidays only to unfreeze them all a month later, or extortionists charging massive prices for CB Halloweens to those who missed them...

Edited February 9, 2014 by angelicdragonpuppy

[Renorei]

I support this idea, although I think we need to think of a few more things besides just unfreezing that these scrolls could do.

 

It's true that if they are trade-able, some people will try to "charge" a lot for them. But I don't agree that that's necessarily a bad thing. If someone wants to pay that price and can "afford" to, they will. If someone doesn't or can't afford it, they won't. I don't think it's a big deal one way or the other if they are trade-able, but I'm leaning towards thinking they should be so if someone grabs one and has no use for it, they can at least do something with it.

 

Overall I think it's a fun idea and would add to the game.

[Obscure_Trash]

Hm, this is a pretty neat idea. I'm on the fence about trading or not trading because there are pros and cons both ways. At the very least, I'd like the to be giftable, so I guess overall, I would say yes to trading. (And some ideas might not be useful for everyone, so trading would be nice.)

 

My ideas for other things they could do:

-Influence/incubate/fertility/teleport(?) - maybe a new user who doesn't have a BSA dragon or a user who doesn't have enough BSA dragons will be lucky enough to pick one of these up and use it. New user with one pink who managed to grab a second pink but just has to hope it genders right - perhaps they'll find a spell scroll and not have to worry.

-Perhaps this is a way to introduce a hatchling incubate - we'll just use magic to further the hatchling along. (Can only be used on hatchlings that weren't incubated as eggs due to the chance of sickness or something? Perhaps only takes off 12 hours? Or it can work on whichever dragon for 24 hours. Depending on how common spell scrolls are, maybe.)

-Heal sickness in a growing dragon/protect it from death. (Protects it until it hatches or has matured? Or protects it for 12 hours and if after that it still has too many views it could still get sick and die.)

-Give eggs/hatchlings one more day. Perhaps for new users who are still getting a hang of the game and they haven't gotten enough views yet and don't know about fansites.

 

I'm sure we could come up with some more cool stuff, too. o3o

[RainDear]

Thanks for the ideas Socky, added to the OP. Great ideas, too.

 

If there are enough different uses, they will drop more commonly I would expect.

[Fuzzbucket]

Again, it depends on how common they are. If they're common as dirt, sure. But if they're anything less, the people who already rule the trade markets can now obtain a lot of control over how others simply use their scrolls as well. I'd be ticked if an unfreezing option was added, but I had to pay someone to be able to do so because I couldn't catch the darn things myself.

It would be no worse than the (ugh) trade value of metallics etc.

[angelicdragonpuppy]

I guess my other big issue with the idea is: isn't this what BSAs are for? Obviously BSAs don't fit every situation (unless we get more magically inclined dragons), but it seems like suggesting scroll spells would take away ideas from the BSA section. Any useful BSA (read: not earthquake) almost invariably makes the breed holding it more popular, even if people aren't overly fond of the sprite. So I'd rather see more dragons getting useful actions than pieces of paper.

 

@Fuzz: not being able to do an action on my dragons is different from not being able to get a new dragon. Plus, high gen metals aren't all that pricey, whereas with this there'd be no such sliding scale of availability. (Unless you made varieties of the same items with better / worse odds of success, I guess)

Edited February 9, 2014 by angelicdragonpuppy

[cyradis4]

I like the general mechanic, but not for freezing if its the only way to unfreeze. I can see how the scrolls would end up with the super fast clickers, who'd then charge an arm and a leg for them.

 

As another way to do a Dragon BSA or other (limited) scroll action, I support. Just so long as there are other ways to do the same things, even if limited.

 

Would it be one scroll per use, or one scroll per action? Ie, like little trees, you can only have one, period.

 

Cheers!

C4.

[CNR4806]

Em no thanks. I think it's very enough that we have a connection speed competition in catching dragons.

 

Having action tokens that requires fast-catching or a mountain worth of trading power is overdoing it.

Edited February 9, 2014 by CNR4806

[RainDear]

This is my opinion, just my opinion. I do not presume to speak for anyone else.

 

The inflated prices some perceive for low gen Prizes or other dragons is largely user driven/perceived. Most of the "outrageous prices" I have seen on the trade threads are offers made for Prize offspring as opposed to prices asked by prize holders for their eggs. I seldom actually see Prize offspring up for trade. I expect that most CB Prize owners have their own gift lists, or have made arrangements by pm that make it impossible for them to be offering on trade threads until their "obligations" have been met. I don't have a CB Prize, but I do know that if I had one, the gifts I would want to make would keep me very busy even without a lot of pmed requests for a fairly long time indeed. Prizes are only as difficult to get/expensive as they are because so many want them while so few have them. This is no reason to presuppose what the market will be for Spell Scrolls.

 

Nothing is preventing you if you catch a scroll of unfreeze from offering it up for a bred dragon of your choosing or a different scroll, dropping it in the community notice thread, or asking a CB Gold for it. If you want a scroll of unfreeze nothing prevents you from offering anything you like to get one. Different people will ask or accept different things for anything in cave. Many people when they see someone who wants something whether in the trading threads, the help forum or elsewhere will breed or gift if they can. I got a CB Silver and one of the bred Vals I was looking for as generous gifts from kind strangers who had seen my wish list or posts I had made. Other players often trade CB Golds for common eggs/hatchlings or give them outright to others. Don't presuppose the same won't/can't happen with spell scrolls.

[cyradis4]

This is my opinion, just my opinion. I do not presume to speak for anyone else.

 

The inflated prices some perceive for low gen Prizes or other dragons is largely user driven/perceived. Most of the "outrageous prices" I have seen on the trade threads are offers made for Prize offspring as opposed to prices asked by prize holders for their eggs. I seldom actually see Prize offspring up for trade. I expect that most CB Prize owners have their own gift lists, or have made arrangements by pm that make it impossible for them to be offering on trade threads until their "obligations" have been met. I don't have a CB Prize, but I do know that if I had one, the gifts I would want to make would keep me very busy even without a lot of pmed requests for a fairly long time indeed. Prizes are only as difficult to get/expensive as they are because so many want them while so few have them. This is no reason to presuppose what the market will be for Spell Scrolls.

 

Nothing is preventing you if you catch a scroll of unfreeze from offering it up for a bred dragon of your choosing or a different scroll, dropping it in the community notice thread, or asking a CB Gold for it. If you want a scroll of unfreeze nothing prevents you from offering anything you like to get one. Different people will ask or accept different things for anything in cave. Many people when they see someone who wants something whether in the trading threads, the help forum or elsewhere will breed or gift if they can. I got a CB Silver and one of the bred Vals I was looking for as generous gifts from kind strangers who had seen my wish list or posts I had made. Other players often trade CB Golds for common eggs/hatchlings or give them outright to others. Don't presuppose the same won't/can't happen with spell scrolls.

This depends on the scrolls dropping on a regular basis. If they were more common than Trios, I'd buy that. But really, I've rarely ever seen CB Golds going for hatchies. Granted that might be because most seem to be tied up in people asking for 2nd gen Prizes, but....

 

So yea. It depends on how common these drop.

 

C4.

[angelicdragonpuppy]

You are right that we can't know for certain, and that even rare things sometimes go cheaply or for free.

 

However, the fact that low supply and high demand usually create high prices is not to be ignored. Occasional exceptions to a rule don't mean the situation is balanced.

 

That's why I'd rather they be very common or not exist at all. And I still hope new ideas are generally used as BSAs instead of this (Last but not least--unless there were limits on their use, much like has been suggested in the other thread, unfreezing could quickly be abused in all the ways people have feared it might be).

[Thuban]

Random scrolls, cb stripe levels of dropping. They are an uncommon that can swing both directions.. and scrolls would be good in that range

 

Scrolls would be great for those BSA's people want, that we dont have dragons for yet (or for those cases where dragons ARE made for those BSA's but arent getting released for one reason or other...).

[Amazon_warrior]

This is an interesting idea. What if the scroll was a "pool" of magic that could be used for any of those actions (you get a choice of available actions you can use the scroll for) and you can never have more than one at a time? That way, no one can hoard them and you don't have the frustration of hunting endlessly for one type when you really need another...

[Fuzzbucket]

This is an interesting idea. What if the scroll was a "pool" of magic that could be used for any of those actions (you get a choice of available actions you can use the scroll for) and you can never have more than one at a time? That way, no one can hoard them and you don't have the frustration of hunting endlessly for one type when you really need another...

Yeah. I like. And as for the rest - we don't give up hunting for CB golds - what's SO different about hunting for magic ? I suspect it wouldn't command as high a price simply because a CB gold is permanent, a magic is only for 7 days.

[Amazon_warrior]

Yeah. I like. And as for the rest - we don't give up hunting for CB golds - what's SO different about hunting for magic ? I suspect it wouldn't command as high a price simply because a CB gold is permanent, a magic is only for 7 days.

Actually, if they worked as I outlined I don't think it'd be a problem if they had an unlimited lifespan....

[Fuzzbucket]

Actually, if they worked as I outlined I don't think it'd be a problem if they had an unlimited lifespan....

I must have missed something - I would think the spell can only be used once ?

[cyradis4]

I'd prefer unlimited lifetime until used....

 

Cheers!

C4.

[Amazon_warrior]

I must have missed something - I would think the spell can only be used once ?

Oh yes. When used, the scroll would expire and you'd have to get a new one. But each scroll would have an unlimited lifespan until used, it wouldn't just evaporate after 7d.

[Kojayo]

I wish so much for a way to change my scroll name. I think the idea of a spell scroll is refreshing and different.

Edited February 9, 2014 by Kojayo55

[Fuzzbucket]

I wish so much for a way to change my scroll name. I think the idea of a spell scroll is refreshing and different.

Awesome spell possibility, that one !

[Imzadi]

I could see it being kind of like a leetle tree. It won't expire, but you can only have one at a time. No hoarding, no collecting a bunch to get rare stuff etc. Once used, it is gone, and you have to get another.

Edited February 9, 2014 by ainisarie