ANSWERED:Multi clutch for Prize dragons?

[AnanoKimi]

What IF you got to pick the code... but that you didn't KNOW what breed the eggies were until you picked?

Nuuuuuuuu please no. If someone is looking to keep a specific egg from their breeding but are basically given a blind grab at one of the produced eggs then that would just be awful

[Amazon_warrior]

What IF you got to pick the code... but that you didn't KNOW what breed the eggies were until you picked?

Ugh, No thank you. (Regardless of what breeds the parents were; if I'm trying for a Blusang from Blacktip, I'd like to know whether I actually got the egg I was looking for!)

[JavaTigress]

Just a thought.

 

Maybe there were good reasons TJ ecided to do away with multiclutches with the exception of for Holidays.

 

Seems like they have the potential to cause drama.

[AnanoKimi]

Just a thought.

 

Maybe there were good reasons TJ ecided to do away with multiclutches with the exception of for Holidays.

 

Seems like they have the potential to cause drama.

I think it might have been done originally because of the whole if the AP got too ful it would block the cave thing. If people kept breeding dragons that could multi clutch with a quickly growing userbase we would be forced to pick only from the AP. I think arpund the same time the AP blocking the cave thing was removed the feature that allowed all dragons to multi clutch was removed.

[Fuzzbucket]

What IF you got to pick the code... but that you didn't KNOW what breed the eggies were until you picked?

 

Ouch !

[JavaTigress]

 

Ouch !

yeah. That was other people's thoughts too.

 

So... not such a good idea.

Don't worry, I can accept that.

 

I begin to think that somehow or other, this just can't please everyone.

I mean, HOW to satisfy both those that want absolute control over their dragons' eggies and those that would like more variety in the AP...

 

Maybe the thing IS that all the good eggs get grabbed fromt he AP quickly as it is, leaving the ones that no one really wants?

 

 

[AnanoKimi]

yeah. That was other people's thoughts too.

 

So... not such a good idea.

Don't worry, I can accept that.

 

I begin to think that somehow or other, this just can't please everyone.

I mean, HOW to satisfy both those that want absolute control over their dragons' eggies and those that would like more variety in the AP...

 

Maybe the thing IS that all the good eggs get grabbed fromt he AP quickly as it is, leaving the ones that no one really wants?

Bold

A compromise. I already stated that what red said semed a little excessive. If it could be done: Lets say the Multiclutch BSA is approved and implemented. If my Moonstone produces 4 eggs (All moonstone eggs) when bred with her white dragon partner, I could have the chance to keep 2 eggs, and let the other two go to the AP.

 

Or my Moonstone produces 3 eggs (All moonstones) with her White dragon partner, I should be able to keep 1 and the rest go to the AP.

 

If she breed 2 eggs then one for me one for the AP

If she breeds One the one for me and thats it.

If she breeds none then no body gets one, better luck next time.

 

You see what I mean? If at max production it goes halvsies, then really I'm not keeping too much nor giving too little, its equal, two for me and two for the AP. Past that it reverts to one for me the rest for the AP.

 

Italics

That is also the reason we can't find good eggs in the cave. Those who are luckier and faster than the rest of us get all the good things and we're left with the rest until those start moving along and something nice pops up. Even then the faster one to notice and click get the rare eggs in that instance. Sadly thats how the game is.

Edited January 6, 2015 by AnanoKimi

[Syphoneira]

I think it might have been done originally because of the whole if the AP got too ful it would block the cave thing. If people kept breeding dragons that could multi clutch with a quickly growing userbase we would be forced to pick only from the AP. I think arpund the same time the AP blocking the cave thing was removed the feature that allowed all dragons to multi clutch was removed.

 

 

Actually, TJ created multi-clutching specifically in order to supply eggs to the community at a time when the AP was often empty.

 

Over time, the multi-clutches were no longer needed to supply the AP/community with eggs which were regularly Cave-available or possible to breed using Cave-available eggs only, and so were done away with, having by that point proved to be a problem, due to increased numbers of players breeding and abandoning sufficient eggs for the single-egg clutch to be plenty.

 

(At that point, AP Cave-Blocking also existed, and this was done away with as well, so that the present system is an incredibly massive improvement.)

 

The continuation of multi-clutches for Holidays was targeted specifically to ensure that the community continued to have access to bred past Holiday eggs which were otherwise not readily available except directly from owners.

 

Like the Raffles, the multi-clutch exists to randomly distribute eggs throughout the community.

[AnanoKimi]

 

Actually, TJ created multi-clutching specifically in order to supply eggs to the community at a time when the AP was often empty.

 

Over time, the multi-clutches were no longer needed to supply the AP/community with eggs which were regularly Cave-available or possible to breed using Cave-available eggs only, and so were done away with, having by that point proved to be a problem, due to increased numbers of players breeding and abandoning sufficient eggs for the single-egg clutch to be plenty.

 

(At that point, AP Cave-Blocking also existed, and this was done away with as well, so that the present system is an incredibly massive improvement.)

 

The continuation of multi-clutches for Holidays was targeted specifically to ensure that the community continued to have access to bred past Holiday eggs which were otherwise not readily available except directly from owners.

 

Like the Raffles, the multi-clutch exists to randomly distribute eggs throughout the community.

Yeah I knew they were connected, just wasnt sure how. As for that well I like sharing, I love being able to give some happiness from something I have to those who do not have it. But being demanded I should share is a different story. This is why I went from supporting this thread to supporting it as a BSA.

 

I'd like to think that some people see control over multi clutching like if one were an animal breeder in our reality. If I'm a dog breeder, I breed German shepherds, and my dog produces 5 offpsring, I have control over those offspring, where they go, if they are sold, if they are donated to agencies, or if they are gifted/sold to friends and family. In the end the breeding pair were my dogs. Now lets say something like this was implemented in our reality. This means that a limit would be placed on how many of my bred babies I could keep. After that, some random agency would choose for me what to do with the puppies I bred. Does that seem fair. Those puppies that agency took could very well end up in the street, dead, in some animal abusers hands, in the hands of some ignorant person who could starve that puppy into diseas, just as much as that puppy could end up alone in a shelter, in some loving child's hands, in the hands of another breeder, in the hands of an awful breeder, in the hands of an inexperienced breeder, I mean the possibilities are endless and I would have no say. My puppies could suffer, could be well taken care of, could die, could become someones puppy maker who would ensure they are healthy or not give to rats behinds what happened to them or the puppies they bred.

 

Its this sort of idea that bothers some people. How much opposition is there to freezing eggs because "It traps a hatchling in its shell and kills it." Maybe Prize owner X doesn't want the eggs they produce to go to someone who will use their baby for trading? Maybe Prize owner Y wants to ensure that those who receive their egg will continue the naming scheme or lineage style? What if Prize owner T wants to make sure his offspring are well taken care of by those they trust like friends and family? What if Prize owner A, like me, wants to give them away regardless of who as long as they are cared for? Just like a dog breeder should be allowed to ensure their puppies are going to specific people, we should be allowed to ensure that our eggs go to specific people as well.

 

This can be achieved by those who want specific control to breed without the use of a multi clutch BSA and those of us who want to donate our eggs at random to anyone in the community can use that multi clutch BSA to do so :3

[Ha-Ki]

Honestly, my biggest problem with this suggestion is singling out a breed to be able to multi-clutch, just because low generation offspring of the breed considered highly desirable to many users. I understand the reasons why it's being suggested just for the Prize dragons, but I'd really rather see an across-the-board multi-clutch option, even with all the troubles THAT could potentially bring. I'd even support a new breed who had the specific characteristic of producing multi-clutches anytime they bred. However, I don't feel like this is necessarily the best option to spread the Prize love.

Exactly my thoughts on the suggestion. And it's not only singling out a breed, but also only certain generations of it - a no-go in my opinion.

 

Also, I don't see a single reason that justifies incapacitating prize owners of deciding where their dragons' offspring goes while everyone else (including owners of 4th+ gen prize dragons, according to this suggestion) gets to control their dragons' offspring. How is that fair?

 

Adding a BSA that allows multiclutching for any breed, and can be either used or ignored by people, is perfectly fine. But changing the game mechanics for certain generations of a single breed just because there's high demand - no thanks.

[olympe]

Yeah I knew they were connected, just wasnt sure how. As for that well I like sharing, I love being able to give some happiness from something I have to those who do not have it. But being demanded I should share is a different story. This is why I went from supporting this thread to supporting it as a BSA.

 

*snip*

 

This can be achieved by those who want specific control to breed without the use of a multi clutch BSA and those of us who want to donate our eggs at random to anyone in the community can use that multi clutch BSA to do so :3

Ahem. DC is a game about pixel dragons. Not about breeding real living, breathing animals. There is a difference.

And I'm afraid that, to many players, a multi-clutch BSA would be too unwieldy to use every time. In order to gift an egg - and improve your chances of getting it in the first place - you'd need to use fertility on one parent, then the multi-clutch BSA, then teleport. If you want to keep the egg, you'd need influence instead of teleport. Plus maybe incubate... And each and every single BSA use means that you need to pick a dragon to use the BSA with, pick the target dragon (the prize dragon or its mate), enter your password... Three times for a single (succesful) breeding. More so if you also need to pick an egg. (Another click, password, click)

 

 

Exactly my thoughts on the suggestion. And it's not only singling out a breed, but also only certain generations of it - a no-go in my opinion.

That's what I said pages back. I don't see this happening for just certain generations of certain breeds. I can imagine it happening for just prize dragons - but independent of generation. The game has never distinguished between any kind of lineages - from CB to heavily inbred. I doubt it's going to happen now. However, prize dragons just might warrant as much of an exception as holiday dragons.

[Prince_Xanthius]

In order to gift an egg - and improve your chances of getting it in the first place - you'd need to use fertility on one parent, then the multi-clutch BSA, then teleport.

 

One of the BSAs (moonstone) currently being discussed actually has a scrollwide 'next 5 breedings' effect, that is stackable (so can do multiple moonstones at one time) to increase how many breedings are affected, precisely to get around the unweildiness of having to pick every time and so slowing down the breeding process.

[AnanoKimi]

Ahem. DC is a game about pixel dragons. Not about breeding real living, breathing animals. There is a difference.

And I'm afraid that, to many players, a multi-clutch BSA would be too unwieldy to use every time. In order to gift an egg - and improve your chances of getting it in the first place - you'd need to use fertility on one parent, then the multi-clutch BSA, then teleport. If you want to keep the egg, you'd need influence instead of teleport. Plus maybe incubate... And each and every single BSA use means that you need to pick a dragon to use the BSA with, pick the target dragon (the prize dragon or its mate), enter your password... Three times for a single (succesful) breeding. More so if you also need to pick an egg. (Another click, password, click)

 

 

That's what I said pages back. I don't see this happening for just certain generations of certain breeds. I can imagine it happening for just prize dragons - but independent of generation. The game has never distinguished between any kind of lineages - from CB to heavily inbred. I doubt it's going to happen now. However, prize dragons just might warrant as much of an exception as holiday dragons.

The bold part is what interests me because Prince_Xanthius addressed the rest.

 

Then explain to me why so many people are opposed to just freezing an egg with the 'hatchling' inside in fear of killing it? Why so many take an oath to name a dragon that has no real existance other than as information on the internet? Why so many people take the time and care to create lineages or adopts unwanted eggs so they dont die? Why people sit for minutes or hours putting together this story to a set of numbers with an image/

 

These dragons may not be alive, but people have given them life. On their scrolls, in their minds, these creatures feel, express, live. Thats why there are so many thread trying to get around killing an unborn hatchling, why there are threads where people can take an oath to name dragon that should have no meaning to them, why these topics exist.

 

That is why I said that in my mind people see breeding dragons like being a dog breeder. The similarities are there though they are not exactly the same.

 

They my not be alive but tell that to the cluster of users screaming "NO!" at the mention of just freezing an egg regardless of what happens to the hatchling inside.

Edited January 6, 2015 by AnanoKimi

[Syphoneira]

Yeah I knew they were connected, just wasnt sure how. As for that well I like sharing, I love being able to give some happiness from something I have to those who do not have it. But being demanded I should share is a different story. This is why I went from supporting this thread to supporting it as a BSA.

 

I'd like to think that some people see control over multi clutching like if one were an animal breeder in our reality. If I'm a dog breeder, I breed German shepherds,  and my dog produces 5 offpsring, I have control over those offspring, where they go, if they are sold, if they are donated to agencies, or if they are gifted/sold to friends and family. In the end the breeding pair were my dogs. Now lets say something like this was implemented in our reality. This means that a limit would be placed on how many of my bred babies I could keep. After that, some random agency would choose for me what to do with the puppies I bred. Does that seem fair. Those puppies that agency took could very well end up in the street, dead, in some animal abusers hands, in the hands of some ignorant person who could starve that puppy into diseas, just as much as that puppy could end up alone in a shelter, in some loving child's hands, in the hands of another breeder, in the hands of an awful breeder, in the hands of an inexperienced breeder, I mean the possibilities are endless and I would have no say. My puppies could suffer, could be well taken care of, could die, could become someones puppy maker who would ensure they are healthy or not give to rats behinds what happened to them or the puppies they bred.

 

Its this sort of idea that bothers some people. How much opposition is there to freezing eggs because "It traps a hatchling in its shell and kills it." Maybe Prize owner X doesn't want the eggs they produce to go to someone who will use their baby for trading? Maybe Prize owner Y wants to ensure that those who receive their egg will continue the naming scheme or lineage style? What if Prize owner T wants to make sure his offspring are well taken care of by those they trust like friends and family? What if Prize owner A, like me, wants to give them away regardless of who as long as they are cared for? Just like a dog breeder should be allowed to ensure their puppies are going to specific people, we should be allowed to ensure that our eggs go to specific people as well.

 

This can be achieved by those who want specific control to breed without the use of a multi clutch BSA and those of us who want to donate our eggs at random to anyone in the community can use that multi clutch BSA to do so :3

 

 

I get what you're saying - but apart from anything else, right now, we already have too many unwanted, ugly mongrels being produced.

 

The return of general, rather than targeted, multiclutching would involve a potential increase of up to 4 times the numbers of messy mongrels being repeatedly thrown aside, starved for Neglected research, Frozen or used for reproduction in order to toss more messies back to the AP and spoiling people's search for the nicely lineaged or CB dog which is all that they want/need.

 

As a BSA, there would certainly be a far more limited effect but if of the thousands of 'puppies' currently in the AP, and if for random example's sake we say 20% of an arbitrary 2000 had been BSA'd into multiclutching an average of 3 'puppies' rather than one, wouldn't that mean an additional 400 'puppies', many of which would likely be step metal-breeding fails of one sort or another or some other result utterly useless to most of us?

 

How many ugly 'puppies' do we want to have to pick through and toss aside while they pile up and rotate in the AP, when this is already a problem occurring with single-egg clutches and renewed interest in mass-breeding?

 

 

More generally: the problem with the Prizes and reason for the travails of the Prize owners is that they own a tiny fraction of dragons forming *the only source* of a sprite which, while not rare in itself, has an absurdly tiny initial breeding pool.

 

Naturally, of the 65,750 registered members, having a fair number of these trying to conduct the normal trade request procedure for 2nd gens is going to be perceived as an inundation by the very few CB prize owners.

 

The fact that demand for lower gens is player-generated is hardly grounds for dismissal of the issues created by the current Prize situation, as some seem to feel - there are real problems and an alteration to the site direction which many find unpleasant.

 

The pool of low-gen Prizes needs to be expanded; unfortunately, there doesn't seem to be any fix acceptable to all parties concerned, which is hardly a surprising result among those in any large group.

 

However, it would seem that nobody is happy with the way matters currently stand.

 

At this point it would appear that the most practical proceeding might be, from here on in, for TJ to Release new Prize dragons with higher breeding ratios in the first few gens and multi-clutching built-in - take it, or leave it and accept something else - and at least avoid increasing the problems with which both CB Prize owners and the players as a whole seem currently unable to deal well.

 

But something does need to be done to alleviate the situation, even if over the long term.

[AnanoKimi]

 

I get what you're saying - but apart from anything else, right now, we already have too many unwanted, ugly mongrels being produced.

 

  The return of general, rather than targeted, multiclutching would involve a potential increase of up to 4 times the numbers of messy mongrels being repeatedly thrown aside, starved for Neglected research, Frozen or used for reproduction in order to toss more messies back to the AP and spoiling people's search for the nicely lineaged or CB dog which is all that they want/need.

 

As a BSA, there would certainly be a far more limited effect but if of the thousands of 'puppies' currently in the AP, and if for random example's sake we say 20% of an arbitrary 2000 had been BSA'd into multiclutching an average of 3 'puppies' rather than one, wouldn't that mean an additional 400 'puppies', many of which would likely be step metal-breeding fails of one sort or another or some other result utterly useless to most of us?

 

How many ugly 'puppies' do we want to have to pick through and toss aside while they pile up and rotate in the AP, when this is already a problem occurring with single-egg clutches and renewed interest in mass-breeding?

 

 

More generally: the problem with the Prizes and reason for the travails of the Prize owners is that they own a tiny fraction of dragons forming *the only source* of a sprite which, while not rare in itself, has an absurdly tiny initial breeding pool.

 

Naturally, of the 65,750 registered members, having a fair number of these trying to conduct the normal trade request procedure for 2nd gens is going to be perceived as an inundation by the very few CB prize owners.

 

The fact that demand for lower gens is player-generated is hardly grounds for dismissal of the issues created by the current Prize situation, as some seem to feel - there are real problems and an alteration to the site direction which many find unpleasant.

 

The pool of low-gen Prizes needs to be expanded; unfortunately, there doesn't seem to be any fix acceptable to all parties concerned, which is hardly a surprising result among those in any large group.

 

However, it would seem that nobody is happy with the way matters currently stand.

 

At this point it would appear that the most practical proceeding might be, from here on in, for TJ to Release new Prize dragons with higher breeding ratios in the first few gens and multi-clutching built-in - take it, or leave it and accept something else - and at least avoid increasing the problems with which both CB Prize owners and the players as a whole seem currently unable to deal well.

 

But something does need to be done to alleviate the situation, even if over the long term.

I completely agree with you on the issue with such a low CB pool. I am not opposed to expanding it, I don't see why many would, so long as it means expanding the pool of winners as opposed to giving them away to everyone and at that point ruining what made them special.

 

Your reasoning about why generalized multi cluthing would just increase the amount of messies in the AP is exactly why something like a BSA for multi clutching would hopefully reduce that bit. New players shouldnt really know unless they scoured the forums, had the actual bright idea of looking fora wiki, or played around with what they have and check every single link and aspect of DC itself.

 

The winner circle needs to be expanded to allow for far more than the number of CB prizes that exist now.

 

numbers should be adjust according to how many people are active on the site as well as how many participate in the events that allow you entry into the raffle.

 

per say lets throw numbers around and say that about 5,000 people are active on DC, but only lets say 3,000 actually participate in the raffle that gives away the prize. Those 2,000 that missed out or chose to not participate get left out of how many prize winners there should be.

 

150 winners out of approx. 3,000 participants is a spit of people compared to how many participted. Increasing it to be maybe 200-400 eastern winners, 200-400 western winners, and 100-200 HM winners means we will get a ton of new blood in the CB Prize and HM breeds.

 

Thats 400-800 new Prize dragons and 100-200 HM winner exclusives (like hollies, gen 1 hell horses, things like that.)

 

Even if out of the 400-800 winners maybe 150 freeze or dont breed their dragons, thats 250-650 still hopefully active breeding individuals. That would seriously alleviate some of the pain me and the spit of remaining breeders have had to deal with.

 

In order to improve the situation, Ratios have to be improved, a multi clutch BSA should be implemented, and the amount of winners available cumulatively should increase to accomodate the ever growing DC user base.

Edited January 6, 2015 by AnanoKimi

[cyradis4]

Ugly eggs will be dealt with there the same way they are now:

Once they hit 5 days, someone incu-hatches them, and either toss it back, keep it (freeze / grow), or send it to the wild. And I've never once seen a hatchy stay on the AP for more than a short while.

 

The AP has been staying up around 5d 12+hr for many months now. Except during an actual release or during a Holiday breeding week (and the week after), the AP has been maintaining itself well above 5days. That means people are picking up enough eggs from it to keep its time up, and I myself won't pick up something I don't need from it unless its time is driven down (but if its close to 5 days, I'll pick up many extra things that I don't need and would not otherwise have gotten). I think that even if you double or tripled egg production, you'd probably see the same thing: it'd reach steady state again after the "novelty" of it wore off and only those that need it continue to use it. Yes, it might make CBs harder to find in the AP... Which might mean people only interested in CBs will pick them up from the biomes, while the lineage hunters who don't want CBs haunt the AP. The AP wasn't meant to be a dumping ground for CB Blockers after their 5 hr limit was up, after all.

 

Cheers!

C4.

[Auriene]

Truthfully, I don't think that multiclutching would solve anything... In my opinion, the best resolve would be releasing "old" prize dragons to the biomes as "regular" rares and introducing new ones in their place - let's say, in the three-years cycle. Without increasing the distribution of prizes, without adding new prize breeds to existing ones.

 

I suppose that old prize dragons should be as rare as Golds, or maybe even more rare during the first year of their existence in the biomes. For many players they would still be unobtainable, but at least everyone would have a chance - a very small chance - to catch a CB one. Not to mention that 2nd gens. or 3rd gens. would be easier to get too.

 

In my opinion, this solution would also benefit the "original" prize owners. After three, two or one year of dealing with rude users, never ending lists or tons of private messages they finally would be able to enjoy their prizes without additional pressure. I'm sure that the "original" prize dragons' offsprings would still have a great value for many players, like offsprings of spriters' alts or caveborn hybrids, and that prize owners would still be able to trade their shiny eggs for a relatively high price. They wouldn't be able to control the entire market forever, as it is now - but they would still be in a better position than the majority of players.

[AnanoKimi]

Truthfully, I don't think that multiclutching would solve anything... In my opinion, the best resolve would be releasing "old" prize dragons to the biomes as "regular" rares and introducing new ones in their place - let's say, in the three-years cycle. Without increasing the distribution of prizes, without adding new prize breeds to existing ones.

 

I suppose that old prize dragons should be as rare as Golds, or maybe even more rare during the first year of their existence in the biomes. For many players they would still be unobtainable, but at least everyone would have a chance - a very small chance - to catch a CB one. Not to mention that 2nd gens. or 3rd gens. would be easier to get too.

 

In my opinion, this solution would also benefit the "original" prize owners. After three, two or one year of dealing with rude users, never ending lists or tons of private messages they finally would be able to enjoy their prizes without additional pressure. I'm sure that the "original" prize dragons' offsprings would still have a great value for many players, like offsprings of spriters' alts or caveborn hybrids, and that prize owners would still be able to trade their shiny eggs for a relatively high price. They wouldn't be able to control the entire market forever, as it is now - but they would still be in a better position than the majority of players.

I don't really like that idea because then they wouldn't be prizes and if their just gonna be released into biomes then whats the point in having given them away as prizes? The whole thing that made them what they are would be moot by making them even super rare cave available dragon. There is no reason in releasing something as a prize only to turn around and go "Oh you got excited because it was special? Lol NOPE their just a new cave release." That seems unfair.

 

Multi clutching wont solve the entire issue but some way to improve ratios, expanding the prize pool, and multi clutching should help improve the situation. More winners means more people breeding, improved ratios or at least a way to improve them means some alleviation to dry spells, and a BSA that allows for selective multi clutching means spreading some love into the AP.

 

 

[DarkEternity]

On one hand multiclutching definitely increases randomness. There is randomness in the way that prize winners are selected and there is randomness in the way that individuals can pick up eggs from the AP as the population hunting there varies depending on timezone, day of the week and inclination to hunt.

 

On the other hand, multiclutching creates related eggs and each egg from a clutch is a direct sibling meaning more inbredness.

[LadyLyzar]

This thread has gone way off topic. I am going to go through it and remove off-topic posts, so don't be surprised when some posts disappear.

 

Alright, let's try to stay on topic and debate the merits of this suggestion. Discussion of raffle mechanics and how it is supposedly fair or unfair do not belong in this topic.

 

Topic reminder: Multi clutch for Prize dragons?

Edited January 7, 2015 by LadyLyzar

[AnanoKimi]

I have seen so many posts about "Only Prize owners can make lineages" "Only Prize owners control trade market" "Only Prize owners can do this" "Only Prize owners can do that" all of those followed by "But I cant and as such this should happen so I can in some way,shape, or form."

 

That's where this kinda irks me. Multi clutch so you can have a better chance to do what you want to do (not you specifically just generally saying) and get what you want.

 

Multi clutching will definitely add more to the AP but I don't think it will fix the trading situation. Why? because people who will want to get all those golds and silvers and ND's will AP stalk, take those 2nd gens, and trade them off for the ridiculous prices that exist. Very few will really be lucky enough to catch one and make use of it for anything other than trading.

 

This fixes nothing and imposes game play that not all prize owners want or would want if they were to win.

 

as for the whole chances of winning thing, You have made every point necessary Syphoneira. Really there's nothing to it~

[Jazeki]

On the other hand, multiclutching creates related eggs and each egg from a clutch is a direct sibling meaning more inbredness.

How are they more inbred when extras auto-abandon? Sure there's a chance that people can pick up eggs from the same clutch (I have related Halloween dragons on my scroll), but that doesn't mean they'll necessarily breed them together.

[JavaTigress]

One of the issues here seems to be that while players generally seem to be concerned about fixing a SITUATION where the chances of anyone obtaining lower-gen Tinsels and Shimmers to breed are very slow and low, over years, some owners seem to be taking this as a 'demand' that they each PERSONALLY somehow convince their babies to spit out more eggs for everyone by magic.

 

This may be understandable to the extent that CB Prize owners are the only - and relatively tiny - source of 2nd gens, however, I don't recall seeing anyone on this thread 'demanding' "...give, me give, me give me, give me, NOW!..." lol.

 

Some CB Owners may unfortunately come to feel that way, being so very few among so very many, and being continually subjected to such a flood of requests, but I really don't think it's intended that way by anyone remotely mature, or by anyone whom I can recall seeing posting on this thread.

 

 

As far as people winning on the Raffle; we have almost no chance of winning anyway, and I can't see anyone by any wild freak (cheating being an entirely different proposition,) winning twice as taking a chance away from anyone else, because winning is so very, extremely, impossibly unlikely to begin with.

 

My personal view is, why get upset about not winning something you aren't going to win anyway?

 

Why not instead try helping in the attempt at working out some way acceptable to TJ by which more useful low-gen Prize offspring can, in the future, be produced and bred in turn, so that everyone - CB owners and players - can be less stressed and better enjoy our time at DC?

 

This is supposed to be fun! 

I agree in so far as that only a very FEW people can win.

 

IT occurs to ME that maybe part of the reason prize-owners feel the way they do about this request is the way SOME people have of dogpiling on them for eggs from the moment they found out they won. ADMITTEDLY many of those that ask for eggs PROBABLY don't realize how much stress said winners are already under. As Syphoneria said, there ARE those that make unreasonable demands on them, of course, but THAT is covered as by harassment.

 

PART of me wonders if the whole 'guide to being a new prize owner' thing ought to be stickied for all, ALL, owner of CB prize or not, to read?

 

It might help a little bit with the empathy thing.

 

I feel that IF it felt like their was less demand, it might help out the working of a solution of some kind between prize owner sand non-owners.

Before that can happen there needs to be less of a 'Us versus them' mentality.

 

Though as I said, besieged as they are by requests, even IF they are mostly polite and well meaning, is it any wonder if prize owners come to feel like they can NEVER satisfy the perceived demand? Really they can't.

 

I get that some prize owners don't WANT this idea. After finding out a bit more about it, I think I also get why.

 

Given that, AND the unlikelihood of getting more than ONE 2G prize in a multiclutch, I begin to think that forcing this sin't the answer... though perhaps something else can be worked out that would be mutually beneficial and agreeable?

Edited January 7, 2015 by Silverswift

[AnanoKimi]

Well for those of us hoping to get more that one shiny baby in a multiclutch that want to multi clutch theres that whole Moonstone multiclutch BSA thread happening in the BSA suggestions so those that want to have the ability to multi clutch can, and thsoe who would rather not (like whitebaron stated at some point) don't have to.

 

This way its not imposed, this way its not forced, and as with all things within this game, people are given the freedom to play as they like.

 

Also yes the dog piling does cause stress but most of all the complaints in threads like this where prize owners are seen as some kind of lineage or collection inhibitors where because of us they cant get what they want is what just stresses me out the most.

 

You're guide should definitely be stickied though. I'm sure it will definitely help many new time place winners and even some HM winners who decide to take on the responsibility of getting a CB Holly or CB Hybrid.

[olympe]

IT occurs to ME that maybe part of the reason prize-owners feel the way they do about this request is the way SOME people have of dogpiling on them for eggs from the moment they found out they won. ADMITTEDLY many of those that ask for eggs PROBABLY don't realize how much stress said winners are already under. As Syphoneria said, there ARE those that make unreasonable demands on them, of course, but THAT is covered as by harassment.

And why is it that people do this dogpiling? Because there are only a very select few CB prizes, but at least hundreds of forum members who want to try and secure themselves a 2nd gen (since they can't have a CB).

 

I think the solution to this problem is not the introduction of multiclutches, but a vast increase in the number of prize dragons given out, plus (maybe) improved breeding ratios. Which is an entirely different suggestion.